Goaltending

[MP5029]

Or…I. 2 years Vladar becomes

our starter, Wolf becomes the backup and Markstrom is out? Who knows?

[travel_dude]

43 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Really like the signing.

 

It's hard to find a backup goalie for 2.2 in UFA, not to mention with the upside Vladar has. It's also very tradeable if need be.

 

I'm not worried for Wolf. He will be up when he's ready. There will be injuries in net at some point and he will get a chance. Also worth noting that Corey Crawford played 5 seasons in the AHL and 255 games, Jimmy Howard spent parts of 6 seasons in the AHL. Goalies always take a while to develop. If Wolf needs three seasons with the Wranglers, so-be-it

Wolf is really a ways off at this point.  He needs to dominate for more than just one season.

If he is ready at some point, he will get the starts.

He looks good right now, but not quite ready.

[Thebrewcrew]

3 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

Wolf is really a ways off at this point.  He needs to dominate for more than just one season.

If he is ready at some point, he will get the starts.

He looks good right now, but not quite ready.

Agreed.

 

Look at his WHL teammate, Carter Hart. Now, Hart is bigger than Wolf, but both dominated in junior. Hart was rushed by the Flyers and has been so-so ever since.

 

Too much time in the minors isn't a bad thing, although it may be frustrating.

[robrob74]

Marky has been a bit off to start. Not terrible when the team scores to make up for it. Goalies let in stinkers every once in awhile, but gotta shut the door sometimes. Starter's job is to stop the puck. 

[travel_dude]

19 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

Marky has been a bit off to start. Not terrible when the team scores to make up for it. Goalies let in stinkers every once in awhile, but gotta shut the door sometimes. Starter's job is to stop the puck. 

 

Two games, well reall one and a third.

First game I will ignore since he's had worse to start the seasons.

2nd game was one deflected just before it hit the net.

He had zero chance as he was lined up for the shot.

The goal where it sat on the line I didn't like.

You can't leave a gap behind you like that.

Should have layed out not sat on it (he thought).

If you don't see it, look behind or flop back.

 

Anyway that was a minor concern.

The play without the puck sucked.

Hard to win when you take too many penalties and only get one PP yourself.

Mange blew coverage on Vlarad's last goal against.

That was one of many bad plays.

 

[redfire11]

Markstom doesn't seem to be mentally prepared to start the games.

 

Maybe Vladar should start the first periods and Markstrom finish up the game.  LOL

[JTech780]

So I looked at goalies who have played at least 250 mins. at 5v5 this year and here is where Markstrom ranks of the 35 goaltenders who fit that criteria: 

 

Save%: 24th (.908)

HDSave%: 29th (.760)

 

Here are his ranks at all strengths of the 41 goalies that played at least 250 mins.:

 

Save%: 27th (.897)

HDSave%: 32nd (.765)

 

For this team to be where they want to be, Markstrom has to be much closer to the Vezina finalist he was last year than the very average goalie he has been to start this season.

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

So I looked at goalies who have played at least 250 mins. at 5v5 this year and here is where Markstrom ranks of the 35 goaltenders who fit that criteria: 

 

Save%: 24th (.908)

HDSave%: 29th (.760)

 

Here are his ranks at all strengths of the 41 goalies that played at least 250 mins.:

 

Save%: 27th (.897)

HDSave%: 32nd (.765)

 

For this team to be where they want to be, Markstrom has to be much closer to the Vezina finalist he was last year than the very average goalie he has been to start this season.

 

The way I see it is that he is awesome for most of the shots, but leaks one that should be automatic.

No goalie is gonna stop some of the goals I have seen.

His 5 hole seems a bit open at times, though.

High blocker seems a little exp[osed due to going down early.

[cross16]

1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

So I looked at goalies who have played at least 250 mins. at 5v5 this year and here is where Markstrom ranks of the 35 goaltenders who fit that criteria: 

 

Save%: 24th (.908)

HDSave%: 29th (.760)

 

Here are his ranks at all strengths of the 41 goalies that played at least 250 mins.:

 

Save%: 27th (.897)

HDSave%: 32nd (.765)

 

For this team to be where they want to be, Markstrom has to be much closer to the Vezina finalist he was last year than the very average goalie he has been to start this season.

 

Just to add to this (before the "Flames haven't been playing good D crowd gets involved) at 5 on 5 (per 60mins) the Flames rank:

 

7th in shots against

11th in Expected goals against

21st in Scoring Changes against

7th in High danger Changes against

 

Could be better for sure but it doesn't provide enough of an excuse IMO for the goaltending, it needs to be better and in particular it needs to be more timely. I mean a few timely saves and this isn't a losing streak:

Markstrom needs to stop that error on the McDavid rim against Edmonton. 

Vladar not stopping at least 1 of the Kraken goals in the 3rd

Palmari goal last night

 

Sometimes its when you make the saves and not how many. 

[Heartbreaker]

I pretty much agree... even without the fancy stats, you can see that the goaltending is shaky this year. Last night, up until the second goal (against the Islanders, in case you're reading this nine years in the future like the trades thread), I was thinking that Markstrom might steal the game. This was the one where he'd find his groove. It was the third period, the Flames were up by two, the Islanders were coming on strong, the Flames defense was shaky, but the goalie shut the door... then the second goal happened, and then a very bad goal less than a minute later, and it's a tie game - except the Islanders have all the momentum.

 

They're not the toughest team mentally, and a big part of that starts in net.

 

Love.

[sak22]

2 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Just to add to this (before the "Flames haven't been playing good D crowd gets involved) at 5 on 5 (per 60mins) the Flames rank:

 

7th in shots against

11th in Expected goals against

21st in Scoring Changes against

7th in High danger Changes against

 

Could be better for sure but it doesn't provide enough of an excuse IMO for the goaltending, it needs to be better team in particular it needs to be more timely. I mean a few timely saves and this isn't a losing streak:

Markstrom needs to stop that error on the McDavid rim against Edmonton. 

Vladar not stopping at least 1 of the Kraken goals in the 3rd

Palmari goal last night

 

Sometimes its when you make the saves and not how many. 

So true, its something we could say we got what we paid for with Hiller, Elliott, Smith, Rittich, Talbot, etc., this guy is making the bigger bucks he needs to be better.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

Could be better for sure but it doesn't provide enough of an excuse IMO for the goaltending, it needs to be better and in particular it needs to be more timely. I mean a few timely saves and this isn't a losing streak:

Markstrom needs to stop that error on the McDavid rim against Edmonton. 

Vladar not stopping at least 1 of the Kraken goals in the 3rd

Palmari goal last night

 

It's kinda the problem.  He makes a bunch of really good saves and lets in one that changes the game.

But, let's face it, the Flames were under siege when they score the 2 and 3 goal.

You want him to make that timely save.

Too many chances all in a row are going to come back on you.

I don't like 5 hole goals at all.

 

I will say this.

It's frustrating when we have 18 shots in a period and we get scored on on the 1st shot.

Almost says that we are wasting quality with quantity, if it takes that many to have one goal.

Some goalies get smoked like that but other shut the door.

Make it look like we just can't score.

Maybe some of the two on one rushes are just poorly executed.

2nd player not in a position to take the pass.

Shooter has no choice and the goalie knows it.

[JTech780]

20 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Just to add to this (before the "Flames haven't been playing good D crowd gets involved) at 5 on 5 (per 60mins) the Flames rank:

 

7th in shots against

11th in Expected goals against

21st in Scoring Changes against

7th in High danger Changes against

 

Could be better for sure but it doesn't provide enough of an excuse IMO for the goaltending, it needs to be better and in particular it needs to be more timely. I mean a few timely saves and this isn't a losing streak:

Markstrom needs to stop that error on the McDavid rim against Edmonton. 

Vladar not stopping at least 1 of the Kraken goals in the 3rd

Palmari goal last night

 

Sometimes its when you make the saves and not how many. 

Last night was a good example of needing a timely save. The Hischier goal wasn’t a great goal, it was one where Markstrom should have had it, but sometimes you get beat by good players. It was the time and score of the game where you needed Markstrom to make that save. Tied with less than 10 minutes left in the 3rd, you need your big ticket goalie to make that save.

 

Personally I thought that was a game where Vladar should have gotten the start, not that the outcome would have been to much different, Markstrom wasn’t terrible, but he also didn’t get the win.

[travel_dude]

31 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

Last night was a good example of needing a timely save. The Hischier goal wasn’t a great goal, it was one where Markstrom should have had it, but sometimes you get beat by good players. It was the time and score of the game where you needed Markstrom to make that save. Tied with less than 10 minutes left in the 3rd, you need your big ticket goalie to make that save.

 

Personally I thought that was a game where Vladar should have gotten the start, not that the outcome would have been to much different, Markstrom wasn’t terrible, but he also didn’t get the win.

 

I would have preferred a Vladar start in one of these two games.

NJ was the tougher opponent, but Markstrom wasn't exactly flawless against NYI.

I understand the use of your top goalie in the first of a B2B, trying to get the easier win (fresh players).

Going back to them after a less than great game is questionable.

[cross16]

I wouldn't have been upset with Vladar but at the same time I don't think he's been good to start the year and your trying to get Markstrom to find his game. 

 

So I get why Markstrom started.

[sak22]

I was thinking they planned on Vladar for Boston, old team and shut them out last year.

[conundrumed]

NHL

Markstrom: 8-5-2; 3.03gaa; .889sv%

Vladar: 1-4-1; 2.82gaa; .908sv%

AHL

Wolf: 10-3; 2.65gaa; .912sv% 1SO

ECHL

Daniil Chechelev 8-4; 2.89gaa; .918sv%

NCAA

Sergeev: 5-1-1; 2.69gaa; .917sv%

 

Any corrections? NCAA in particular is hard to isolate data.

[travel_dude]

Probably just a result of a recent game, but Wolf is .915 and 2.59 GAA.

 

Anyway, the goaltending is worse for the early part of the season than the last two years.

Markstrom was a stud last year with a strong start.

The year before he started strong and faded to average.

Vladar is playing very well, but Sutter wants W's.

Backups regularly take the starter role at times in a season, but we won't see that here.

[robrob74]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Probably just a result of a recent game, but Wolf is .915 and 2.59 GAA.

 

Anyway, the goaltending is worse for the early part of the season than the last two years.

Markstrom was a stud last year with a strong start.

The year before he started strong and faded to average.

Vladar is playing very well, but Sutter wants W's.

Backups regularly take the starter role at times in a season, but we won't see that here.

they said on the fan yesterday that one game this season brings his totals down and that taking that game away he is about a ..925 or 935 save percentage on the season. I was listening to the Flames Hour 2 podcast from yesterday this morning while driving. I forget the actual numbers but it was really good. 

[travel_dude]

19 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

they said on the fan yesterday that one game this season brings his totals down and that taking that game away he is about a ..925 or 935 save percentage on the season. I was listening to the Flames Hour 2 podcast from yesterday this morning while driving. I forget the actual numbers but it was really good. 

 

Ball said the same thing during the last broadcast.

Including the full CAR game and the relief against BUF, he is .930 this season.

That excludes the SEA game which was bad on all counts.

[Thebrewcrew]

I would really consider giving Vladar a 3rd consecutive start.

 

I don't think they will though. Markstrom will likely play MTL, then Vladar Saturday. Markstrom doesn't have stellar career numbers vs WSH. Something Sutter alluded to last yeat, Vladar started both of those games last year. Markstrom also lost to them a week ago.

[travel_dude]

10 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I would really consider giving Vladar a 3rd consecutive start.

 

I don't think they will though. Markstrom will likely play MTL, then Vladar Saturday. Markstrom doesn't have stellar career numbers vs WSH. Something Sutter alluded to last yeat, Vladar started both of those games last year. Markstrom also lost to them a week ago.

 

I think it makes sense.  You want both guys battling.

Vladar takes his defined role very seriously though.

When Sutter says you are the backup, that is all you ever are.

Be ready when you get the call, practice when you don't.

In his mind there is no controversy.

He could start 9 of 10 and still feel that he is just the backup.

[jjgallow]

Vladar the better goalie this year

[jjgallow]

I was hoping to have an "i told you so" moment with Askarov, Wallstedt....

 

So far will have to wait.     Cossa is banished to ECHL...wow.. but I wasn't ever high on him so ok.

 

Howeva...lol... Askarov and Wallstedt still both looking good for their age, not writeoffs by any means.  And good that their teams are taking it slow with them.

 

Askarov above 900 in the AHL.   I was hoping to see him maybe do that in the NHL by now but he is literally all of 20 years old.    Still the best goalie in his draft year by a mile.   The transition from Russia cannot be stress free.

 

Wallstedt also around 900 in the AHL, and a year younger too.   Or half a year anyway.    I'd like to see at least one of them dominating in the AHL by end of year or early next season.  If so, then they were worth the pick and the risk imho.

[travel_dude]

1 minute ago, jjgallow said:

I was hoping to have an "i told you so" moment with Askarov, Wallstedt....

 

So far will have to wait.     Cossa is banished to ECHL...wow.. but I wasn't ever high on him so ok.

 

Howeva...lol... Askarov and Wallstedt still both looking good for their age, not writeoffs by any means.  And good that their teams are taking it slow with them.

 

Askarov above 900 in the AHL.   I was hoping to see him maybe do that in the NHL by now but he is literally all of 20 years old.    Still the best goalie in his draft year by a mile.   The transition from Russia cannot be stress free.

 

Wallstedt also around 900 in the AHL, and a year younger too.   Or half a year anyway.    I'd like to see at least one of them dominating in the AHL by end of year or early next season.  If so, then they were worth the pick and the risk imho.

 

🤣