Flames 22/23 Lineup

[pcs]

3 hours ago, cross16 said:

Not a fan of that lineup nor am I a fan of how Sutter continues to throw these less than subtle jabs at Huberdeau. 

 

Sutter has had a varying leash on different players this year that could come back to bite him. 

 

 

Hubie with Backlund I’m OK with, if he were to put another goal-scorer on the right wing. One nice move on a PK doesn’t suddenly make Lewis a credible offensive threat though, and you’re not going to help Hubie “get going” by putting him on a line that will clearly be used in a defensive role. Especially since I thought (and so did all the talking heads) that Hubie actually played a damn good game before he went out with the injury.

[cross16]

2 hours ago, pcs said:

Hubie with Backlund I’m OK with, if he were to put another goal-scorer on the right wing. One nice move on a PK doesn’t suddenly make Lewis a credible offensive threat though, and you’re not going to help Hubie “get going” by putting him on a line that will clearly be used in a defensive role. Especially since I thought (and so did all the talking heads) that Hubie actually played a damn good game before he went out with the injury.

 

And just to be fair the only really problem I have with the lineup is Lucic. He's just not worthy of a top 6 role or a spot beside Kadri at this point. 

 

I don't have a problem with Huberdeau with Backlund and in fact that probably helps alleviate Huberdeau's focus in transition. 

[pcs]

1 minute ago, cross16 said:

 

And just to be fair the only really problem I have with the lineup is Lucic. He's just not worthy of a top 6 role or a spot beside Kadri at this point. 

 

I don't have a problem with Huberdeau with Backlund and in fact that probably helps alleviate Huberdeau's focus in transition. 

Yeah i agree with all of this. Looch was doing perfectly in his 4th-line role. I think putting him with Kadri minimizes what both of them can bring to the table. But I don’t have a Jack Adams award so wtf do i know, lol. Sutter’s gotten it right before, many times. I fear that in this case however he might be falling victim to his own biases about experience, players that have won cups, etc. and being a little pissy about Hubie not yet living up to his contract and potential.

[The_People1]

As I posted before, Huberdeau-Backlund replicates Huberdeau-Bennett so that has potential to work well, at least for Huberdeau.

 

Lucic is a step behind this season.  Not sure what we can do there.  Perhaps Boston wants him back for one final Cup run with the old gang and that's our only option to trade him.  Just don't expect much coming back.  BOS has no cap room too.

 

Really excited to see Ruzicka build on his 2-point game.

[The_Tribal Chief]

[The_Tribal Chief]

i seen that and was like WOW

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

As I posted before, Huberdeau-Backlund replicates Huberdeau-Bennett so that has potential to work well, at least for Huberdeau.

 

Lucic is a step behind this season.  Not sure what we can do there.  Perhaps Boston wants him back for one final Cup run with the old gang and that's our only option to trade him.  Just don't expect much coming back.  BOS has no cap room too.

 

Really excited to see Ruzicka build on his 2-point game.

 

I think Lucic is a non starter.

The only thing about playing with 2nd line is that it prevents a black hole 4th.

4th was good to start season but had trouble defensively.

[zima]

22 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Just a black hole. Like Vrana, but at least we know Vrana entered the league’s player assistance program as Price and others have done.

Kylington is a bigger question mark. Personally, I have zero idea why it remains hidden. Seems very counter-intuitive. It will be addressed like a tidal wave when/if he comes back. Why not attempt to get ahead of it a little?

Very strange to let it reach a crescendo of silence in this day and age.

I hope it's not drug related not nice to go there but we all know how pain meds can deter a persons life again I am just making things up here I have no Idea what has happened but very strange the cone of silence? 

[travel_dude]

9 minutes ago, zima said:

I hope it's not drug related not nice to go there but we all know how pain meds can deter a persons life again I am just making things up here I have no Idea what has happened but very strange the cone of silence? 

It's been described as family related and he is in Sweden with his family.

Substance abuse is dealt with by the NHL and they provide that info.

So, it's not that at all.

[cross16]

Not surprised as Sutter clearly didn't feel comfortable playing him but I liked some of what I saw from DeSimone. Wish he would have been given more of a shot. 

 

Probably some preference to Gilbert and the Left shot to restore the balance at play here too. 

 

 

[travel_dude]

If I recall, Gilbert is a bit more of a rugged player.  A bit bigger (212).  He isn't afraid to step up and hit.  DeSimone was probably reasonable in his defensive ability, but Sutter wasn't comfortable with him for 1/2 the game.  For whatever reason.

[JTech780]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

Not surprised as Sutter clearly didn't feel comfortable playing him but I liked some of what I saw from DeSimone. Wish he would have been given more of a shot. 

 

Probably some preference to Gilbert and the Left shot to restore the balance at play here too. 

 

 

 

See I didn’t like what I saw from DeSimone at all, he isn’t great in his own end and made a lot of risky plays.

 

Gilbert is more aggressive, but will keep his game a bit more simple. He is a little more like Stone as a player.

 

At the end of the day Mackey, DeSimone and Gilbert are all AHL depth players who really shouldn’t be playing too many games at the NHL level.

 

At a certain point if Kylington is going to be out for the season, then Treliving is going to have to find a defenseman who can play more than 10 minutes a night on the back end.

[travel_dude]

9 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

See I didn’t like what I saw from DeSimone at all, he isn’t great in his own end and made a lot of risky plays.

 

Gilbert is more aggressive, but will keep his game a bit more simple. He is a little more like Stone as a player.

 

At the end of the day Mackey, DeSimone and Gilbert are all AHL depth players who really shouldn’t be playing too many games at the NHL level.

 

At a certain point if Kylington is going to be out for the season, then Treliving is going to have to find a defenseman who can play more than 10 minutes a night on the back end.

 

Ideal situation is we have 6 NHL D plus Stone.

He's done a good job so far, but I don't think he's 100% effective.

He has a deadly shot, but bleeds a little defense.

[travel_dude]

Nobody has really taken the starter role so far.

Both goalies have been a little off.

We should be giving more starts to the backup at this point.

He's shown that he lets in fewer "bad" goals.

Marky has a few highlight reel saves, but otherwise underwhelming.  

Vladar seems to make good 1st and 2nd saves.

Rebound control a little suspect at times, though.

 

Both goalies need to get starts at this stage.

Nobody is killing it.

[tmac70]

On 11/14/2022 at 11:31 AM, cross16 said:

Not a fan of that lineup nor am I a fan of how Sutter continues to throw these less than subtle jabs at Huberdeau. 

 

Sutter has had a varying leash on different players this year that could come back to bite him. 

 

 

So what in that statement is incorrect. He is a good player and has struggled. I will agree the gone for Satoshi Nakamoto comment was funny, and out of line with his injury we found out later. If no one wants the truth than why interview the man When asked a question he provides a truthful answer. If that hurts their feelings simple fix play better. Frankly Hubie has been a disappointment thus far as is Weegar, however I do belive they will elevate their games once they get use to the system.  I love Sutters press confernace because at least your going to be provided a truthfull answer. If comments like this have a huge impact mentally on anyone in that room, we are doomed.  Poor players fold under pressure, good players strive to be better and great players rise to the occassion. Sutter has been just as hard on Ruzicka and he has started to perform. We will soon see if Hubie rises to the occassion as everyone is hoping

[travel_dude]

19 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

So what in that statement is incorrect. He is a good player and has struggled. I will agree the gone for Satoshi Nakamoto comment was funny, and out of line with his injury we found out later. If no one wants the truth than why interview the man When asked a question he provides a truthful answer. If that hurts their feelings simple fix play better. Frankly Hubie has been a disappointment thus far as is Weegar, however I do belive they will elevate their games once they get use to the system.  I love Sutters press confernace because at least your going to be provided a truthfull answer. If comments like this have a huge impact mentally on anyone in that room, we are doomed.  Poor players fold under pressure, good players strive to be better and great players rise to the occassion. Sutter has been just as hard on Ruzicka and he has started to perform. We will soon see if Hubie rises to the occassion as everyone is hoping

 

The "gone for a sh*t" comment irked some players.

Sutter was being a jerk and not answering why Hubey left the bench.

The answer implied he was attending to personal business.

I laughed because I thought he was just fed up with questions about injuries.

Not that it was a truthful answer; I didn't view it that way.

I'm not a athlete, so I can't say whether that would PO me or not.

 

It's not quite as funny as the one about stitching up Gudbranson.

Even that one annoyed some players.

 

[flames for life]

2 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

See I didn’t like what I saw from DeSimone at all, he isn’t great in his own end and made a lot of risky plays.

 

Gilbert is more aggressive, but will keep his game a bit more simple. He is a little more like Stone as a player.

 

At the end of the day Mackey, DeSimone and Gilbert are all AHL depth players who really shouldn’t be playing too many games at the NHL level.

 

At a certain point if Kylington is going to be out for the season, then Treliving is going to have to find a defenseman who can play more than 10 minutes a night on the back end.

10 games into the season is hardly to to declare Kylington is “done for the year”.  It was stated he was away for personal family related issues, period.  Management stated to respect privacy and as such, be patient.  If, or when it will changes into more, I’m sure we will be told.

in the meantime, I get to wish he was in the lineup, and look for bigger and better things to come from him!

[zima]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Nobody has really taken the starter role so far.

Both goalies have been a little off.

We should be giving more starts to the backup at this point.

He's shown that he lets in fewer "bad" goals.

Marky has a few highlight reel saves, but otherwise underwhelming.  

Vladar seems to make good 1st and 2nd saves.

Rebound control a little suspect at times, though.

 

Both goalies need to get starts at this stage.

Nobody is killing it.

Bring up Wolf maybe he will get us back to top 3 in our division.

[bosn111]

I don’t know what the answer to the Flames issue right now. With 6 goals from 6 players against LA, multiple 30+ goal scorers, I don’t think it is an individual player issue but more of a chemistry issue that was evident during training camp.

 

Huberdeau and Gaudreau are not the same player, nor are Toffoli and Tkachuk. I am not surprised by the slower start for Lindholm, though through 2 games there seems to be more chemistry between Lindholm, Toffoli and Ruzicka.

 

Huberdeau worked well with Bennett in Florida in a more run and gun style. Bennett driving hard and fast to the net and Huberdeau getting him the puck. Neither Lindholm or Toffoli play that game. They are more get control of the puck, get a player open in the circle and rifle a shot through. I would say Dube plays more like Bennett, so I would like to see Huberdeau and Dube get some time together.

 

Kadri adds some grit at centre and scores “dirty” goals more than clean shots. Mangiapane is similar. This is likely why there is less chemistry as they both are looking to do the same thing, I would split them up to get more complimentary pieces.

 

Kadri could work well with Huberdeau and Dube. Dube push fast to the net, Huberdeau passes to Dube for the initial shot with Kadri cleaning up the rebound.

 

Ruzicka is working well on the top line as he states, he is the hunter. He goes to the boards to retrieve the puck and get it to Lindholm and Toffoli in the dangerous shooting zones, similar to what Backlund does for players.

 

I would put Mangiapane with Backlund and Coleman. Coleman can do the hard work on the boards, Backlund can help with possession and they work the puck to the hard areas in front of the net for Mangiapane to do his thing.

 

 I think Huberdeau on 3rd line last night was a bit of first game back from injury and trying to jumpstart his game away from top line pressure. I don’t see it as punishment, just trying something different. He won’t stay there, not with his contact.

 

Rotating Ritchie, Lewis, Rooney and Lucic on the 4th line will keep them fresher and they all provide similar benefits and detractors.

 

The D is more of a mess right now than other areas, even if it was supposed to be the strength of the team. Hanifin is inconsistent. He has a really good game, followed by a bad game. I see the talent and why he is trusted, and then the brain farts. Weegar hasn’t found his footing yet, possibly from not having a set partner. Due to injuries, he has had a different partner every game and often multiple per game. Zadorov has been more steady this season, but similar to Hanifin he can be hot and cold. Tanev is good when healthy in whatever role you put him, other than PP. Andersson is having a good offensive year but D is a little off. Is this due to overwork because of injuries to Tanev and Stone?

 

Markstrom is not making some of the saves he should, but some goals against have simply been great shots or bad luck. 
 

Ultimately finding the right fit for forwards, getting Weegar a stable partner, lowering playing time of the top 4 D by getting a more stable 3rd pair and getting Markstrom more rest by giving Vladar more games will likely help the team plenty.

[travel_dude]

^^^^^^

Tkachuk was a big passer on the top line.

Gaudreau, IIRC, was the one with more primary assists.

RW to LW to C and in.

Or RW to LW in.

Or LW to RW in.

That's overly simplistic, but shows what was different.

Now there is a pair of RHS's and one LHS.

You almost need a LHS passer on the RW.

 

So why does Ruzie work there.

IMHO because he's a natural C and can pass.

He attacks more from the middle than wing.

Seems like good chemistry with him and Toffoli.

 

Anyway, I won't look a gift horse in the mouth.

Top line is working and not a defensive hole.

Hiberdeau works well with Backlund because he can enter the zone.

That puts Hubey in a attack from the wing spot, not worrying about entries.

Lewis not the right fit.

 

The difficult decision for me is Backlund or Kadri.

Maybe the following to make use of the mix:

Top line

Coleman-Kadri-Dube

Hubey-Backlund-Mangiapane

Lucic-Lewis-Ritchie

 

As shown the other night, Lewis and Dube could swap positions.

Not sure that 100% works with Kadri, but a thought. 

[bosn111]

I am not against those lines TD. That third line should be good. My only issue is that rather than more offence, that second line is just a pain in the rear line. They will get some chances but are more just creating space for the other lines. I like the way Dube and Coleman play, but they are not top passers or finishers. They are really good supporting players which leaves Kadri as the primary offence on that line. It could work, I just wouldn’t expect big numbers of goals from that line.

[redfire11]

11 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Top line

Coleman-Kadri-Dube

Hubey-Backlund-Mangiapane

Lucic-Lewis-Ritchie

I could really see these lines working. 

[tmac70]

16 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

The "gone for a sh*t" comment irked some players.

Sutter was being a jerk and not answering why Hubey left the bench.

The answer implied he was attending to personal business.

I laughed because I thought he was just fed up with questions about injuries.

Not that it was a truthful answer; I didn't view it that way.

I'm not a athlete, so I can't say whether that would PO me or not.

 

It's not quite as funny as the one about stitching up Gudbranson.

Even that one annoyed some players.

 

Sutter has on more than one occassion questions about possible or injuries of any kind should not be discussed. Could his comment been tongue and cheek with Hubie most likely, but uncertain. What I find remarkabley odd is team and players have been Satoshi Nakamoto and when asked your suppose to pat them on the back. Hubie knows he hasn't had a great start, Sutter acknowledges that. Hubie was in the media talking about just wait you havn't seen anything yet, but here we are still waiting. If your going to talk the talk than step up that was the commnet from the coach, everyone talks about it but the results are not there. He is fighting or was an injury and the systems are most likey harder to adjust to than FLA. His goal against LA if you watch it was actually brillant. Anderson pinches, he covers as Anderson heads to the corner Hubie breaks to the net and Lewis covers the point, coverage lost, hubie is wide open. This was how JG Chucky and Lindy scored. Lewis understands the systems Backlund is Defensively sound Hubie is finding his way. The read and development of that play is what he needs to learn. The LA game was the first game we have seen that looked similar to the style I watched last year, with the exception of the 10 minute melt downs. The one D man that is missed the most is Gubranson IMHO. 

[travel_dude]

51 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

Sutter has on more than one occassion questions about possible or injuries of any kind should not be discussed. Could his comment been tongue and cheek with Hubie most likely, but uncertain. What I find remarkabley odd is team and players have been Satoshi Nakamoto and when asked your suppose to pat them on the back. Hubie knows he hasn't had a great start, Sutter acknowledges that. Hubie was in the media talking about just wait you havn't seen anything yet, but here we are still waiting. If your going to talk the talk than step up that was the commnet from the coach, everyone talks about it but the results are not there. He is fighting or was an injury and the systems are most likey harder to adjust to than FLA. His goal against LA if you watch it was actually brillant. Anderson pinches, he covers as Anderson heads to the corner Hubie breaks to the net and Lewis covers the point, coverage lost, hubie is wide open. This was how JG Chucky and Lindy scored. Lewis understands the systems Backlund is Defensively sound Hubie is finding his way. The read and development of that play is what he needs to learn. The LA game was the first game we have seen that looked similar to the style I watched last year, with the exception of the 10 minute melt downs. The one D man that is missed the most is Gubranson IMHO. 

 

I don't think anyone cares if the coach calls them out; players know they are not performing.  The off the cuff comment is the one that riled a few.  But anyway...

 

Hubey reminds me of JG when Sutter first arrived.  Was used to playing a more wide open game.  The rest of the team is used to it.  Finding his way is an accurate statement.  Finding a balance of his old game and how that works or doesn't work here.  How he can work with his line to improve outcome.  I'm not worried about him, other than he needs to produce positive results.  Those have been lacking.  Sutter doesn't care if he gets 75 assists, just that the line is above zero in goals for vs goals against.  

[conundrumed]

Sutter came in saying we’re one of the slowest teams in the league and I agreed.

Now he puts an anchor on every line so I don’t understand. My guess would be put Huberdeau and Dube together and either Kadri/Backlund doesn’t really matter. Not so much about speed as pace.

Match the players that can play the same pace or close. Huberdeau is the hardest because he wants fast and faster. Sutter’s frustration seems to be he wants him to slow his pace. Are we wanting to be a deathly slow team again? I don’t pretend to understand.

But we’re getting at that time of year when the speed of play gets on the uptick by a lot.