Treliving-Flames mutually part ways. Maloney POHO/interim GM and search on for new GM

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, cross16 said:

As a general rule I don't really like the former franchise player approach to building a management team. I know it worked for Sakic in Colorado but generally I don't think it works. 

 

But at the same time i think this idea has merit because as critical as it is for the Flames to get their hockey ops right and have good decision makers, they have to really consider their image too. It's not great right now and having Iginla involved, really in any capacity, is not a bad idea. 

 

 

 

That's an interesting suggestion and I agree it helps the Flames rebuild their image.  If anything, having Iginla around again would create a good feeling for the fanbase.

 

I'm personally okay with former players working management.  Sakic, Yzerman, Shanahan... Trevor Linden did well with the Canucks until they fired him.

 

But is Iginla actually qualified to be assistant GM if Conroy takes the lead role?  Iginla hasn't shown any interest in returning to the game at all.  He enjoys walking the streets of Boston as an anon and lives a normal life.

 

That said, I've been saying for awhile now that the Flames need a former NHL superstar to stand up to the ownership group and counter their ideas.

[cross16]

31 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

That's an interesting suggestion and I agree it helps the Flames rebuild their image.  If anything, having Iginla around again would create a good feeling for the fanbase.

 

I'm personally okay with former players working management.  Sakic, Yzerman, Shanahan... Trevor Linden did well with the Canucks until they fired him.

 

But is Iginla actually qualified to be assistant GM if Conroy takes the lead role?  Iginla hasn't shown any interest in returning to the game at all.  He enjoys walking the streets of Boston as an anon and lives a normal life.

 

That said, I've been saying for awhile now that the Flames need a former NHL superstar to stand up to the ownership group and counter their ideas.

 

Sorry I should clarify and expand because I have no problem with former players working in management, i just want them to earn their roles. The idea I don't like is brining in former franchise icons back to the franchise, especially in roles they are not qualified for. Yzerman had to work as a special assistant an then had to leave to be a GM elsewhere before Detroit hired him. What I don't like is the Bobby Clarke, Trevor Linden, Rob Blake approach when they aren't qualified and likely get the jobs due to their name more than anything else. 

 

If Iginla wants to come here then he should build up his profile as a special assistant to the GM. I'd have no problem with that.

 

Should also admit the approach isn't that common anymore. Most people that want to be executives build their careers up post playing. Was an approach I just really disliked in the 90s-2000s. Can add Cam Neely to this list of people who have done very well with it. 

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Sorry I should clarify and expand because I have no problem with former players working in management, i just want them to earn their roles. The idea I don't like is brining in former franchise icons back to the franchise, especially in roles they are not qualified for. Yzerman had to work as a special assistant an then had to leave to be a GM elsewhere before Detroit hired him. What I don't like is the Bobby Clarke, Trevor Linden, Rob Blake approach when they aren't qualified and likely get the jobs due to their name more than anything else. 

 

If Iginla wants to come here then he should build up his profile as a special assistant to the GM. I'd have no problem with that.

 

Should also admit the approach isn't that common anymore. Most people that want to be executives build their careers up post playing. Was an approach I just really disliked in the 90s-2000s. Can add Cam Neely to this list of people who have done very well with it. 

 

Ya that's fair for sure.  Just because someone was great at scoring goals in the NHL, it doesn't mean they will be great managing a roster, contracts, drafts, development, public relations, building up a winning team over time, etc.  If Iginla is even interested in an upper management role, then he needs to start somewhere small and build up his credentials.  And, if Iginla is interested in an upper management role, then I think the Flames should do the right thing and at least make an offer to have him come join Conroy for a few years.

[cross16]

Mark Hunter was a hot GM name a few years ago. Seemed to be upset they gave the GM job to Dubas and he left the NHL. 

 

Good scouting background and got a lot of praise for helping to build the Leafs

 

 

[The_People1]

Should the Flames consider Tod Button for GM?  If we are going to have a youth movement then it would great to have a GM with thorough knowledge of all the young kids entering the NHL.  I don't know much about him other than his draft record.  Does he have the qualities to manage an NHL team?

[Thebrewcrew]

Finally having clarity on the coach is important.

 

It makes the job a little more appealing for an external candidate. Not tied to a coach. 

 

There are two potential coaches that stand out right now.

 

Mitch Love- If he doesn't get this job, he will get another job elsewhere. Best coach in the AHL the past two years. Knows the prospects as well as anyone.

 

Andrew Brunette- Did really well with FLA in a tough spot last year. Got the best out of Huberdeau, which is important.

[The_People1]

2 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Finally having clarity on the coach is important.

 

It makes the job a little more appealing for an external candidate. Not tied to a coach. 

 

There are two potential coaches that stand out right now.

 

Mitch Love- If he doesn't get this job, he will get another job elsewhere. Best coach in the AHL the past two years. Knows the prospects as well as anyone.

 

Andrew Brunette- Did really well with FLA in a tough spot last year. Got the best out of Huberdeau, which is important.

 

Firing Sutter helps the new GM come into a clean situation.  It's always a tough job for a new GM to come in and have to fire somebody on the first day in office.

[travel_dude]

26 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Finally having clarity on the coach is important.

 

It makes the job a little more appealing for an external candidate. Not tied to a coach. 

 

There are two potential coaches that stand out right now.

 

Mitch Love- If he doesn't get this job, he will get another job elsewhere. Best coach in the AHL the past two years. Knows the prospects as well as anyone.

 

Andrew Brunette- Did really well with FLA in a tough spot last year. Got the best out of Huberdeau, which is important.

 

21 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Firing Sutter helps the new GM come into a clean situation.  It's always a tough job for a new GM to come in and have to fire somebody on the first day in office.

 

Have to agree with Peeps.  The new GM could still land on either of these two, but let's let him get to it.  The next two weeks will see some other coaches fired and potentially GM's.  No point in hitching to a coach at this point.

[Thebrewcrew]

16 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

Have to agree with Peeps.  The new GM could still land on either of these two, but let's let him get to it.  The next two weeks will see some other coaches fired and potentially GM's.  No point in hitching to a coach at this point.

Oh for sure.

 

Those are just two names that I think will be seriously considered for the head coaching job

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Finally having clarity on the coach is important.

 

It makes the job a little more appealing for an external candidate. Not tied to a coach. 

 

There are two potential coaches that stand out right now.

 

Mitch Love- If he doesn't get this job, he will get another job elsewhere. Best coach in the AHL the past two years. Knows the prospects as well as anyone.

 

Andrew Brunette- Did really well with FLA in a tough spot last year. Got the best out of Huberdeau, which is important.

Might be a good time to add in that he's done that with plenty of help from the AHL's version of Vasilevsky. Not to take away from him, but that's an important factor. Is the team top of the league without Wolf?

[Thebrewcrew]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Might be a good time to add in that he's done that with plenty of help from the AHL's version of Vasilevsky. Not to take away from him, but that's an important factor. Is the team top of the league without Wolf?

That’s fair. 
 

With Love though, there’s a track record of success. He was a really highly respected assistant on Everett, one of the better programs in the Western league. Went to a Saskatoon team that wasn’t in a very good spot. Turned that franchise around. Wolf is a major factor the whole “good goalie, good coach” thing. But as we all know, the Wranglers aren’t exactly loaded with super high end prospects,  but they aren’t a veteran heavy team. He’s maximizing the talent on that team. Nothing against Pelletier/Zary/Phillips/Poirier of course, but they aren’t the regarded as blue chip guys

 

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

That’s fair. 
 

With Love though, there’s a track record of success. He was a really highly respected assistant on Everett, one of the better programs in the Western league. Went to a Saskatoon team that wasn’t in a very good spot. Turned that franchise around. Wolf is a major factor the whole “good goalie, good coach” thing. But as we all know, the Wranglers aren’t exactly loaded with super high end prospects,  but they aren’t a veteran heavy team. He’s maximizing the talent on that team. Nothing against Pelletier/Zary/Phillips/Poirier of course, but they aren’t the regarded as blue chip guys

 

 

The players you are talking about don't stay in the AHL that long.  They graduate.

We have had a couple of years of Pelletier, Phillips, Wolf and Ruzicka (last year).

They aren't NHL former stars, or top 10 draft picks, but they aren't dogSatoshi Nakamoto

[phoenix66]

12 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

That’s fair. 
 

With Love though, there’s a track record of success. He was a really highly respected assistant on Everett, one of the better programs in the Western league. Went to a Saskatoon team that wasn’t in a very good spot. Turned that franchise around. Wolf is a major factor the whole “good goalie, good coach” thing. But as we all know, the Wranglers aren’t exactly loaded with super high end prospects,  but they aren’t a veteran heavy team. He’s maximizing the talent on that team. Nothing against Pelletier/Zary/Phillips/Poirier of course, but they aren’t the regarded as blue chip guys

 

My take is we need to go outside.while I think Conroy would do a good job, he tutored under the previous regimes and is bound to have similar approaches.

Mitch love I'd like to see behind the bench but as an assistant.

 

I can't recall how far back you have to go to in this organization to find a gm that didn't inherit a coach.. coaches who didn't inherit assistants or bad them assigned to them (I personally think Muller was hired to buffer Daryl)

 

We have a unique opportunity here.. we already know we can't rebuild on the ice, but we can rebuild the upper culture. Start with the GM. A fresh voice vision and perspective. Hire a coach that matches that vision..let the coach hire assistants that complement their style..

 

Al these internal names are good quality competent people.. and I wouldn't hate it if any got the roles.. but personally I'd clean house..change the narrative from above. It's very possible the new coach would select familiar names for assistants etc thru a hiring process but it needs to be his call.

Huska might be the one guy I'd be seriously ok with if we stayed internal for coach. He's succeded under multiple regimes.

 

I just think at this point if you go with too much internal you won't see change. Not even saying the upper culture has been bad..it really hasn't ..but we obviously need different.

 

[travel_dude]

23 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

My take is we need to go outside.while I think Conroy would do a good job, he tutored under the previous regimes and is bound to have similar approaches.

Mitch love I'd like to see behind the bench but as an assistant.

 

I can't recall how far back you have to go to in this organization to find a gm that didn't inherit a coach.. coaches who didn't inherit assistants or bad them assigned to them (I personally think Muller was hired to buffer Daryl)

 

We have a unique opportunity here.. we already know we can't rebuild on the ice, but we can rebuild the upper culture. Start with the GM. A fresh voice vision and perspective. Hire a coach that matches that vision..let the coach hire assistants that complement their style..

 

Al these internal names are good quality competent people.. and I wouldn't hate it if any got the roles.. but personally I'd clean house..change the narrative from above. It's very possible the new coach would select familiar names for assistants etc thru a hiring process but it needs to be his call.

Huska might be the one guy I'd be seriously ok with if we stayed internal for coach. He's succeded under multiple regimes.

 

I just think at this point if you go with too much internal you won't see change. Not even saying the upper culture has been bad..it really hasn't ..but we obviously need different.

 

 

Yeah, I am leaning the same way.  The coach and GM change mean we can bring in a new crew.  Build from the ground up.  The culture was changed over the years.  There may have been some entitlement issues, but that really isn't the case now.  But the work hard to make up for lack of talent only takes you as far as the coaching strategy allows.  You compete, but you don't really get ahead.  One of the goals was to make the Dome a feared place to visit.  Well, the only thing dangerous about playing the Flames at home was getting injured.  Clearly, the home advantage didn't exist.  Once we were down a goal after a period or two, it never seemed like we would be able to win it.  That's on the coach's for not using the advantages and on the players for playing inside the box and not using their talents to get past that.

 

Huska is about the only A/coach I would consider.  Even then I wonder if he was too much a part of an overall losing strategy.  We still has issues with defense and it wasn't just goaltending.  If there are better ideas coming from a new coach, then maybe we need to part ways.

[redfire11]

55 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Yeah, I am leaning the same way.  The coach and GM change mean we can bring in a new crew.  Build from the ground up.  The culture was changed over the years.  There may have been some entitlement issues, but that really isn't the case now.  But the work hard to make up for lack of talent only takes you as far as the coaching strategy allows.  You compete, but you don't really get ahead.  One of the goals was to make the Dome a feared place to visit.  Well, the only thing dangerous about playing the Flames at home was getting injured.  Clearly, the home advantage didn't exist.  Once we were down a goal after a period or two, it never seemed like we would be able to win it.  That's on the coach's for not using the advantages and on the players for playing inside the box and not using their talents to get past that.

 

Huska is about the only A/coach I would consider.  Even then I wonder if he was too much a part of an overall losing strategy.  We still has issues with defense and it wasn't just goaltending.  If there are better ideas coming from a new coach, then maybe we need to part ways.

"Say What" signed the Kraken

[travel_dude]

31 minutes ago, redfire11 said:

"Say What" signed the Kraken

 

The end of the line says it all "coaching strategy allows".  Seattle is fast and offensive.

And key to us not getting ahead was overuse of the less skilled or using a strategy design for less skilled play.  Key minutes to lesser players when we needed a goal.

 

[jjgallow]

On 4/27/2023 at 12:32 PM, cross16 said:

 

Sorry I should clarify and expand because I have no problem with former players working in management, i just want them to earn their roles. The idea I don't like is brining in former franchise icons back to the franchise, especially in roles they are not qualified for. Yzerman had to work as a special assistant an then had to leave to be a GM elsewhere before Detroit hired him. What I don't like is the Bobby Clarke, Trevor Linden, Rob Blake approach when they aren't qualified and likely get the jobs due to their name more than anything else. 

 

If Iginla wants to come here then he should build up his profile as a special assistant to the GM. I'd have no problem with that.

 

Should also admit the approach isn't that common anymore. Most people that want to be executives build their careers up post playing. Was an approach I just really disliked in the 90s-2000s. Can add Cam Neely to this list of people who have done very well with it. 

 

I agree with this.

 

Never good to have an inexperienced figurehead as your GM.

 

It's too the point that I also generally don't like the idea of franchise players as GMs.   EVEN when they've earned it.

 

I see the situation with Iginla a little differently though.  I do think he is one of the more intelligent players out there.   Comes across as a thinker, and well spoken.   Likely has the tools to surround himself with the right people.  Not an obvious ego risk either.

 

 

[travel_dude]

6 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I agree with this.

 

Never good to have an inexperienced figurehead as your GM.

 

It's too the point that I also generally don't like the idea of franchise players as GMs.   EVEN when they've earned it.

 

I see the situation with Iginla a little differently though.  I do think he is one of the more intelligent players out there.   Comes across as a thinker, and well spoken.   Likely has the tools to surround himself with the right people.  Not an obvious ego risk either.

 

 

 

As far as Iggy goes, he will always be the face of the Flames.  That's not enough to be the GM.  Is he running any big organizations or have experience managing contracts?  Yes he can surround himself with those, but I want the GM out there making calls, getting stuff done.  If Iggy would come back as head of development or pro evaluation or something like that, then fine.  Assuming those are areas that need improvements.

 

I have often wondered about Plett.  Is he good at evaluation of pros and the fit with the team or coach wasn't there?  Or is he a poor judge of talent?  Toffoli is a good fit.  Jarnkrok wasn't.  Neal wasn't.  Brouwer wasn't.  Weegar and Huberdeau seem to be, but success is tough to measure when the players seem to have been used wrong.  What was the issue with claiming TT off waivers?  GM, coach or pro scouting?  Or just cap?

[taz89]

Would Iggy consider coaching?  I think he would do great, maybe as an assistant?

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, taz89 said:

Would Iggy consider coaching?  I think he would do great, maybe as an assistant?

He might do better than Roy did.  

But, I think we need someone from the current era not from the Sutter days of play.

Just kidding.  I think Brunette would have a better chance at success (former player that is).

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, taz89 said:

Would Iggy consider coaching?  I think he would do great, maybe as an assistant?

 

Iginla is currently coaching kids hockey in Kelowna.  He spoke 2 days ago about the Flames and hopes Conroy gets the GM job.

 

https://theathletic.com/4471998/2023/04/30/iginla-conroy-flames/

[taz89]

3 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Iginla is currently coaching kids hockey in Kelowna.  He spoke 2 days ago about the Flames and hopes Conroy gets the GM job.

 

https://theathletic.com/4471998/2023/04/30/iginla-conroy-flames/

Seems like he's tied up and wouldn't be able to commit to this.  Andrew Brunette IMO would be a good choice, but i guess it's up to the future GM.

[jjgallow]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

As far as Iggy goes, he will always be the face of the Flames.  That's not enough to be the GM.  Is he running any big organizations or have experience managing contracts?  Yes he can surround himself with those, but I want the GM out there making calls, getting stuff done.  If Iggy would come back as head of development or pro evaluation or something like that, then fine.  Assuming those are areas that need improvements.

 

I have often wondered about Plett.  Is he good at evaluation of pros and the fit with the team or coach wasn't there?  Or is he a poor judge of talent?  Toffoli is a good fit.  Jarnkrok wasn't.  Neal wasn't.  Brouwer wasn't.  Weegar and Huberdeau seem to be, but success is tough to measure when the players seem to have been used wrong.  What was the issue with claiming TT off waivers?  GM, coach or pro scouting?  Or just cap?

 

I just think he has a way with people, and I think that's important.

 

it's the exact same reason that I would be a good candidate.

[cross16]

22 hours ago, taz89 said:

Seems like he's tied up and wouldn't be able to commit to this.  Andrew Brunette IMO would be a good choice, but i guess it's up to the future GM.

 

 

I like Mitch Love as the clubhouse favorite but I 100% agree he should get an interview. 

[The_People1]

32 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I like Mitch Love as the clubhouse favorite but I 100% agree he should get an interview. 

 

Might as well let Huberdeau choose our next coach while we are at it.  Since his contract is untradeable, he will be here for the next 8-years.  Andrew Brunette it is.  Luckily Brunette appears totally qualified.