Johnny Gaudreau

[sak22]

2 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

But... it's well known Gaudreau wants to play in PHI and has not engaged the Flames in... well, at all.

It depends on what you hear and what you believe at this point.  I've heard there have been discussions but not much traction, but wouldn't put that in the column with not engaging.  Also Leonard had 2 LA options, only one Flyers in the league.

[robrob74]

4 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Of course we have enough talent to make the playoffs. We just won't have enough game breakers to win the Cup so I ask why bother in that case.

I actually don’t think we have enough to make the playoffs. Can the PP improve or stay the same without Gaudreau? 
 

you take about 35-40 goals out of the lineup without him. That’s the setups and ones he scored. People will score without him but the Flames need to replace his playmaker abilities and we already saw how low we were when he was shut down. 
 

do we have any playmakers to go to to replace that? 
 

im gonna get roasted for the opinion but… 

[travel_dude]

11 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

I actually don’t think we have enough to make the playoffs. Can the PP improve or stay the same without Gaudreau? 
 

you take about 35-40 goals out of the lineup without him. That’s the setups and ones he scored. People will score without him but the Flames need to replace his playmaker abilities and we already saw how low we were when he was shut down. 
 

do we have any playmakers to go to to replace that? 
 

im gonna get roasted for the opinion but… 

 

Roasted?  Naw, I don't think so.  Without replacing him, we are not close to where we were.  But then again, we wouldn't be standing pat.  You might see a Hamilton type deal made or a big UFA signing or trading players with value for players with value.

 

I would hold off until end of camp to define what we are as a team.  Until then, we just don't know.  Many thought that Gio gone meant we were a non-playoff team.  Having Guddy, Zaddy and Kyl was not a NHL defense.  

[sak22]

9 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

I actually don’t think we have enough to make the playoffs. Can the PP improve or stay the same without Gaudreau? 
 

you take about 35-40 goals out of the lineup without him. That’s the setups and ones he scored. People will score without him but the Flames need to replace his playmaker abilities and we already saw how low we were when he was shut down. 
 

do we have any playmakers to go to to replace that? 
 

im gonna get roasted for the opinion but… 

If you take 35-40 goals away from the team last year do we make the playoffs?  I'd say easily because they still would've had a +40 or higher goal differential, I couldn't see any team missing with that differential.  I don't know how many times I've said this offseason, but keep the goals against down and the team will be fine.  But I guess we're going to struggle winning those 9-1 games against the Coyotes next year if he leaves, so.

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

37 minutes ago, sak22 said:

If you take 35-40 goals away from the team last year do we make the playoffs?  I'd say easily because they still would've had a +40 or higher goal differential, I couldn't see any team missing with that differential.  I don't know how many times I've said this offseason, but keep the goals against down and the team will be fine.  But I guess we're going to struggle winning those 9-1 games against the Coyotes next year if he leaves, so.

You're going to be needing that GIF alot with this crowd for the next little while.

 

Johnny will sign. I'm not sure why people seem to take rumor as gospel but whatever. 

[cross16]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

But... it's well known Gaudreau wants to play in PHI and has not engaged the Flames in... well, at all.

I don’t think thats what has occurred here. 

 

Kawahi also never went public to say he would consider playing in Toronto. He made efforts to squash any idea he wanted to be in Toronto as did his family 

[rickross]

1 hour ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

You're going to be needing that GIF alot with this crowd for the next little while.

 

Johnny will sign. I'm not sure why people seem to take rumor as gospel but whatever. 

Yeah don’t think that necessarily the case here. I think ppl are now started to see the writing on the wall with 24hrs remaining and no signs of progress that’s being reported of course. I’m not surprised if JH Atleast waits to see offers come Wednesday…he’s earned that right. Is Kadri the right kind of supplement? If Kadri isn’t available what really are BT’s contingency plans? He’s had a long time to prepare for this day 

[DHT]

1 hour ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

You're going to be needing that GIF alot with this crowd for the next little while.

 

Johnny will sign. I'm not sure why people seem to take rumor as gospel but whatever. 

From the date of my last posting on this thread, I have a feeling that he will walk, and this feeling haven't subsided yet. He loves his family and he wants to be near home. His home is in NJ. I want to be wrong here. His jersey is the first Flames jersey that I bought ,so I hope I can continue to wear it without ridicule. LOL

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

You're going to be needing that GIF alot with this crowd for the next little while.

 

Johnny will sign. I'm not sure why people seem to take rumor as gospel but whatever. 

 

Huh?  If Gaudreau signs then why would Sak need that GIF a lot around here?

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Huh?  If Gaudreau signs then why would Sak need that GIF a lot around here?

JH will sign at the 11th hour.  Until then everyones got their stoies to believe in. 

[The_People1]

14 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

JH will sign at the 11th hour.  Until then everyones got their stoies to believe in. 

 

I hope he signs.  So we can all move forward with our sanity intact.  

[rickross]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

I hope he signs.  So we can all move forward with our sanity intact.  

I think Craig Conroy is the X factor here! He was talking smack early in the season….promising to get it done, pretty sure the man said he was “Santa Claus handing out contracts!” We are so screwed lol

[jjgallow]

7 hours ago, sak22 said:

If you take 35-40 goals away from the team last year do we make the playoffs?  I'd say easily because they still would've had a +40 or higher goal differential, I couldn't see any team missing with that differential.  I don't know how many times I've said this offseason, but keep the goals against down and the team will be fine.  But I guess we're going to struggle winning those 9-1 games against the Coyotes next year if he leaves, so.

 

With risk of seeming Jekyl and Hyde, I think there is much to miss in Gaudreau in the regular season.

 

Pound for pound, Gaudreau is the most talented player in hockey right now.  Not McDavid, not Makar.   You fire him up with a great coach in a contract year, he's going to be unstoppable in the regular season and he was.

 

If you want to know his impact, you need not look further than the playoffs.  Because in the playoffs, well, his impact is severely blunted.   In the playoffs, we were pummelled.   So there's that answer.

 

During the regular season, he's much, much more than +35 goals.   His points, his posession....all of it...it's unreal.  Even if I'm wrong though, and we make the playoffs without him, I would ask if that's really acceptable.  To squeak in.

 

I always liked Gaudreau.  I always liked Fleury.  We've been through this before.  Smaller player.  Effective in regular season.   Not so much in the playoffs.   Gaudreau was a more extreme example of both.

 

If I could do it all over again with the Fleury days, woulda traded him as much as I was a fan, because we lost all those years in terms of the playoffs.   Gaudreau, even moreso.  Especiallly against the contender teams (imho we never got far enough to even see that though).

 

Losing Gaudreau isn't going to hurt us as a playoff team.  But losing him for nothing, does hurt.   He's also iconic, of course.  Who will be that next icon for us?     IMHO they have not yet been drafted.   

[rocketdoctor]

2 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

 

 

If you want to know his impact, you need not look further than the playoffs.  Because in the playoffs, well, his impact is severely blunted.   In the playoffs, we were pummelled.   So there's that answer.

 

 

 

Not saying there is not room for some more in the playoffs but 14 points in 12 games, only 3 on the PP, and an OT series winner I am not sure how much more you want from him.    He showed us last year that he can perform in the playoffs whereas previously he has been a lot quieter.  His linemates in this years playoffs maybe less so.

 

[conundrumed]

14 hours ago, jjgallow said:

Well,

 

I wanted a rebuild, and I'm going to get one.   Not many other outcomes to giving away your most valuable asset for free in a league with this much parity, again.

 

the length of the rebuild, and the level of pain, that wasn't part of my plan.

 

I know BT is going to be defended on here and elsewhere, I already know people are going to say it was "out of his hands", even though we've known for 5 years that our most valuable asset wanted out and would leave at first opportunity, something we kept denying in here, but knew.

 

I'll say it once.    I already know what people will think,

 

This Should be a fireable offense, BT should go.   They should bring in someone new, and they should do scorched earth.   If you're going to rebuild, the least you could do is have a shot at Bedard for the sake of your poor fans.

 

But it seems pretty clear right now that they will keep BT, and they will "soldier on" with a mediocre season followed by x  number of declines before it is obvious to everyone that the rebuild started some time ago.

 

p.s...we will have one saving grace imho.   The Erixon/Fox curse.

         Whoever acquires Gaudreau will never win a cup.  And likely never win a round in the playoffs (I feel this will be a much stronger curse than Fox).

The problem being, there wasn't really a good time to trade him. We won the division and most talking heads had our chances on par, or even exceeding, Toronto's chances.

But it ain't over until it's over(how insightful). So we can hope for the best. But I won't be happy if this hits $10.5-11.

So if he goes, and that's the number, I really can't blame BT.

I'd balk at it myself, soooo....I can't blame him.

In that scenario, it all comes down to how BT shifts his focus. I won't understand JG's stance at all though.

"Closer to home, closer to family". That's overplayed and overrated. You make $10 per and have 3 months off. I think you can probably afford to put your friends and family up, all day, every day, wherever.

Then the flip side. Great, I'm home. Good luck with the weight of expectations. If it doesn't go well, does he revert back to whiny Johnny that gets distracted way too easy?

Forget the romanticism, there are 2 very distinct sides to this coin.

I should get an 800 number and give advice.lol

 

[jjgallow]

4 hours ago, rocketdoctor said:

 

Not saying there is not room for some more in the playoffs but 14 points in 12 games, only 3 on the PP, and an OT series winner I am not sure how much more you want from him.    He showed us last year that he can perform in the playoffs whereas previously he has been a lot quieter.  His linemates in this years playoffs maybe less so.

 

 

He was effective in the first series but Dallas was pretty borderline in terms of being a playoff hockey team

[jjgallow]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

The problem being, there wasn't really a good time to trade him. We won the division and most talking heads had our chances on par, or even exceeding, Toronto's chances.

But it ain't over until it's over(how insightful). So we can hope for the best. But I won't be happy if this hits $10.5-11.

So if he goes, and that's the number, I really can't blame BT.

I'd balk at it myself, soooo....I can't blame him.

In that scenario, it all comes down to how BT shifts his focus. I won't understand JG's stance at all though.

"Closer to home, closer to family". That's overplayed and overrated. You make $10 per and have 3 months off. I think you can probably afford to put your friends and family up, all day, every day, wherever.

Then the flip side. Great, I'm home. Good luck with the weight of expectations. If it doesn't go well, does he revert back to whiny Johnny that gets distracted way too easy?

Forget the romanticism, there are 2 very distinct sides to this coin.

I should get an 800 number and give advice.lol

 

 

I agree that there is no blame to be laid foe letting him go now.  The price is too high and the playoff payback isn't there.   It's like a contract to lock the team into x years of playoff disappointment and cap issues.

 

I don't blame BT for deciding to let him go, I blame him for waiting until now.   And of course there's no good time but BT's there to make those hard decisions, so that we can have a future.

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

11 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

He was effective in the first series but Dallas was pretty borderline in terms of being a playoff hockey team

The problem is that pretty much describes everyone in the lineup. Everyone played their part in the first series as much as everyone fell apart in the next one.

[jjgallow]

1 hour ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

The problem is that pretty much describes everyone in the lineup. Everyone played their part in the first series as much as everyone fell apart in the next one.

 

You're 100% right.

 

Thus my scorched earth recommendation.  I place a lot of weight on playoff performance.    Of course I understand and appreciate those who want to believe in the current core, it's honorable.    And most likely, we will keep it.

 

Some exceptions:  I actually thought Backlund was good in the postseason.   I've always included him in a scorched earth player sell but he's getting to the age now where the return wouldn't be great.  Could be more valuable as a mentor.

 

Honorable mention to Mangiapane, Coleman, Stone, Kylington, Tanev, Zadarov.   The only two having a return value being Mangiapane and Kylington.    IMHO you definitely keep Kylington.  Mangiapane I could go either way on but we can probably afford to have one smaller player now given what's likely about to happen with JG.

 

[The_People1]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

The problem being, there wasn't really a good time to trade him. We won the division and most talking heads had our chances on par, or even exceeding, Toronto's chances.

But it ain't over until it's over(how insightful). So we can hope for the best. But I won't be happy if this hits $10.5-11.

So if he goes, and that's the number, I really can't blame BT.

I'd balk at it myself, soooo....I can't blame him.

In that scenario, it all comes down to how BT shifts his focus. I won't understand JG's stance at all though.

"Closer to home, closer to family". That's overplayed and overrated. You make $10 per and have 3 months off. I think you can probably afford to put your friends and family up, all day, every day, wherever.

Then the flip side. Great, I'm home. Good luck with the weight of expectations. If it doesn't go well, does he revert back to whiny Johnny that gets distracted way too easy?

Forget the romanticism, there are 2 very distinct sides to this coin.

I should get an 800 number and give advice.lol

 

I would venture to guess some of the decision to go back to NJ is happy wife happy life.  If it was up to Johnny, then he probably signed already... But it's probably not only his decision to make.

[rickross]

Tick. Tock. We are really running out of time here. I had always hoped we’d be able to extend Gaudreau but the optics of radio silence aren’t looking too great right now. This is getting too close for comfort! Cmon Johnny sign on the line!!

[travel_dude]

17 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I would venture to guess some of the decision to go back to NJ is happy wife happy life.  If it was up to Johnny, then he probably signed already... But it's probably not only his decision to make.

 

His agent is trying to squeeze every last dime out of the Flames.  JH wasn't going to get in the middle of that.  He hasn't lost anything or had to make a decision yet.  By the sounds of it, the Flames are caving in.  It won't come down to money.  While I agree that his relatives may live in NJ, most of his friends live here.  His wife may have her family there, but do you only ever lean on them or do you spend time every day with your friends?  The WAGs of Calgary are probably closer to her.  They share similar experiences. 

 

I am over thinking it, the same way that people that suggest they need to be around their families 24/7.  Road trips exist for every team.  He won't be any more available than he would be in a different city.   

[The_People1]

5 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

His agent is trying to squeeze every last dime out of the Flames.  JH wasn't going to get in the middle of that.  He hasn't lost anything or had to make a decision yet.  By the sounds of it, the Flames are caving in.  It won't come down to money.  While I agree that his relatives may live in NJ, most of his friends live here.  His wife may have her family there, but do you only ever lean on them or do you spend time every day with your friends?  The WAGs of Calgary are probably closer to her.  They share similar experiences. 

 

I am over thinking it, the same way that people that suggest they need to be around their families 24/7.  Road trips exist for every team.  He won't be any more available than he would be in a different city.   

 

I don't blame Gaudreau if he leaves.  He's a UFA.  It's his right.  

 

If anything, it's all BT's fault for miscommunication with Gaudreau's camp or misjudged the market.  BT didn't want to be the GM who trades Gaudreau but it's no better to be the GM who let Gaudreau walk away.

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I don't blame Gaudreau if he leaves.  He's a UFA.  It's his right.  

 

If anything, it's all BT's fault for miscommunication with Gaudreau's camp or misjudged the market.  BT didn't want to be the GM who trades Gaudreau but it's no better to be the GM who let Gaudreau walk away.

 

My bone of contention was he went in with an offer of less than $10M.  If you are serious and want to make him the franchise player, make the offer such that he knows it's this or less than the open market.  I don't mean a final offer, but coming in $1,5M less than you are willing to pay doesn't make it move fast.

[The_People1]

16 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

My bone of contention was he went in with an offer of less than $10M.  If you are serious and want to make him the franchise player, make the offer such that he knows it's this or less than the open market.  I don't mean a final offer, but coming in $1,5M less than you are willing to pay doesn't make it move fast.

 

For sures.  The league was shocked when the Leafs gave Auston Matthews that huge contract while RFA but there was a real threat that Matthews wanted to go home to Arizona and sign an offer sheet with the Coyotes.

 

When the threat is real, then you do what you have to do.