WHO ARE THE CALGARY FLAMES???

[MP5029]

5 hours ago, ABC923 said:

It sure seems like the room is broken. It’s tough, in a normal year maybe you go shoot each other with paintball or something, but this year you’re not even allowed to play a few rounds of CoD in a hotel room together. No team bonding, so problems can fester. I wouldn’t be shocked if we start hearing a few more trade requests soon, Tkachuk seems checked out for instance.

Yup it’s clear there’s something wrong in the locker room, and I think it’s Ward, time for him to go!

 

this team should be the one of the most tight knit teams in the NHL as the majority of them (core) have been together for 5 years but their play looks like a bunch of first year midget players.

[LouCifer]

To answer the forum topic question at this point in the season:

Soft. Fragile. Disjointed. Divided. Lost. 

[dieselmarble]

51 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

To answer the forum topic question at this point in the season:

Soft. Fragile. Disjointed. Divided. Lost. 

 

 

Agree 100%, small defense corps who can't move anyone from the front of the net.  Small forwards, speedy, not really but too small and scared to go to the net. When has anyone seen the flames crowd the goalie,, never maybe one guy in the area. Soft BOA hardly any hits, big guys next to no hits, no fights. Afraid to crash the net, almost all shots from the boards, easy for any goalie. NO Grit, NO Heart, NO Balz, NO Hitting, NO Fighting, NO CLearing the Net, NO Crowding the Opp Goalie.  NO HARD PLAYERS HERE, JUST SOFT

 

[robrob74]

7 hours ago, dieselmarble said:

 

 

Agree 100%, small defense corps who can't move anyone from the front of the net.  Small forwards, speedy, not really but too small and scared to go to the net. When has anyone seen the flames crowd the goalie,, never maybe one guy in the area. Soft BOA hardly any hits, big guys next to no hits, no fights. Afraid to crash the net, almost all shots from the boards, easy for any goalie. NO Grit, NO Heart, NO Balz, NO Hitting, NO Fighting, NO CLearing the Net, NO Crowding the Opp Goalie.  NO HARD PLAYERS HERE, JUST SOFT

 

 

see, we have made some good picks, but at the same time no one to come up and fill old spots. 
 

Hanifin and Tanev have been really good. Andersson and Valamaki are part of the future, so who do you trade? 
 

I get you, there’s no hate in our D. They play too nice. I don’t mean brawl when I say stick up for teammates, there are other ways to do it. Some say, score and win and that’s the best way to show the other team, but I also think there’s a bit of sending a message. I don’t think doing fly-by hockey does that. 

[dieselmarble]

Valamaki is weak as they come for clearing that net, in reality they all are. The only guys I've seen who clear the front of the net are not on the flames team. The team couldn't score goals last year and nothing was done to address it so what do we expect the outcome to be. Time to clear out the dead weight even if some contracts have to be bought out. 

 

[dieselmarble]

WHO ARE THE CALGARY FLAMES.. Well they are the team you want to play if you are in a funk or need an easy 2 points.. They are the Maple Leaf's of old. The identity is SOFT DEFENSE can't clear the blue paint, DON'T STAND in front of the opposing goal tender. SHOOT PUCKS from the boards, DON'T CHARGE The Net. A POWER PLAY that only 2 guys can skate the puck into the opposing zone. 1 BIG GUY who doesn't fight or hit just looks grumpy. LITTLE GUYS Who are Not Fast. ONLY 1 player with any heart and passion for the game and to win at all costs, Chuckie. A Captian who is old/slow and complacent. DECENT GOALIES who need to face a lot of shots from 2 feet out because DEFENSE IS SOFT. A COACH who needs to go. A SYSTEM that does not work. A GM who does the minimum.  AM I WRONG, I DON'T THINK SO. ITS THE REALITY OF THIS TEAM AND I'M A  PISSED OFF FAN.

[MP5029]

1 hour ago, dieselmarble said:

WHO ARE THE CALGARY FLAMES.. Well they are the team you want to play if you are in a funk or need an easy 2 points.. They are the Maple Leaf's of old. The identity is SOFT DEFENSE can't clear the blue paint, DON'T STAND in front of the opposing goal tender. SHOOT PUCKS from the boards, DON'T CHARGE The Net. A POWER PLAY that only 2 guys can skate the puck into the opposing zone. 1 BIG GUY who doesn't fight or hit just looks grumpy. LITTLE GUYS Who are Not Fast. ONLY 1 player with any heart and passion for the game and to win at all costs, Chuckie. A Captian who is old/slow and complacent. DECENT GOALIES who need to face a lot of shots from 2 feet out because DEFENSE IS SOFT. A COACH who needs to go. A SYSTEM that does not work. A GM who does the minimum.  AM I WRONG, I DON'T THINK SO. ITS THE REALITY OF THIS TEAM AND I'M A  PISSED OFF FAN.

I think at this point...5 years of foolishness and building and saying give them time

to learn is more than enough..he’ll Edm started a year or two after us and we are still “growing?” Unacceptable period and every fan has a right to be pissed right off at this point.

[pikey7883]

I didn’t know where to put this as parts of it apply in many different places. 
1. Who are the Calgary Flames? Their LOST, IMO the players believe they are a fast skilled team that can run with the best of them. The coaches however have them playing a different game, and I can’t even identify which style the coaches want them to play because it’s so sporadic, sometimes a heavy dump and chase, but then there are so many times we gain the zone and then button hook back and patrol the perimeter. I think there is confusion in the players heads of what they could be and what they’re being asked to be.

2. Captain or Leadership? I think Gio’s tenure is up, not as a solid d man, but as a lead by example tough high minute all situation defender. The problem with this is we do not have the guy to step into that role, Tkachuk may be evolving into it, but he is not ready yet. We can also not strip Gio of the C and leave him on this team, I actually think we can make a trade with Toronto by retaining 50% in exchange for a 1st, and taking back someone like Keefoot to balance it out. 
I suggest this, because it sends a message to the team, it also shows loyalty to Gio by trading him to a contender and his hometown (where he can go in a be very good without being the guy). But I also want to show the team if your not cutting it here then we are not afraid to move you, and there is no help coming, this is on you guys to figure it out. 
3. Coaching? This goes hand in hand with Leadership and poor decision making. It is time to tell this team that the inmates are no longer ruling this team, which is why I want to see Gallant come in and grab this team and show them how to become winners, which is also why Gio would have to go. It comes with a statement that everything prior to now was not good enough, and Gallant is the new leader, we have no captain at this point, we will figure that out later.

I also really like Gallants style as he promotes an up tempo style game, with lots of pressure in transition, he likes to activate his d men. He also took a team of outcasts and built them into a Stanley Cup contender. He knows how to make players into a team, a team that stands up for each other and fights for each other. 
4. GM? I still like treliving, I believe he has been building us into a faster more aggressive team, kind of like having a bunch of puck hungry pit bulls on our team. Mang, Dube, Benny, Tkachuk, Pelletier, Zary. They are all guys that play with a lot of intensity and have a propensity to be relentless in their pursuit of the puck. The unfortunate part is they all small and Left Handed. But I think he has a vision for this team, and when they play that way we have seen the results. 
 

End of Rant

[LouCifer]

Great post Pikey! 
 

I also just read a great article that I think sums up everything that needs to be said about the Calgary flames. I was never a fan of Jeremy Franklin, but new Flames correspondent Salim Valji with TSN is quickly becoming my favorite flames read. I love that his writing approach isn’t vindictive or negative, but truthful and honest - despite if it’s detailing positives or negatives. Please have a read. 
 

https://www.tsn.ca/1.1596915.1614007446

 

 

[JTech780]

I am going preface this post by saying that I didn't actually watch or listen to this interview, and it has nothing to do with Backlund.

 

My issue is that everytime I have heard a Flames player say that they are expecting the other team to come out hard and they better be prepared for that push, they do the opposite and come out flat. This goes back the last few years so it has nothing to do with coaching. Hopefully tonight is different, I just don't have a lot of hope that it will be.

 

Sorry to be negative, but it is so frustrating that they know what they have to do, but just don't do it, and it happens over and over again.

[MP5029]

33 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

I am going preface this post by saying that I didn't actually watch or listen to this interview, and it has nothing to do with Backlund.

 

My issue is that everytime I have heard a Flames player say that they are expecting the other team to come out hard and they better be prepared for that push, they do the opposite and come out flat. This goes back the last few years so it has nothing to do with coaching. Hopefully tonight is different, I just don't have a lot of hope that it will be.

 

Sorry to be negative, but it is so frustrating that they know what they have to do, but just don't do it, and it happens over and over again.

Your not being negative your being a realist, cause this is exactly what they say and do for years now and the fan base is quite frankly sick and tired of the predictable disappointment.

 

it’s why many of us are calling for some changes to the core and coaching staff as the room culture is and has been this for far too long! 
 

with nay luck BT can manage some changes, but it’s a bad year with a flat cap and restricted player movement across boarders...

[robrob74]

4 hours ago, MP5029 said:

Your not being negative your being a realist, cause this is exactly what they say and do for years now and the fan base is quite frankly sick and tired of the predictable disappointment.

 

it’s why many of us are calling for some changes to the core and coaching staff as the room culture is and has been this for far too long! 
 

with nay luck BT can manage some changes, but it’s a bad year with a flat cap and restricted player movement across boarders...

yup! I agree. And o think I was tired of it way too early compared to almost everyone else. JJ will always be JJ until we draft the Second Coming of Roy, and doing a rebuild the right way. Same with People/minus the need for the Roy, but a really good goalie and a correct rebuild. 
 

but it’s safe to say this team has had  a trend every year. 

[travel_dude]

5 hours ago, JTech780 said:

I am going preface this post by saying that I didn't actually watch or listen to this interview, and it has nothing to do with Backlund.

 

My issue is that everytime I have heard a Flames player say that they are expecting the other team to come out hard and they better be prepared for that push, they do the opposite and come out flat. This goes back the last few years so it has nothing to do with coaching. Hopefully tonight is different, I just don't have a lot of hope that it will be.

 

Sorry to be negative, but it is so frustrating that they know what they have to do, but just don't do it, and it happens over and over again.

 

The things they say seem to be the same every game.

Show me the effort and I will watch this after the fact.

[rickross]

20 games in and no closer to defining who or what this team is. If anything the Flames do not look like they have fun playing in Wards system. There’s skill on this team but we don’t such much creativity on the ice. There’s no discipline to this team either, constantly taking penalties...the players just give up too often and leave the team out to dry killing off PPs. It’s almost the halfway mark and it still not looking promising and we still have yet to define exactly who this team is...other than frustrating 

[dieselmarble]

Just not a good team thats who they are. Watching the flames ottawa game. Definately not a good team.

[rickross]

It’s a that point where I actually just expect them to lose the game now. If my belief level in this team is that low I can’t imagine how the players are feeling getting embarrassed nightly. They playing bottom tier hockey right now, I don’t believe anything the players or coaches say prior to games anymore. We’d be crazy to think things will just magically improve with this current team. It’s looking like the Flames season was over before it even started. 

[rickross]

The Flames are playing like some hot trash. I’m talking trash that only has used baby diapers and old Indian food in it, that’s been sitting in 30 degree heat for a month. We suck is our identity right now. 

Its funny, u keep hearing about the Flames needing to just “ find their game again”. Lol...and what game is that exactly ? Consistently bounced by the 1st rd type of game? That’s what we’re striving for here? There is NO GAME to rediscover , over the years there’s really nothing to build off of. Our game is inconsistency, that is the Flames true identity. Sadly that is exactly who we are, a team that losses consistently because of inconsistency. 

[Thebrewcrew]

There are 3 ways for this years Flames team to win a game.

 

-Flames goalie steals the game.

-Opposing goalie has a bad game. 
-They score two or more goals on the PP

[robrob74]

52 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

There are 3 ways for this years Flames team to win a game.

 

-Flames goalie steals the game.

-Opposing goalie has a bad game. 
-They score two or more goals on the PP

 

My answer to this: Play harder and draw more penalties.

[rickross]

I started this thread with the intent to determine the identity of this team. The irony is I now realize, this isn’t a team at all. 
 

I think for years the idea has been that the core of a team consists of a foundation of players. It’s wrong. The core should always be what makes a team a “team”. The heartbeat! Sadly these Flames are flatlining right now. We got so caught up with right shot D man, 1st line RW, workhorse goaltender, that we’ve forgot how to build a team. We’re just filling gaps with individuals who don’t know how to play together as a collective. Maybe this is the season the Flames learn how to be a team again. Until then we will continue to be this wandering aimless franchise

[dieselmarble]

You can put lipstick on a Pig and you all know the results. On their best day they are a mid range team. Take away the HYPE and HOPE and WHAT IF'S and its hard to disagree you get what you get. A BELOW AVERAGE TEAM PLAYING LIKE A BELOW AVERAGE TEAM BECAUSE THATS WHO THEY ARE.

[travel_dude]

On 2/21/2021 at 10:36 AM, pikey7883 said:

I didn’t know where to put this as parts of it apply in many different places. 
1. Who are the Calgary Flames? Their LOST, IMO the players believe they are a fast skilled team that can run with the best of them. The coaches however have them playing a different game, and I can’t even identify which style the coaches want them to play because it’s so sporadic, sometimes a heavy dump and chase, but then there are so many times we gain the zone and then button hook back and patrol the perimeter. I think there is confusion in the players heads of what they could be and what they’re being asked to be.

2. Captain or Leadership? I think Gio’s tenure is up, not as a solid d man, but as a lead by example tough high minute all situation defender. The problem with this is we do not have the guy to step into that role, Tkachuk may be evolving into it, but he is not ready yet. We can also not strip Gio of the C and leave him on this team, I actually think we can make a trade with Toronto by retaining 50% in exchange for a 1st, and taking back someone like Keefoot to balance it out. 
I suggest this, because it sends a message to the team, it also shows loyalty to Gio by trading him to a contender and his hometown (where he can go in a be very good without being the guy). But I also want to show the team if your not cutting it here then we are not afraid to move you, and there is no help coming, this is on you guys to figure it out. 
3. Coaching? This goes hand in hand with Leadership and poor decision making. It is time to tell this team that the inmates are no longer ruling this team, which is why I want to see Gallant come in and grab this team and show them how to become winners, which is also why Gio would have to go. It comes with a statement that everything prior to now was not good enough, and Gallant is the new leader, we have no captain at this point, we will figure that out later.

I also really like Gallants style as he promotes an up tempo style game, with lots of pressure in transition, he likes to activate his d men. He also took a team of outcasts and built them into a Stanley Cup contender. He knows how to make players into a team, a team that stands up for each other and fights for each other. 
4. GM? I still like treliving, I believe he has been building us into a faster more aggressive team, kind of like having a bunch of puck hungry pit bulls on our team. Mang, Dube, Benny, Tkachuk, Pelletier, Zary. They are all guys that play with a lot of intensity and have a propensity to be relentless in their pursuit of the puck. The unfortunate part is they all small and Left Handed. But I think he has a vision for this team, and when they play that way we have seen the results. 
 

End of Rant

 

Your rant is well directed.

 

I don't think it's the inmates running the asylum.  I think Nurse Cratchet is sending the wrong messages.  Dump and chase and battle for loose pucks is fine, if that is how you are built.  We are more than skilled enough to attack with the puck.  We are not using the best way to gain the zone, since it seems like the only time we try to hold onto the puck is during a PP.  The PP entry is a useless exercise, in that it forces us to gain the zone with the other team lining up.

 

The GM looked at things the team was missing or lost.  Pro scouting seems to be an issue, but I don't think the major pieces are the problem.  We added a goalie and a D-man that should have made us better.  Bring them into a broken environment, and it's going to be an issue.

 

I don't think Gio is the problem on reflection.  He's not helping get us out, but his heart is there.  Where he struggles is trying to take the team on his back.  Doing too much.

[rickross]

There is no team here. It’s so apparent. It’s why they struggle severely with consistency, there’s no team foundation right now. Why do they struggle with emotion and intensity? Again , this is not a team. There’s no soul here, it’s just X’s and O’s attempting to get executed. They don’t stand up for each nor do they play for each other because there is no concept of team to defend or play for. No amount of players only meetings will instill heart and soul to a team. This is an issue from the top down IMO. Management has simply failed to do its primary responsibility, build a team. 

[cross16]

I think we put too much focus on coaching and management like they can control every outcome. The product sucks this year but who is making the passes? who is making the decisions on the ice? Is Ward/Treliving the ones telling them to only play when it's easy, turn pucks over in the neutral zone? Fire blind passes every which way?

 

This isn't me advocating for anyone to keep their job. Everyone has their own reasons to fire/keep someone and to each their own. I'm past the point of even caring who gets fired because that all comes down to appeasement anyway. Firing Ward right now, or even Treliving for that matter, is just going to appease the fans and provide a short term boost. Time to get to the root of the issue and hold the players accountable. 

 

Here are 2 rants, 1 is post game yesterday from Milan Lucic and the other is Glen Gulutzan in a post game rant over 4 years ago in Montreal. Listen to them and see how similar they are.  The players have made their bed, time for them to lie in it and take whatever comes their way. 

 

 

 

[travel_dude]

38 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I think we put too much focus on coaching and management like they can control every outcome. The product sucks this year but who is making the passes? who is making the decisions on the ice? Is Ward/Treliving the ones telling them to only play when it's easy, turn pucks over in the neutral zone? Fire blind passes every which way?

 

The things he can control are the things that I see being questionable.

Players scratched when the ones that play the next game were as much the reason for failure.    

Use of Lindholm at C long past the time it showed the top 6 was struggling to score.

Parade of D-men into the 3rd pair.

I would not say the 3rd pair has been the worst, but there is no clear indication of players coming out are because they were bad or to play someone else.

Top pairing struggling with no end in sight.

Are there things the coach can do there?

 

Ultimately, the players own the problems because they are not playing at top form and not making up for bad plays enough.

But two lesser coaches not having success do not prove the coach is right. 

Lucic owns a few goals against scored on his watch.

Two games I can point to are a pass into Bennett's feet on the exit.

Example 1, comes back as a goal against, lazy backchecking.

Example 2, comes back as a goal against, lazy backchecking by Bennett.

That's not even counting the one where Lucic poked it into the middle of the ice and Gudbranson gets a goal.

No, I'm not harping on Lucic, because he cares and takes ownership for his mistakes.

 

If the coach feels this is an execution issue and the X's and O's are sound, then bench the guys that are not following or look like they aren't part of the solution.

Obviously, the D is not executing something correctly right now.

If the positioning doesn't match the plan, drill it into their heads.

What is with the 60 foot passes exiting the zone?

Why is the forward having so much space to enter the D-zone?

Do you expect a one man forecheck to do anything?

How is it the neutral zone is a free skate for other teams?