2024 NHL draft - A New Hope

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Small clarification. The decision point on the Florida pick is this year. If Florida is in the top 10 this year then they cannot complete the trade for Giroux, would keep their pick and send Philly their 2025 first. Be default that would give the Flames Florida 2026 first rounder. At that point, it no longer matters where Florida finishes. 

 

If, and this is looking to be the most likely scenario given Florida is already 13 points clear of the bottom 10 and playing well, Florida finishes outside the top 10 their 2024 first rounder goes to Philly and then the 2025 rounder goes to Calgary. There is no top 10 protection on that. 

 

Then the next decision point is next year's standings. If both CGY/Florida finish outside the top 10 Montreal gets the better of the 2. If CGY is top 10 and Florida isn't, Panthers pick goes to Montreal and it's done. 

 

so in order for the Flames to give up a top 10 pick, Florida essentially has to have a pretty epic collapse for the rest of the season. 

 

So, if I am reading it correctly (hate the double team conditions) you said that if Philly gets FLA's 2024 pick, we automatically get the FLA 2025 pick regardless of 1st overall or not.  When I look at the conditions in the CGY trade, it says that if 2025 is a lotto pick, we get the 2026 pick.

 

I tend to agree with the way you stated it here.

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, Sarasti said:

I hope I speak for everyone when I say conditional first rounders Blockchaining suck 

 

The unfortunate truth is that the lottery sucks.  Teams are willing to give up a pick when they don't think they have a chance at 1st overall.  But they are quick to realize that a future year may be different.

 

The bigger problem is that we were dumb enough to trade a first to move a player and get nothing in return.  That's contender stuff when you have a useless player to get rid of killing your cap.  Or you need to move a pick to get an exciting player in return at TDL.

[cross16]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

So, if I am reading it correctly (hate the double team conditions) you said that if Philly gets FLA's 2024 pick, we automatically get the FLA 2025 pick regardless of 1st overall or not.  When I look at the conditions in the CGY trade, it says that if 2025 is a lotto pick, we get the 2026 pick.

 

I tend to agree with the way you stated it here.

 

Yes sorry that was a typo on my part. There is no lottery protection if the Panthers can't send the 2025 pick to Calgary and it becomes the 2026. Correct that there is lottery protection on the 2025 for the Panthers. 

 

But to keep it simple this all boils down to the Panthers IMO. I think we know what the Flames are it's whether or not the Panthers have a collapse in them. 

 

If they collapse this season and somehow fall into the bottom 10, that's trouble because then the Flames won't get the 2025 first rounder.  

Next season if they fall off and wind up in the bottom 10 that's also trouble because it would mean Flames could give up a top 10 pick. 

 

Bottom line is become a Panthers fan for the next 18 months. 

 

[cross16]

1 hour ago, zima said:

So we don't have top 6 protection ? So if we picked between 1 and 6 they can take the pick ? As usual I'm confussed.

 

There are essentially 2 worst case scenarios for the Flames:

 

1. Flames lose a first rounder between 2 and 10 in the 2025 draft. In order for this to happen the Panthers would have to fall from top 10 to bottom 10 this year AND wind up as a lottery pick team next year. 

2.  The Flames could feasible give up the 1st overall pick in 2026. In order for this to happen all of the above has to happen in addition to the Flames winning the lottery and drafting 1st overall in 2025 and then winning it again in 2026

[cross16]

1 hour ago, Sarasti said:

I hope I speak for everyone when I say conditional first rounders Blockchaining suck 

 

I am a nerd so I think they are fun. 

 

Very much in the minority on that one i'm sure.

[Thebrewcrew]

 

[Ryan Man]

7 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

 

A beautiful story of dreams, hope, sacrifice and hopefully fulfilment. Great share, thanks BC.

[Thebrewcrew]

I think Ivan Demidov is going to be the #2 pick. He's a really dynamic player. The kind that sells tickets. What he's doing this season in the MHL has surpassed players like Kaprizov and Kucherov. His contract in Russia is also really manageable. I believe it's up after next season.

 

Levshunov or Dickinson will be the top D off the board IMO. I could see either going as high as 3rd. Silayev being under contract for two more years may be a hindrance to some teams.

 

Eiserman is a bit of a wildcard. Could go anywhere from 2nd to 7th.

[Thebrewcrew]

Zayne Parekh is an interesting one.

 

 

He's still only 17. Meaning he's two years away from being AHL eligible. That's ok, because he looks really skinny on the ice. He needs to fill out quite a bit.

 

His playing style reminds me of Brent Burns, in the sense that he's essentially a rover. Never shy about jumping into the play.  He's going to score 30+ this season as a 17yr old defenceman. That's pretty special. 

 

Saginaw is hosting the Memorial Cup, there's going to be a lot of high profile viewings of Parekh heading into draft season.

 

I like him. It's hard to find players like him. There's time for him to develop the defensive side of his game.

[The_People1]

9 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Zayne Parekh is an interesting one.

 

 

He's still only 17. Meaning he's two years away from being AHL eligible. That's ok, because he looks really skinny on the ice. He needs to fill out quite a bit.

 

His playing style reminds me of Brent Burns, in the sense that he's essentially a rover. Never shy about jumping into the play.  He's going to score 30+ this season as a 17yr old defenceman. That's pretty special. 

 

Saginaw is hosting the Memorial Cup, there's going to be a lot of high profile viewings of Parekh heading into draft season.

 

I like him. It's hard to find players like him. There's time for him to develop the defensive side of his game.

 

I feel we need to get another pick in the early 10s so we can take one of Yakemchuk or Parekh.  Both are RHS RD.  

 

I also want Tij Iginla around 12-15 range.

[420since1974]

Ideally to me; after the TDL trades, Calgary will end up with three 1st round draft picks this year.

One in the 7 - 12 range (Calgary's own), another in the 13 - 20 range (via Hanifin trade with NJ?), and the Canuck' late first round.

That would enable them to pick one of the Top 5 D in this draft with their own pick, a decent C (who might even be Iginla) with NJ's pick, and someone like Ritchie (RW) or Pettersson (C) with Vancouver's pick.

[jjgallow]

6 hours ago, 420since1974 said:

Ideally to me; after the TDL trades, Calgary will end up with three 1st round draft picks this year.

One in the 7 - 12 range (Calgary's own), another in the 13 - 20 range (via Hanifin trade with NJ?), and the Canuck' late first round.

That would enable them to pick one of the Top 5 D in this draft with their own pick, a decent C (who might even be Iginla) with NJ's pick, and someone like Ritchie (RW) or Pettersson (C) with Vancouver's pick.

 

that's my hope too.  We really need that top 5 D.     But they are going to be looking for Iginla, for sure.  And I don't blame them.    (even though I'm very experienced at it)

[Thebrewcrew]

I like Michael Hage, later in the first round.

 

Big RHS C. Looks like he will project as a centre at the next level. Wise base with his skating stance, looks a bit like Jack Eichel’s skating.

 

https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/597678/michael-hage
 

 

Luke Misa is also interesting. Bit of an older player in this class, this being his third year in the OHL. The Flames lack speed and this kid has a ton of it. Really creative too. He modems his game after Jesper Bratt, in a video he said.

https://www.eliteprospects.com/player/698042/luke-misa

 

 

 

[The_People1]

10 hours ago, 420since1974 said:

Ideally to me; after the TDL trades, Calgary will end up with three 1st round draft picks this year.

One in the 7 - 12 range (Calgary's own), another in the 13 - 20 range (via Hanifin trade with NJ?), and the Canuck' late first round.

That would enable them to pick one of the Top 5 D in this draft with their own pick, a decent C (who might even be Iginla) with NJ's pick, and someone like Ritchie (RW) or Pettersson (C) with Vancouver's pick.

 

Hanifin is going to a contender (aka 25th pick or later)

 

It's going to take trading Andersson or Weegar to BUF/OTT for their 1st round pick.  I think both BUF and OTT are motivated to trade for Andersson/Weegar because those teams are done rebuilding and want to push to win next year.  BUF/OTT could be picking anywhere from 5-10.  Same as the Flames.  

[robrob74]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Hanifin is going to a contender (aka 25th pick or later)

 

It's going to take trading Andersson or Weegar to BUF/OTT for their 1st round pick.  I think both BUF and OTT are motivated to trade for Andersson/Weegar because those teams are done rebuilding and want to push to win next year.  BUF/OTT could be picking anywhere from 5-10.  Same as the Flames.  

makes a lot of sense. If it is a top 10 pick and the Flames trade Andersson for that, it's like trading a Schneider to Jersey back in the day. Would they add to the deal or is it straight up. Andersson is a very good #2/3D on a very good contract. Weegar is on a decent contract. 

[The_People1]

7 hours ago, robrob74 said:

makes a lot of sense. If it is a top 10 pick and the Flames trade Andersson for that, it's like trading a Schneider to Jersey back in the day. Would they add to the deal or is it straight up. Andersson is a very good #2/3D on a very good contract. Weegar is on a decent contract. 

 

Right now OTT has the #5 overall pick.  They have Sanderson, Chabot, and Chychrun on LHS LD.  Total imbalance.

 

Weegar was born in OTT, probably would waive to go home and avoid rebuilding with the Flames.  Roster wise, what a perfect fit.  OTT needs that RHS RD top pair.

 

Flames could select Dickinson or Levshunov with the #5 overall.  Future #1 LD/RD.  There is risk for the Flames for sure so OTT would need to add.  But this feels like a good hockey trade where the Flames have 4/5 years to wait for Dickinson/Levshunov while OTT doesn't.  They want to win now.

 

.

After that, move Andersson to BUF or ARZ.  BUF has the 8th overall.  ARZ has the 6th. Standings are very fluid at this point needless to say.  At 6th, possible one of Dickinson or Levshunov is still available.  Take them.  If not, there's Parekh, Yakemchuk, and Jiricek.  That's three RHS RD to replace Andersson.  Obviously need to wait about 4-years.  BUF and ARZ doesn't want to wait anymore.  Their core is ready to push for the playoffs.

 

The Flames also have their own 1st round pick that I guess is 9 or 10th overall.  Good place to take Tij Iginla.  If not, then Yakemchuk is a good one.  Home grown talent in Calgary.  Seen him a couple times at the Dome this year.  He's steady steady.  Big but can skate very well.  Strong defensively.  Lacks flash to be a #1 D but is a safe 2/3/4 in the NHL when he hits his peak.  RHS RD with size will help balance the pairings.

[jjgallow]

9 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Right now OTT has the #5 overall pick.  They have Sanderson, Chabot, and Chychrun on LHS LD.  Total imbalance.

 

Weegar was born in OTT, probably would waive to go home and avoid rebuilding with the Flames.  Roster wise, what a perfect fit.  OTT needs that RHS RD top pair.

 

Flames could select Dickinson or Levshunov with the #5 overall.  Future #1 LD/RD.  There is risk for the Flames for sure so OTT would need to add.  But this feels like a good hockey trade where the Flames have 4/5 years to wait for Dickinson/Levshunov while OTT doesn't.  They want to win now.

 

.

After that, move Andersson to BUF or ARZ.  BUF has the 8th overall.  ARZ has the 6th. Standings are very fluid at this point needless to say.  At 6th, possible one of Dickinson or Levshunov is still available.  Take them.  If not, there's Parekh, Yakemchuk, and Jiricek.  That's three RHS RD to replace Andersson.  Obviously need to wait about 4-years.  BUF and ARZ doesn't want to wait anymore.  Their core is ready to push for the playoffs.

 

The Flames also have their own 1st round pick that I guess is 9 or 10th overall.  Good place to take Tij Iginla.  If not, then Yakemchuk is a good one.  Home grown talent in Calgary.  Seen him a couple times at the Dome this year.  He's steady steady.  Big but can skate very well.  Strong defensively.  Lacks flash to be a #1 D but is a safe 2/3/4 in the NHL when he hits his peak.  RHS RD with size will help balance the pairings.

 

I feel like first round picks, even late ones, should be used to draft guys with first-line potential.  Personally.   Now, admittedly that means you might have more first-round failures.    But imho it's worth it.      That would be my only issue with taking Yakemchuk that high.  No issue with taking a D that high lol.

 

Having said all that, I doubt many thought Giordano had 1st line potential at this age.

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

 

I feel like first round picks, even late ones, should be used to draft guys with first-line potential.  Personally.   Now, admittedly that means you might have more first-round failures.    But imho it's worth it.      That would be my only issue with taking Yakemchuk that high.  No issue with taking a D that high lol.

 

Having said all that, I doubt many thought Giordano had 1st line potential at this age.

 

I generally agree using 1st round picks to swing for the fence but then again, I feel you need to reach for RHS because they are rare.  And then there's RHS RD with size.  Size is another one where if you don't reach for it a bit, you'll end up with a bunch of small and skilled players.  Will lack balance.  You and teach size.  Some of the best teams in the NHL have the biggest Defense not by accident.

[jjgallow]

34 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I generally agree using 1st round picks to swing for the fence but then again, I feel you need to reach for RHS because they are rare.  And then there's RHS RD with size.  Size is another one where if you don't reach for it a bit, you'll end up with a bunch of small and skilled players.  Will lack balance.  You and teach size.  Some of the best teams in the NHL have the biggest Defense not by accident.

 

my life is a bit chaotic right now and I have not seen him play despite living here.   I'm taking your word that he doesn't have first line potential.  kid has a lot of goals.

 

But if he doesn't, then, quite frankly, you're right about the rhd.   That means we need Artyom Levshunov.

 

Straight up lol.

 

We need the RHSD, but we specifically need First Line RHD.

 

Not first line LHD, not 2nd line RHD.  

 

We need the real thing.

 

My guess is he'll be available because teams always bump down defencemen.  Even Makar.    Foreign defencemen?  big bump down.

 

But that leaves us with an Iginla problem.

[travel_dude]

41 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

my life is a bit chaotic right now and I have not seen him play despite living here.   I'm taking your word that he doesn't have first line potential.  kid has a lot of goals.

 

But if he doesn't, then, quite frankly, you're right about the rhd.   That means we need Artyom Levshunov.

 

Straight up lol.

 

We need the RHSD, but we specifically need First Line RHD.

 

Not first line LHD, not 2nd line RHD.  

 

We need the real thing.

 

My guess is he'll be available because teams always bump down defencemen.  Even Makar.    Foreign defencemen?  big bump down.

 

But that leaves us with an Iginla problem.

 

Prior to the Lindholm trade, we didn't have a top RHD prospect. 

If we manage to find on in this draft, due to out position (grabbing him early) or them falling, will that be any closer to finding the top RHD that you crave (we all crave)?  I realize that HB may be similar to Bouchard in EDM.  Was lighting it up in the OHL.  And he had 4 years of it compared to 2 years for HB.  Needed and still needs time to be considered a top D.

 

So, opinion wise, are you convinced that any of the available D in the draft will eclipse HB at his age?

Always want more, but I still want to know.

[The_People1]

44 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

my life is a bit chaotic right now and I have not seen him play despite living here.   I'm taking your word that he doesn't have first line potential.  kid has a lot of goals.

 

But if he doesn't, then, quite frankly, you're right about the rhd.   That means we need Artyom Levshunov.

 

Straight up lol.

 

We need the RHSD, but we specifically need First Line RHD.

 

Not first line LHD, not 2nd line RHD.  

 

We need the real thing.

 

My guess is he'll be available because teams always bump down defencemen.  Even Makar.    Foreign defencemen?  big bump down.

 

But that leaves us with an Iginla problem.

 

I do have a bias towards drafting Tij Iginla.  It would be a great story.  Would be happy if it happened but I understand the whole argument about pressure and high expectations.  It's virtually impossible for Tij to live up to what Jarome accomplished here with the Flames.

 

 

[jjgallow]

22 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Prior to the Lindholm trade, we didn't have a top RHD prospect. 

If we manage to find on in this draft, due to out position (grabbing him early) or them falling, will that be any closer to finding the top RHD that you crave (we all crave)?  I realize that HB may be similar to Bouchard in EDM.  Was lighting it up in the OHL.  And he had 4 years of it compared to 2 years for HB.  Needed and still needs time to be considered a top D.

 

So, opinion wise, are you convinced that any of the available D in the draft will eclipse HB at his age?

Always want more, but I still want to know.

 

I am convinced yes.    I think it's fair to assume that most (not all, but most) in the top 15 of this year's draft will eclipse him.   Some already are, and a year younger.  HB does not project has that first liner D.   Doesn't mean he won't be a first-liner, but I don't think we can say he's solved that. 

 

Anyway I wasn't trying to get into prospect bashing, very happy with our trade that brought HB over.   

 

On the "always want more" front:    If you draft/ acquire a bunch of high-end D, two things will happen:

 

1.  It will take them an extra 2 years to develop

2.  You will be way ahead of everyone else once they have developed

 

There is no situation where you can have too many elite D prospects.  Especially RHD.   Simply put, they Always have high trade value.  Always.    You think you need a center instead?   And you got too many elite RHD prospects?   Any team will make that trade with you.

 

Accumulate LWers, and quite frankly it doesn't work the other way around.  

[jjgallow]

26 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I do have a bias towards drafting Tij Iginla.  It would be a great story.  Would be happy if it happened but I understand the whole argument about pressure and high expectations.  It's virtually impossible for Tij to live up to what Jarome accomplished here with the Flames.

 

 

I understand that arguement, but they have to draft him and I think they will draft him.  If they were worried about those pressures, his Dad wouldn't be coach lol.  Pretty clear how they see that.

 

I actually think Tij is very, very similar in projection to his Dad.   Obviously doesn't guarantee he will stay on that curve, but imho he's on it.     His brother, Joe....imho is maybe looking More promising than his Dad.

 

I think we almost have to draft Tij, and we either need to stock up on 2026 picks, or tank hard, or both.   Because if Tij seems like a high price to pay, his brother's gonna be right up there, maybe even giving Gavin McKenna a run for his money.    

 

People say we're "not rebuilding" because we didn't receive much value for a lot of our vets these last few years.

That's another way of saying we're going into a deep, deep rebuild.    

 

Hopefully we come out of it with some top D, a top goalie, and these two Iginla kids.

 

I know what you're saying....how to accomplish more than Dad.   Best way to do that would be for both brothers to play on the same team and bring a few cups home.

 

Could happen.

[MP5029]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

 

I understand that arguement, but they have to draft him and I think they will draft him.  If they were worried about those pressures, his Dad wouldn't be coach lol.  Pretty clear how they see that.

 

I actually think Tij is very, very similar in projection to his Dad.   Obviously doesn't guarantee he will stay on that curve, but imho he's on it.     His brother, Joe....imho is maybe looking More promising than his Dad.

 

I think we almost have to draft Tij, and we either need to stock up on 2026 picks, or tank hard, or both.   Because if Tij seems like a high price to pay, his brother's gonna be right up there, maybe even giving Gavin McKenna a run for his money.    

 

People say we're "not rebuilding" because we didn't receive much value for a lot of our vets these last few years.

That's another way of saying we're going into a deep, deep rebuild.    

 

Hopefully we come out of it with some top D, a top goalie, and these two Iginla kids.

 

I know what you're saying....how to accomplish more than Dad.   Best way to do that would be for both brothers to play on the same team and bring a few cups home.

 

Could happen.

Agreed 100% 

[The_People1]

In regards to trading Andersson and Weegar to OTT, BUF, or ARZ, my question is, is Dickinson and Levshunov the next Sanderson and Drysdale?  Or are they the next Makar and Heiskanen?

 

Is it worth having no RD for the next 4 years as we invest in the draft?