Training Camp 2022

[Thebrewcrew]

18 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Well, it's early yet.  The kids will get 2-3 games to prove they are worth keeping for the 4th game.

Sutter hasn't seen much of him yet.

Give it the next game before we get too high on him.

That's true of Milano, but he has a little less to prove.

It's most likely that Milano wins the competition.

 

He's on a PTO so any contract he earns won't be that expensive. If he doesn't end up working out, it will be a contract you can bury or move rather easily.

 

The Flames were incredibly healthy last year, unlikely that continues. If Pelletier/Phillips or any young player doesn't make it out of camp, there'll be opportunities throughout the year. 

[pikey7883]

Put me in the camp that really liked Phillips game, and I hope he continues to surprise, similar to how Mang did. The things I saw with him in direct comparison to Pelletier was Phillips is a lot like Johnny in his engagement on the forecheck and board play, he has to be so much smarter and pick his spots. Where I saw on a couple occasions Pelletier went in almost fearless more akin to Mang, that being said, Phillips was the better player.

One other thing I took away was Zary centering Eakin and Milano. I feel like it might be sending a message without saying it. Eakin is a borderline 4th line center, so you better be able to outplay him. And Milano who has shown flashes of elite scoring has found himself in a little bit of no man’s land. Again, telling Zary to not end up in mediocrity, find your niche and be great at it.

Also like most others really disheartened with Valimaki, was really hoping for a better showing. 

[rocketdoctor]

Was there a second cut announced that i missed?

 

Usually they trim after the split squad games.

 

 

[bosn111]

My guess is that with the Wranglers now in Calgary, there is little point making official cuts to the AHL squad early. Coaching staffs for both teams likely present at camp evaluating players.

 

Enough players earned the extra NHL preseason time (McLain, Phillips, Klapka, etc) that they get at least 1 more game of mixed team to prove themselves. With Sutter saying he won’t rush Kadri into games in preseason, I expect Ruzicka and Schwindt to get more preseason games. Mangiapane coming back from minor injury means he likely doesn’t get into the next 2 preseason games but will play last 2 for getting up to speed. This leaves space for others to play. Also likely see more vets resting some games to avoid injuries and too much ice time in meaningless games.

[JTech780]

Pretty much all the bubble guys playing in Seattle tonight. Stand out tonight get another look, if not you might be moving on to Wranglers camp.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, bosn111 said:

My guess is that with the Wranglers now in Calgary, there is little point making official cuts to the AHL squad early. Coaching staffs for both teams likely present at camp evaluating players.

 

Enough players earned the extra NHL preseason time (McLain, Phillips, Klapka, etc) that they get at least 1 more game of mixed team to prove themselves. With Sutter saying he won’t rush Kadri into games in preseason, I expect Ruzicka and Schwindt to get more preseason games. Mangiapane coming back from minor injury means he likely doesn’t get into the next 2 preseason games but will play last 2 for getting up to speed. This leaves space for others to play. Also likely see more vets resting some games to avoid injuries and too much ice time in meaningless games.

 

Good point.  The roster has to be trimmed down though.  Too many players to juggle in a camp.  You need to work on specific things with the main group.  They will rotate in and out the guys that look the best, but it's going to be roughly 2 squads.  Top 6 from each group is the ones to focus on.  Getting a bump to it means you are getting a look.

 

Phillips, Milano, Klapka, Schwinny, Zary are getting an extra look.  IMHO

[travel_dude]

See where Ruzicka will play on the wing tonight with Zary and Milano.

Good for him to see where he can earn a spot.

[Thebrewcrew]

If there are any Shaw customers here, tonight's game is on TV. NHL Centre Ice free preview. SEA feed

[Thebrewcrew]

Not surprising, given the roster, but the Flames are hard to watch tonight.

 

Vladar has been excellent. First goal likely goalie interference if they were able to review. Second a shorty, where he had no chance.

 

Not a ton of standout performances, but I've liked Zary and Mackey. This is as confident as Zary has looked in an NHL camp. Mackey has been steady and reliable.

[flames for life]

21 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Not surprising, given the roster, but the Flames are hard to watch tonight.

 

Vladar has been excellent. First goal likely goalie interference if they were able to review. Second a shorty, where he had no chance.

 

Not a ton of standout performances, but I've liked Zary and Mackey. This is as confident as Zary has looked in an NHL camp. Mackey has been steady and reliable.

Agree with your assessment of Zary; best he has looked so far.  Phillips is not as noticeable this game, and I’m not impressed with the defence at all tonight.  The whole team looks scattered and disorganized.  Vladar is playing well, but without a lot of support.

[flames for life]

Again, watched the full game, and for players pushing for a spot, I didn’t see much.  The ones I thought would press hard….didn’t.  Defence was apathetic, and forwards did not seem interested in the game.

lots of training needed for the season!

[tmac70]

Wathced this one and yeah it was hard to find anyone outher Vldar that stood out. To many players trying the one and done thing. One player that yuo have to take your hat off to is Klapka though. He seems to be not out of place presently. Rozie and Phillips were invisible, Valimaki has regressed some much its sad. I would say Mackey was the best Dman. Zary is looks good, Pelts was meh. The PTO  Eakin is always moving and plays a good 200 foot game, Milano had a bright moment with Dube. I think putting him on a line with skilled guys you may get a better glimpse of what he could be. I will say if I were the Kraken yeah its going to be a long season with that roster.  

[travel_dude]

I thought that some of the line choices ruined any chance of good performances.

Dube looked like he was struggling to do much.

Same issues as last year.

Valimaki was not good.

Ruzie/Zary/Milano played the most minutes.

All of them had looks and Zary was using the other well.

Zary isn't ready; too much missed time, not enough pro experience.

Sutter talked about Ruzie needing to make the opening day roister.

Said the chances at C are slim, so needs to show he can be a winger as well.

Right now, he could be as high as a 3rd LW, but hard to say.

Needs to learn how to speed up the wings.

 

Vladar was solid and Sutter is impressed.

Wants him to take another step.

Says the regular platers trust him.

 

Tonight is mostly Flames roster against EDM.

Fringe guys need to impress.

 

Saying that, the first 4 games mean little.

As the competition ramps up, the play needs to with it.  

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

Wathced this one and yeah it was hard to find anyone outher Vldar that stood out. To many players trying the one and done thing. One player that yuo have to take your hat off to is Klapka though. He seems to be not out of place presently. Rozie and Phillips were invisible, Valimaki has regressed some much its sad. I would say Mackey was the best Dman. Zary is looks good, Pelts was meh. The PTO  Eakin is always moving and plays a good 200 foot game, Milano had a bright moment with Dube. I think putting him on a line with skilled guys you may get a better glimpse of what he could be. I will say if I were the Kraken yeah its going to be a long season with that roster.  

 

I wasn't sure on the lines because there was no audio.

Had to use another stream to get full coverage.

Admitedly, I was still not sure who played with who.

For the 3rd, they used Ruzie at C.

[conundrumed]

36 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

Wathced this one and yeah it was hard to find anyone outher Vldar that stood out. To many players trying the one and done thing. One player that yuo have to take your hat off to is Klapka though. He seems to be not out of place presently. Rozie and Phillips were invisible, Valimaki has regressed some much its sad. I would say Mackey was the best Dman. Zary is looks good, Pelts was meh. The PTO  Eakin is always moving and plays a good 200 foot game, Milano had a bright moment with Dube. I think putting him on a line with skilled guys you may get a better glimpse of what he could be. I will say if I were the Kraken yeah its going to be a long season with that roster.  

Thanks tmac, good post.

It’s probably time for some to stop trading Dube, and to start considering Rozie and Phillips and what we can get from ARI/BUF.

Giving up on Dube is a fool’s game imho.

He came up too early because:

A: the big team was pretty vacuous at F.

B: He’s too good for the A.

He’s being judged by his 22-23yo seasons.and compared to bread at an older age.

IMO, Dube is only weak in center of gravity and decision-making. Near everyone does at the NHL level. 

Add in the tumultuous coaching change to a real coach. Dube was only 22, the big ? mark. Sutter said, “some guys brought up too early”. You know he’s talking about Dube…my feeling is Sutter has taken him under his wing.

Every fwd position to benching for a few games.

Sutter and his “teachable” moments.

Dube’s going to be a really good NHLer.

Blockchain people, be patient.

He was 23 and 24 topping our fitness training. He’ll break out. Learning curve stuff.

 

 

[travel_dude]

15 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

IMO, Dube is only weak in center of gravity and decision-making. Near everyone does at the NHL level. 

Add in the tumultuous coaching change to a real coach. Dube was only 22, the big ? mark. Sutter said, “some guys brought up too early”. You know he’s talking about Dube…my feeling is Sutter has taken him under his wing.

 

Look, we are all looking for Dube to take a big step.  The finish to the NHL season proved that he can score, but he didn't carry that into the playoffs. At all.  It might just be that he is best suited to be a C.  That is problematic considering the depth there, and he was taken off that last season when opportunities existed.  If he wants to be taken seriously as a middle 6 winger, he has to improve the same way Tkachuk and Mangiapane did with Backlund.  Or he has to become another Coleman and sacrifice offense in favor of preventing goals and gaining trust.

 

The opportunity is there to play with Kadri.  If that's not in the cards, then fitting in with Backlund to the point of being the best option should be his goal.  He's in the same boat as Bennett was his final season here.  That's the reality.  If he ends up on the 4th line, then his time is done.      

[flames for life]

7 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Look, we are all looking for Dube to take a big step.  The finish to the NHL season proved that he can score, but he didn't carry that into the playoffs. At all.  It might just be that he is best suited to be a C.  That is problematic considering the depth there, and he was taken off that last season when opportunities existed.  If he wants to be taken seriously as a middle 6 winger, he has to improve the same way Tkachuk and Mangiapane did with Backlund.  Or he has to become another Coleman and sacrifice offense in favor of preventing goals and gaining trust.

 

The opportunity is there to play with Kadri.  If that's not in the cards, then fitting in with Backlund to the point of being the best option should be his goal.  He's in the same boat as Bennett was his final season here.  That's the reality.  If he ends up on the 4th line, then his time is done.      

Agree with this assessment of Dube.  He does need to find a different level of play to his game, and strengthen his gravity centre.  The upside of Dube is that no matter where he plays, he doesn’t quit.  If he is on this ice, he is engaging.  He is a fighter and wants to play.  He did well with Backlund, and should stay with him imo.  Backlund has a knack for teaching and mentoring young up and comers.  Let him teach Dube,and maybe Pelletier.

[travel_dude]

Possible lines for tonight:

 

Huberdeau-Lindholm-Toffoli
Mangiapane-Kadri/Backlund-Coleman
Lucic-Rooney-Lewis
Sutter-Bishop-McLain

Hanifin-Andersson
Zadorov-Weegar
Poirier-Tanev
Solovyov-Stone

Markstrom
Wolf

[travel_dude]

Initially, I thought that Valimaki would be a waiver casualty, getting claimed after being waived.  Now, I not so sure.  He hasn't done enough to stay on the roster, but at the same time, he hasn't shown he is worth it to a NHL team to claim.  He's being lapped by even guys like Poirier.  Has to prove better than Stone and Meloche, who have all looked NHL ready at this point.  Sure it's a small sample size, but if you aren't the best on a AHL roster in preseason, you aren't likely to survive the cuts.  Give the kid some props for sticking with it, but he has to simplify his game or focus on a role that shows his skills.  What he is showing isn't working.   

 

I really hate it when the young guys don't do enough to make the team.  I'm not saying he feels he should be there, just that he hasn't proved it yet.  He will be here until the last cuts, but I'm not really confident at this point.  Too bad.

[conundrumed]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Look, we are all looking for Dube to take a big step.  The finish to the NHL season proved that he can score, but he didn't carry that into the playoffs. At all.  It might just be that he is best suited to be a C.  That is problematic considering the depth there, and he was taken off that last season when opportunities existed.  If he wants to be taken seriously as a middle 6 winger, he has to improve the same way Tkachuk and Mangiapane did with Backlund.  Or he has to become another Coleman and sacrifice offense in favor of preventing goals and gaining trust.

 

The opportunity is there to play with Kadri.  If that's not in the cards, then fitting in with Backlund to the point of being the best option should be his goal.  He's in the same boat as Bennett was his final season here.  That's the reality.  If he ends up on the 4th line, then his time is done.      

Nothing good starts by someone saying, “Look”. And here we are. All the patience in the world for Mangiapane, zero for Dube, who just turned 24.

It makes zero sense to trade him when all he lacks is growing by experiencing.

Sutter sees potential. I do too. 

 

[Sarasti]

1 minute ago, conundrumed said:

Nothing good starts by someone saying, “Look”. And here we are. All the patience in the world for Mangiapane, zero for Dube, who just turned 24.

It makes zero sense to trade him when all he lacks is growing by experiencing.

Sutter sees potential. I do too. 

 

 

Despite what we have seen in pre season so far I suspect Dube is in for a big season.

20-20-40 im thinking.

His fitness levels over the last 2 seasons and his finish to last season have been encouraging. 

And like you said, he is still just 24.

[The_People1]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Thanks tmac, good post.

It’s probably time for some to stop trading Dube, and to start considering Rozie and Phillips and what we can get from ARI/BUF.

Giving up on Dube is a fool’s game imho.

He came up too early because:

A: the big team was pretty vacuous at F.

B: He’s too good for the A.

He’s being judged by his 22-23yo seasons.and compared to bread at an older age.

IMO, Dube is only weak in center of gravity and decision-making. Near everyone does at the NHL level. 

Add in the tumultuous coaching change to a real coach. Dube was only 22, the big ? mark. Sutter said, “some guys brought up too early”. You know he’s talking about Dube…my feeling is Sutter has taken him under his wing.

Every fwd position to benching for a few games.

Sutter and his “teachable” moments.

Dube’s going to be a really good NHLer.

Blockchain people, be patient.

He was 23 and 24 topping our fitness training. He’ll break out. Learning curve stuff.

 

And here I was worried no one would want Dube, you give me hope.  Maybe we can actually get something for him before he trends into the next Derek Ryan.  Hopefully, Ken Holland feels the same as you and gives us Puljujarvi for Dube straight up.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, Sarasti said:

 

Despite what we have seen in pre season so far I suspect Dube is in for a big season.

20-20-40 im thinking.

His fitness levels over the last 2 seasons and his finish to last season have been encouraging. 

And like you said, he is still just 24.

 

Oh yes, the 8 goals against non-playoff teams (and NAS) to finish the season was impressive.  LOL.

Playoffs, not so much.

Seriously though, it's time for him to take a step.

I'm not worried about the preseason.

He's no rookie so we should be seeing him come on strong in first month.

Not bust category yet, just need to see something this season.

 

 

[cross16]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Nothing good starts by someone saying, “Look”. And here we are. All the patience in the world for Mangiapane, zero for Dube, who just turned 24.

It makes zero sense to trade him when all he lacks is growing by experiencing.

Sutter sees potential. I do too. 

 

 

I do too but I will admit bias I've been a fan of Dube since he was 16. 

 

I think there is always danger too in looking for the camp standout. I think that is a trap you get sucked into more often than not and we forget that these guys are getting thrown in situations they won't see in the regular season. Have to be careful drawing conclusions based on pre season games. Chuck Kobasew would have had a Rocket Richard if that was the case. 

 

 

[conundrumed]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

And here I was worried no one would want Dube, you give me hope.  Maybe we can actually get something for him before he trends into the next Derek Ryan.  Hopefully, Ken Holland feels the same as you and gives us Puljujarvi for Dube straight up.

This is why I always finish ahead of you in the pool these days.lol

We lose that trade. Thankfully, it ain’t happening.