2021 Offseason Thread

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

Possibly a case of CSKA Moscow giving him an offer that beats league minimum?   Because that will beat anything he can get here.    And if it beats, they can put a time limit on it.

 

Wasn't what I was confused about.  Was talking about signing QO's etc.

But to your point, the KHL isn't known for their great salaries.

A journeyman isn't going to get a great deal, but he may not have been too happy with his year here.

Maybe it's the water in CGY.  If he had scored 12 goals we would be in the playoffs.

[The_People1]

I'm a huge pass on Hyman.  His career high is 41-points and at 29-years-old will probably look to get paid 5 or 6 years at up to $6-mil-per.  In a cap world, "value" is paramount and no team is getting value on Hyman's next contract.  In a couple years, we could be stuck in a situation where our 3rd line is an old Lucic-Backlund-Hyman taking up $17-mil.  3rd Liners should cost $2 to $3-mil and most hopefully bring some youthful enthusiasm and energy.

[travel_dude]

33 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

I'm a huge pass on Hyman.  His career high is 41-points and at 29-years-old will probably look to get paid 5 or 6 years at up to $6-mil-per.  In a cap world, "value" is paramount and no team is getting value on Hyman's next contract.  In a couple years, we could be stuck in a situation where our 3rd line is an old Lucic-Backlund-Hyman taking up $17-mil.  3rd Liners should cost $2 to $3-mil and most hopefully bring some youthful enthusiasm and energy.

 

We have a version of Hyman, but younger and improving...

Mangiapane.

They play a similar style.

 

[rocketdoctor]

Nesterov going back to the KHL

 

[cross16]

So far the Flames are losing:

 

Nesterov

Nordstrom

Lerby

Yelesin

 

All have gone to KHL, or SHL in Lerby's case. 

[sak22]

 

 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

So far the Flames are losing:

 

Nesterov

Nordstrom

Lerby

Yelesin

 

All have gone to KHL, or SHL in Lerby's case. 

 

Do you know if we have rights to him (Lerby) if he comes back to NA?

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, sak22 said:

 

 

 

Didn't realize we had a vacancy.

Unless they are thinking of moving on from Huska.

Everyone else got a promotion.

 

[robrob74]

20 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Didn't realize we had a vacancy.

Unless they are thinking of moving on from Huska.

Everyone else got a promotion.

 

who do we have on the bench?

 

Sutter, Muller, Huska and Labarbara?

 

Gelinas is player development now. 
 

McLean is the new Eye in the Sky. His job is to analyze from above and pre-scout teams before games.

 

wouldnt Tocchet be a decent add? 

[The_People1]

Why do we need so many coaches?

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

who do we have on the bench?

 

Sutter, Muller, Huska and Labarbara?

 

Gelinas is player development now. 
 

McLean is the new Eye in the Sky. His job is to analyze from above and pre-scout teams before games.

 

wouldnt Tocchet be a decent add? 

 

I like the results he got in Arizona as a defensive team.

He made some bizarre choices their fans hated.

But he was a head coach on a team with major holes.

[robrob74]

Just now, travel_dude said:

 

I like the results he got in Arizona as a defensive team.

He made some bizarre choices their fans hated.

But he was a head coach on a team with major holes.

I thought so too, I mean he’s been around a lot. 

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

Why do we need so many coaches?

 

The tendency is to bring in the "next guy" as an assistant.

Other teams fire and hire.

We promote, fire and hire.

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

The tendency is to bring in the "next guy" as an assistant.

Other teams fire and hire.

We promote, fire and hire.

 

He's not even next in line as an Assistant if the Associate is next in line.  Right?

[cross16]

16 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Do you know if we have rights to him (Lerby) if he comes back to NA?

 

Not 100% on this one but I don't think so. With him signing in Sweden I don't think the Flames will be able to qualify him and once they don't qualify him he'll be a UFA

 

18 hours ago, sak22 said:

 

 

 

 

I'm skeptical of this one. Tocchet is a great coach and would be a tremendous get but it does sound like he'll get Seattle and even if he doesn't the Flames dont' have a spot. My guess is that the Flames spoke to him prior to hiring Muller and that's where this rumor stems from. 

 

The only scenario that is plausible to me is they move Huska back to coach the Heat and Tocchet takes his spot. 

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I'm skeptical of this one. Tocchet is a great coach and would be a tremendous get but it does sound like he'll get Seattle and even if he doesn't the Flames dont' have a spot. My guess is that the Flames spoke to him prior to hiring Muller and that's where this rumor stems from. 

 

The only scenario that is plausible to me is they move Huska back to coach the Heat and Tocchet takes his spot. 

 

For sure Huska would be the one to go.

I'm not sure that bringing in Cali only to demote Huska is a move we would typically do.

[robrob74]

13 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Not 100% on this one but I don't think so. With him signing in Sweden I don't think the Flames will be able to qualify him and once they don't qualify him he'll be a UFA

 

 

 

I'm skeptical of this one. Tocchet is a great coach and would be a tremendous get but it does sound like he'll get Seattle and even if he doesn't the Flames dont' have a spot. My guess is that the Flames spoke to him prior to hiring Muller and that's where this rumor stems from. 

 

The only scenario that is plausible to me is they move Huska back to coach the Heat and Tocchet takes his spot. 

 

5 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

For sure Huska would be the one to go.

I'm not sure that bringing in Cali only to demote Huska is a move we would typically do.

 

 

With the Expansion Draft coming along, you'd think Seattle would want to get their coach soon, to at least have some input and analysis of what they know about the players? Plus, teams usually like to have their coaches in for the Entry Draft. 

 

I could see them move on from Huska IF they really wanted Tocchet and Tocchet were to come. Maybe another move within the organization? 

 

I guess our D improved when Sutter got here, and was that Sutter or Huska? or them working together?

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

 

 

With the Expansion Draft coming along, you'd think Seattle would want to get their coach soon, to at least have some input and analysis of what they know about the players? Plus, teams usually like to have their coaches in for the Entry Draft. 

 

I could see them move on from Huska IF they really wanted Tocchet and Tocchet were to come. Maybe another move within the organization? 

 

I guess our D improved when Sutter got here, and was that Sutter or Huska? or them working together?

 

I was a little disappointed with Huska.

I don't know if it was his system or the personnel.

Then again, my view doesn't 100% match the results we achieved.

And the defense is not the only reason.

We kept in place a pair that was struggling and only used Hanifin-Tanev to make up for it.

The 3rd pair was a mixed bag and I don't think it was well managed.

 

It's hard to pinpoint the reason for the improvement.

With Sutter, we still lost a ton of games.

Some of it was related to lack of scoring.

But if you can't transition from defending to offense, you aren't scoring.

Also, I would submit that we won games that didn't matter.

 

If Seattle is going to hire Tocchet, it will happen soon.

He's having a 3rd interview, so I think it's close to done.

 

[cross16]

37 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

 

 

With the Expansion Draft coming along, you'd think Seattle would want to get their coach soon, to at least have some input and analysis of what they know about the players? Plus, teams usually like to have their coaches in for the Entry Draft. 

 

I could see them move on from Huska IF they really wanted Tocchet and Tocchet were to come. Maybe another move within the organization? 

 

I guess our D improved when Sutter got here, and was that Sutter or Huska? or them working together?

 

From what i've read Seattle wants their coach in place by the end of the month. 

 

I'm a fan of Huska. I think he's done a good job here and despite some of the public opinion the Flames have been a good defending team for most of his tenure here as an assistant, things just went off the rails under Ward. Hard to know the working relationship of the staff but for me I don't think it makes sense to blame or give credit to the head coach as I think assistants play a key role. In the good and in the bad too, but like I said overall things have been good under Huska. 

 

But always a possibility that Sutter disagrees, or sees this as an opportunity to grab a high end coach or perhaps there is an angle that we aren't discussing and that's that Huska has another opportunity he is considering too. 

 

But again still have a hard time seeing the truth to this rumor. 

[jjgallow]

On 6/16/2021 at 9:49 AM, travel_dude said:

 

Wasn't what I was confused about.  Was talking about signing QO's etc.

But to your point, the KHL isn't known for their great salaries.

A journeyman isn't going to get a great deal, but he may not have been too happy with his year here.

Maybe it's the water in CGY.  If he had scored 12 goals we would be in the playoffs.

 

It could  be the water yes.

 

Nothing else comes to mind.

 

[Thebrewcrew]

Two more UFA's I could see the Flames being interested in

 

Joel Armia- Having a very good playoffs. Ideally a 3rd liner, big body, good on the PK. Likely costs you 2.5-3.5 on a 3 or 4 year deal.

 

Jamie Oleksiak- If Gio or Tanev is selected by SEA. Another big body. Unlike many of the other UFA D, this is a player that is still getting better. A guy like Martinez will cost more, but a decline could happen at any moment. Something like 3.5x4 gets you into the mix on Oleksiak, similar numbers to MTL's UFA signings of Chiarot and Edmundson to that number. 

[travel_dude]

22 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Two more UFA's I could see the Flames being interested in

 

Joel Armia- Having a very good playoffs. Ideally a 3rd liner, big body, good on the PK. Likely costs you 2.5-3.5 on a 3 or 4 year deal.

 

Jamie Oleksiak- If Gio or Tanev is selected by SEA. Another big body. Unlike many of the other UFA D, this is a player that is still getting better. A guy like Martinez will cost more, but a decline could happen at any moment. Something like 3.5x4 gets you into the mix on Oleksiak, similar numbers to MTL's UFA signings of Chiarot and Edmundson to that number. 

 

JO is one that I would target as well.

He's nothing special, but he checks some boxes we need.

Big and tough.

Defensive.

 

Tanev is one of the few guys that doesn't get overpowered by big forwards.

I like Ras, but that's not his game.

Gio has struggled to contain players and will only be here a bit longer.

We need to accept that and start to move on.

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Two more UFA's I could see the Flames being interested in

 

Joel Armia- Having a very good playoffs. Ideally a 3rd liner, big body, good on the PK. Likely costs you 2.5-3.5 on a 3 or 4 year deal.

 

Jamie Oleksiak- If Gio or Tanev is selected by SEA. Another big body. Unlike many of the other UFA D, this is a player that is still getting better. A guy like Martinez will cost more, but a decline could happen at any moment. Something like 3.5x4 gets you into the mix on Oleksiak, similar numbers to MTL's UFA signings of Chiarot and Edmundson to that number. 

 

No interest in Armia from me.  Too many shifts where he does nothing.

 

Oleksiak would be a great add at under $4-mil-per.  Agreed if we lose Giordano or he could replace Hanifin if we can trade Hanifin.  

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

No interest in Armia from me.  Too many shifts where he does nothing.

 

Oleksiak would be a great add at under $4-mil-per.  Agreed if we lose Giordano or he could replace Hanifin if we can trade Hanifin.  

 

I would be more comfortable in trading Hanifin if Valimaki had taken a step this season.

I think he's poised to do that, but it being held back by Dutter.

We need to move on from Gio sooner than later.

Signing JO now would make that much smoother.

We could make the Gio trade during the season if he's not claimed.

Might actually get some decent value back, even if we had to retain a bit.

[LouCifer]

On 6/19/2021 at 5:27 PM, travel_dude said:

 

I would be more comfortable in trading Hanifin if Valimaki had taken a step this season.

I think he's poised to do that, but it being held back by Dutter.

We need to move on from Gio sooner than later.

Signing JO now would make that much smoother.

We could make the Gio trade during the season if he's not claimed.

Might actually get some decent value back, even if we had to retain a bit.

For me, Seattle would be stupid not to grab Gio and Hamilton on D. They played together, have some chemistry, and as far as I’m concerned are as close to a slam dunk that you can get in the game of hockey. Seattle not picking up those 2 for their defense would be beyond foolish in my opinion, as Gio alone could net you additional assets at the deadline - or - could re-sign at a lower AAV like  Engelland and mentor that defense. 
 

PS> I like the JO idea a lot.