The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 1 hour ago, Thebrewcrew said: Regarding your last post, a 10.5x7 offersheet for Tkachuk will never happen. The compensation for that equals four 1st rounders. It will require a bit over $10.5 but ya... that's why I think Tkachuk will ask for $10.5 "or else" he will go sign an offer sheet and force the deal on the Flames. We will be facing 2 Firsts, 1 Second, and 1 Third... No one would do $10.6 though because that's 4 first round picks. That's strictly for the McDavids-level RFAs. https://www.capfriendly.com/offer-sheet-calculator Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sak22 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: he's a 100pt winger just coming into his prime in the Mould of a Brad Marchand. to some teams he'd be a franchise player . I could see it , especially knowing there's a high chance we cant match and the teams that are most lethal are ones that trade away their firsts on a regular basis He's had 1 100 point season, it's almost like calling Kreider a 50 goal scorer. But this season had 8 100 point guys, all but McDavid and Draisatl had their first, add in another 10 could've gotten 100 points if they played a full season. This season is a hard season to judge offensive output, big numbers throughout the league. Weird schedule, some teams were put in bad situations due to covid, some teams played, many teams used 4 or more goalies this year, even Jon Gillies got 14 starts. I could be wrong, but I don't see a team willing to go 4 firsts for someone that hasn't proven to be a consistent P/PG player Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 I’d love an offer sheet. All those picks could be used to restock the farm and be used as currency for other trades. An offer sheet would save us from ourselves because in my mind BT is too enamored with Chucky. I’d much rather have UFA Right-shot RW Forsberg at Chucky money (84 pts in 69 regular season games, 56 pts in 75 playoff games) if he wants to join the Swedish movement here in CGY. Fiala would be another good target. And we gotta get rid of Mony’s contract - it’s a non negotiable if we truly want to be competitive next year. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 7 minutes ago, The_People1 said: For this reason alone, we might as well full rebuild if we lose one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk because, 1. There is no equivalent or better upgrade via UFA. 2. If it's picks and prospects, then we're talking "years" before that player(s) can make an impact. Which goes back to this past TDL. If the plan all along was to rebuild then BT needs to get fired for not moving Gaudreau at the deadline for picks and now watching him walk away for nothing. Picks also = Trade currency. You could use the 2OA in a trade for Chychrun for example. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 4 minutes ago, The_People1 said: For this reason alone, we might as well full rebuild if we lose one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk because, 1. There is no equivalent or better upgrade via UFA. 2. If it's picks and prospects, then we're talking "years" before that player(s) can make an impact. Which goes back to this past TDL. If the plan all along was to rebuild then BT needs to get fired for not moving Gaudreau at the deadline for picks and now watching him walk away for nothing. Heres the thing .. Johnny is priority one.. he has to be signed before FA or he doesn't get the 8th year . Flames by all the signs pretty much have to give him what he wants.. Im sure it will be Market fair, but theres no discount deal happening here . I expect it to start with an 11 If that number comes in high , it limits what we can offer Chucky above 9 ( he can get 9 just by signing the tender) I'm certain BT has a number in mind for both , but if it comes in high ..vultures could take a run .. its not a case of rebuilding , its reacting to the market .. most GMs if they have any integrity give the other Gm a heads up to make a trade first ... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sak22 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, LouCifer said: Picks also = Trade currency. You could use the 2OA in a trade for Chychrun for example. Why wouldn't NJ go that route instead. Cheap player of a position of need for that team. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 32 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: If they make An offer it will be a high one with the picks ..teams know we will totally match anything up to the 10.x mark .. anything less than that and they've done us a favor 2019 he wasnt the player he is now The Blues are going to need their 1st's, they have a cap crunch coming After 22/23, four of their top five scorers are up as well as ROR. They are gonna need young talent to be able to step into their lineup. They would love to have Tkachuk, but doesn't make sense via offersheet. 8 minutes ago, The_People1 said: For this reason alone, we might as well full rebuild if we lose one of Gaudreau or Tkachuk because, 1. There is no equivalent or better upgrade via UFA. 2. If it's picks and prospects, then we're talking "years" before that player(s) can make an impact. Which goes back to this past TDL. If the plan all along was to rebuild then BT needs to get fired for not moving Gaudreau at the deadline for picks and now watching him walk away for nothing. If the Flames believe that they can't sign Gaudreau, then it makes more sense to explore that hypothetical NJ deal. Without Johnny, it makes more sense to rebuild. Although ownership may have other ideas. And regarding the offersheet, the compensation is based on a 5yr deal, 6 or 7 years and the compensation increases, so 10.5 equals four 1st's Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, sak22 said: Why wouldn't NJ go that route instead. Cheap player of a position of need for that team. They should definitely be exploring that, if that’s their priority. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 5 minutes ago, The_People1 said: It will require a bit over $10.5 but ya... that's why I think Tkachuk will ask for $10.5 "or else" he will go sign an offer sheet and force the deal on the Flames. We will be facing 2 Firsts, 1 Second, and 1 Third... No one would do $10.6 though because that's 4 first round picks. That's strictly for the McDavids-level RFAs. https://www.capfriendly.com/offer-sheet-calculator see and i think wed match a 10.5 and teams know that .. but that would be our limit Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, LouCifer said: They should definitely be exploring that, if that’s their priority. well apparently they're tempted by Fiala .. so why wouldn't they do a Chucky instead and pay a bit more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said: The Blues are going to need their 1st's, they have a cap crunch coming After 22/23, four of their top five scorers are up as well as ROR. They are gonna need young talent to be able to step into their lineup. They would love to have Tkachuk, but doesn't make sense via offersheet. If the Flames believe that they can't sign Gaudreau, then it makes more sense to explore that hypothetical NJ deal. Without Johnny, it makes more sense to rebuild. Although ownership may have other ideas. And regarding the offersheet, the compensation is based on a 5yr deal, 6 or 7 years and the compensation increases, so 10.5 equals four 1st's Can a team even do a 6 or 7 year RFA deal? I thought 5 was the max. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 1 minute ago, The_People1 said: Can a team even do a 6 or 7 year RFA deal? I thought 5 was the max. nope 7.. just like any free agent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, The_People1 said: Can a team even do a 6 or 7 year RFA deal? I thought 5 was the max. Yeah they can do up to 7yrs. I really don't worry about a Tkachuk offer-sheet. Only way STL could do it by gutting their picks for 4yrs, anything short of that and CGY matches. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 1 minute ago, phoenix66 said: well apparently they're tempted by Fiala .. so why wouldn't they do a Chucky instead and pay a bit more I’m not sure what NJ is going to do. I’m sure they’re going to table lots of scenarios just like we come up with here. Depends where their priorities lay. It’s interesting to me that the GM is related to Chucky. That could sway the decision making right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 5 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: most GMs if they have any integrity give the other Gm a heads up to make a trade first ... Ya true. Marc Bergevin is no longer GM of any team so... But he is a Senior advisor with the LA Kings so maybe? Division rivals so maybe just to give us some pain? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 https://thehockeywriters.com/maple-leafs-2022-trade-targets-flames/ Bit of a silly article. Says the Flames may not be able to afford Mang, which is fair. But also says Kerfoot or Muzzin may need to be in the deal. Or how about the Flames keep Mangiapane, instead of taking on that Muzzin deal? Talks about Vladar. Says the Flames may not be sold on Markstrom as their starter lol. Oh Leaf nation, you never fail Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: nope 7.. just like any free agent 2 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said: Yeah they can do up to 7yrs. I really don't worry about a Tkachuk offer-sheet. Only way STL could do it by gutting their picks for 4yrs, anything short of that and CGY matches. https://www.capfriendly.com/offer-sheet-calculator Okay so if I understand this correctly, if Tkachuk gets a $70-million offer for 7-years, then the compensation is calculated by dividing $70-mil by 5-years... making it $14-mil (four 1st round picks). This is why Aho only got a 5-year offer last time. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 At the end of the day, the flames have to do what’s best for the flames. Johnny shouldn’t come in at more $$ than McDonkey in spOil country IMO. If Johnny returns, the smart move would be to move Chucky whose value is at an all time high, to round out the roster and make like bandits. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, The_People1 said: https://www.capfriendly.com/offer-sheet-calculator Okay so if I understand this correctly, if Tkachuk gets a $70-million offer for 7-years, then the compensation is calculated by dividing $70-mil by 5-years... making it $14-mil (four 1st round picks). This is why Aho only got a 5-year offer last time. That's correct, anything over 5yrs changes the compensation Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 2 minutes ago, The_People1 said: https://www.capfriendly.com/offer-sheet-calculator Okay so if I understand this correctly, if Tkachuk gets a $70-million offer for 7-years, then the compensation is calculated by dividing $70-mil by 5-years... making it $14-mil (four 1st round picks). This is why Aho only got a 5-year offer last time. Just now, Thebrewcrew said: That's correct, anything over 5yrs changes the compensation I suppose if a team is prepared to give up four 1st round picks then might as well offer 7-year and completely blow past the $10.503-mil upper limit. Why not at that point. Make sure you secure Tkachuk for 7-years if you are giving up that many draft picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 11 minutes ago, LouCifer said: I’m not sure what NJ is going to do. I’m sure they’re going to table lots of scenarios just like we come up with here. Depends where their priorities lay. It’s interesting to me that the GM is related to Chucky. That could sway the decision making right? If they are truly offering 2OA, Zacha, Stillman, and MUOTweufdsihfsd, then that tells me they are willing to give up four 1st round picks because all those are 1st round picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 Just now, The_People1 said: I suppose if a team is prepared to give up four 1st round picks then might as well offer 7-year and completely blow past the $10.503-mil upper limit. Why not at that point. Make sure you secure Tkachuk for 7-years if you are giving up that many draft picks. For McDavid, Makar or Matthews I think you do that. I would be very surprised if somebody would do that for Tkachuk, but if they do the Flames should tip their cap and take the picks. Four years is a long time. NJ was a playoff team 4yrs ago, now look at where that team is. If you can control a team's 1st for 4yrs, you do it everytime Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LouCifer Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 4 minutes ago, The_People1 said: If they are truly offering 2OA, Zacha, Stillman, and MUOTweufdsihfsd, then that tells me they are willing to give up four 1st round picks because all those are 1st round picks. I believe whoever posted that said it was a suggestion from the fan base. Whatever the case, I’d definitely explore Forsberg if Chucky moves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 6, 2022 Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 6 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said: For McDavid, Makar or Matthews I think you do that. I would be very surprised if somebody would do that for Tkachuk, but if they do the Flames should tip their cap and take the picks. Four years is a long time. NJ was a playoff team 4yrs ago, now look at where that team is. If you can control a team's 1st for 4yrs, you do it everytime this is why i say if BT thinks the threat is real he should push for a NJ deal. I doubt he would sign an offer sheet there , but we can trade him there .. add a 2nd conditional 1st if they sign him to an extension Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted June 6, 2022 Author Report Share Posted June 6, 2022 4 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: this is why i say if BT thinks the threat is real he should push for a NJ deal. I doubt he would sign an offer sheet there , but we can trade him there .. add a 2nd conditional 1st if they sign him to an extension Unfortunately, you can't trade picks with conditions based on a player signing anymore. It was introduced when they did the CBA before the bubble. PA worried that it discouraged teams from signing players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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