jjgallow Posted March 6, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 6, 2017 10 hours ago, Carty said: A good skills coach or trainer in the off season can be very beneficial... A while back I mention how Mikael Backlund working with Darryl Belfry had improved his game... Here's one of the articles on that... http://www.calgarysun.com/2014/02/01/skills-coach-reveals-secret-behind-new--improved-flames-sniper-mikael-backlund Some of the other players Belfry has worked with are P. Kane, Tavares, Duchene, Parise and Pacioretty... Good stuff. So...for instance, a guy like Tkachuk. Should the Flames be encouraging him to do that in the offseason? (on the theme of learning from the past) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 6, 2017 Report Share Posted March 6, 2017 2 hours ago, jjgallow said: Good stuff. So...for instance, a guy like Tkachuk. Should the Flames be encouraging him to do that in the offseason? (on the theme of learning from the past) Tkachuk has an enormous amount of natural talent, but perhaps it can be enhanced even further... Only one way to find out, so I would say yes... That said, there are a few things required for that kind of thing to work... The instruction needs to come from a qualified person(s) with a good track record, and the player truly has to want to do it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted March 6, 2017 Report Share Posted March 6, 2017 35 minutes ago, Carty said: Tkachuk has an enormous amount of natural talent, but perhaps it can be enhanced even further... Only one way to find out, so I would say yes... That said, there are a few things required for that kind of thing to work... The instruction needs to come from a qualified person(s) with a good track record, and the player truly has to want to do it... I agree, and would only add the biggest thing for me depends on the player's mindset. IMO, Backlund isn't using any "skill"s now he didn't have years ago when he was struggling. Biggest difference know is he has the confidence to know he is good and know what to do and he struggled with that before. I can easily see how a skills coach would help you build up that belief, but Backlund has always been a skilled guy. Tkachuk does not strike me as someone who battles his confidence, and that is a great thing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted March 7, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 So, maybe Tkachuk doesn't compare well to Baertschi and Backlund in terms of young confidence. But is that the only reason it makes sense? Ie... Mark Scheifele. First of all, they didn't rush him. But more importantly, he started the NHL with lots of confidence, and similar performance to the likes of Monahan, Bennett, Tkachuk. Monahan and Bennet levelled off, though (or have so far). I can't say it was for lack of confidence either. Sooo.... If it makes sense to do extra development on a prospect struggling to make the NHL...does it make more or less sense to put that investment into your most valuable prospects??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 9 hours ago, jjgallow said: So, maybe Tkachuk doesn't compare well to Baertschi and Backlund in terms of young confidence. But is that the only reason it makes sense? Ie... Mark Scheifele. First of all, they didn't rush him. But more importantly, he started the NHL with lots of confidence, and similar performance to the likes of Monahan, Bennett, Tkachuk. Monahan and Bennet levelled off, though (or have so far). I can't say it was for lack of confidence either. Sooo.... If it makes sense to do extra development on a prospect struggling to make the NHL...does it make more or less sense to put that investment into your most valuable prospects??? One thing not being mentioned is the backgrounds of where they gathered their playing experience along with the level of competition received. The system in STL that Tkachuk came out of is highly touted and obviously prepared him for the OHL and London's program also has a great reputation for developing its players. I don't think there is any set recipe that you can apply in isolation and this is where the scouts have to earn their keep. Background is very important, so are the systems the players come from. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 I would prefer that we let this thread fizzle out, unless people want to talk about Baertschi from a fan perspective. Baertschi was developed under a coach that was fired. The player was traded. It's not like talking about Iggy, who was a Flames legend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pyromancer Posted March 7, 2017 Report Share Posted March 7, 2017 I agree! Too much thought given to an ex-Flame by playing the woulda, coulda, shoulda game. Baertschi was a piece of crap as a Flame. He failed to develop under the Flame's system as a result of his own shortcomings; primarily psychological. He had a plethora of talent & that's why we drafted him but was unable to let "others" fine-tune it for the NHL. Best of luck to the Nucks to successfully transform the boy into a man...... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 5 hours ago, Pyromancer said: Baertschi was a piece of crap as a Flame. Nuck... Piece of crap... Same thing... Baertschi is a Nuck now, so he's still a piece of crap... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted March 8, 2017 Report Share Posted March 8, 2017 10 hours ago, travel_dude said: I would prefer that we let this thread fizzle out, unless people want to talk about Baertschi from a fan perspective. Baertschi was developed under a coach that was fired. The player was traded. It's not like talking about Iggy, who was a Flames legend. I actually find it funny that some are pissed at trading Baertschi and then saying they are disappointed in Bennett's play. We trade Bennett now, we will be even more disappointed than the Baertschi trade in the long run. Two years in the NHL! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 18 hours ago, robrob74 said: I actually find it funny that some are pissed at trading Baertschi and then saying they are disappointed in Bennett's play. We trade Bennett now, we will be even more disappointed than the Baertschi trade in the long run. Two years in the NHL! There has to be more understanding when assessing a player's ability other than some flash while in Junior. Baertschi is Swiss and I am going to guess did not get a lot of high level competition all along his career. In a weak system getting passed ahead becomes expected by the player. I got a sense that Baertschi felt some of this entitlement was being taken away from him here. He didn't believe he needed to be put through the paces to become a better player. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 On 3/6/2017 at 9:48 AM, jjgallow said: Good stuff. So...for instance, a guy like Tkachuk. Should the Flames be encouraging him to do that in the offseason? (on the theme of learning from the past) I think his Dad is coaching him on a daily/ game-by-game basis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 I got in many debates over the trading of Sven on the side of who gives a rats checking from behind if he makes it or not. So he and Granlund have found some success on a team with minimal talent, who cares. Still don't understand the man crush with this kid, for the love of god we didn't trade Crosby or McDavid. time to let it go . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted March 9, 2017 Author Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 2 hours ago, tmac70 said: I got in many debates over the trading of Sven on the side of who gives a rats checking from behind if he makes it or not. So he and Granlund have found some success on a team with minimal talent, who cares. Still don't understand the man crush with this kid, for the love of god we didn't trade Crosby or McDavid. time to let it go . way to go tmac, you just made everything twice as bad. I forgot all about Granlund. He's on pace for 25 goals and still young...damn. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 8 hours ago, jjgallow said: way to go tmac, you just made everything twice as bad. I forgot all about Granlund. He's on pace for 25 goals and still young...damn. Well that trade has worked well for Grandlund, not sure he makes it here but good for him. Hey what about Paul Byron....let him walk on waivers seems to be lighting it up with the HABS. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 4 hours ago, tmac70 said: Well that trade has worked well for Grandlund, not sure he makes it here but good for him. Hey what about Paul Byron....let him walk on waivers seems to be lighting it up with the HABS. Man, we traded Brett Hull. Forgot about Newy and Gilmore. Are they doing well elsewhere? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zima Posted March 9, 2017 Report Share Posted March 9, 2017 I would like to add that Baerctshi was always hurt when here or in the A's played 10 games or so and sit in IR for 10-20 games or so could never seem to get it together. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulstad Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 6 hours ago, travel_dude said: Man, we traded Brett Hull. Forgot about Newy and Gilmore. Are they doing well elsewhere? Gary Leeman says they're adjusting well to their new homes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 6 hours ago, travel_dude said: Man, we traded Brett Hull. Forgot about Newy and Gilmore. Are they doing well elsewhere? On the other hand we gained when we got Iggy for Nieuwendyk after Iggy was #11 OA & the draft. Joe was a dang good player for us while Baer was a frustrating waste. Hopefully Rasmus works out to be good for us. To balance off some of the bad trades/releases we were pretty well gifted Kipper. ****************************************************************************************************************** I don't know if any of you caught the Jets/Pengie game but Pitts called up Sestito. In 1:02 minutes spread over 3 shifts he managed a fight with Thorburn (a draw IMO), injured Enstrom & got about 38 minutes & a misconduct. Today the NHL suspended him for 4 games. Anti-fighting advocate Rutherford called up Sistito specifically for 1 game. Stay classy Pittsbung (sic). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 14 hours ago, Flyerfan52 said: I don't know if any of you caught the Jets/Pengie game but Pitts called up Sestito. In 1:02 minutes spread over 3 shifts he managed a fight with Thorburn (a draw IMO), injured Enstrom & got about 38 minutes & a misconduct. Today the NHL suspended him for 4 games. Anti-fighting advocate Rutherford called up Sistito specifically for 1 game. Stay classy Pittsbung (sic). It's typical for the Pengies... Much like when Mario was doing a lot of complaining about dirty play, while at the same time having a couple of the leagues most notorious dirtbags on the roster... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 23 hours ago, travel_dude said: Man, we traded Brett Hull. Forgot about Newy and Gilmore. Are they doing well elsewhere? Many were up in arms about his development this Blah, blah blah, if I not mistaken you were not a fan of the deal, which is neither here nor there. Never understood the reasoning on why he is still a topic. My god its like still hanging on to the ex that dumped you 3 years ago....let it go and move on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 26 minutes ago, tmac70 said: Many were up in arms about his development this Blah, blah blah, if I not mistaken you were not a fan of the deal, which is neither here nor there. Never understood the reasoning on why he is still a topic. My god its like still hanging on to the ex that dumped you 3 years ago....let it go and move on The Brett Hull trade is long done and over with, so it is what it is, and I don't dwell on it... But what really P's me O about the golden Brett was his snub of Canada and choosing to play for the States when he was born here... For that reason I will not have him on my team in NHL 17 and I will gladly take a charging or boarding call any time I see him on the ice for the other team and get the chance... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 The one thing about Granlund is, I wish he would've played LW. He apparently didn't want to, but I think is now in Van? We could have used another LW with his skill. Although still not truculent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 1 hour ago, robrob74 said: The one thing about Granlund is, I wish he would've played LW. He apparently didn't want to, but I think is now in Van? We could have used another LW with his skill. Although still not truculent. Start of the season the LW depth was Gaudreau - Tkachuk - Ferland - Bouma. Now it's Gaudreau - tkachuk - Versteeg - Bouma. I honestly don't think Granlund would have made this team and I think the Flames knew it. You can question the return they got if you want but I think it was absolutely the right call to move him when they did. They likely don't get the same return if they wait until camp and then have to risk putting him on waivers. And again, before we get too excited about Granlund's points remember that Sam Bennett is out producing him 5 on 5 and Granlund definitely would not have been a PP option here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 4 hours ago, Carty said: The Brett Hull trade is long done and over with, so it is what it is, and I don't dwell on it... But what really P's me O about the golden Brett was his snub of Canada and choosing to play for the States when he was born here... For that reason I will not have him on my team in NHL 17 and I will gladly take a charging or boarding call any time I see him on the ice for the other team and get the chance... I remember when Jeremy Roenick was on the trading block as a UFA. He openly admitted to sending a fax to every Canadian team stating that he had no interest in playing in Canada, so don't bother attempting trying to trade for him. Perhaps he was worried that his ego might not fit through the border. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted March 10, 2017 Report Share Posted March 10, 2017 8 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said: I remember when Jeremy Roenick was on the trading block as a UFA. He openly admitted to sending a fax to every Canadian team stating that he had no interest in playing in Canada, so don't bother attempting trying to trade for him. Perhaps he was worried that his ego might not fit through the border. Was also about 5 minutes away from signing in Calgary at the end of this career. Only thing that changed his mind was getting a call from San Jose (played with Doug Wilson), but he was ready to sign here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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