2019 Playoffs: What have we learned?

[cccsberg]

Now that the first round is almost complete there are certainly a few trends impacting a bunch of the regular season's high-end teams.  TBL, Pittsburg, Calgary and Winnipeg are all gone in major upsets, with Boston, Nashville and SJS hanging on by a thread.  Are there common themes and learnings we can take back to the Flames?

[ABC923]

Beware complacency late in the regular season.  Tampa and Calgary were cruising for the last week or two (or four, maybe five for Tampa), and both were swept aside by teams playing their hearts out down the stretch.

[The_People1]

Flash wins regular season games.  Sandpaper wins playoff games.

 

I know some want to trade all our flash for sandpaper but we run the risk of not making the playoffs at all in that case.  It's a tough balancing act.  

[Thebrewcrew]

I think as fans we were bamboozled by the regular season record. Up until the end of January the team deserved the record they had. The second half wasn’t as good, just treaded water. We won the games we had to but if SJ didn’t go on a 7 game skid, we may have finished 2nd. Looking back now the warning signs were there for a 1st round exit. No real top line since the end of January. COL more wins than us from Feb to April. 

 

I find myself very disappointed and frustrated but looking around the league, Winnipeg, Pittsburgh and Tampa are all out too. All 3 of those teams had legit Stanley Cup aspirations in September. While expectations from us as fans changed throughout the season from making playoffs to a deep run, I can’t imagine the frustration in TB and WPG, both teams are cap strapped .

 

I think what we can learn is what we already knew. Where you finish is irrelevant. How you’re playing come the start of the playoffs is what’s gonna give you a early exit or a playoff run of a lifetime.

 

 

 

 

[cross16]

The NHL is a parity league and the difference between 1-16 on talent is small so some combination of confidence, execution and luck is what's going to win a series not talent. 

[robrob74]

10 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I think as fans we were bamboozled by the regular season record. Up until the end of January the team deserved the record they had. The second half wasn’t as good, just treaded water. We won the games we had to but if SJ didn’t go on a 7 game skid, we may have finished 2nd. Looking back now the warning signs were there for a 1st round exit. No real top line since the end of January. COL more wins than us from Feb to April. 

 

I find myself very disappointed and frustrated but looking around the league, Winnipeg, Pittsburgh and Tampa are all out too. All 3 of those teams had legit Stanley Cup aspirations in September. While expectations from us as fans changed throughout the season from making playoffs to a deep run, I can’t imagine the frustration in TB and WPG, both teams are cap strapped .

 

I think what we can learn is what we already knew. Where you finish is irrelevant. How you’re playing come the start of the playoffs is what’s gonna give you a early exit or a playoff run of a lifetime.

 

 

 

 

 

The team had its warts throughout the year. We forget the coaches weren’t pleased with the team’s play before Christmas. They were winning a lot but not sticking to the X’s And 0’s. Peters was begging to practice. They finish out well going to the all star break and a quarter to half of the team was off and on Satoshi Nakamoto since then. 

 

We sqy day we played well the whole season. Not true. We played crappy until Pittsburgh. From Pittsburgh to Xmas we played good but started to decline and won despite of the decline in play. Cleaned it up again until the all star break, and then our best players couldn’t get back on the horse since then. 

 

The warts we have shown through the playoffs. Mistakes made are mistakes I’ve witnessed all year. 2/3s of the regular season, you can win despite those warts, but you cannot win in the playoffs with them.

[rickross]

We learned to respect Nathan McKinnon. 

 

We learned that the regular season doesn’t determine who’s a Cup contender or Pretender. 

 

We learned that we have not yet built a playoff ready team. 

 

I learned that wearing your teams jersey doesn’t create any type of luck or give your team any kind of boost in the playoffs. 

 

I also learned with the ousting of the Jets, that leaves 1 Canadian team in contention being the Leafs. The amount of Leafs coverage alone is going to make sick! Lol

 

[robrob74]

6 minutes ago, rickross said:

We learned to respect Nathan McKinnon. 

 

We learned that the regular season doesn’t determine who’s a Cup contender or Pretender. 

 

We learned that we have not yet built a playoff ready team. 

 

I learned that wearing your teams jersey doesn’t create any type of luck or give your team any kind of boost in the playoffs. 

 

I also learned with the ousting of the Jets, that leaves 1 Canadian team in contention being the Leafs. The amount of Leafs coverage alone is going to make sick! Lol

 

 

I learned that this team isn’t willing to put the effort in to try. It took them until game 5 to really start the playoffs. 

[rickross]

10 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

I learned that this team isn’t willing to put the effort in to try. It took them until game 5 to really start the playoffs. 

It’s actually effed up to shutout a team 4-0 in Game 1 then proceed to lose your next 4 games. 2 of them complete blowouts at that! Smh!

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

16 hours ago, The_People1 said:

Flash wins regular season games.  Sandpaper wins playoff games.

 

I know some want to trade all our flash for sandpaper but we run the risk of not making the playoffs at all in that case.  It's a tough balancing act.  

- I learned some supposed "fans" think the only answer is a total blowup/rebuild.

- I learned that the almost exact same line up dominated in the first half but couldn't keep the pace in the end. The main issue to focus on.

- I learned that I still hate the bump back on the PP.

- I learned that the teams has no solution for  a shut down strategy by an opposing team.

- I learned that I have no idea what the answer for Neal is.

- I learned that most of the parts are here, they just need to be assembled differently.

 

I for one will be a loud and proud Flames fan come September (as always) regardless what happens in the offseason.

[MAC331]

I agree with cross16 that league parity exists and any team has to maintain the effort to play their best hockey. Where we ended up in the standings had a lot to do with other teams struggles throughout the course of the season. I didn't think we played all that great all season and were a team getting to know the coach and our team mates. I learned that BT and BP need to keep building this team so they improve on the good aspects discovered this season.

[phoenix66]

11 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

I agree with cross16 that league parity exists and any team has to maintain the effort to play their best hockey. Where we ended up in the standings had a lot to do with other teams struggles throughout the course of the season. I didn't think we played all that great all season and were a team getting to know the coach and our team mates. I learned that BT and BP need to keep building this team so they improve on the good aspects discovered this season.

I think (hope ) we learned that Talent doesn't guarantee you success.. this unfortunately has to be learned

I don't know how old everybody here is , but I remember the 1982 Edmonton Oilers .. the cocky , infamous "singing on the bench" team.. LA beat them in the first round 

Next season ?  went to the finals  

 

How different is this series , if we hold the lead and win game 2?- go to Colorado with a 2-0 lead and the pressure on Colorado?.. Colorado was a reeling , confused , frustrated team after we shut them out in game 1.. a win in game 2 would have hurt big time.. instead, we let them have some confidence 

That is the lesson of playoffs..never let your foot off their throat. 

[MAC331]

3 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

I think (hope ) we learned that Talent doesn't guarantee you success.. this unfortunately has to be learned

I don't know how old everybody here is , but I remember the 1982 Edmonton Oilers .. the cocky , infamous "singing on the bench" team.. LA beat them in the first round 

Next season ?  went to the finals  

 

How different is this series , if we hold the lead and win game 2?- go to Colorado with a 2-0 lead and the pressure on Colorado?.. Colorado was a reeling , confused , frustrated team after we shut them out in game 1.. a win in game 2 would have hurt big time.. instead, we let them have some confidence 

That is the lesson of playoffs..never let your foot off their throat. 

If you don't learn from losing you are almost guaranteed to stay a loser. We were by no means a well tuned winning machine and most everyone got swept up with the winning.

We did not get best efforts from our best players when it counted the most both offensively and on defense. Hopefully our remaining players for next season remember the lessons.

[jjgallow]

24 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

If you don't learn from losing you are almost guaranteed to stay a loser. We were by no means a well tuned winning machine and most everyone got swept up with the winning.

We did not get best efforts from our best players when it counted the most both offensively and on defense. Hopefully our remaining players for next season remember the lessons.

 

This

[jjgallow]

20 hours ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

- I learned some supposed "fans" think the only answer is a total blowup/rebuild.

-

 

Nobody has any right to question whether  others on here are true fans.  That is childish and totally unacceptable.

 

The topic of this thread is "what did we learn".

 

Your answer was "go flames go".

 

Yes, from  a corporate perspective you are a much better fan for the Flame's bottom line.   Guaranteed income regardless of the quality of the product 

 

Some of us here like watching great hockey.   Playoff hockey especially.  Some of us want our city represented well.  Some of us want more, and we're willing to accept a little pain to get it. 

 

You don't have to agree with it but the least you can do is respect it.   

[phoenix66]

28 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

If you don't learn from losing you are almost guaranteed to stay a loser. We were by no means a well tuned winning machine and most everyone got swept up with the winning.

We did not get best efforts from our best players when it counted the most both offensively and on defense. Hopefully our remaining players for next season remember the lessons.

agreed .. I'l even add to my post WHY it let down .. players will never admit it , because its psychological..

Game 1 :   we didn't even play our best and we shut them out !  we got this !

Game 2 :  Wait , what happened..but no problem , Smith is keeping us in there .. (3rd period )..see?  we tied it and got the lead back.. we got this ( OT..WTF just happened??)

Game 3:  WTH----  but no problem , we just need a win in their building , and we get home ice back..they're not winning there again 

Game 4:  see game 2

Game 5: half the team already checked out in Game 4

 

[MAC331]

7 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

agreed .. I'l even add to my post WHY it let down .. players will never admit it , because its psychological..

Game 1 :   we didn't even play our best and we shut them out !  we got this !

Game 2 :  Wait , what happened..but no problem , Smith is keeping us in there .. (3rd period )..see?  we tied it and got the lead back.. we got this ( OT..WTF just happened??)

Game 3:  WTH----  but no problem , we just need a win in their building , and we get home ice back..they're not winning there again 

Game 4:  see game 2

Game 5: half the team already checked out in Game 4

 

I agree with you because they had that kind of luck from the AS break onward. Most times good is not good enough, hopefully this is what they learned.

[jjgallow]

12 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

agreed .. I'l even add to my post WHY it let down .. players will never admit it , because its psychological..

Game 1 :   we didn't even play our best and we shut them out !  we got this !

Game 2 :  Wait , what happened..but no problem , Smith is keeping us in there .. (3rd period )..see?  we tied it and got the lead back.. we got this ( OT..WTF just happened??)

Game 3:  WTH----  but no problem , we just need a win in their building , and we get home ice back..they're not winning there again 

Game 4:  see game 2

Game 5: half the team already checked out in Game 4

 

 

I completely agree.   However, I am not convinced that psychology alone was enough to get pummelled that thoroughly.   We had our limbs torn off out there.

 

I think we have to concede that yes, they broke us psychologically, but they were also just a better playoff team.  Bigger, better defence, better offense, and, when it comes down to it, they may have had the better goaltending too although nobody's about to blame Smith by any means.

 

It will be interesting to see how Colorado does in the remainder of the playoffs.    If they go to the finals, then maybe we have some reprieve.  Maybe they're just better than we all thought.   If they get knocked out early, it is confirmation that we have a big problem.

[phoenix66]

4 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I completely agree.   However, I am not convinced that psychology alone was enough to get pummelled that thoroughly.   We had our limbs torn off out there.

 

I think we have to concede that yes, they broke us psychologically, but they were also just a better playoff team.  Bigger, better defence, better offense, and, when it comes down to it, they may have had the better goaltending too although nobody's about to blame Smith by any means.

 

It will be interesting to see how Colorado does in the remainder of the playoffs.    If they go to the finals, then maybe we have some reprieve.  Maybe they're just better than we all thought.   If they get knocked out early, it is confirmation that we have a big problem.

oh I agree it wasn't the only reason , but it was the biggest one 

I truly feel we are a good playmaking center away.. they said it on FAN this morning and it made sense ..

Too much pressure on the top line .. they get shut down,  Backlunds line is trying to shut down their top line.. now suddenly the load needs to be carried by Jankowski's line and hope the Ryan line chips in

 

You add a new Playmaking center .. now you have a legitimate scoring line available with 2 more lines possibly picking up the slack

Push Backlund down to the 3rd line , let the 2nd and 1st line carry the load for scoring ..   your 4th line just became even more deadly 

Ranatanen destroyed us from the 2nd line position ,  Draisaitl owns us in edmonton mostly from the 2nd line 

OUr 2nd line is also our checking line ..we're wasting Tkachuk there 

 

How deadly could this be ?

 

JG - Monahan - LIndholm

Tkachuk - Duchesne(just for example) - Neal

Bennett  - Backlund - Dube

Mang - Ryan - Hathaway

 

 

 

[cross16]

 

I agree fully with this quote from Gio.

 

Flames all season derived their success form taking it to teams, by out skating them and by being quick in transition and that was not there in the playoffs. They were so much more concerned about trying to trying to slow down the Avs they got away from their game. Flames really put themselves on their heels more so than the Avs did IMO. 

 

Why I think there is great worry in making so many decision based on the playoffs alone. 

[MAC331]

41 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

oh I agree it wasn't the only reason , but it was the biggest one 

I truly feel we are a good playmaking center away.. they said it on FAN this morning and it made sense ..

Too much pressure on the top line .. they get shut down,  Backlunds line is trying to shut down their top line.. now suddenly the load needs to be carried by Jankowski's line and hope the Ryan line chips in

 

You add a new Playmaking center .. now you have a legitimate scoring line available with 2 more lines possibly picking up the slack

Push Backlund down to the 3rd line , let the 2nd and 1st line carry the load for scoring ..   your 4th line just became even more deadly 

Ranatanen destroyed us from the 2nd line position ,  Draisaitl owns us in edmonton mostly from the 2nd line 

OUr 2nd line is also our checking line ..we're wasting Tkachuk there 

 

How deadly could this be ?

 

JG - Monahan - LIndholm

Tkachuk - Duchesne(just for example) - Neal

Bennett  - Backlund - Dube

Mang - Ryan - Hathaway

 

 

 

Duchene as been accused of being anyting but a playmaker so not sure you are on the right track there.

[phoenix66]

9 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Duchene as been accused of being anyting but a playmaker so not sure you are on the right track there.

Nearly 60% of his points are assists so not really sure what their definition is then 

 

Season	TEAM	GAMES	GOALS	ASSISTS	POINTS
2009-2010         COL		81	24	31	55
2010-2011	COL	80	27	40	67
2011-2012	COL	58	14	14	28
2012-2013	COL	47	17	26	43
2013-2014	COL	71	23	47	70
2014-2015	COL	82	21	34	55
2015-2016	COL	76	30	29	59
2016-2017	COL	77	18	23	41
2017-2018	COL	14	4	6	10
2017-2018	OTT	68	23	26	49
2018-2019	OTT	50	27	31	58
2018-2019	CBJ	23	4	8	12
Career	-	727	232	315	547

[MAC331]

38 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

I agree fully with this quote from Gio.

 

Flames all season derived their success form taking it to teams, by out skating them and by being quick in transition and that was not there in the playoffs. They were so much more concerned about trying to trying to slow down the Avs they got away from their game. Flames really put themselves on their heels more so than the Avs did IMO. 

 

Why I think there is great worry in making so many decision based on the playoffs alone. 

I thought the flaws were mostly there all season, just overlooked because they were winning. There were some real positives to come out this season beginning with Lindholm. He is a very good hockey player, is game is topnotch. Bennett showed he has learned a lot and his game was at another level, could he go back to C a line I think so. Hathaway progressed, Mangiapane showed through and Ryan finally showed the reliability we had heard about.

On defense Andersson emerged, Valimaki is a solid player, Hanfin was good in spurts, Kylington was good with his time and Fantenberg proved to be a good move by BT. Granted all these young defensemen showed struggles at various times however lots to like.

Rittich answered the bell and we now know he can be relied upon.

[MAC331]

1 minute ago, phoenix66 said:

Nearly 60% of his points are assists so not really sure what their definition is then 

 

Season	TEAM	GAMES	GOALS	ASSISTS	POINTS
2009-2010         COL		81	24	31	55
2010-2011	COL	80	27	40	67
2011-2012	COL	58	14	14	28
2012-2013	COL	47	17	26	43
2013-2014	COL	71	23	47	70
2014-2015	COL	82	21	34	55
2015-2016	COL	76	30	29	59
2016-2017	COL	77	18	23	41
2017-2018	COL	14	4	6	10
2017-2018	OTT	68	23	26	49
2018-2019	OTT	50	27	31	58
2018-2019	CBJ	23	4	8	12
Career	-	727	232	315	547

Right place , right time, don't know and was just repeating what I heard. Is he a fit here I don't know that either. If we are going for a C the player I would like is Braydon Schenn from STL. Where do you think Duchene's asking price will be ?

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

oh I agree it wasn't the only reason , but it was the biggest one 

I truly feel we are a good playmaking center away.. they said it on FAN this morning and it made sense ..

Too much pressure on the top line .. they get shut down,  Backlunds line is trying to shut down their top line.. now suddenly the load needs to be carried by Jankowski's line and hope the Ryan line chips in

 

You add a new Playmaking center .. now you have a legitimate scoring line available with 2 more lines possibly picking up the slack

Push Backlund down to the 3rd line , let the 2nd and 1st line carry the load for scoring ..   your 4th line just became even more deadly 

Ranatanen destroyed us from the 2nd line position ,  Draisaitl owns us in edmonton mostly from the 2nd line 

OUr 2nd line is also our checking line ..we're wasting Tkachuk there 

 

How deadly could this be ?

 

JG - Monahan - LIndholm

Tkachuk - Duchesne(just for example) - Neal

Bennett  - Backlund - Dube

Mang - Ryan - Hathaway

 

 

 

If you could obtain Duchene I would still move Monahan out of a C position to LW. I think the team needs a few new dynamics.

Gaudreau, Bennett, Tkachuk

Monahan, Duchene, Lindholm

Dzingel, Backlund, Kapanen

This would be 3 awesome lines for us.