GM_3300 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 14 minutes ago, JTech780 said: I will own my part of the negativity. Sometimes I can take things a bit far to try and prove my point. I think Rittich will have a big year this coming season. That being said I think we are looking for a 2nd goalie to be part of the tandem. My guess is that we won't have a goalie that plays 50+ games next season unless there are injuries. I am nervous about Talbot, but I think there is a decent chance he could rebound and be a solid goalie for us. I mean we just seen Lehner and Mrazek have very nice rebound seasons. Having Gillies or Parsons or Zagidulin as 3rd options gives lots of chances that 1 could turn into a Binnington in the off chance that things don't go according to plan next season. I was just going to say out of this list Talbot on a 1year deal would be my choice. If the signing is confirmed I think we have a good situation for our net. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 8 minutes ago, The_People1 said: Damn, it better be a 1-year deal. $2-mil max. Yeah that about where I see it as well. I mean if we look at it like that Talbot actually got the Oilers to the 2nd round a couple of years ago, that's a pretty big accomplishment. Listening to Treliving the other day, he said that they see Rittich as the guy and they want to bring someone in the help support him, I think Talbot can fit that. Smith always seemed like a guy that didn't like being the 1B or back up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 20 minutes ago, JTech780 said: I thought teams were not allowed to discuss price during the interview process. Right? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 Just now, The_People1 said: I thought teams were not allowed to discuss price during the interview process. Right? I think they talk in generalities, but aren't supposed to talk contracts. So they could probably say things like, we are thinking a 1 year deal around $2m, how does that sound? And Talbot and his team can say we would have interest in that. I mean at the end of the day the league wants July 1 to be an eventful day so having a bunch of deals signed and ready to go to be announced on July 1 is good for the league. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 1 minute ago, JTech780 said: I think they talk in generalities, but aren't supposed to talk contracts. So they could probably say things like, we are thinking a 1 year deal around $2m, how does that sound? And Talbot and his team can say we would have interest in that. I mean at the end of the day the league wants July 1 to be an eventful day so having a bunch of deals signed and ready to go to be announced on July 1 is good for the league. Lol can't talk money but can talk in terms of "i think"? Such grey area. So only gentleman handshake allowed with all numbers agreed to but the official contract cannot be submitted to your agent until July 1st. Right? So stupid. Just let them talk money and term. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, The_People1 said: Lol can't talk money but can talk in terms of "i think"? Such grey area. So only gentleman handshake allowed with all numbers agreed to but the official contract cannot be submitted to your agent until July 1st. Right? So stupid. Just let them talk money and term. Oh I agree. If you look at the NBA, guys have deals worked out weeks before free agency opens up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MP5029 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 Lehner would be my #1 target right now all be it it will cost some coin but we’ll worth it...only thing is if it were done we would have to let Ritich go he’s getting to a point of 3mil+ per season very soon if he keeps developing this way...and I’d also consider Remier in Fla as my second choice (I think you could squeeze either a good prospect or decent draft pick from them)...Tabilot is my distant 3rd option all be it cheaper option over Rimier there is less squeeze they and both kinda rebound projects. all and all I think it’s a smart move to let Ritich have the chance to be our go to, he earned it 😊 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 Assuming Talbot is a 1-year $3-mil, then what do we want to see for Rittich? Maybe, $3.5 x 2? Is that a fair deal? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 I am one of the most critical and negative poster on here. Sorry for that. I do want this team to be a model of consistency and a perennial threat. I just don’t see it yet with this group and we do have good to great parts. There are holes and will always be holes. But one of the things we don’t have is drive or killer instinct. I’d say Johnny and Benny are the ones with the highest compete on the team. The problem is that Benny has never taken the next step. Others have it as well, but we just aren’t quite there yet. Plus the coach refused fused to fix parts of the roster that wasn’t working and then became a one line team. There are a lot of great parts. The mix needs tinkering. So sorry about it. I really don’t know what can be done to fix it. How many moves can Bt realistically make? I think Talbot could be a good add. I’d honestly hope it is for a few more seasons than a 1yr. We love to say if we could just get league average goaltending. I kind of think Talbot’s numbers could fall somewhere in the middle of those numbers with and not with Edmonton, which would equate to about league average. 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM_3300 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 8 minutes ago, robrob74 said: I am one of the most critical and negative poster on here. Sorry for that. I do want this team to be a model of consistency and a perennial threat. I just don’t see it yet with this group and we do have good to great parts. There are holes and will always be holes. But one of the things we don’t have is drive or killer instinct. I’d say Johnny and Benny are the ones with the highest compete on the team. The problem is that Benny has never taken the next step. Others have it as well, but we just aren’t quite there yet. Plus the coach refused fused to fix parts of the roster that wasn’t working and then became a one line team. There are a lot of great parts. The mix needs tinkering. So sorry about it. I really don’t know what can be done to fix it. How many moves can Bt realistically make? I think Talbot could be a good add. I’d honestly hope it is for a few more seasons than a 1yr. We love to say if we could just get league average goaltending. I kind of think Talbot’s numbers could fall somewhere in the middle of those numbers with and not with Edmonton, which would equate to about league average. I would be more inclined to have Talbot at 1.75M on a 1year keeping it short term and Rittich at 2.5M on a 3 year deal. This is how I would position our Goaltending for now. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 13 minutes ago, robrob74 said: I am one of the most critical and negative poster on here. Sorry for that. I do want this team to be a model of consistency and a perennial threat. I just don’t see it yet with this group and we do have good to great parts. There are holes and will always be holes. But one of the things we don’t have is drive or killer instinct. I’d say Johnny and Benny are the ones with the highest compete on the team. The problem is that Benny has never taken the next step. Others have it as well, but we just aren’t quite there yet. Plus the coach refused fused to fix parts of the roster that wasn’t working and then became a one line team. There are a lot of great parts. The mix needs tinkering. So sorry about it. I really don’t know what can be done to fix it. How many moves can Bt realistically make? I think Talbot could be a good add. I’d honestly hope it is for a few more seasons than a 1yr. We love to say if we could just get league average goaltending. I kind of think Talbot’s numbers could fall somewhere in the middle of those numbers with and not with Edmonton, which would equate to about league average. Appreciate the negative stuff to offset the positive stuff. That's what makes this a good place for discussion. Where I think we focus too much is on the the end of season results. We were a team that performed really well for the majority of the season. We had issues. We fixed some of them. There is no right way to build a contender. Lightening in a bottle is what wins cups. STL was worst in the league at one point. It's going to be near impossible for them to do that again. TBL collapsed. Is that going to happen again. What I like is that this team has some of the things you need to build a contender. Getting everything right and going to the finals is tough. Fixing the little problems is a good start. Understanding why some players are struggling is key. Removing the negatives is as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 5 minutes ago, travel_dude said: Appreciate the negative stuff to offset the positive stuff. That's what makes this a good place for discussion. Where I think we focus too much is on the the end of season results. We were a team that performed really well for the majority of the season. We had issues. We fixed some of them. There is no right way to build a contender. Lightening in a bottle is what wins cups. STL was worst in the league at one point. It's going to be near impossible for them to do that again. TBL collapsed. Is that going to happen again. What I like is that this team has some of the things you need to build a contender. Getting everything right and going to the finals is tough. Fixing the little problems is a good start. Understanding why some players are struggling is key. Removing the negatives is as well. I also think we could be close as well. The playoffs the team had could also be a wake up call to the group. Hope it was. It took nearly 3 games to get back on track. The team did very well in the regular season getting out of ruts. We assumed it would’ve happened again. i think Talbot could be a good signing. I’d gamble on a two year deal on him. I’d prefer 3 but there’s a need to keep options open if Rittich and Talbot fall. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 I think Tkachuk gets a Nylander type deal. He’s not quite the face of the franchise or first go to guy so he gets a similar portion of the cap that Nylander gets. I’d put Tkachuk at 7.75-8m/yr. I would prefer 7-7.5 because I am cheap. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GM_3300 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 6 minutes ago, robrob74 said: I also think we could be close as well. The playoffs the team had could also be a wake up call to the group. Hope it was. It took nearly 3 games to get back on track. The team did very well in the regular season getting out of ruts. We assumed it would’ve happened again. i think Talbot could be a good signing. I’d gamble on a two year deal on him. I’d prefer 3 but there’s a need to keep options open if Rittich and Talbot fall. I'm not sold on Rittich just yet of whether he shapes out as a regular starter or a very good back up, thus keeping things short term. Parsons should make strides this coming season and this Russian kid is 23 already so another reason to not get to long into contracts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Tribal Chief Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 I Think The Team is Leaning towards Rittich As The Starter And talbot as Back now i dont know if we sign talbot how we will have the space for Rfa Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flames-fan-in-jets-land Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 15 minutes ago, The_Snowbear said: I Think The Team is Leaning towards Rittich As The Starter And talbot as Back now i dont know if we sign talbot how we will have the space for Rfa Talbot should be under 2m, as not to hurt total spending too much. Even 2m is the top end I'd like to see for another reclamation project. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 41 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said: Talbot should be under 2m, as not to hurt total spending too much. Even 2m is the top end I'd like to see for another reclamation project. And how many reclamation projects of BT's have worked ZERO. Tre should only be allowed to do trades and work the draft. His track record on UFAs are dismal 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 20 minutes ago, tmac70 said: And how many reclamation projects of BT's have worked ZERO. Tre should only be allowed to do trades and work the draft. His track record on UFAs are dismal UFA season has become the most feared time for Flames fans. I'm dreading to hear what's Talbot's final numbers look like. Probably $4 x 2-years. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 24 minutes ago, tmac70 said: And how many reclamation projects of BT's have worked ZERO. Tre should only be allowed to do trades and work the draft. His track record on UFAs are dismal The one who ruined the plan is Gillies. The plan obviously was to get the 2 years out of Smith, by which time Gillies and Rittich would be the tandem, while Parsons incubates a bit longer in the A Unfortunately, Rittich has earned the #1 but with not quite enough rope to be relied on for a large load while Gillies eases into backup, as he has not shown he can be relied on Leaves 2 options Abandon Rittich as #1, sign a big name and relegate Rittich to backup.. which he has shown enough that would be a slap in the face Or Give Rittich the rope to further cement himself as the man, and get a reliable backup who has already shown he can handle a workload if necessary.. maybe by that time, Gillies , the Russian or Parsons can prove they want the job next year..or sooner Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 9 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: The one who ruined the plan is Gillies. Hey, I totally get the accountability thing. Many times on here I've held staff accountable and people say "can't just blame staff". But this is a numbers thing. You cannot, in all serious, blame any single goaltending prospect for a 25-year failure to develop goaltending prospects. You cannot even blame a single goaltender for any particular year. Because if there is only one, management has totally failed already. I can go through a list of dozens, and dozens, and dozens of failures. And yes, at Least half of them, maybe 80%, were never going to make it in any system. But odds dictate that at least 10-20% of them should have turned into something. The data and history is overwhelming and systemic. This is much bigger than any one tender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flames-fan-in-jets-land Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 1 hour ago, The_People1 said: UFA season has become the most feared time for Flames fans. I'm dreading to hear what's Talbot's final numbers look like. Probably $4 x 2-years. $4 x 2 years? Hell I'll chip in a toonie and make it $5 x 2. 😏 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 I think when it comes to goalies, you either draft them in the first round, or else go find one in Europe who's 21/22 and you can sort of project them better. It's too hard to tell who is the real deal at 18. When we drafted Jon Gillies in the 3rd round, there were 6 goalies drafted before him and the only 3 notable ones are Vasilevsky, Korpisalo, and Subban. What's more is the best goalie drafted in that year might arguably be Matt Murray who was drafted 8 picks after Jon Gillies. Detroit Red Wings even picked a goalie in between the two. Who knew? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted June 28, 2019 Report Share Posted June 28, 2019 3 hours ago, jjgallow said: Hey, I totally get the accountability thing. Many times on here I've held staff accountable and people say "can't just blame staff". But this is a numbers thing. You cannot, in all serious, blame any single goaltending prospect for a 25-year failure to develop goaltending prospects. You cannot even blame a single goaltender for any particular year. Because if there is only one, management has totally failed already. I can go through a list of dozens, and dozens, and dozens of failures. And yes, at Least half of them, maybe 80%, were never going to make it in any system. But odds dictate that at least 10-20% of them should have turned into something. The data and history is overwhelming and systemic. This is much bigger than any one tender. When Murray was drafted, his numbers were Smith 2018/19 bad on the OHL. It wasn;t until his last season there and until he played in the AHL before he showed very good numbers. Nature vs nurture. I don;t see any success so far with our AHL program. The NHL one seems to cause regression if anything. Rittich was an established goalie before he came here. He was inconsistent there and similar in his 1st year of AHL. He got more consistent, he didn;t get better. I think we can look back and figure out when our current goalie coach was in the AHL. We can see what it's been like since he got to the NHL. AT some point you have to overhaul the program when the picks aren't working out. Gillies and Parsons could have developed better. The talent seemed to be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted June 29, 2019 Report Share Posted June 29, 2019 50 minutes ago, travel_dude said: When Murray was drafted, his numbers were Smith 2018/19 bad on the OHL. It wasn;t until his last season there and until he played in the AHL before he showed very good numbers. Nature vs nurture. I don;t see any success so far with our AHL program. The NHL one seems to cause regression if anything. Rittich was an established goalie before he came here. He was inconsistent there and similar in his 1st year of AHL. He got more consistent, he didn;t get better. I think we can look back and figure out when our current goalie coach was in the AHL. We can see what it's been like since he got to the NHL. AT some point you have to overhaul the program when the picks aren't working out. Gillies and Parsons could have developed better. The talent seemed to be there. This. Need to be addressed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_Tribal Chief Posted June 29, 2019 Report Share Posted June 29, 2019 Honestly Edmonton ruined Talbot i felt he was a decent Goalie and i honestly Feel With the Way the flames play and there Defence that Talbot could really do well here Imo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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