Goaltending

[conundrumed]

13 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 I get why people like Kehatch are concerned 

And they always will be. No offense to him, but he's been pretty sour lately in his posts.

Hopefully he comes around because he's a very intelligent poster.

You get too high and then a 6 game losing streak. You get too low and a 6 game win streak.

Cheques and balances. We could all complain endlessly.

I'm hear to cheer, not magnify mistakes.

[travel_dude]

8 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

And they always will be. No offense to him, but he's been pretty sour lately in his posts.

Hopefully he comes around because he's a very intelligent poster.

You get too high and then a 6 game losing streak. You get too low and a 6 game win streak.

Cheques and balances. We could all complain endlessly.

I'm hear to cheer, not magnify mistakes.

 

We always have the Positivity thread to help us look at the good things.  Not much traction lately, but then again the Burn it Down thread is also down to a dull roar.  We all haves our pet peeves.  Mine is riding a not-hot goalie over a hot one.  The evidence is out there.  Play to win while you have all your tools available.

[cross16]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I agree, but just start your best player, so far it's Rittich. That's not an indictment of Smith. Perfect opportunity to limit his starts rn.

There's no saying Rittich won't fall apart when the pressure gets cranked, but take advantage now and give Smith time to work out the mechanics.

We don't have to force it rn is all I'm saying.

 

In the 14 games since Rittich got his first start it's 8-6 split in favor of Smith.

 

I think we're making too much of this "Smith is the starter" thing. Playing out much more like a tandem IMO which I don't have a problem with. If we are still having this conversation in another 8-10 games i'd change my tune. 

 

1 hour ago, robrob74 said:

 

Hmm if getting chances within that pink area is the only thing that constitutes a high danger chance then it could be extremely flawed. The chances from there can still be, by the eye test, not very good. We can put chance everyone from that area but still be considered poor chances by the eye test.

 

High danger would constitute the green box with the 24/193. Medium danger the pinker box and the peach colored box is low danger. 

 

1 hour ago, robrob74 said:

 

I get that we are relatively early in the season. We don’t really know what the future plans are for goalies. Will riding smith mean a re-sign situation or shouldn’t we be grooming the goalie for future starter in the league. 

 

Counting on UFA and summer trades hasn’t been a great plan either. How long can Brobovsky play at an elite level. HK of the NYR has dropped in play the past few seasons as he is aging out. A UFA signing might still only bandage the situation.

 

I don’t mind if Rittich maintains his play as a backup. But the starter position scares me for the future. I get why people like Kehatch are concerned 

 

I get the concern too but I also think people need to get better at just letting things play out and seeing what happens. These are human beings so to me the best plan is often going to fail and sometimes you discover what you have by accident and opportunity. Weren't sure what to think about our D core with an aging D and declining Brodie but how that we are seeing Valamki/Andersson aren't we feeling better about it? What were your thoughts of Kipper before they gave him a chance? Not saying anyone in the organization is Kipper but who was Martin Jones or Connor Helleybyuck?

 

Let's see how things play out is all i'm saying instead of making definite definitions less than 20 games into the season. There is a fair bit of talent in this organization at the goalie position. 

[robrob74]

37 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Not even 20 games in yet. I don't really have a problem getting both guys going so long as Smith plays like he did in SJ and not against Colorado. 

 

Plenty of time for this to sort itself out and certainly not even close to needing to make decisions for next year. 

 

I get that we are relatively early in the season. We don’t really know what the future plans are for goalies. Will riding smith mean a re-sign situation or shouldn’t we be grooming the goalie for future starter in the league. 

 

Counting on UFA and summer trades hasn’t been a great plan either. How long can Brobovsky play at an elite level. HK of the NYR has dropped in play the past few seasons as he is aging out. A UFA signing might still only bandage the situation.

 

I don’t mind if Rittich maintains his play as a backup. But the starter position scares me for the future. I get why people like Kehatch are concerned 

[robrob74]

57 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

In the 14 games since Rittich got his first start it's 8-6 split in favor of Smith.

 

I think we're making too much of this "Smith is the starter" thing. Playing out much more like a tandem IMO which I don't have a problem with. If we are still having this conversation in another 8-10 games i'd change my tune. 

 

 

High danger would constitute the green box with the 24/193. Medium danger the pinker box and the peach colored box is low danger. 

 

 

I get the concern too but I also think people need to get better at just letting things play out and seeing what happens. These are human beings so to me the best laid plan is often going to fail and sometimes you discover what you have by accident and opportunity. Weren't sure what to think about our D core with an aging D and declining Brodie but how that we are seeing Valamki/Andersson aren't we feeling better about it? What were your thoughts of Kipper before they gave him a chance? Not saying anyone in the organization is Kipper but who was Martin Jones or Connor Helleybyuck?

 

Let's see how things play out is all i'm saying instead of making definite definitions less than 20 games into the season. There is a fair bit of talent in this organization at the goalie position. 

 

Honestly! This is my favourite Kipper moment:

 

i went to see the Canucks and Sharks play when Kipper was with them. Kipper got the start and  I got to sit behind his net In the first row of upper deck to watch the game. I told my dad, this is the goalie I wish the flames had. He battled, had good form and made some awesome saves. He lost 5-2 or 5-3, but wow did he look good.

 

but true, someone will come along. Whatever happened to the kid Kipper clone. He should be old enough now !

[Cowtownguy]

10 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Honestly! This is my favourite Kipper moment:

 

i went to see the Canucks and Sharks play when Kipper was with them. Kipper got the start and  I got to sit behind his net In the first row of upper deck to watch the game. I told my dad, this is the goalie I wish the flames had. He battled, had good form and made some awesome saves. He lost 5-2 or 5-3, but wow did he look good.

 

but true, someone will come along. Whatever happened to the kid Kipper clone. He should be old enough now !

Mime school?

[electrical_ace]

I’ve seen enough of Mike Smith. How many bad goals before they get it???

[redfire11]

Another .864 sv% night for Smith.  Coaching staff need to wake up.

[tmac70]

He has been given enough rope, tonights game should be enough proof he is washed up

[The_People1]

They can't just cross the blue line and score on wrist shots.  This is not an isolated incident.  Fool me once... 

[Thebrewcrew]

Quite the conundrum between the pipes. Give Rittich the next handful of starts. Seee if he can provide quality goaltending over a handful of games.

 

If he can’t, that puts us in a precarious spot. Surely no team will want Smith at this point. Which means if BT feels the need to add a goalie we will most likely have to carry a three headed monster in net

[robrob74]

3 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Quite the conundrum between the pipes. Give Rittich the next handful of starts. Seee if he can provide quality goaltending over a handful of games.

 

If he can’t, that puts us in a precarious spot. Surely no team will want Smith at this point. Which means if BT feels the need to add a goalie we will most likely have to carry a three headed monster in net

 

IF THEY CAN MAKE A DEAL for another goalie, we could bury smith in the AHL. I think there is enough cap space to do it. 

[travel_dude]

I was thinking it was a golden opportunity to start Rittich against MTL.

The game got away from the team in MTL, Rittich still managed to keep it close enough to come back.  40 saves.

EDM would have been the logical choice for Smith, as his last two against them were dominant, even after he came back from injury.

 

Now we started Smith and he comes up on the wrong side of stoppable shots.  First was bad.  3rd was worse.

We can;t go back to Smith on Saturday.

There is no pint or logic.

Get Smith going?  That was San Jose game, which only showed that he still leaks goals.

Now that we see Smith isn;t going.  3 loses in 3 starts.

 

Let's drop the term "starter" and just give the starts to the goalie that gives you the best chance to win.

Or, the one the Head Coach feels is the right choice based on HIS review of game tapes, not Sigalet's opinion. 

[The_People1]

2 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Or, the one the Head Coach feels is the right choice based on HIS review of game tapes, not Sigalet's opinion. 

 

Did Peters manage his goalies well in Carolina?  They seem to have had 3 headed monsters every season under Peters.

[robrob74]

4 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

I was thinking it was a golden opportunity to start Rittich against MTL.

The game got away from the team in MTL, Rittich still managed to keep it close enough to come back.  40 saves.

EDM would have been the logical choice for Smith, as his last two against them were dominant, even after he came back from injury.

 

Now we started Smith and he comes up on the wrong side of stoppable shots.  First was bad.  3rd was worse.

We can;t go back to Smith on Saturday.

There is no pint or logic.

Get Smith going?  That was San Jose game, which only showed that he still leaks goals.

Now that we see Smith isn;t going.  3 loses in 3 starts.

 

Let's drop the term "starter" and just give the starts to the goalie that gives you the best chance to win.

Or, the one the Head Coach feels is the right choice based on HIS review of game tapes, not Sigalet's opinion. 

 

 

I think the Flames missed an opportunity to get some points on the Canucks and then separate from the other teams. 

 

Its early in the season, but it’s like you said, gotta go win and you’re in. Maybe a goalie runs with it and it pushes Smith to be better.

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

IF THEY CAN MAKE A DEAL for another goalie, we could bury smith in the AHL. I think there is enough cap space to do it. 

 

Considering that LA is in a pickle with Quick and JJ both out with torn knee meniscus, the likelyhood of finding a replacement for Smith is close to zero.

Also Tampa lost their starter.

We could trade him to LA for something.

But we still need to get a goalie.

 

Maybe Mrazek or Darling or Jarry.

Or just sign a stone cold Mason.

Speaking of Stone cold, we could trade Stone for a goalie.

[robrob74]

1 minute ago, travel_dude said:

 

Considering that LA is in a pickle with Quick and JJ both out with torn knee meniscus, the likelyhood of finding a replacement for Smith is close to zero.

Also Tampa lost their starter.

We could trade him to LA for something.

But we still need to get a goalie.

 

Maybe Mrazek or Darling or Jarry.

Or just sign a stone cold Mason.

Speaking of Stone cold, we could trade Stone for a goalie.

 

Ya. Exactly. Has Mason been practicing?

 

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Did Peters manage his goalies well in Carolina?  They seem to have had 3 headed monsters every season under Peters.

 

Darling looked like crap and Lack was crap.

From what it sounds, Sigalet is making the recommendations not BP.

There was one game where it sounded like Smith was getting the next start and they gave it to Rittich.

I think that was the coach, not JS.

[JTech780]

6 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Darling looked like crap and Lack was crap.

From what it sounds, Sigalet is making the recommendations not BP.

There was one game where it sounded like Smith was getting the next start and they gave it to Rittich.

I think that was the coach, not JS.

 

It could be worse we could go back to last year when Smith decided who played.

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Ya. Exactly. Has Mason been practicing?

 

 

There is zero news on him.

Nothing other than he said he might retire when he went unsigned to start the season.

How about the Glass "kid".

He sign in Europe?

 

Seriously, I don;t think it's that drastic.  Smith will probably rebound at some point, but I don;t think it's any time soon.

It's not the same issue as Price.

Price is elite and playing like crap this year.

Smith is not elite and playing like crap.

 

The funny thing is when we had Gillies last year, he would let the first one or two in and be a brick wall after that.

We were just too frail to ever come back.

This year, Smith is doing the exact same thing, yet he is mostly not a brick wall after that.

Tonight, it should have been a brick wall after he let in the easy goal.

Against ANA, it should have been a brick wall.

 

He has to start from scratch right now, not try to win the game on one save.  Gain confidence by showing up at practice knowing you are not starting.  Battle back to retake the net.    

 

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

It could be worse we could go back to last year when Smith decided who played.

 

Is JS saying it's Smith or a JS look-alike hand puppet saving Smith gets the start.

Too much respect, perhaps.

 

I liked Hartley's "Wheel of Goalie" to decide.

[Thebrewcrew]

Goalies potentially available 

 

Rask/Crawford- would have to be draft day trades probably as both goalies have high cap hits

Bob- 1st, roster player and a Kylington or Mangi for a possible rental

Neuvirth/Pickard- a lateral move if anything 

Howard- Friedman reporting they may re-sign him so maybe unlikely 

 

[MAC331]

17 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

I get that we are relatively early in the season. We don’t really know what the future plans are for goalies. Will riding smith mean a re-sign situation or shouldn’t we be grooming the goalie for future starter in the league. 

 

Counting on UFA and summer trades hasn’t been a great plan either. How long can Brobovsky play at an elite level. HK of the NYR has dropped in play the past few seasons as he is aging out. A UFA signing might still only bandage the situation.

 

I don’t mind if Rittich maintains his play as a backup. But the starter position scares me for the future. I get why people like Kehatch are concerned 

I don't believe there is or was any plans of taking Smith past this contract. I think all eyes will be on Gilles and Parsons because there is not much of anything to trade for or hope for coming from FA. We need to iron out the best arrange with our defense and forwards so a young Goalie can come into a good team without tons of pressure. I have every confidence in Rittich as our back up.

[phoenix66]

10 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Quite the conundrum between the pipes. Give Rittich the next handful of starts. Seee if he can provide quality goaltending over a handful of games.

 

If he can’t, that puts us in a precarious spot. Surely no team will want Smith at this point. Which means if BT feels the need to add a goalie we will most likely have to carry a three headed monster in net

This..

I gotta say this has been extremely hard to watch. Smith is struggling , 99% in his own head .

The time is here to see what we have . before we go jumping on trades and such, Smith needs to  get the Holtby treatment .

Give Rittich the reigns, Smith gets backup duty . If Rittich stumbles, then fine , start looking at options , but Rittich has earned the right to see what kind of load he can carry.

 

Ironic thing is , if there is any team that can snap Smith out of a funk, its Edmonton , but in light of everything Rittich needs to get that start .

 

Around the league, goalies are dropping like flies.. the trade options are NOT good.. if we feel we need a new one , off season is the time , unless you want to badly overpay 

 

..and I swear to God, now that Crawford is back if they bring in Ward I'll lose my mind..lol

[phoenix66]

5 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

I don't believe there is or was any plans of taking Smith past this contract. I think all eyes will be on Gilles and Parsons because there is not much of anything to trade for or hope for coming from FA. We need to iron out the best arrange with our defense and forwards so a young Goalie can come into a good team without tons of pressure. I have every confidence in Rittich as our back up.

I think this season was going to be the decision time on Smith . If he was playing like last year , Id say there'd be a very real opinion to sign him back to at least a 1 year deal and use him with an even lighter workload.. but right now you could be looking at a guy that just doesn't have it anymore . Like i said just earlier , its in his own head.. the body is just fine.

I would be very easy to convince we could target a player like Varlamov in UFA after the season ..BOB is too expensive and to me anyway , just a bad contract waiting to happen