2021 Offseason Thread

[conundrumed]

22 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Sometimes it's the team he's dealing with won't budge.

He want's player X and the other team wants Y + Z.

Not being willing to give up Z is not completely wrong, but he doesn't close.

 

There have been other things at play different than this year.

We have available cap, so we don't have to restrict to money in and money out.

We can still do something major.

You may be right though.

I just have this sense that something akin to a shakeup is coming.

Not for the sake of making a trade, but a shakeup of the core.

Gio was step one, whether that the best idea or not.

Adding depth at C and in the middle/bottom six should be looked at.

Adding a good D would also help.

 

I realize that we can't do it all.

We should be able to improve what we had last year, without just relying on ELC's to take major steps.

 

Capfriendly is showing Vladar as non-roster so if he's roster we're at 5.375 remaining for Dube, Gawdin, Mackey/potentially Stone.

We don't really have much cap left, just PTO cap.

[conundrumed]

 

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Capfriendly is showing Vladar as non-roster so if he's roster we're at 5.375 remaining for Dube, Gawdin, Mackey/potentially Stone.

We don't really have much cap left, just PTO cap.

 

With 13F, 7D and 1G showing in the cap calculation, we are at minimum 1 position not filled.

At the least, subtract $750k for Vladar.

Once Dube signs, we likely demote one F.

When Mackey signs, Welinski or Kylington or Mackey goes to the AHL.

 

BT will spend to the cap or close to it.

A PTO is not going to make much of a dent in that.

 

If we make a trade, it might mean some money going out and a bigger cap coming in.

In other year, we had to send dollar for dollar.

I'm just saying there is more chance this year than in other years.

[cross16]

Flames have about 3-4 million left to spend depending on how they want to run their roster. I'm guessing around 1 million for Dube, max 1.25 but once he signed a forward will get demoted which is only a net positive cap hit of 500k. Add Vladar at 750k and it's a net cap hit of 1.25 which brings it to 4 million for a 22 person roster. Still have room to run a full 23 which would only add about 750-800K. 

 

That's quite a bit of cap space to be sitting on, especially for a team that generally likes to spend to the cap. 

[kehatch]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

He does that every year. Perhaps he tried to make moves but didn't like the ask/return.

Can't win them all. He got better depth at G and bottom lines. Coleman's a good add.

D leaves something to be desired. Need younger players to take another good step.

Different and short offseason, maybe moves will be made into the season.

 

Agree. Goalie is theoretically better, but that assumes Vlader does well. D got worse, but lots of opportunity for young guys to step up to balance that out. Wing is a fair bit better with Coleman and some Sutter guys, but still weak on right. Same issues at C as before, though we can hope Monahan is better. 

[jjgallow]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

He does that every year. Perhaps he tried to make moves but didn't like the ask/return.

Can't win them all. He got better depth at G and bottom lines. Coleman's a good add.

D leaves something to be desired. Need younger players to take another good step.

Different and short offseason, maybe moves will be made into the season.

 

He really does.  Every year we barely do anything with PTOs or overseas signings and when we Do do an overseas signing it's always weird.

 

We just wait for the next LW to come up through our development system so we can play them on 4th line RW.

 

Now I'm getting worked up again lol.

 

Here's an off-season move:

https://www.nhl.com/lightning/team/hockey-staff

 

Poach one of these guys. Yes as our Gm.   Yeah, I know we already did it with Feaster and it didn't pan out.    I for one didn't mind Feaster and much of our existing core was brought in by him.   My issue with Feaster is that he ended the rebuild too soon and that's likely a problem higher up.   Oh, and...Jankowski.  

Limit it to personel who have actually played hockey.

 

Next level planning:   Developing GMs:

 

I hate to go on about Tampa lol it annoys me too.   But here I'm going to suggest acquiring a player over 30 for the first time ever.   Alex Killorn.   Alex is one of the few players in the NHL who are genius level.    When he retires, which can't be that far off, expect him to move up into management with whatever team he is with, or with corporate NHL.  Should be an easy trade as I very much doubt their GM wants him taking his job lol.

 

One a little more ready is Colin Greening.  He should just be finishing up his MBA this year at Harvard after a very respectable NHL career.   Expect him to move up into Senators management  (if there is such a thing) or whoever else takes him.   The problem here is that he's never seen what winning looks like.

 

I'm way off the beaten path now I'm just frustrated lol.    I am confident I will get my wish about BT within the next 2 years.  I am less confident a good decision will be made.   It think if ownership Realizes they are heading into a rebuild, they may do okay in finding someone.   But there is the question.

 

 

[jjgallow]

39 minutes ago, kehatch said:

 

Agree. Goalie is theoretically better, but that assumes Vlader does well. D got worse, but lots of opportunity for young guys to step up to balance that out. Wing is a fair bit better with Coleman and some Sutter guys, but still weak on right. Same issues at C as before, though we can hope Monahan is better. 

 

I like Vladar.   But he is still a project.    Sutter is not a project coach.   He gonna play Markstrom.

Markstrom gonna be just below average.   Again (but older).  If he doesn't get another concussion.

 

The dangerous thing about where Markstrom is right now is he's just good enough, nobody's going to panic and do something about his position.  But he's just bad enough to severely limit our success.

[zima]

37 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I like Vladar.   But he is still a project.    Sutter is not a project coach.   He gonna play Markstrom.

Markstrom gonna be just below average.   Again (but older).  If he doesn't get another concussion.

 

The dangerous thing about where Markstrom is right now is he's just good enough, nobody's going to panic and do something about his position.  But he's just bad enough to severely limit our success.

So how does he stack up against Smith ?

 

[tmac70]

So to at this point of the year, the million dollar question is, are we any better than last year? IMHO this club is marginally better up front and weaker in the back end. We are or will be better coached but this roster has still does make anyone shiver with fear when we appear on the schedele. I do think they will play better but I don't see this roster as more than 2-1, 3-2 games. Playing tight hockey defensively is great when you have the D to do it, this club is not even close to this. 

 

The Eichel scenario is out  no frahcise center for this club.  Think more  what keeps you average would be more in line for a trade.  A Dvorak for Monahan would be something Tre would do plus we would add. The more this GM stays in place the worse we get. Next season you have Matthew and Johnny up, the best thing to happen would be both refuse to sign. Than  we have no other option than to run it into the rocks, which creates his removal.  The cherry on top is Tre holds on to each player to long and we get nothing for them as per normal

[jjgallow]

31 minutes ago, zima said:

So how does he stack up against Smith ?

 

He's definitely worth more.   On the ice, I would like to think he can be the better goalie against a 39 year old Smith.  But I expect Sutter will mostly play Markstrom especially against our friends in the North

[robrob74]

10 hours ago, conundrumed said:

It's almost time to get the PTOs in place and find out which plugs will keep our ELCs in the A.

Keep wondering if Phillips will ever get a look.

Would've been nice for BT to accomplish more this off-season, but the devil's in the details I guess.

 

optimists will say that the Flames are not done yet. I don’t know how much else will get done. I assume that there might be one move where we trade a skill player for a similarly skilled player. 
 

they’ll end up just shuffling the deck. Some say Giordano leaving is a big enough shake up. I think the D could be better this year. But the forwards are still stale. 

[conundrumed]

11 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

optimists will say that the Flames are not done yet. I don’t know how much else will get done. I assume that there might be one move where we trade a skill player for a similarly skilled player. 
 

they’ll end up just shuffling the deck. Some say Giordano leaving is a big enough shake up. I think the D could be better this year. But the forwards are still stale. 

Well they talk about parity in the NHL, but that's all BS. Some teams are definitely stacked against attracting talent no matter how you slice it. It's pretty much the USHL.

[robrob74]

3 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

I like Vladar.   But he is still a project.    Sutter is not a project coach.   He gonna play Markstrom.

Markstrom gonna be just below average.   Again (but older).  If he doesn't get another concussion.

 

The dangerous thing about where Markstrom is right now is he's just good enough, nobody's going to panic and do something about his position.  But he's just bad enough to severely limit our success.

he’s good enough to make us a cusp team. We’ll  be in the fight to the end.

 

I don’t see us winning the division. I see wild card possibly but possibly just out. Like this year. Be out then go on a streak and be like, we need a winning attitude, because we will be the best of all of the losers!

[robrob74]

1 minute ago, conundrumed said:

Well they talk about parity in the NHL, but that's all BS. Some teams are definitely stacked against attracting talent no matter how you slice it. It's pretty much the USHL.

 

ya, the taxing sucks. And then the desire to live in big cities is a thing. Then there’s going to a winner. We got lucky Coleman wanted to sign with us. Maybe we were one fo the only teams that could offer his contract? 
 

my bet is we sign Stone to play with Valamaki. 

[conundrumed]

2 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

ya, the taxing sucks. And then the desire to live in big cities is a thing. Then there’s going to a winner. We got lucky Coleman wanted to sign with us. Maybe we were one fo the only teams that could offer his contract? 
 

my bet is we sign Stone to play with Valamaki. 

Well, we had Fox, but the NHL Blockchains all of that up.

[robrob74]

5 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Well, we had Fox, but the NHL Blockchains all of that up.

Ya, I feel that if a team drafts a player it should be mandatory to play for the team. But that’s a lot of legality I doubt would ever change. Teams aren’t required to play players in the NHL though too.

[The_People1]

11 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Well they talk about parity in the NHL, but that's all BS. Some teams are definitely stacked against attracting talent no matter how you slice it. It's pretty much the USHL.

 

Can they fix this?  I mean, the salary cap has done wonders already but I wish there was more than can be done.  Some teams have zero chance to ever win a Cup because no talent would go there if they had a choice.

[The_People1]

Just now, robrob74 said:

Ya, I feel that if a team drafts a player it should be mandatory to play for the team. But that’s a lot of legality I doubt would ever change. Teams aren’t required to play players in the NHL though too.

 

I feel if US College (and Canadian Juniors for that matter), if they don't sign or refuse to sign, then they must go back into the draft and their rights now belong to a new team for 3-years.

[conundrumed]

8 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I feel if US College (and Canadian Juniors for that matter), if they don't sign or refuse to sign, then they must go back into the draft and their rights now belong to a new team for 3-years.

Just extend the original draft teams rights to the player.

[The_People1]

1 minute ago, conundrumed said:

Just extend the original draft teams rights to the player.

 

No because sometimes the team screws its prospects for whatever reason.  Give these kids a chance for a fresh start.

 

Kids can circumvent this by signing with a KHL team for one year and coming back as a UFA... so maybe this needs some thought.  Maybe the age for full on UFA needs to be 27 and all pros from other leagues coming into the NHL is subject to waivers or something.

[kehatch]

16 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I feel if US College (and Canadian Juniors for that matter), if they don't sign or refuse to sign, then they must go back into the draft and their rights now belong to a new team for 3-years.

 

The issue isn't the NHL rules. The issue is the NCAA rules that prevent a prospect from signing a contract. A player from any league can sit out long enough and sign where they want. 

[jjgallow]

24 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

Ya, I feel that if a team drafts a player it should be mandatory to play for the team. But that’s a lot of legality I doubt would ever change. Teams aren’t required to play players in the NHL though too.

 

Unless it's Edmonton

[jjgallow]

6 minutes ago, kehatch said:

 

The issue isn't the NHL rules. The issue is the NCAA rules that prevent a prospect from signing a contract. A player from any league can sit out long enough and sign where they want. 

 

I would argue that it is the NHL rules because a player in the NCCA can keep developing and increasing their value.

 

 Player outside of NCCA cannot keep developing as easily.   Their best shot is the AHL so they need to play ball with their team.

 

Or better put, this is something the NHL could fix.

 

Imho the best fix would have been to not have a draft this year and change the age to 19, with a procedure for exceptional status.

[robrob74]

26 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I would argue that it is the NHL rules because a player in the NCCA can keep developing and increasing their value.

 

 Player outside of NCCA cannot keep developing as easily.   Their best shot is the AHL so they need to play ball with their team.

 

Or better put, this is something the NHL could fix.

 

Imho the best fix would have been to not have a draft this year and change the age to 19, with a procedure for exceptional status.

 

All they have to do is extend the team's rights for 1 or 2 years after their college eligibility is completed. Like, they can't just sign with just anyone after the college is up. For the full season they're out. And then who ever they sign with must give up a draft pick to the team they sign a player from. Like, how Fox was traded to the Rangers. The team signing has to give the team the draft pick back. 

[Horsman1]

16 hours ago, kehatch said:

 

Phillips might be a tough sell. He makes Gaudreau look big, but he doesn't have the offensive toolkit to play in the top 6. I hope to be wrong with Phillips, but I don't know if we have an NHL player in him. But there are definitely a few young guys I hope get a long look. 

 

Gawdin is a competent 4 line C, though his upside is limited. Zary or Pelletier could be a dark horse to make the team, but the safe bet is for them to start in the AHL. 

 

Ruzicka would be my summer picks of an ELC to make the team. He led the AHL club in scoring in his sophomore season, and looked decent in a brief call up. 

 

But if you expand the list beyond ELCs and instead look at low priced rookies the two guys I think should make an impact this season are Vlader and Mackey. Vlader is likely the backup, and Mackay I think has a lot of upside and shoes he is NHL ready when called up last season. You could put Kylington on that list, but I have never been a big Kylington fan. nt

 

 

And of course you still have Valimaki who is younger then the two D above, though he is already a proven NHL player. 

unfortunately.. we rarely have a roster spot open for a rookie unless through injury.. Too many 3/4line players signed to contracts..doesn't give much hope to give er hell during pre -season knowing that ultimately.. Yer goin down