Goaltending

[cross16]

23 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

Might have been you , not sure but somebody had a good point that , we might have the advantage of being in the west, just like how TO had the advantage with Andersson.   If we were to offer TJ and Rittich for those 2, might carry some weight .

The only way i see them trading Burakovsky tho is if they know they are out On Carlson....  but even then Rittich for Grubauer could make a lot of sense to them .. NHL ready backup , good cap hit most likely ..   and if Washington is confident Grubauer is ready to be a starter, they would want him far away from them 

 

Maybe the West thing means something that's a fair point. Assume the Flames have interest, which i'm not sure they do.

 

With Ilya Samsonov on the way, I would highly doubt the Caps have interest in Rittich. Certainly not enough to warrant passing on what is being rumored as a pretty solid asking price for Grubauer. 

[conundrumed]

Grubauer's a no for me. What does he have, 90 career NHL games? Just played his most in a season at 35 games?

If the price is something around Bennett(low cap hit), not interested at all. Let someone else take the buyer's remorse.

[Thebrewcrew]

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

Might have been you , not sure but somebody had a good point that , we might have the advantage of being in the west, just like how TO had the advantage with Andersson.   If we were to offer TJ and Rittich for those 2, might carry some weight .

The only way i see them trading Burakovsky tho is if they know they are out On Carlson....  but even then Rittich for Grubauer could make a lot of sense to them .. NHL ready backup , good cap hit most likely ..   and if Washington is confident Grubauer is ready to be a starter, they would want him far away from them 

I never really did think of that. Great point.

 

The teams that were reported as being in on Grubauer, have been NYI, a division rival and Carolina. Maybe they wanna send him to the West to seldom face him...

[conundrumed]

5 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I never really did think of that. Great point.

 

The teams that were reported as being in on Grubauer, have been NYI, a division rival and Carolina. Maybe they wanna send him to the West to seldom face him...

Seeing as they just won the Cup, I doubt they would fear Grubauer. They'll maximize the return on him without taking salary back, regardless of which team maximizes.

[Khrox]

9 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I never really did think of that. Great point.

 

The teams that were reported as being in on Grubauer, have been NYI, a division rival and Carolina. Maybe they wanna send him to the West to seldom face him...

From what I understand, the Islanders rumoured offer was the Flames first round pick (12) and Ho-Sang for Grubauer. Overall, that's not a bad haul that I doubt we can really match, especially if Carlson stays (as our best trade chips would only be valuable to them if Carlson leaves)

[The_People1]

On 6/15/2018 at 2:59 PM, cross16 said:

 

Maybe the West thing means something that's a fair point. Assume the Flames have interest, which i'm not sure they do.

 

With Ilya Samsonov on the way, I would highly doubt the Caps have interest in Rittich. Certainly not enough to warrant passing on what is being rumored as a pretty solid asking price for Grubauer. 

 

I think Samsonov is only 21 so the Caps may want to incubate him for at least one more year.  Maybe even two.  Rittich could be a good stop gap for them.

[cross16]

11 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I think Samsonov is only 21 so the Caps may want to incubate him for at least one more year.  Maybe even two.  Rittich could be a good stop gap for them.

 

Possible. But it's also tough to get guys to come over from the K if the plan is to play them in the A

[JTech780]

42 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Possible. But it's also tough to get guys to come over from the K if the plan is to play them in the A

 

MacLellan has come out and said that Samsonov will start in the AHL, and Samsonov has said he is fine starting in the AHL.

[conundrumed]

As BT has stated he likes to draft a goalie every second year. But I don't think that limits to drafting does it? Could sign Lehtonen cheap. I know he's old, but he's a longtime NHL goalie and used to be 1 of the top. Insurance policy on Smith? Is there a better one available? Hutton?

My biggest worry with Smith is I believe he needs an insurance policy behind him. It's short term, but still.

Gillies and Rittich can do 1A/1A minor in the A.

Knowing the position is wide open for the 2019 season.

[travel_dude]

58 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

As BT has stated he likes to draft a goalie every second year. But I don't think that limits to drafting does it? Could sign Lehtonen cheap. I know he's old, but he's a longtime NHL goalie and used to be 1 of the top. Insurance policy on Smith? Is there a better one available? Hutton?

My biggest worry with Smith is I believe he needs an insurance policy behind him. It's short term, but still.

Gillies and Rittich can do 1A/1A minor in the A.

Knowing the position is wide open for the 2019 season.

 

I get the need to keep drafting goalies, but 4th found we need to add to the forward crop.  Probably losing a few to FA this summer and (hopefully) one or two to the Flames.

Goalies are still available in the 7th right?  Or the ones outside the draft.

 

Hutton is UFA.

Khudobin is UFA.

Hutchinson is UFA.

 

Of the 3, Hutton has been better.  STL may be moving on from him, and saving the money for a big fish.

He would be an insurance policy for the Flames.  Allows them to bring in Rittich or Gillies according to their timetable, not the best before date of Smith. 

[robrob74]

10 hours ago, conundrumed said:

As BT has stated he likes to draft a goalie every second year. But I don't think that limits to drafting does it? Could sign Lehtonen cheap. I know he's old, but he's a longtime NHL goalie and used to be 1 of the top. Insurance policy on Smith? Is there a better one available? Hutton?

My biggest worry with Smith is I believe he needs an insurance policy behind him. It's short term, but still.

Gillies and Rittich can do 1A/1A minor in the A.

Knowing the position is wide open for the 2019 season.

 

Is them doing 1A/1B working? After they tired out in the NHL after a stint of being starters, I wonder if getting them regular work helps their development more?

[conundrumed]

4 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Is them doing 1A/1B working? After they tired out in the NHL after a stint of being starters, I wonder if getting them regular work helps their development more?

I think it's the way to go. You've had your sniff, every goal you let in at the next level is an important one. Work hard and treat it the same way in the A.

Get your feeling hurt and take offense, well...it's not going to work out for you.

I'm not a fan of kid gloves. Hard work = $millions in your bank account.

Too hard? Okay, there's 100 guys that want your shot.

[robrob74]

46 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I think it's the way to go. You've had your sniff, every goal you let in at the next level is an important one. Work hard and treat it the same way in the A.

Get your feeling hurt and take offense, well...it's not going to work out for you.

I'm not a fan of kid gloves. Hard work = $millions in your bank account.

Too hard? Okay, there's 100 guys that want your shot.

 

I was just thinking, they need to run with one and if they proved they belong, it’s why they ran with him.

 

i am not too worried about the other guy as they’ve had about two years in the A, time to put up some numbers, and minus some, for all of the stats that count for goalies.

[conundrumed]

1 minute ago, robrob74 said:

 

I was just thinking, they need to run with one and if they proved they belong, it’s why they ran with him.

I doubt it's that easy.

Gillies was gifted the spot, Rittich has barged in. Give both the reps, see who comes out the other end.

My guess would be Rittich.

Unless Gillies feels like realizing that he's being pushed and picks up his socks.

Rittich>Gillies

[travel_dude]

8 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I doubt it's that easy.

Gillies was gifted the spot, Rittich has barged in. Give both the reps, see who comes out the other end.

My guess would be Rittich.

Unless Gillies feels like realizing that he's being pushed and picks up his socks.

Rittich>Gillies

 

At this point I would agree with the ranking.

Gillies "should" be the more likely to emerge, but his injury/surgery year messed him up.

Rittich took too many pointers from the goalie coach/Smith about playing the puck, and it changed his game for the worse.

There were other things that happened, but he started making mistakes before he got the starter net.

Gillies is wildly inconsistent right now.  Big swings in the same game.

 

Maybe the best thing this season is to run with Smith and Mrazek (assuming you can get him on the cheap) or somebody similar.  Then you bring up the backup from the guys battling in the AHL for Smith ineveitable injury, or the trade at TDL that likely has to happen with a pending UFA facing a 35+ contract.  We have to solidy the spot, whether an outsider is the solution or one of the guys we already have. 

[phoenix66]

5 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

At this point I would agree with the ranking.

Gillies "should" be the more likely to emerge, but his injury/surgery year messed him up.

Rittich took too many pointers from the goalie coach/Smith about playing the puck, and it changed his game for the worse.

There were other things that happened, but he started making mistakes before he got the starter net.

Gillies is wildly inconsistent right now.  Big swings in the same game.

 

Maybe the best thing this season is to run with Smith and Mrazek (assuming you can get him on the cheap) or somebody similar.  Then you bring up the backup from the guys battling in the AHL for Smith ineveitable injury, or the trade at TDL that likely has to happen with a pending UFA facing a 35+ contract.  We have to solidy the spot, whether an outsider is the solution or one of the guys we already have. 

just again keep in mind, if we bring in another Big Club backup .. Id put the likelihood of losing Rittich on waiver , over 90%. He did show enough that some team will absolutely take him as a backup.

So if we do that , we better have a deal to trade Rittich to guarantee we get a return

[manu11]

I would stay far away from Mrazek, the guy isn't good anymore. Rittich has at least played pretty well in the world cup even if his numbers weren't anything spectacular. He played against some tough competition in close games against Sweden and Russia and made some great saves in the latter game. Had a shutout in his 3rd and last game against France, though he couldn't really show his stuff there, as he got only 10 shots on goal.

[robrob74]

11 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

At this point I would agree with the ranking.

Gillies "should" be the more likely to emerge, but his injury/surgery year messed him up.

Rittich took too many pointers from the goalie coach/Smith about playing the puck, and it changed his game for the worse.

There were other things that happened, but he started making mistakes before he got the starter net.

Gillies is wildly inconsistent right now.  Big swings in the same game.

 

Maybe the best thing this season is to run with Smith and Mrazek (assuming you can get him on the cheap) or somebody similar.  Then you bring up the backup from the guys battling in the AHL for Smith ineveitable injury, or the trade at TDL that likely has to happen with a pending UFA facing a 35+ contract.  We have to solidy the spot, whether an outsider is the solution or one of the guys we already have. 

 

I wonder if there’s a Kipper kind of deal out there, someone third in line and waiting for a chance but the other two are fairly good, or are your guys? 

 

Which teams have that? Did the sharks know what they even gave up? 

 

At this point it seems that a lot of teams are placing value on that #2 guy and so many are “the next Talbot.” Well, we expect one or two to come out every year.

 

Is it grasping if we try digging for someone who just needs the chance?

 

which 3rd stringers out there are stuck without opportunity?

[MAC331]

23 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

I wonder if there’s a Kipper kind of deal out there, someone third in line and waiting for a chance but the other two are fairly good, or are your guys? 

 

Which teams have that? Did the sharks know what they even gave up? 

 

At this point it seems that a lot of teams are placing value on that #2 guy and so many are “the next Talbot.” Well, we expect one or two to come out every year.

 

Is it grasping if we try digging for someone who just needs the chance?

 

which 3rd stringers out there are stuck without opportunity?

I honestly don't understand why the hunt for another Goalie ? Rittich will be just fine as a back up this season so let him run with it . Let Gilles and Parson battle it out in the A for this 3rd in line you are seeking. My bet is on Parson emerging as our starter and Gilles gets traded.

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, MAC331 said:

I honestly don't understand why the hunt for another Goalie ? Rittich will be just fine as a back up this season so let him run with it . Let Gilles and Parson battle it out in the A for this 3rd in line you are seeking. My bet is on Parson emerging as our starter and Gilles gets traded.

 

Its more that I just don’t have faith in any of our prospects being a starter. Albeit it’s really their first sniff at the NHL, but Rittich looked like a quality backup while Gillies looked like a head case. Even though he settles down after a few bad goals, a few bad goals comes back to haunt you. I still see a lot holes in his game. Maybe he needs glasses?

 

i am all for using Rittich as the backup this year. 

I hope parsons develops that way.

[phoenix66]

What do these Goalies all have in Common ?

 

Mark Visentin
Mika Noronen
Al Montoya
Jamie Storr
Eric Fichaud
Riku Helenius
Jimmy Waite
Chet Pickard
Marek Schwarz
Patrick DesRochers
Jack Campbell 
Brent Krahn
Brian Finley
Leland Irving
Trevor Kidd

 

 

these are just a selection of 1st round , Cant Miss, future superstar Goalies .. they also all became tire fires 

Fact is , there is a reason why Goalies are called VooDoo.. because you do not know what you have until you put them in the net . Their past means nothing , their potential means nothing .

No team yet, has been able to legitimately create a solid reliable goalie pipeline .. because you just simply don't know how to get all the variables right . Scorers can typically score on any team, they just have that skill.. Defensemen typically evolve to the same level , at every level.. goalies shine or crater from team to team , level to level.

More superstar goalies have been taken in later rounds than early .. its just the way it is .

 

There is a VERY high probability , when the time comes , we will be trading for our next true starter .. just based on the odds 

[conundrumed]

4 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

What do these Goalies all have in Common ?

 

Mark Visentin
Mika Noronen
Al Montoya
Jamie Storr
Eric Fichaud
Riku Helenius
Jimmy Waite
Chet Pickard
Marek Schwarz
Patrick DesRochers
Jack Campbell 
Brent Krahn
Brian Finley
Leland Irving
Trevor Kidd

I was gonna go with, "they're all in your post"?

It's a real shame we traded down to get a 2nd in the 2012 draft. We needed something coming behind Kipper.

Vasilevsky had an incredible draft year, he wasn't exactly hiding.

But hey, we got a longterm project Jankowski and Sieloff.

[MAC331]

16 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

Its more that I just don’t have faith in any of our prospects being a starter. Albeit it’s really their first sniff at the NHL, but Rittich looked like a quality backup while Gillies looked like a head case. Even though he settles down after a few bad goals, a few bad goals comes back to haunt you. I still see a lot holes in his game. Maybe he needs glasses?

 

i am all for using Rittich as the backup this year. 

I hope parsons develops that way.

Carey Price was terrible his first 3 seasons so how do you guys know so much about our pipeline so early in these goalies careers ? They have to play and if you keep pushing them back what will the measure be 10 shut outs in a row while in Stockton ? get them in here while we have Smith and let them play their way in or out.

[robrob74]

5 hours ago, MAC331 said:

Carey Price was terrible his first 3 seasons so how do you guys know so much about our pipeline so early in these goalies careers ? They have to play and if you keep pushing them back what will the measure be 10 shut outs in a row while in Stockton ? get them in here while we have Smith and let them play their way in or out.

 

Inthink it really depends on whether the machanics are there. For me, I felt Gillies was erratic. I can’t say I watched a lot of Price early in his career. I did see a few games of Kipper before he became a Flames goalie and even though he got shelled I wanted him quite a bit. 

[The_People1]

23 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Inthink it really depends on whether the machanics are there. For me, I felt Gillies was erratic. I can’t say I watched a lot of Price early in his career. I did see a few games of Kipper before he became a Flames goalie and even though he got shelled I wanted him quite a bit. 

 

Really on Kipper?  I actually felt Toskala was the real deal at the time.  I felt a second rounder for Kipper was too much.  He was super inconsistent with SJ, one day Vezina material and the next he would be pulled.

 

But Gillies plays on his knees too much and doesn't challenge the shooters.  I don't have high hopes for him anymore.