In with the new.

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, MP5029 said:

Thing is, RS Ctrs are always high demand, unless there is a huge gap between BPA and the next best RS Ctr it seems to me the smart thing to do is draft nothing but RS Ctrs, they are a tradable commodity and rarely loose ground on them…they can be used to get D including RS D, G and Wing including the elusive RW.

 

personally that’s what I’d like to see Cgy focus in on is drafting nothing but RS Ctrs and RS D…unless the BPA gap is large this year’s draft is a good example going with the D cause the next best available Ctr was a huge gap.

 

That would be my draft strategy as well.  Prioritize RHS.  Only 25% of the NHL is RHS so there is instant trade value there.

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, sak22 said:

I would say top 4 is being generous as well.  Reality is some drafts don't even have 1, others will only have 1 and few like 2013 and 2015 have multiple, but there are more teams than true #1 C's personally I feel there is more only around 10 that I would feel you could win with.  Realistically most high ranked C's with max out as a #2 or be better suited on the wing in the NHL.  Not an easy position to project on 17 year olds like people are making it sound.

 

Yes, mostly agree here.  I would stretch that to about 15 #1 Centers in the NHL that I think teams can win the Cup with.  Most so called #1 Centers are only #1 because their team doesn't have anyone better (aka, Dylan Larkin).

 

And since it's to tough to get a #1 Centers, you have to at least pick in the top 4.  At least.

[jjgallow]

22 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Yes, mostly agree here.  I would stretch that to about 15 #1 Centers in the NHL that I think teams can win the Cup with.  Most so called #1 Centers are only #1 because their team doesn't have anyone better (aka, Dylan Larkin).

 

And since it's to tough to get a #1 Centers, you have to at least pick in the top 4.  At least.

 

pretty much.   I will say that there are exceptions, of course you can get a #1 center anywhere in the draft, once in a blue moon.   and, teams can win the cup without them.  once in a blue moon.    But in both scenarios, chances of success are greatly diminished.

 

It's another reason why i like drafting defencemen after the top 10, the chances of upside surprise are perhaps greater as it takes much longer to find out what they are.

 

Next two drafts are center-heavy.   We get two cracks at it....and 2026 of course has the big prize.   So...you know...no rush lol.

[The_People1]

53 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

pretty much.   I will say that there are exceptions, of course you can get a #1 center anywhere in the draft, once in a blue moon.   and, teams can win the cup without them.  once in a blue moon.    But in both scenarios, chances of success are greatly diminished.

 

It's another reason why i like drafting defencemen after the top 10, the chances of upside surprise are perhaps greater as it takes much longer to find out what they are.

 

Next two drafts are center-heavy.   We get two cracks at it....and 2026 of course has the big prize.   So...you know...no rush lol.

 

Yups 1000%.

 

Of course you don't need to tank hardcore mofo to win the Cup.  Of course it's possible.  Of course.  But play the odds.  It's stats.  It's math.  It's that simple... Not that it's simple like, it's easy and guaranteed.  But i mean, it's a simple as in the philosophy is straight forward to understand.

[robrob74]

5 hours ago, sak22 said:

I would say top 4 is being generous as well.  Reality is some drafts don't even have 1, others will only have 1 and few like 2013 and 2015 have multiple, but there are more teams than true #1 C's personally I feel there is more only around 10 that I would feel you could win with.  Realistically most high ranked C's with max out as a #2 or be better suited on the wing in the NHL.  Not an easy position to project on 17 year olds like people are making it sound.

Thats the thing here though, it's easier to move to the wing than it is to move to center, so I guess that's the reasoning. But like MP said, if there is a sizeable gap, go for the gap. 

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Yes, mostly agree here.  I would stretch that to about 15 #1 Centers in the NHL that I think teams can win the Cup with.  Most so called #1 Centers are only #1 because their team doesn't have anyone better (aka, Dylan Larkin).

 

And since it's to tough to get a #1 Centers, you have to at least pick in the top 4.  At least.

ooh thems fighting words with @conundrumed lol

[conundrumed]

2 hours ago, robrob74 said:

ooh thems fighting words with @conundrumed lol

The nerve!! Calling out Captain Intensity. Dude can't even relax at an ASG. lol

Larkin is lodged somewhere around 8-12th best in the league. I'd put both Point and PP specialist Draisaitl behind him.

[The_People1]

7 hours ago, conundrumed said:

The nerve!! Calling out Captain Intensity. Dude can't even relax at an ASG. lol

Larkin is lodged somewhere around 8-12th best in the league. I'd put both Point and PP specialist Draisaitl behind him.

 

Larkin is a young Elias Lindholm.  Great player.  Would be a great #2C on a Cup contender.

[sak22]

28 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Larkin is a young Elias Lindholm.  Great player.  Would be a great #2C on a Cup contender.

Who are your 15 #1's that you can win a cup with?

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Larkin is a young Elias Lindholm.  Great player.  Would be a great #2C on a Cup contender.

Sure he would be. lol

That means MacKinnon is your 1C.

 

[travel_dude]

On 7/29/2024 at 5:07 PM, robrob74 said:

I'm mostly in agreement. But what I am saying and just think there might be a time we need to target some centers. It's always supposed to be BPA. Maybe we need to target BCA. 

we

might have done that last year and may not even be the Best Big Player Available. But I guess to them it was. While maybe we should have already started targeting a center then. I wanted Sandin Pellikka. If I remember correctly, some wanted Moore? I think Barlow's name came up. It's a science.

 

I don't subscribe to drafting by position, but with all the LW's that we have targeted at BPA, I think we should be looking at the list a little closer.  These aren't LW/C, just strictly wingers.  I guess the thing about the LW is that we use picks on them a lot, but have not really hit homeruns in awhile.  Zary was more of a C.  Not sure if Pospicil was, but he was a later pick anyway.  One would hope that between Pelletier and Honzek and Coronato that we hit on two that will be top 6 wongers.  

 

I don't think it's science.  Not in the selection part.  I think it's luck that your scouts like a player more than another and that your team develops that player in his sweet spot to be a top player.  Some of the best take about 4-6 years before you see anything out of them that resembles a true NHL talent at the top of a lineup.  There are exceptions of course, but those are reserved for the 1st overall some years.

[MP5029]

What to do with Coranato? 
 

I was reading an article on Coranato and how he was not so good in his first 10 games and how he improved quite a bit from his stint in the A to his final 19 games with the flames at the end of the season.

 

personally, I feel the smart play with his development is to start him in the A this year and let him develop the entire season in the A until the flames are eliminated from playoffs, then bring him up to the NHL for the last few games and let him adjust to the NHL 

 

this would probably be the best thing to seeing Coranato reach his full potential.

 

I could see Coranato as a legitimate 2nd winger if they develop him properly and send him to the AHL this year let him hone his skills and confidence and dominate at the AHL level.  
 

Can’t help but feel if they don’t, Coranto will end up bottom 6 player for his career if they start him in the NHL then send him down and back up.

 

they should be targeting him as a full time NHLer in 2056/2026 season not this season.

[jjgallow]

1 hour ago, MP5029 said:

What to do with Coranato? 
 

I was reading an article on Coranato and how he was not so good in his first 10 games and how he improved quite a bit from his stint in the A to his final 19 games with the flames at the end of the season.

 

personally, I feel the smart play with his development is to start him in the A this year and let him develop the entire season in the A until the flames are eliminated from playoffs, then bring him up to the NHL for the last few games and let him adjust to the NHL 

 

this would probably be the best thing to seeing Coranato reach his full potential.

 

I could see Coranato as a legitimate 2nd winger if they develop him properly and send him to the AHL this year let him hone his skills and confidence and dominate at the AHL level.  
 

Can’t help but feel if they don’t, Coranto will end up bottom 6 player for his career if they start him in the NHL then send him down and back up.

 

they should be targeting him as a full time NHLer in 2056/2026 season not this season.

 

I think they will do the obvious move, which is keep in him the NHL, but I 100% agree with you.   A little time in the AHL would allow him to really develop the things we need out of him.

 

I'm not expecting it but I would be very pleasantly surprised if they kept him the AHL and let him develop as a dominant player.

[cross16]

I think Coronato all depends on how much work he put in over the summer. I actually think he played solid in the NHL last year but what is holding him back is skating, in particular acceleration and burst. He's just a bit slow to get to pucks and into scoring areas. 

 

If he got stronger and worked on that then I suspect you'll see him in the NHL. I think that is what is going to make or break his ceiling so I don't think the AHL vs NHL debate maters all that much. 

[conundrumed]

26 minutes ago, cross16 said:

how much work he put in over the summer.

I sooo agree. This is always the way with young players.

They get advice, regiments etc. Literally gift-wrapped.

Then it's, "put in the work".

This year is a clean slate. Did you put in the work, or do you wanna stay in the A for peanuts?

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, cross16 said:

I think Coronato all depends on how much work he put in over the summer. I actually think he played solid in the NHL last year but what is holding him back is skating, in particular acceleration and burst. He's just a bit slow to get to pucks and into scoring areas. 

 

If he got stronger and worked on that then I suspect you'll see him in the NHL. I think that is what is going to make or break his ceiling so I don't think the AHL vs NHL debate maters all that much. 

 

Agreed.  And I have hope for Coronato because we saw the same issue with Pelletier who fixed his burst/accel issues in one off-season.  Beyond that, I think he needs better shot accuracy/confidence but, he has to fix his skating first or nothing else matters.

[robrob74]

9 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Agreed.  And I have hope for Coronato because we saw the same issue with Pelletier who fixed his burst/accel issues in one off-season.  Beyond that, I think he needs better shot accuracy/confidence but, he has to fix his skating first or nothing else matters.

I think this is why I sometimes think we have to move away from guys who isn't naturally a good skater. Although, I guess the amount of good skaters that don't make the NHL are probably close to those that don't skate as well with other talents. 
 

if you look at some guys they have the iq to understand where to be and when. 

[cross16]

37 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

I think this is why I sometimes think we have to move away from guys who isn't naturally a good skater. Although, I guess the amount of good skaters that don't make the NHL are probably close to those that don't skate as well with other talents. 
 

if you look at some guys they have the iq to understand where to be and when. 

 

Think it's always a balancing act. You can have a great skater who has minimal hockey IQ or a weak shot and they don't make it work (Angelo Esposito comes to mind, or Zach Boychuk) as you mention. 

 

I think at the end of the day have to remember these kids are always going to have to improve somewhere after they get drafted and for me it comes down to what do you think you can work with them to improve upon. IMO skating is almost always at the top of that list. 

[tmac70]

7 hours ago, robrob74 said:

I think this is why I sometimes think we have to move away from guys who isn't naturally a good skater. Although, I guess the amount of good skaters that don't make the NHL are probably close to those that don't skate as well with other talents. 
 

if you look at some guys they have the iq to understand where to be and when. 

Skating and size were the knock on Brayden Point.  I don't think any of us would be displeased with him on the roster. Skating coach and hard work and Viola!!! 

[robrob74]

3 hours ago, tmac70 said:

Skating and size were the knock on Brayden Point.  I don't think any of us would be displeased with him on the roster. Skating coach and hard work and Viola!!! 

maybe it also has something to do with playbook for a team to play slow. 

[travel_dude]

16 hours ago, tmac70 said:

Skating and size were the knock on Brayden Point.  I don't think any of us would be displeased with him on the roster. Skating coach and hard work and Viola!!! 

 

Yeah, work hard with a power skaing coach and put in the practice.

He has the shot and IQ, just needs to pick it up.

[conundrumed]

It'll be an interesting year to see how we start transitioning from the known into the unknown.

I'm interested to see why we took Mantha. I'm more than familiar with him. He's the best player on the ice for 8% of games. Do the Flames have a keycode for him? A fob? lol

Huberdeau connection?

Kuzmenko entering his 4th year. Is he reading play better?

Backlund's not getting younger.

I have a lot of faith in Pelletier. Will Zary and Pospisil take steps back, as often happens?

Can Weegar and Andersson run a D -core?

Vladar and Wolf are riddles wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma.

And can the coaching staff parlay this assortment?

Brave New World stuff.

This season will be nothing short of interesting.

[cberg]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

It'll be an interesting year to see how we start transitioning from the known into the unknown.

I'm interested to see why we took Mantha. I'm more than familiar with him. He's the best player on the ice for 8% of games. Do the Flames have a keycode for him? A fob? lol

Huberdeau connection?

Kuzmenko entering his 4th year. Is he reading play better?

Backlund's not getting younger.

I have a lot of faith in Pelletier. Will Zary and Pospisil take steps back, as often happens?

Can Weegar and Andersson run a D -core?

Vladar and Wolf are riddles wrapped in a mystery inside an enigma.

And can the coaching staff parlay this assortment?

Brave New World stuff.

This season will be nothing short of interesting.

Along with multiple players pushing for spots on the Wranglers, as well as the Flames.  Finally who will be the first traded player and in total how many?  This is a team in transition with tons of opportunities, who will grab ahold of those and who will fall by the wayside?

[conundrumed]

5 hours ago, cberg said:

Along with multiple players pushing for spots on the Wranglers, as well as the Flames.  Finally who will be the first traded player and in total how many?  This is a team in transition with tons of opportunities, who will grab ahold of those and who will fall by the wayside?

As an aside, I decided to vine my butternut squash through about a 12' section of my 6' tall wooden fence this year. Now, I'm getting fearful that I'm going to lose a 6'+ section of my fence. I can't cut off the fruit fast enough when they ripen. 2 plants. The yield is, ummm, excessive, shall we say? My fence is completely a screen now.

I need a cold room. I stopped watering it weeks ago. It really doesn't care. lol

edit

they say they'll vine, "up to 15ft". I guess I should call the Guinness people. I'm an easy 30' with 2 stocks from 1 plant. Easily double 15'. The other one is maybe only 24'. lol

Crazy. Can't wait for the food shelter to tell me why they can't take 50lbs of erroneous squash. I'll be handing them off in their parking lot.🙄

[cberg]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

As an aside, I decided to vine my butternut squash through about a 12' section of my 6' tall wooden fence this year. Now, I'm getting fearful that I'm going to lose a 6'+ section of my fence. I can't cut off the fruit fast enough when they ripen. 2 plants. The yield is, ummm, excessive, shall we say? My fence is completely a screen now.

I need a cold room. I stopped watering it weeks ago. It really doesn't care. lol

edit

they say they'll vine, "up to 15ft". I guess I should call the Guinness people. I'm an easy 30' with 2 stocks from 1 plant. Easily double 15'. The other one is maybe only 24'. lol

Crazy. Can't wait for the food shelter to tell me why they can't take 50lbs of erroneous squash. I'll be handing them off in their parking lot.🙄

Wow, something I can’t do here.  Hard enough to get a decent zucchini harvest.