Sam Bennett

[JTech780]

2 hours ago, jjgallow said:

ok ok.

 

Getting back on topic I agree with Peeps.  No point in trading him.  You'll get nothing back and he still has that same high ceiling he always did.

 

I still think a conditioning stint in the AHL with top-line minutes....  isn't going to make things worse and might make things dramatically different.

 

Without going into broader problems, or root causes or even coaches (which will lead us into GMs), the way you get maximum value out of Bennett imho is to get him back to the player we drafted (a high-scoring top-line pro), in the AHL or elsewhere, and re-assess at that point.  Even if you ARE going to trade him, you do this first because then at least he has some value.

 

I don't even think Bennett's Trying to be that player anymore and that's a problem.   He Must be frustrated far more than we are.   Someone just needs to sit down with him and say hey, we're going to get you back on the path of a talented superstar, it's up to you what you make of it.   Do a good job and we'll bring you back up on the first line or trade you to a team that will.

 

The only way to send him down for a conditioning stint is if he is coming off an injury and he has to agree to it, also it only last for 7 days if I remember correctly.

 

He would need waivers to go down to the AHL for a prolonged stay.

[JTech780]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

Honestly I don’t even understand why the discussion is so centered on junior or not. If you think that would make a difference fine but the reality is no one is right because we don’t know. Maybe it would have maybe it didn’t matter but there are no facts that prove it or disprove it unless you’ve created an alternative universe we are unaware of. It’s all a matter of opinion. 

 

for me it’s not the crux of the issue because it doesn’t really matter what type of development you’ve had prior to getting to the NHL you still need to develop at the NHL level  I think it’s pretty clear the flames went quite wrong with Bennett at the nhl level so imo it’s not very relevant whether or not he went back to junior because it’s highly probably the results are the same because the problem has been his nhl development. I don’t agree with this notion that players come to the nhl full developed and ready to go, nor is it accurate either. 
 

I didn’t like Hartley but he was good for young players. He had a plan, he put them in situations that maximizes their strengths and minimized their weaknesses. It’s no surprise that Bennett looked awesome under Hartley, had a bright future and then it went away once that plan wasn’t as clear. 

 

I agree with this. 

 

I think what needs to happen now is let him stay with some skilled linemates, I like the Ryan, Mangiapane line that he was with at practice today, but they have to let that trio form some chemistry. 

 

I would prefer a Mangiapane-Bennett-Czarnik line as those are the most skilled guys outside the top 6 on this team, and I do get the sense that Bennett is most comfortable at center.

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

I agree with this. 

 

I think what needs to happen now is let him stay with some skilled linemates, I like the Ryan, Mangiapane line that he was with at practice today, but they have to let that trio form some chemistry. 

 

I would prefer a Mangiapane-Bennett-Czarnik line as those are the most skilled guys outside the top 6 on this team, and I do get the sense that Bennett is most comfortable at center.

 

I'm fine with the Bennett-Ryan-Mangiapane line.

Could even be Mangiapane-Bennett-Ryan.

The issue I have with Czarnik is that he will always shoot the puck over making a play.

But that's just limited views this year, so I could be off.

 

Part of the reason I would lean towards Ryan at C, is that it starts them with the puck more.

It would help if they started wth the puck in the O-zone more.

Right now, all the C's are struggling in sames, so It's hard to say what the best setup is to start them with pssession.

 

On a side note, I find Bennett to be the guy with absolutely the worst luck on the team.

He stands in front of the net, the puck hits him and dies, to be cleared by a defender, or goes off into the corner.

He goes to a puck battle in the corner, and it comes loose on the opposite side he is on.

He makes a pass and it goes behind a player.

A player passes to him and it goes behind him.

He's involved in a shift where the puck is controlled for the whole shift, and the end results is a weak shot by someone else.

He touches a player and gets called for tripping or whatever.

THAT must be frustrating.

 

[jjgallow]

 

Is he....really at risk of being claimed in a waiver?  With salary in consideration?

 

one of those things...might just be a question of this year or next year

[stubblejumper1]

8 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

So, 

 

I feel like we're at that point where you're just going to refuse you're wrong and if that's impossible, attack my attitude.   That has always been my experience on here when things get to this point.

 

But you do seem to be missing the key point of all this that he should have stayed an extra year in junior.    That is Really the key message being driven home and you're just not dealing with it.

 

If we Must talk about the far  less critical point of the AHL, there's...I dunno,

 

Kyle Palmieri, Brayden Schenn, Taylor Hall, Jordan Eberle, Mika Zibanejad, Tyler Toffoli, Dylan Strome, Ryan Strome, David Pastrnak, Jonathan Drouin Literally off the top of my head that either had similar PPG or GPG in the NHL to Bennett, went to the AHL, and came out the same or usually improved.

 

sooooo.... anyway i dunno what to say.  I feel like when we start getting down to facts that's when things get hostile on here so whatever it's all good.

 

I am late chiming in, but if I recall correctly, Taylor Hall and Jordan Eberle went to the AHL because of an NHL lockout.  The AHL was the best league they could have played in while the NHL was shut down.  That is a different situation than sending Bennett down after a relatively successful rookie season in the NHL.

 

I used to think Bennett has to earn his opportunities.  Now I realize how difficult it is to do a good job when you aren't allowed to make mistakes.  Every time Bennett makes a mistake he seems to get bumped down the lineup or has his ice time cut.  I'm sure it really hard for Bennett to relax/focus when he has no margin for error.  Not a recipe for success.  

 

However, he really needs to cut out the bad penalties.  There is no excuse for such a lack of discipline.  

 

 

[LouCifer]

On 10/17/2019 at 10:27 PM, stubblejumper1 said:

However, he really needs to cut out the bad penalties.  There is no excuse for such a lack of discipline.  

 

 

 

Perhaps I’m wearing my flames coloured glasses, but I feel like Bennett has been tagged for quite a few marginal calls... sure, some have been blatant, and some could have been avoided by his stick placement, however, time and time again I see more obvious calls get to slide while Bennett seems to be a target for the zebras. 

[cross16]

Imo for the most part Bennett has cut out the bad penalties. There was the one late in the game earlier in the season but the rest have imo been attributed to aggressive play (which you want from him) or some incredibly soft calls. 
 

case in point, last night. If you want a player to live on the edge you have to accept your going to get calls like that. 

[travel_dude]

36 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Imo for the most part Bennett has cut out the bad penalties. There was the one late in the game earlier in the season but the rest have imo been attributed to aggressive play (which you want from him) or some incredibly soft calls. 
 

case in point, last night. If you want a player to live on the edge you have to accept your going to get calls like that. 

 

Tkachuk plays a similar game without going over the "edge" nearly as much.

The part that most frustrates me though is trying to dangle too often.

It reminds me to much of Gaudreau's tendency to wind around in the O-zone, which can set up for a 2-1 the other way.

If you are behind the net with control, the last place you should end up is the blueline.

 

I did like the way the line looked with Ryan and Mangiapane.

What I can't say is who's driving it. 

[cross16]

14 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Tkachuk plays a similar game without going over the "edge" nearly as much.

The part that most frustrates me though is trying to dangle too often.

It reminds me to much of Gaudreau's tendency to wind around in the O-zone, which can set up for a 2-1 the other way.

If you are behind the net with control, the last place you should end up is the blueline.

 

I did like the way the line looked with Ryan and Mangiapane.

What I can't say is who's driving it. 

There games are not really that similar. I don’t consider tkachuk aggressive, he’s more the agitator (after the whistle, behind the play, get under the skin) type of player. Bennett’s the aggressive, throw big hits, put people on the ice type. 
 

not saying Bennett doesn’t need to continue to Work at things as he does. I think he’s made strides with the stick penalties, which are the problem, but you are going to get marginal calls when you play the way he does. He could also start drawing more which would change the conversation. 

[cccsberg]

On 10/24/2019 at 6:26 PM, lou44291 said:

 

Perhaps I’m wearing my flames coloured glasses, but I feel like Bennett has been tagged for quite a few marginal calls... sure, some have been blatant, and some could have been avoided by his stick placement, however, time and time again I see more obvious calls get to slide while Bennett seems to be a target for the zebras. 

Absolutely true.  Sure he plays an aggressive style, but the issue is inequality in the reffing.  Seems like he is getting singled out.

[conundrumed]

18 minutes ago, cccsberg said:

Absolutely true.  Sure he plays an aggressive style, but the issue is inequality in the reffing.  Seems like he is getting singled out.

Again, I've been saying this since Tkachuk joined us, The OHL line.

Tkachuk-Mony-Bennett. We're 2/3rds ways there. Let Mangiapane be a 1st liner, give him a shot. He was a sniper. Can't prove it in the bottom 6.

Take it from Pittsburgh, put guys in positions to succeed, not fill a 4th line gap.

[LouCifer]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Again, I've been saying this since Tkachuk joined us, The OHL line.

Tkachuk-Mony-Bennett. We're 2/3rds ways there. Let Mangiapane be a 1st liner, give him a shot. He was a sniper. Can't prove it in the bottom 6.

Take it from Pittsburgh, put guys in positions to succeed, not fill a 4th line gap.

 

I like the look and sound of that line, and, I’d love to see mange get a shot on line 1, however the stumbling block for me is who plays C with Gaudreau and Mange on line 1? Lindholm? Backlund? Not to mention, that line 1 would be so tiny... 

[conundrumed]

1 minute ago, lou44291 said:

 

I like the look and sound of that line, and, I’d love to see mange get a shot on line 1, however the stumbling block for me is who plays C with Gaudreau and Mange on line 1? Lindholm? Backlund? Not to mention, that line 1 would be so tiny... 

Lindholm, for sure. D brings some muscle. If needed. Be fast.

[Horsman1]

9 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Lindholm, for sure. D brings some muscle. If needed. Be fast.

thachuck/monahan/mangiapane

gaudreau/backlunf/lindstrom

bennett/ryan/frolik

lucic/jankowki/whoever

[conundrumed]

3 minutes ago, Horsman1 said:

thachuck/monahan/mangiapane

gaudreau/backlunf/lindstrom

bennett/ryan/frolik

lucic/jankowki/whoever

Not bad.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Again, I've been saying this since Tkachuk joined us, The OHL line.

Tkachuk-Mony-Bennett. We're 2/3rds ways there. Let Mangiapane be a 1st liner, give him a shot. He was a sniper. Can't prove it in the bottom 6.

Take it from Pittsburgh, put guys in positions to succeed, not fill a 4th line gap.

 

I think you are onto something.

You don;t score that much with a subpar shot.

Mangiapane finds those holes and all he needs is a pass on the tape.

 

21 minutes ago, Horsman1 said:

thachuck/monahan/mangiapane

gaudreau/backlunf/lindstrom

bennett/ryan/frolik

lucic/jankowki/whoever

 

Also a well thought out lineup.

We have to be able to trust Lucic taking more defensive responsibility, since his scoring is meh.

Bennett with Ryan and Folik is not a lot different from Bennett-Backlund-Frolik.

They can be the Satoshi Nakamotodown line.

 

[89Again]

I am going to mix things up here.  Benny has a big heart and we are low on big hearts!!

No 1. He has looked good at times this season.  He looks better with Ryan and Mangi.  This line should have been given more time after a great first game.  Mind you Quin is doing an admiral job and the Backlund line is better with Mangi so I get it.

 

No 2.  He is unbelievable unlucky.  Call me crazy but I am pretty superstitious.  He started with number 63 and should return to it.  If you follow Chinese numerology 9 is very unlucky for him.  Worth a shot.  
 

No 3.  His stick looks as long as Janko’s and he looks slower with it. Often getting caught at release.  Maybe he thought he needed it longer for D reasons maybe it’s not longer?  If your a guy who bangs in front don’t you need to be a bit quick in tight with the stick?  He also still has incredible passing skill in traffic.  Is an inch shorter worth a shot in practice?

 

No 4. Can he see over the Stache? 
 

No 5.  The team plays better when he’s in the game.

 

No. 6. He looks pumped but is he trying to be the power forward when he should be working on speed training.  He probably thinks he needs to be tough because he has been the toughest guy on the team.  Sad.  He has been brutally mismanaged.

 

No 7. I have been a huge supporter and will continue to do so for a bit but I am concerned.  They need to stabilize his line mates for a while and look at all facets of training on and off the ice and if there is no grand improvement then we need to move effort to others.

 

[travel_dude]

^^^^

His luch is really bad.

I don't know if his vision is low or he just reads plays wrong, but he seems to be going the other direction of the puck.

A Flames player is has the puck behind the other team's net, he going in on the right side and the puck goes out the other.

A point shot is taken, he deflects it up and away.

 

Just don't know what he needs to do.

Bring in Jobu?

 

[89Again]

30 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

^^^^

His luch is really bad.

I don't know if his vision is low or he just reads plays wrong, but he seems to be going the other direction of the puck.

A Flames player is has the puck behind the other team's net, he going in on the right side and the puck goes out the other.

A point shot is taken, he deflects it up and away.

 

Just don't know what he needs to do.

Bring in Jobu?

 

Definitely the number! Definitely Jobu!

[robrob74]

25 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

^^^^

His luch is really bad.

I don't know if his vision is low or he just reads plays wrong, but he seems to be going the other direction of the puck.

A Flames player is has the puck behind the other team's net, he going in on the right side and the puck goes out the other.

A point shot is taken, he deflects it up and away.

 

Just don't know what he needs to do.

Bring in Jobu?

 

he makes great deflections and they hit the post or crossbar.

[conundrumed]

Would hate to see him have a good game vs NJ.

Shut you whiny things up.

[travel_dude]

17 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Would hate to see him have a good game vs NJ.

Shut you whiny things up.

 

Bwahahaha...

I keep waiting for him to explode.

I keep hoping that they will play him with guys that fit his game.

Not sure why Mangiapane should be with Backlund and Tkachuk.

He's good, but in a different way.

Maybe if they played Bennett on LW and Tkachuk on RW they might have something.

 

We can always hope for the CHL line of Bennett-Monahan-Tkachuk.

That leaves JH-Backlund-Lindy, which might not be  bad thing.

At least right now, since Monahan is struggling to put the puck in.

Would be more skill and one finisher.

Better defensively, though.

[89Again]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

Bwahahaha...

I keep waiting for him to explode.

I keep hoping that they will play him with guys that fit his game.

Not sure why Mangiapane should be with Backlund and Tkachuk.

He's good, but in a different way.

Maybe if they played Bennett on LW and Tkachuk on RW they might have something.

 

We can always hope for the CHL line of Bennett-Monahan-Tkachuk.

That leaves JH-Backlund-Lindy, which might not be  bad thing.

At least right now, since Monahan is struggling to put the puck in.

Would be more skill and one finisher.

Better defensively, though.

Have to say these lines look really interesting.  Would like to see it

[conundrumed]

Bennett needs to engage imho. His best hockey is when he flies around hitting everything that moves. Take a penalty? Fine, get back out there and hit everything that moves.

When he plays with that kind of intensity, the rest of his game tends to come around without overthinking everything, which he is prone to do when lulled to sleep.

I feel like, "hey we're down 2-0 because of Bennett's penalties, he's getting demoted" is the wrong play.

He's at his best playing a high passion game which few others on this team bring, just let him play that way. Stop putting the reins on him. Let your horses run without such an overwhelmingly hairy eyeball. Let him play the way he needs to be his best.

Bennett playing that style is the guy I wanna see. That Bennett, at the very least, creates space for everyone.

The only down on Bennett I can think of, if you let him play the way he needs to, is he has to change his shot release. You aren't zipping a 60km wrister from behind your waist past an NHL goalie. Watch Tkachuk. He pulls it towards his skates more often than not before releasing. Bennett has to learn that, not, "shooting from my other leg", as he claimed he worked on in the summer. Change the trajectory. Every goalie will tell you that's the hardest thing to deal with. Been saying this about Bennett for awhile now. You don't need the perfect shot, you need to fool the goalie.

[travel_dude]

13 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Bennett needs to engage imho. His best hockey is when he flies around hitting everything that moves. Take a penalty? Fine, get back out there and hit everything that moves.

When he plays with that kind of intensity, the rest of his game tends to come around without overthinking everything, which he is prone to do when lulled to sleep.

I feel like, "hey we're down 2-0 because of Bennett's penalties, he's getting demoted" is the wrong play.

He's at his best playing a high passion game which few others on this team bring, just let him play that way. Stop putting the reins on him. Let your horses run without such an overwhelmingly hairy eyeball. Let him play the way he needs to be his best.

Bennett playing that style is the guy I wanna see. That Bennett, at the very least, creates space for everyone.

The only down on Bennett I can think of, if you let him play the way he needs to, is he has to change his shot release. You aren't zipping a 60km wrister from behind your waist past an NHL goalie. Watch Tkachuk. He pulls it towards his skates more often than not before releasing. Bennett has to learn that, not, "shooting from my other leg", as he claimed he worked on in the summer. Change the trajectory. Every goalie will tell you that's the hardest thing to deal with. Been saying this about Bennett for awhile now. You don't need the perfect shot, you need to fool the goalie.

 

What I see from Bennett is the failure to get a clean shot away most times.

Tries to dange to get away and shoot.

Telegraphs his shot, so a stick is on the shot reducing the velocity.

When it's a clean shot, it's not on nets, since he trying the perfect shot.

 

I would prefer him to drive the front of the net and stake a claim to it.

Let the other team take the penalty for trying to move you, not picking a player trying to defend.