Flyerfan52 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 5 hours ago, redfire11 said: So why is the business of Hockey so different than any other service or entertainment business? If your staff is not performing to their paid expectations as a GM there are a few things you can immediately do to correct this. 1) Re-educate and draw up a liable solutions with your managers and staff 2) Make an example of an employee. 3) Replace your managers BT needs to sit down separately and confidentially with each manager and player and have them explain why disassociation exists. A majority of the time a clear picture will form and appropriate action can be taken. If this doesn’t work then an employee example needs to be implemented. (an example was Burke with Baertschi). If this still does not work BT needs to bring in a hard-nosed manager with HIS full backing to get the core on track. Also investing in specialized assisting management personnel to target areas of deficiency. PK and PP , fore checking , zone entries etc. ( Edmonton brought in a referee –as an example) Just remember that the players will cooperate fully into any system that advances their careers and this is achieved by wins and points. I know Wpg. brought in Paul Devorski but was unaware Edmonton did similar with a ref. Who was the 1 they brought in? Some players only seem to cooperate in contract years BTW. Including @ least 1 that I see some posters wanting to trade for. Funny how making 5.25 guaranteed can make an owie an IR but the same guy is real healthy when he's auditioning for $s. *********************************************************************************************************************************************************** The usual steps GMs take when their team is underperforming: 1) Waive players & call up others - done 2) Minor trade 3) Trade of 3rd/4th liners or 3rd pairing 4) Fire coach 5) Bigger trade 6) Resign to save face if possible to avoid getting fired Sometimes they skip steps when they see management getting antsy. This is for teams that intend to compete. The ditch divers use only step 5 where they trade players for picks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cccsberg Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 56 minutes ago, ABC923 said: To be fair, we badly outchanced and outshot the flyers. They turned the tide on a bogus PP and outdueled us in goal. The other losses in the homestand were awful though. The Flyers had by far the better chances, right in front of the net with man advantages. Lots of peripheral shots does not mean much, especially when the goalie can see most of the shots with limited to zero screens and nobody around to pick up the rebounds..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cccsberg Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 3 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said: I know Wpg. brought in Paul Devorski but was unaware Edmonton did similar with a ref. Who was the 1 they brought in? Some players only seem to cooperate in contract years BTW. Including @ least 1 that I see some posters wanting to trade for. Funny how making 5.25 guaranteed can make an owie an IR but the same guy is real healthy when he's auditioning for $s. *********************************************************************************************************************************************************** The usual steps GMs take when their team is underperforming: 1) Waive players & call up others - done 2) Minor trade 3) Trade of 3rd/4th liners or 3rd pairing 4) Fire coach 5) Bigger trade 6) Resign to save face if possible to avoid getting fired Sometimes they skip steps when they see management getting antsy. This is for teams that intend to compete. The ditch divers use only step 5 where they trade players for picks. They haven't really utilized step 1 to the extent needed, and deserved. In addition, even before that I'd be limiting ice time to the guys really underperforming by benching them or moving them down the line-up to send a message. GG has done very little of that to date, though I will say we are starting to see it a bit recently. More is definitely called for. If that doesn't get the players attention and effort then more drastic steps need to follow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 15 minutes ago, cccsberg said: The Flyers had by far the better chances, right in front of the net with man advantages. Lots of peripheral shots does not mean much, especially when the goalie can see most of the shots with limited to zero screens and nobody around to pick up the rebounds..... 100% it gets painful listen to GG talk about well we out shot them or we out chanced them. Not sure what he is watching but shooting from the corner at the top of the circle is not a great chance. We have to many one and done plays, 2 on 1 miss the net. Gio is world famous for the hit the logo on the goalie.. What ever happened to the low shot to the far corner and the rebound put away by the rushing forward? We never see that. The slap pass tipped in, have we even gotten a goal that way? Our D with the exception of Stone cant get a shot on net. How is it we as fans can recognize the issues but nobody behind the bench see's the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 13 minutes ago, cccsberg said: They haven't really utilized step 1 to the extent needed, and deserved. In addition, even before that I'd be limiting ice time to the guys really underperforming by benching them or moving them down the line-up to send a message. GG has done very little of that to date, though I will say we are starting to see it a bit recently. More is definitely called for. If that doesn't get the players attention and effort then more drastic steps need to follow. I'm at a loss to understand the demotion of Ferland. It's happened twice that I know of. Maybe it was deserved or maybe he was shuffling the deck chairs because he looked bored. Maybe the guy put up there deserved the promotion. Don't know. The only notable name to be benched is Stajan, and we could probably see that coming from miles away. Brodie has not. Stone has not. Brouwer has not. Versteeg was but I think that turned out to be the injury. Jtech pointed out (and I saw this too) that after Brodie had made a bonehead play resulting in a goal, he was chuckling on the bench. Wasn't PO's. Looked like, ho hum another minus. Wonder if the GM saw that? Or Burke? I'm not going to dump on Brodie here because he used to be a good D-man on both ends of the ice. At the very least he needs a game to watch from the stands. Before you do that, waive a player (Bart) and bring up Spoon. DOn't worry EDM is not going to pick him up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 Tkachuk was vibrating he was so PO'ed during his after game interview... I also thought that Tkachuk should have been wearing the A on his jersey at the start of the season... Brouwer should never have been given it in the first place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 1 minute ago, Carty said: Tkachuk was vibrating he was so PO'ed during his after game interview... I also thought that Tkachuk should have been wearing the A on his jersey at the start of the season... Brouwer should never have been given it in the first place... Smith was none to happy either love his passion.... To recap he basically stated time to put up or shut up, every one talks a good game time to show we can do what we keep talking about. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cccsberg Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 29 minutes ago, tmac70 said: 100% it gets painful listen to GG talk about well we out shot them or we out chanced them. Not sure what he is watching but shooting from the corner at the top of the circle is not a great chance. We have to many one and done plays, 2 on 1 miss the net. Gio is world famous for the hit the logo on the goalie.. What ever happened to the low shot to the far corner and the rebound put away by the rushing forward? We never see that. The slap pass tipped in, have we even gotten a goal that way? Our D with the exception of Stone cant get a shot on net. How is it we as fans can recognize the issues but nobody behind the bench see's the problem. Speaking of slap pass/tip-in I recall exactly that by Andersson in the game he played on the PP. Great goal. Definitely need more of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cccsberg Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 20 minutes ago, Carty said: Tkachuk was vibrating he was so PO'ed during his after game interview... I also thought that Tkachuk should have been wearing the A on his jersey at the start of the season... Brouwer should never have been given it in the first place... Yes, Tkachuk has the attitude we definitely need more of. Here's hoping that next year he gets the recognition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfire11 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 3 hours ago, Flyerfan52 said: I know Wpg. brought in Paul Devorski but was unaware Edmonton did similar with a ref. Who was the 1 they brought in? Your correct FF I had a lapse in memory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 1 minute ago, redfire11 said: Your correct FF I had a lapse in memory. No problem. I remember the Jets doing that as they took lots of penalties but never heard of Edmonton doing that. Actually after the Wideman problems BT should have done similar as a peace offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 10 hours ago, ABC923 said: Besides all that, there is one coach available right now with plenty of Stanley Cup experience and a pretty good track record, although I'm not sure the team has the right make-up for a Sutter squad. There are a few players that would suit Sutter & some he could whip into shape. He'd probably want input in any trades but he could turn that room around. I'm pretty sure you'd be surprised @ who I think he'd recommend trading but the end result would be even Gaudreau (who I think most of you thought was the 1st gone in that scenario) playing like he was a foot taller & 30 pounds heavier). It sure would be interesting. Remember the Kings didn't play a Sutter game when he got there but bought in. A trade or 2 & everyone was buting in. There aren't many players left from the Sutter era while even the name has an aura among the youth. Beats being a bubble team IMO as long as that bridge wasn't burned when he left. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted December 6, 2017 Report Share Posted December 6, 2017 On 12/5/2017 at 0:52 PM, Carty said: No they don't... They look at it when necessary, and they don't stare at it that much of the time like they are binge watching netflix... As an example, watch Babcock next game and see how he spends more time watching the plays on the ice... and as a bonus he actually talks to the players on the bench, and coaches them during the game... The history of the game is full of good coaches that did just that... Exactly what good is Gully's habit of starting at the screen far too much doing?... It sure isn't helping with matching lines or adapting his "strategy"... GG does not like to match lines. He prefers to rotate lines. As for his strategy I really can't tell you what it is. Anyone help me out? It does not seem to be working on all cylinders. He is on the radio talking about an emotion bank and his trust in the players he has built up... gawd that again... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 1 hour ago, DirtyDeeds said: GG does not like to match lines. He prefers to rotate lines. Unless we see a change for the better, soon, it might be time to rotate the entire coaching staff with a new one... Quote As for his strategy I really can't tell you what it is. Anyone help me out? It does not seem to be working on all cylinders. I can't figure out what his strategy is either, unless it's the same as you would coach little kids... "You guys just go out and enjoy yourselves,... Just go out and play and pretend I'm not even here... and don't worry, no matter what happens I'll never get mad"... Quote He is on the radio talking about an emotion bank and his trust in the players he has built up... gawd that again... I'm getting tired of the same old touchy feely ... I didn't like it when he said something along the lines of not having to worry about 2 losses in a row, because it wasn't an problem until you lost 3 in a row... With 5 losses in the last 7 games one would think he should be more concerned... and if it's true he never goes in the dressing room between periods, I am even less impressed... The team needs direction and motivation, not Mr. Fred freakin' Rogers... There is still a chance Gully could still get his poop in a group, and if he can do it, he needs to do it now... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 37 minutes ago, Carty said: Unless we see a change for the better, soon, it might be time to rotate the entire coaching staff with a new one... I can't figure out what his strategy is either, unless it's the same as you would coach little kids... "You guys just go out and enjoy yourselves,... Just go out and play and pretend I'm not even here... and don't worry, no matter what happens I'll never get mad"... I'm getting tired of the same old touchy feely ... I didn't like it when he said something along the lines of not having to worry about 2 losses in a row, because it wasn't an problem until you lost 3 in a row... With 5 losses in the last 7 games one would think he should be more concerned... and if it's true he never goes in the dressing room between periods, I am even less impressed... The team needs direction and motivation, not Mr. Fred freakin' Rogers... There is still a chance Gully could still get his poop in a group, and if he can do it, he needs to do it now... I don't know about between periods but I do remember him saying he does not like to talk to the guys after a game/loss. Something about getting too emotional and not wanting to say something he might regret. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 Ya the idea he doesn't go in the room between periods needs to end. He most definetly does, he doesn't go in after the games. And because you roll 4 lines does not mean you don't line match. GG does line match but he also uses all 4 lines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 45 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said: I don't know about between periods but I do remember him saying he does not like to talk to the guys after a game/loss. Something about getting too emotional and not wanting to say something he might regret. Wow! Don't talk to the players during nor after the game. I don't do that either but I'm not paid to either coach the players nor stand on the bench playing @ being a coach. We might be better of going real old style with a playing coach. "Hey Backlund, do you want to re-sign but as a player/coach? We'll pay $4 million for the coaching part & $2 million as a player to get you more talent on the ice". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 44 minutes ago, cross16 said: Ya the idea he doesn't go in the room between periods needs to end. He most definetly does, he doesn't go in after the games. Notice that I said "if it's true"... Either way, I would like to see him communicate with the players on the bench more... If Gully is afraid that he might regret what he might say to players after a game, then maybe he's in the wrong business... 44 minutes ago, cross16 said: And because you roll 4 lines does not mean you don't line match. GG does line match but he also uses all 4 lines. If that is his idea of matching lines, then a good number of times I would have to disagree with his choices... It's good to roll 4 lines, but it matters when you do it... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 Quote from Gully about Tkachuk: Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 45 minutes ago, travel_dude said: Quote from Gully about Tkachuk: There is indeed a Hudson's Bay in Saskatchewan. Sask does not border with Hudson's Bay however. 3 NHL players have come from Hudson's Bay Sask Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 4 minutes ago, conundrumed said: Well said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted December 7, 2017 Report Share Posted December 7, 2017 1 minute ago, The_People1 said: Well said. It's the new, "I'm at a loss for words". How banal and irreverent does GG need to get? jeez... He'll never be mistaken for a wordsmith, just stick to, "yeah, what Babcock said". lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JustAFlamer Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 RE : Dec 09 vs Van > What is going on with the Power-Play 1 shot total and 0/4 ? really? are they trying for another record? > Could not believe Ferland got dropped to the 4th line AGAIN in the 3rd > Home ice advantage is not home ice advantage when your consistently throwing 4th line vs the Sedin’s (when Horvat out that basically their top line), is GG trying to prove that rotating lines is better than line matching? > Once again outscored while following game plan, until very end when he lets the players play and go off script. Yes very much STILL on the bye bye GG bandwagon!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted December 10, 2017 Report Share Posted December 10, 2017 On 2017-12-06 at 3:54 PM, DirtyDeeds said: GG does not like to match lines. He prefers to rotate lines. As for his strategy I really can't tell you what it is. Anyone help me out? It does not seem to be working on all cylinders. He is on the radio talking about an emotion bank and his trust in the players he has built up... gawd that again... That, apparently, was everyone’s biggest critique of Willie Desjardins. He rolled his lines and didn’t maximize his talent potential. there isn’t an emotion bank, you either have it or you don’t. Everyone’s emotion meter is different. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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