Mark Giordano Wants $9mil

[conundrumed]

Psychobabble BTW is referring to the analysis of a psychiatric theory. My reference was having to do with the laws of defamation.

You went on a rant about Gio wanting $9mil per.

I'm just trying to lighten your mood because we don't know the real # yet.

[KACaribou]

You went on a rant about Gio wanting $9mil per.

I'm just trying to lighten your mood because we don't know the real # yet.

I am cool with that, but it was discussion as to whether he is worth $9. I say no. I stated reasoning. I wasn't defaming him. It wasn't psychobabble. It was my opinion. There was no need to lighten the mood. Some people believe Gio is the greatest player on the team and perhaps on D in the NHL. I argue that there may be better D even on the Flames. Glasnost my friend.

[jjgallow]

Giordano has always been seen by many as untradeable.

 

An important consideration, at $9 million, is whether that's true.

 

I don't feel that it is.  I believe he is fully tradeable.

 

He has gone from being one of the most under-rated players in the game, to.....maybe a bit over-rated.

[robrob1974]

I would be happy with 6.5-7.5 I think. I worry big contract bury a team. If we aren't careful, I get scared of the Drury and Briere affect; I am not going to put our players in the Daigle category. But even Phaneuf regressed so much with his raise.

So I feel like Gio is worth about 6.5 and go a four years. Going into age 37 is dangerous.

I don't think Subban is worth 9M. But that's just me. I feel like players are worth 8M max, but maybe I am old school.

[KACaribou]

I would be happy with 6.5-7.5 I think. I worry big contract bury a team. If we aren't careful, I get scared of the Drury and Briere affect; I am not going to put our players in the Daigle category. But even Phaneuf regressed so much with his raise.

So I feel like Gio is worth about 6.5 and go a four years. Going into age 37 is dangerous.

I don't think Subban is worth 9M. But that's just me. I feel like players are worth 8M max, but maybe I am old school.

I like your comment but doesn't it seem ridiculous. What kind of alter-world are we now living in when a mere hockey player is making $6 - $8 million a season and we think it is good; while some brilliant scientist researching cures for disease is barely scraping out a living. It tells us how askew our values are these days.

[andymo]

Giordano has always been seen by many as untradeable.

 

An important consideration, at $9 million, is whether that's true.

 

I don't feel that it is.  I believe he is fully tradeable.

 

He has gone from being one of the most under-rated players in the game, to.....maybe a bit over-rated.

Not only is he tradeable, he's the most tradeable he's ever been or ever will be. He's had an amazing year, there are no trade restrictions and if we don't sign him, we'll still be paying 16m to our top 3 D Men in 16-17! This is not a foregone conclusion. No reason for Calgary to pay more or longer than they need on this and if we do, it's a mistake. My gut feeling is $7.5 x5 years which I think is a bit over in both dollar and term, but if he wants more and won't budge, he should be traded. He's our captain, he's never worn another NHL jersey and despite what some have said here, he is definitely our number one defenseman. But I don't think he will be in 2 or 3 years and you ignore that at your peril as a cap team (and we are!!!)

I am not saying trade Gio. I am saying sign Gio to a good deal. But if you can't get a good deal, get a good trade. Sorry Skip.

[Flyerfan52]

I like your comment but doesn't it seem ridiculous. What kind of alter-world are we now living in when a mere hockey player is making $6 - $8 million a season and we think it is good; while some brilliant scientist researching cures for disease is barely scraping out a living. It tells us how askew our values are these days.

It is but look @ actors, musicians, MLB/NFL or NBA players. NHLers are on the bottom end while all are in the entertainment business.

 

If needing surgery I'd rather have a med school intern operate than some highly paid actor that plays a doctor on tv or a movie.

 

Everything is relative.

[Heartbreaker]

It is but look @ actors, musicians, MLB/NFL or NBA players. NHLers are on the bottom end while all are in the entertainment business.

If needing surgery I'd rather have a med school intern operate than some highly paid actor that plays a doctor on tv or a movie.

Everything is relative.

I'd argue that most musicians aren't paid as well as you think...

Love.

[Flyerfan52]

I'd argue that most musicians aren't paid as well as you think...

Love.

Neither are most professional players in all sports.

We tend to focus on the upper level & ignore those on 2 way contracts that get sent down to save a few $s @ all-star break while the big $ contracts are relaxing beside a pool.

 

4th line players don't put butts in the seats. Stars do.

Just like nobody goes to a movie to see the person with a minor role it's the stars that are the draw.

[Flames22]

In a way, I compare Gio to Zdeno Chara. Not so much in the way that they play (although you could draw parallels there as well), but rather in the circumstances surrounding their age and contracts.

 

Chara is a very good player, in fact one of the best in the NHL. The fans in Boston love him, and have many positive things to say about him. He was 32 years old when he signed his most recent contract (a 7 year deal with an AAV of $6.9 mil). When this deal was signed, it was a great deal for Boston as Chara was and continues to be a pillar for the team. While he has slowed down in recent years, no one has ever questioned his worth when compared to his contract. Now however, he is 38 years old with a NMC. Is he worth the money? Probably. But as a Boston fan, would you rather a 38 year old Chara at $7 mil, or a 22 year old Hamilton at $7 mil?

 

This leads me to Giordano. Like Chara, he is a crucial part to this team. He too will be 32 years old heading into this season. It is very probable that Gio gets a similar contract to Chara (I'm guessing 7 years at $8mil). Is Gio worth that now? Sure! Is he still worth that if the Flames have to lose one of Gaudreau/Monahan/Bennett/Hamilton/Brodie down the road?

[MAC331]

All I will say is I hope they don't get carried away with Giordano.

[The_People1]

I think we all knew with PK Subban's deal that increasingly more Dmen will make $9-mil.  Giordano might join that class soon, and then in about 5-years, will see 5-more join.  And eventually, $9-mil will become the norm for that elite level calibre of Dmen.

[jjgallow]

I think we all knew with PK Subban's deal that increasingly more Dmen will make $9-mil.  Giordano might join that class soon, and then in about 5-years, will see 5-more join.  And eventually, $9-mil will become the norm for that elite level calibre of Dmen.

 

I think there' s a pretty big difference between signing a 26 year old to a huge contract, versus a 31 year old.

 

Taking all the emotion out of it, by all accounts it would be reasonable to assume that we just saw Giordano's finest year.

 

Even if he Does make a 100% recovery from his injury.

 

Subban, meanwhile, has his prime years ahead of him.

 

I'm not suggesting that we do a five-player deal with Toronto for Gary Leeman 2.0.

 

I am suggesting that Giordano may be $120/barrel oil right now, imho.

[The_People1]

I think there' s a pretty big difference between signing a 26 year old to a huge contract, versus a 31 year old.

 

Taking all the emotion out of it, by all accounts it would be reasonable to assume that we just saw Giordano's finest year.

 

Even if he Does make a 100% recovery from his injury.

 

Subban, meanwhile, has his prime years ahead of him.

 

I'm not suggesting that we do a five-player deal with Toronto for Gary Leeman 2.0.

 

I am suggesting that Giordano may be $120/barrel oil right now, imho.

 

Giordano will be 32 this October and his play should begin to decline by the time he's 35-ish. 

 

The Flames real legitimate window to win the Cup should open in about 2 years, when Giordano is 34 (and Gaudreau, Monahan, and Bennett are more mature but are still on bridge contracts).

 

So right there, we can all see two curves moving in the opposite directions.  The Flames 'up' and Giordano 'down'.  Even though they are moving in opposite directions though, there is at least a one certain year where the window is open AND Giordano is still in his prime.  I think Cup windows in this day and age don't open wide for long and timing of the roster is everything.  Giordano's prime will still intersect the Flames Cup window and because of that, i believe we have to keep Giordano at all costs.

[phoenix66]

Look, ill start by saying its unfortunate that number ever became public. I have no doubt it was simply an initial starting point,remember Dougie asked for almost 8 from Boston.

I fully expect to see a final number of just slightly more than Hamilton.

On the flipside,Hamilton also gives us insurance. Should it happen that they really dont budge,i know BT wont be held hostage.

Ill be the first to cheer if he gets traded rather than getting an unreasonable contract

But again, i firmly believe it will be done by camp and nowhere near 9 mill or ridiculous term

[travel_dude]

I think there' s a pretty big difference between signing a 26 year old to a huge contract, versus a 31 year old.

 

Taking all the emotion out of it, by all accounts it would be reasonable to assume that we just saw Giordano's finest year.

 

Even if he Does make a 100% recovery from his injury.

 

Subban, meanwhile, has his prime years ahead of him.

 

I'm not suggesting that we do a five-player deal with Toronto for Gary Leeman 2.0.

 

I am suggesting that Giordano may be $120/barrel oil right now, imho.

 

In 2013/14 he was 13-33-47 in 64 games.

In 2014/15 he was 11-37-48 in 61 games.

 

If he plays 82 games, don't you think that will be his finest year?  More experienced players on the team should increase his potential, don't you think?

[Zirakzigil]

Even if he wants 9mil and thats not just his opening offer, he could still get that for the next couple years and make a declining salary amount for the remaining years. People need to relax about the rumoured 9mil asking. 

[jjgallow]

In 2013/14 he was 13-33-47 in 64 games.

In 2014/15 he was 11-37-48 in 61 games.

 

If he plays 82 games, don't you think that will be his finest year?  More experienced players on the team should increase his potential, don't you think?

 

I'm not real kean on bashing Giordano....that's kind of not a great way to make friends here.

 

But, I think you have to ask the question.  What are the odds of him playing 82 games?

 

15% - 20%, based on his history and age, would be my guess.

 

That is without factoring in the question of whether he will recover 100%.

 

I also put more emphasis on goals than assists.  I agree that his finest season was last year.  But, no, I don't feel that's reflected in his goals and points stats, as he's shown a decline in goals.

 

He helped us get into the playoffs.  But there's a lot of defensemen out there who helped their teams go Far in the playoffs.  Or even win the cup.   I am not saying his not capable of it.   But he has not yet shown it.

 

 

Now before someone shoots me,

 

Yes, I agree that it's possible next year could be his best year.

 

That, if he is healthy, fully recovered, and does not suffer from post-signing syndrome.

 

So, the odds are not fantastic but yes, it's possible.  

 

A lot of risk.

[CheersMan]

In 2013/14 he was 13-33-47 in 64 games.

In 2014/15 he was 11-37-48 in 61 games.

 

If he plays 82 games, don't you think that will be his finest year?  More experienced players on the team should increase his potential, don't you think?

 

You might be onto something here.

 

In 2011-2012 he played 61 games.

In 2012-2013 he played 47 games.  Lockout.

 

That's alot of games missed in last 4 years (between 29-32 yr old).  How many games will he miss between 33-40 years?  Just wondering.

[travel_dude]

You might be onto something here.

 

In 2011-2012 he played 61 games.

In 2012-2013 he played 47 games.  Lockout.

 

That's alot of games missed in last 4 years (between 29-32 yr old).  How many games will he miss between 33-40 years?  Just wondering.

 

A fluke injury does not show a tendency to be injury prone. 

 

Shame on him for only playing 47 games in a lockout season. 

 

You can't start basing salaries on number of fames played.  Crosby had the following:

In 2010-2011 he played 41 games.

In 2011-2012 he played 22 games.

In 2012-2013 he played 36 games.  Lockout.

 

How many games will he miss between 28 and 38 (end of his contract)?

 

Seems like he has lost a lot of games to injury (concussion, broken jaw, PMS).

[Flyerfan52]

A fluke injury does not show a tendency to be injury prone. 

 

Shame on him for only playing 47 games in a lockout season. 

 

You can't start basing salaries on number of fames played.  Crosby had the following:

In 2010-2011 he played 41 games.

In 2011-2012 he played 22 games.

In 2012-2013 he played 36 games.  Lockout.

 

How many games will he miss between 28 and 38 (end of his contract)?

 

Seems like he has lost a lot of games to injury (concussion, broken jaw, PMS).

[CheersMan]

For the record, I want Gio on my team...........at the right price.  Gio's next deal will make or break us down the road.  Here is a chart I found, not sure of the source, its a couple years dated but it still looks accurate to me.  Gio will be 33 when his new deal kicks in.

 

[TrippinVdUb]

In a way, I compare Gio to Zdeno Chara. Not so much in the way that they play (although you could draw parallels there as well), but rather in the circumstances surrounding their age and contracts.

 

Chara is a very good player, in fact one of the best in the NHL. The fans in Boston love him, and have many positive things to say about him. He was 32 years old when he signed his most recent contract (a 7 year deal with an AAV of $6.9 mil). When this deal was signed, it was a great deal for Boston as Chara was and continues to be a pillar for the team. While he has slowed down in recent years, no one has ever questioned his worth when compared to his contract. Now however, he is 38 years old with a NMC. Is he worth the money? Probably. But as a Boston fan, would you rather a 38 year old Chara at $7 mil, or a 22 year old Hamilton at $7 mil?

 

This leads me to Giordano. Like Chara, he is a crucial part to this team. He too will be 32 years old heading into this season. It is very probable that Gio gets a similar contract to Chara (I'm guessing 7 years at $8mil). Is Gio worth that now? Sure! Is he still worth that if the Flames have to lose one of Gaudreau/Monahan/Bennett/Hamilton/Brodie down the road?

Excellent comparison.... 

 

I dont want to see Gio go anywhere until he hands over the C to our next captain, I dont want him to be shipped out and the next player named, I would like to see someone, whether its Mony, Bennett, ect... excell and pass Gio as this teams leader. To me, that's apart of the culture we want here in Calgary, its our veteran, star players continuously bringing up and shaping the next crop of players into the organization and showing them the right way of doing things.

 

If Gio leaves, who is the next Captain? Mony still has the look of a kid in his eyes. Russell, Stajan, Huddler? all would be for the short term. This is Giordano's team right now, hes stuck with the flames through the build with out batting an eye and has taken the responsibly of that C  like a true professional, Pay the man what he deserves and lets see if he can lead us to a cup!

[travel_dude]

For the record, I want Gio on my team...........at the right price.  Gio's next deal will make or break us down the road.  Here is a chart I found, not sure of the source, its a couple years dated but it still looks accurate to me.  Gio will be 33 when his new deal kicks in.

 

 

I'm not sure what this chart is supposed to prove other than there are a lot of players under 30.  Are the younger ones the good ones? Considering that most D don't hit their prime until 26, this chart seems to show a lot of players that aren't at their prime yet.

 

Gio's deal will not sink us.  Paying a player like Bouma $3m per season to score 6 goals will.  Keeping Engelland as a 7th D-man will.

Paying Raymond $3m to sit will.  Between Raymond, Engelland, Smid, and Jones, we are paying out over $13m for players that aren't doing enough for their usage and results.

[cccsberg]

I'm not sure what this chart is supposed to prove other than there are a lot of players under 30.  Are the younger ones the good ones? Considering that most D don't hit their prime until 26, this chart seems to show a lot of players that aren't at their prime yet.

 

Gio's deal will not sink us.  Paying a player like Bouma $3m per season to score 6 goals will.  Keeping Engelland as a 7th D-man will.

Paying Raymond $3m to sit will.  Between Raymond, Engelland, Smid, and Jones, we are paying out over $13m for players that aren't doing enough for their usage and results.

You are correct with the 4 players listed.  Gio now isn't a problem or anywhere near a problem.  Signing a $9mm AAV would put Gio onto that list soon, in all likelihood, but I'm positive that will not happen.  Treliving has proven with these last signings that he's a smart manager.  Let's see how it all shakes out.  I would hate to lose Gio, but I'm not afraid to trade him if need be.