Johnny 'Hockey' Gaudreau

[travel_dude]

51 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

I've been saying for a couple years now .He will not be in Calgary if he hits UFA.. he will go home , and I wont blame him 

Johnny is a Grade A, elite, secondary piece .. we've made the mistake of making him a focal point .. he doesn't lead, he doesn't drive 

I would have traded him straight up for a signed Taylor Hall

 

i Think BT has an opportunity now to make a major kill... go all in on making sure you sign Hall this summer , use Johnny to pillage an eastern team 

with all the turmoil going on in Buffalo right now , its not impossible you could pry anybody out of Buffalo..even Eichel is not off the table.. Johnny can be a central piece in getting us an elite Center .. outside of the Big 3 (Connor, Sid, Ovie)  I dont believe anybody is untouchable with Johnny as the bait 

 

Other than concern about his parents, which everyone has, there is nothing to say he wants to go home and play.

 

[Fins&FIre15]

17 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Why would you immediately assume that?

 

I think the word immediately is wrong to use in this situation.

 

It's been a long year for us flames fans to mull things over.

 

Johnny has always struck me as a family first guy, despite signing with us when he did.

 

Just an opinionated conclusion/feeling, not saying its right or wrong.

[phoenix66]

5 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Other than concern about his parents, which everyone has, there is nothing to say he wants to go home and play.

 

Just everything about him screams homesick

Off season , he goes back.. he runs his hockey school there .. his friends are there .. he trains there .. when he's not needed here to put on a jersey he's not here .. outside of the flames he has put down no roots here 

And yes there is the family situation.. his parents have to stay up past midnight to watch the majority of his games 

 

It makes the most sense..if given the choice he will be just like Tavares .. and again, it will be his right..  plus I'll add a team there will pay him what we should not pay him 

[robrob74]

6 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

See and I believe he's supposed to be the heart of this team.. many have disagreed with me when I said he doesn't drive it or even carry a line , so fine .

GIo and Lindholm may be down this season, but I've never once questioned their effort level any given night 

I wanna see Johnny get mad ..I want to see him go out and have a "the shift" of his own 

Dig for a puck in the corner .. block a shot (I've seen him do it when he's on fire ). Heck , hit a guy on the boards (he's done this before too)

There was a time when if you made Johnny mad, he made you pay..now I don't even think he gets mad 

Maybe we need Jagr to come in and have a pep talk with him again?

 

Lately all I see from him is he's trying to be all finesse .. pretty moves , pretty passes .. no "ok boys follow me ". Attitude 

 

 

 

your best players need to be the heart of the team. If they’re not going there is no way they can win. 
 

we need depth heart as well, but if your best players aren’t consistently your heart, you get a team that looks borderline. 
 

johnny and Monny are the driving force.

[sak22]

1 hour ago, robrob74 said:

 

your best players need to be the heart of the team. If they’re not going there is no way they can win. 
 

we need depth heart as well, but if your best players aren’t consistently your heart, you get a team that looks borderline. 
 

johnny and Monny are the driving force.

I'm a Kansas City Chiefs fan and going from watching their playoff run to the Flames has been the ultimate high to low, but I can still compare where they are different.  The Chiefs fell behind by at least 2 scores in every game, made plenty of mistakes in every game, but instead of letting those mistakes beat them they kept their head high and kept fighting the offence went big and the defence became a force.  Patrick Mahomes gets a lot of attention for his talents on the field, but after watching him for 2 years its his drive and attitude that truly makes him great, 2 bad interceptions in the 2nd half of the biggest game of his life and he's unfazed.  The team challenged each other when things went bad.  

 

The Flames right now and especially the stars are letting the bad things in games control them, lets be honest Johnny has been a turnover machine since day 1, he's just not cancelling them out with good plays anymore and its destroying him mentally.

[travel_dude]

Long podcast, but the discussion is appreciated.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/pinder-steinberg/steinberg-klein-johnny-gaudreau-going-figure-now-time/

 

[LouCifer]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

Long podcast, but the discussion is appreciated.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/pinder-steinberg/steinberg-klein-johnny-gaudreau-going-figure-now-time/

 

Ya I heard it live yesterday (yes I listen to Calgary radio), and they’re right - moving a guy like Gaudreau would be best saved for the offseason (when almost every team can be involved to bid for his services). It ups the return. 
 

Unless there’s a desperate GM out there that would trade a star player of his own right now. (Your move Botteril! 😉 Lol) 

[travel_dude]

22 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

Ya I heard it live yesterday (yes I listen to Calgary radio), and they’re right - moving a guy like Gaudreau would be best saved for the offseason (when almost every team can be involved to bid for his services). It ups the return. 
 

Unless there’s a desperate GM out there that would trade a star player of his own right now. (Your move Botteril! 😉 Lol) 

 

I don't agree with much Steinberg says.

He may be right in some of his observations, though.

I find he's usually such a homer that says very little negative against Gio or Backlund or Smith (last year).

 

With what he says, where the heck is the criticism of the rest of the team?

Maybe JH sets the expectations with his play, but where is the leadership from Gio and Backlund?

Backlund bails on any play where he doesn;t get a chance.

Gio is a shadow of his former self.

Offense is supposed to start from the D, but it isn't.

 

I know it's a bad thing to do, but the GM needs to talk to the players and find out what's in their heads.

The players supposedly play for each other, but are they playing for the coach?

[The_People1]

57 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I don't agree with much Steinberg says.

He may be right in some of his observations, though.

I find he's usually such a homer that says very little negative against Gio or Backlund or Smith (last year).

 

This is the problem with mainstream media in general.  As a reporter, if you want access to the star players then you better not talk critically of said stars.  Same goes for politicians, celebrities, etc.

 

Steinberg is no doubt buddy buddy with the core of this team because his career depends on it.  But I believe he knows his stuff but has to self censor.  Sometimes have to read between the lines.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

This is the problem with mainstream media in general.  As a reporter, if you want access to the star players then you better not talk critically of said stars.  Same goes for politicians, celebrities, etc.

 

Steinberg is no doubt buddy buddy with the core of this team because his career depends on it.  But I believe he knows his stuff but has to self censor.  Sometimes have to read between the lines.

 

Sure didn;t pull any punches with Gaudreau.

WHat you are saying sounds right, but it doesn;t ring true.

They are trashing other star players.  

[LouCifer]

With Gio, the effort and compete is never in question. The puck just isn’t going in for him this year the way it did last year. I don’t see glaring mistakes out of him either. I wouldn’t say he’s a shadow of himself at all TD. 
 

This has been brought up before, but BT was saying all last year how instrumental Smith was in our defensive end - assisting with puck retrieval and breakouts. He definitely made it easy on our D because they weren’t getting railroaded every time the puck was dumped in behind them. Essentially, I think we’re seeing a D core that took a year off of puck retrieval, and they have to learn to retrieve pucks again. 

[travel_dude]

50 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

With Gio, the effort and compete is never in question. The puck just isn’t going in for him this year the way it did last year. I don’t see glaring mistakes out of him either. I wouldn’t say he’s a shadow of himself at all TD. 
 

This has been brought up before, but BT was saying all last year how instrumental Smith was in our defensive end - assisting with puck retrieval and breakouts. He definitely made it easy on our D because they weren’t getting railroaded every time the puck was dumped in behind them. Essentially, I think we’re seeing a D core that took a year off of puck retrieval, and they have to learn to retrieve pucks again. 

 

The PP struggles are well known.

Gio is a big part of the results.

This year less than half of the production with 27 games remaining.

27 points to date all situations, compared to 74 last season.

Plays die on his stick on the PP.

He was a key part of the breakout and key to offense.

 

This year, his defense is still there.

Just not the offense.

How many times has he taken a penalty or been walked around after he breaks a stick on the PP?

 

Smith?

Bah, that's not helping the Oilers most nights.

It's a falacy.

[LouCifer]

19 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Smith?

Bah, that's not helping the Oilers most nights.

It's a falacy.

Smith isn’t helping stop goals, I agree. But he is helping their defensive end get the puck moving up ice this season, more than if that suspect D was retrieving it by themselves. but this isn’t about Smith or the Oilers. What changed in our D zone from last season to this season? I’d say “a goalie that played the puck a heck of a lot” is the biggest difference. For better and for worse. 

back to JH. He played a better game last night. Hopefully he can become consistent with a similar effort from game to game. 

[phoenix66]

19 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

Smith isn’t helping stop goals, I agree. But he is helping their defensive end get the puck moving up ice this season, more than if that suspect D was retrieving it by themselves. but this isn’t about Smith or the Oilers. What changed in our D zone from last season to this season? I’d say “a goalie that played the puck a heck of a lot” is the biggest difference. For better and for worse. 

back to JH. He played a better game last night. Hopefully he can become consistent with a similar effort from game to game. 

Couldn't agree more..I've noted this a few times in other threads 

The only people who ever had an issue with Smith's puck playing were fans who only see the inevitable bad plays 

Coaches , teammates, opponents all are on records as saying it was a benefit as well as something the opposition had to specifically game plan on

 

Simply.. many times with Smith , the D is already in full flight exiting the zone when Smith could hit them with a simple pass ..it took the dump in away from the opponent..as well as now , without that aspect, dmen are starting from point zero to get out .. passing needs to be better, slower foot speed is exposed 

 

I'm not saying we should have kept Smith, just that the lost aspect of a 3rd dman on the ice at all times is noticed

 

And I don't think it's a coincidence that suddenly people are calling edmontons d improved 

 

[tmac70]

Teams have learned to play him, but he is not as tenacious on the puck as he was. One can speculate is it a drinking problem, Mony has a girl now maybe he is lonely, drugs, home sick again all speculations. Last night he had time and space and he made the Canucks pay. IMHO the systems in place do not benefit JG, but give him some time and space he will kill you. If this club and he are going to make any kind of splash, he needs a player like him to push the pace. Kane has a slump till Panarin came along. Could you imagine Ryan o reilly with Gadreau or panarin, hall, another winger or center that enhances his style. He always left alone and teams pressure him. Last night 3 on 2 with Lindy Jg and Mony boom in the net 

[travel_dude]

23 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

Teams have learned to play him, but he is not as tenacious on the puck as he was. One can speculate is it a drinking problem, Mony has a girl now maybe he is lonely, drugs, home sick again all speculations. Last night he had time and space and he made the Canucks pay. IMHO the systems in place do not benefit JG, but give him some time and space he will kill you. If this club and he are going to make any kind of splash, he needs a player like him to push the pace. Kane has a slump till Panarin came along. Could you imagine Ryan o reilly with Gadreau or panarin, hall, another winger or center that enhances his style. He always left alone and teams pressure him. Last night 3 on 2 with Lindy Jg and Mony boom in the net 

 

Even him and Janko showed what he can do.

Two rushes, one Grade A chance and one tap in goal.

I suspect it's the lack of calls that is frustrating him more than any hom life thing.

He whine too much and now is being ignored by the refs.

It's not just him, but he takes it harder.

 

Hall is the best complement I can think of right now.

Move JH to RW and Hall on LW; doesn;t matter who the C is.

Until then, we need to find the right player that has requsite speed and finish.

Hoffman would be good, but the asking price is too high.

Toffoli would be a cheap try-out, but might work better with Backlund and Tkachuk.

 

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

Couldn't agree more..I've noted this a few times in other threads 

The only people who ever had an issue with Smith's puck playing were fans who only see the inevitable bad plays 

Coaches , teammates, opponents all are on records as saying it was a benefit as well as something the opposition had to specifically game plan on

 

Simply.. many times with Smith , the D is already in full flight exiting the zone when Smith could hit them with a simple pass ..it took the dump in away from the opponent..as well as now , without that aspect, dmen are starting from point zero to get out .. passing needs to be better, slower foot speed is exposed 

 

I'm not saying we should have kept Smith, just that the lost aspect of a 3rd dman on the ice at all times is noticed

 

And I don't think it's a coincidence that suddenly people are calling edmontons d improved 

 

 

I think you might be the only one calling EDM's D improved.

I could care less about the turnovers created by Smith's plays.

EDM suffers from the exact same thing we did with Smith in nets.

Neutral zone play.

Smith passes to Draisaitl or McD, then it's not a problem.

He wrings it along the glass, then it comes right back.

RInse and repeat.

Save the D a touch on the play and force them to need to defend the same shift.

 

The only positive thing Smith does it intercept the shot around the boards.

Dump and chase disrupted.

Call that a win.

Anything else is noise.

[pikey7883]

18 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Even him and Janko showed what he can do.

Two rushes, one Grade A chance and one tap in goal.

I suspect it's the lack of calls that is frustrating him more than any hom life thing.

He whine too much and now is being ignored by the refs.

It's not just him, but he takes it harder.

 

Hall is the best complement I can think of right now.

Move JH to RW and Hall on LW; doesn;t matter who the C is.

Until then, we need to find the right player that has requsite speed and finish.

Hoffman would be good, but the asking price is too high.

Toffoli would be a cheap try-out, but might work better with Backlund and Tkachuk.

 

 

I think you might be the only one calling EDM's D improved.

I could care less about the turnovers created by Smith's plays.

EDM suffers from the exact same thing we did with Smith in nets.

Neutral zone play.

Smith passes to Draisaitl or McD, then it's not a problem.

He wrings it along the glass, then it comes right back.

RInse and repeat.

Save the D a touch on the play and force them to need to defend the same shift.

 

The only positive thing Smith does it intercept the shot around the boards.

Dump and chase disrupted.

Call that a win.

Anything else is noise.

I am a stats and analytics nerd, and have ran a bunch of scenarios with janko on the top line with Gaudreau, and the results are almost the same as with monahan. It is a great thought to get a couple people going. To complete my theory I will still stand by or need to get Toffoli, lol

 

a lineup of

Tkachuk - Monahan - Toffoli (let this line do some heavy lifting against the best lines on the other team)

Gaudreau - Janko - Lindblom (lindy can help with faceoffs, Janko can keep up with them)

Bennett - Ryan - Dube (this should be an excitingly energy line)

Lucic - Backlund - Reider (limited minutes, but can play a shut down role if needed, and in Rinaldo when you need to lean on a team, ala the bash brothers in the playoffs)

 

 

[cross16]

21 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

Couldn't agree more..I've noted this a few times in other threads 

The only people who ever had an issue with Smith's puck playing were fans who only see the inevitable bad plays 

Coaches , teammates, opponents all are on records as saying it was a benefit as well as something the opposition had to specifically game plan on

 

Simply.. many times with Smith , the D is already in full flight exiting the zone when Smith could hit them with a simple pass ..it took the dump in away from the opponent..as well as now , without that aspect, dmen are starting from point zero to get out .. passing needs to be better, slower foot speed is exposed 

 

I'm not saying we should have kept Smith, just that the lost aspect of a 3rd dman on the ice at all times is noticed

 

And I don't think it's a coincidence that suddenly people are calling edmontons d improved 

 

 

Funny enough there is nothing that points to improvement from Edmonton's D, that talk is mostly BS coming from the Edmonton media. There is very little change from the Oilers from last year to this year at 5 on 5 they have seen very marginal improvements. Calgary's D problems started under Ward, they were still playing good defence under Peters despite losing Smith. He's really made next to zero impact on either team.  Ethan Bear would be a better person to point to if you want to try and claim Edmonton's d is "improved" although IMO the argument is weak.