kehatch

Ramo has been very good. He looks calm and quiet. A great sign for a goalie. If he can keep it up he is going to give Flames management a lot to think about going forward.

You may not want to have a discussion about which goalies to keep beyond this season. That's fine. But this is a Flames discussion board, this is a relevant topic, and this is the correct thread.

No info except he has an upper body injury, he isn't playing tonight, and he is still being assessed before a full update is given. It doesn't sound good.

Agreed

The only D that makes sense with Brodie is Russell. Wideman doesn't have the defensive chops, and you would be moving Brodie to the left side which he isn't used to. Engelland, Potter, and Diaz aren't even options IMO. Wotherspoon isn't ready, though I would put him with Wideman. Russell-Brodie Wotherspoon-Wideman Diaz-Engelland Potter If they want to run 7D to shelter Wotherspoon some that is fine.

Brodie and Engelland together is a terrible terrible terrible decision. Hopefully it isn't what we see on the ice. Terrible.

It doesn't to me. But obviously there will be discussion around a pending UFA. Will they trade him? Extend him? Should they keep him over Hiller? When is Ortio ready? There isn't a problem. Its just a discussion board and this is a valid discussion is all.

Not every post can be about the making the playoffs. Though there are a bunch of those. Ramo is a pending free agent so its a fair discussion.

There are always teams looking for starters. Injuries, trades, insurance, etc. You can find a home for a proven veteran with one season left under contract, especially after a strong season. Plus, the Flames can always retain salary if they can. I think the most likely situation is that Ramo walks and Hiller and Ortio get the net next season. But there are lots of other things that could happen.

There are times when I look at Ramo and think if he was given a regular menu of games he would be a legitimate starter. There are other times where I don't see NHL potential. I guess we will see how this string of games go. If he keeps it up I might agree with keeping Ramo over Hiller. Especially since I think you can move Hiller for assets. But right now I trust Hiller more. Especially with introducing a young goalie like Ortio.

A one way contract means he will get paid his NHL salary if demoted to the AHL. They can still demote him if they want to. Setoguchi is on a one way deal for example. So is McGrattan. The bigger issue is waiver eligibility. That has nothing to do with a one way or two way contract. It is based on the age of the player and the number of NHL games played. Ortio will be waiver eligible next season. Meaning he will need to clear waivers to be demoted to the AHL. Meaning any NHL team could claim him. But if they do claim him they need to keep him on the NHL roster (otherwise he goes on waivers again and Calgary has the right to take him back). I think Ortio is a functional back-up right now and I think he has NHL starter upside. So I doubt he clears waivers personally.

People say that all the time about these players though. People were totally against going after Carter for example for many of the same reasons listed here. Of course he has warts. Any player you acquire outside of the draft has warts. Otherwise they wouldn't be available. Fans spend a lot of time pointing out why a player isn't perfect. Often to see that player do very well with the team that picks him up.

Some of last night is on the coach. If that was Ramo in net he would have been pulled. Hartley has more patience with some players. On another note, sounds like Ortio is hurt. That is huge for Adirondack who have fallen out of a playoff spot. It also outs the breaks on a potential Ramo trade.

I don't agree that guys like Kessel aren't available for cheap every year. I do agree that they can be found much easier then top C or D. But unless you get luck, chances are you are going to have to pay to get them.

Gaborik, Hossa, P Kane ... all guys that could face similar criticism to Kessel. All guys that were a major part of their team winning the cup. Iginla, Fleury, ..... You need wingers. Kessel is an elite scorer and he can be a difference maker.

If you fail to act because you have a chance of getting a 3 percent lotto ticket there is a problem. Not to mention that even if you do win the player may never be as good as Kessel. I know we are all supposed to talk about McDavid with hushed voices and clasped hands, but there is no guarantee he is the next Crosby.

Have to give a shout out to Diaz who has been playing pretty well lately. Pretty amazing actually. This chart so really shows how competent (or incompetent) Smid and Engelland have been.

I enjoy hockey stats as much as the next guy. But I don't like goal tending stats. I don't think they represent the quality of play of the goalies. For a couple of reasons. 1. They are a team stat A goalies stats will fluctuate wildly between one team and the next. It is really dependent on the defensive play, systems, number of shots against, etc. 2. They fluctuate game to game If Ramo has a single 30 save shutout his SV% will jump all of the way from .904 to .910. If Ortio has a bad game and lets in 5 goals on a 30 shot game his SV% will drop from .931 to .914. 3. They are influenced by the PK The number of penalties and the quality of the PK has a big influence on SV%. You can isolate it to even strength save percentage to correct for this. But none of the main pages do this, most fans don't, and its a bit of a pain. I prefer to judge goalies based on: The number of bad goals they let in The number of clutch saves they make (big saves when you need them) Unfortunately that is an entirely subjective view. It also requires actually watching the games. Which is fine when judging the Flames tenders, but is tougher when comparing them to other teams I don't watch as often. I will say this. I trust Hiller more then Ramo or Ortio to make the big save when we really need it. Right now, down the stretch, he is the guy I want starting most of the games. Which means keeping Ortio in the AHL makes sense since there isn't any value in him watching from the bench.

Wideman showed cracks with that many minutes. Really shakey at the end.

There are always rumors of crazy prices before a deal gets done. Rarely does it come to pass. That said, that price may not be too far off. Backlund, Baertschi, and a first were thrown around from a Calgary perspective. Backlund is probably in the same value range as Kreider. Maybe he is worth a bit less. Our first is worth more then theirs as ours is likely going to be higher. Baertschi is worth Duclair/Skjei and a second. Or at least he is in the ball park.

As long as you aren't giving up Giordano, Brodie, Monahan, Bennett, or Gaudreau I am not concerned about that happening.

Everything points to this being a huge project. Football, Hockey, convention centre, etc. That is a lot of moving parts with a lot of stakeholders (political and business). It takes time.

Most of the off season he was. Not sure why. Giordano had a career year post 30 playing with Brodie and he has just got better. It is one of the best pairings in the NHL. Russell and Wideman were split up for part of tonight though. But Hartley out them back together in the third.

He didn't wear our his welcome in Boston. He was traded for a really big return to avoid losing him to an offer sheet. I also couldn't think of a worse environment for him in the NHL then Toronto right now. Most of the times these trades work in the favour of the team acquiring the player. Myers will probably work in Winnipeg. Kane will probably work in Buffalo. Seguin works in Dallas. I remember and almost identical discussion surrounding Carter when he was still in Philly. He works in LA. Bobby Ryan might be the one example against doing this, but he is having a great season in Ottawa. 8 million for a young perennial 30 goal scorer is worth it. Especially since you are probably buying low on the guy.

I think Kessel would do well here. There is already a strong leadership structure in place and he wouldn't have to be the go to guy. He is like a Hossa, Gaborik, Kovalchuk, etc. Really good complimentary player on the right team. I get he is paid alot for that. But considering he is one of the top offensive players in the NHL he is worth his salary. The bigger issue is what would it cost to get him. I am guessing something like Backlund, Baertschi, and a first. I would probably do it. I really like Backlund, but with the number of Cs on the team and in the system we can afford that. The other assets I can live with losing.