2024 Free Agency

[tmac70]

This roster is a hot mess, especially on the D, we still need a gap fit for C. Bean swap for Kylington, I  am not sure about Oliver's thought process maybe it is just a total change that he may require for his health. Wish him well; for those who may think he owes the Flames, no, he doesn't. The organization did the right thing for the individual. 

 

[MP5029]

Just now, tmac70 said:

This roster is a hot mess, especially on the D, we still need a gap fit for C. Bean swap for Kylington, I  am not sure about Oliver's thought process maybe it is just a total change that he may require for his health. Wish him well; for those who may think he owes the Flames, no, he doesn't. The organization did the right thing for the individual. 

 

I disagree about the D, it’s proven sure but that’s all. It may be junk or it may be good/average or it could Even turn out to be amazing…I like the Bean and Bhal adds these two with Weegar and Anderson make for a potentially really good top 4, sprinkle in a Russian or two on the bottom pair and wait and see. Not horrible not a hot mess just unproven.

 

up front, ok it’s a bit messy, but I’m good with that this year, see what we have, I’m good with this cause it increases our odds at a top 5 which we badly need.

 

 

[JTech780]

For me unless Coronato has a great summer and comes to camp and surprises, he probably isn’t on the team to start the year. He really needs to improve his skating and strength to be an everyday NHLer.

[JTech780]

 

[The_People1]

7 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

For me unless Coronato has a great summer and comes to camp and surprises, he probably isn’t on the team to start the year. He really needs to improve his skating and strength to be an everyday NHLer.

 

Reminds me of Pelletier's first year.  Just didn't have enough jump outside of a couple shifts per game.  The rest of the time he's just a waste a space.  Then Pelletier comes back the next year and looks reborn.  He could step on the gas pedal every shift.  Coronato needs to get to this point or else he's trending bust.

[JTech780]

I like Coronato he brings a lot to the table in regards to his willingness to compete, his shot and his hockey IQ, but if he can’t get to spots to use his shot and get in on the forecheck to create turnover and isn’t strong enough to fight through checks then it’s all for nothing.

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

There are 3rd line kids in the farm who would benefit from 4th line NHL experience.  Right now, I don't even think Pelletier has a spot to play if Lomberg is playing full time, for example.  Klapka or Schwindt could surprise at camp and make the team but need a spot.  Maybe Parker Bell could surprise.

 

At the end of the day, the Flames aren't a playoff team anyways.  Give the kids a chance to play.

is Pelletier a 3rd liner though? If he is, trade him. He's too small for that role and no bite. Lomberg is not blocking him.

[robrob74]

20 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

For me unless Coronato has a great summer and comes to camp and surprises, he probably isn’t on the team to start the year. He really needs to improve his skating and strength to be an everyday NHLer.

I agree, I wanted to see more from him and maybe that's after next year. I dunno if it was a hype train he got on but he didn't look ready, like he believed the hype and then had to put in work in the A. Hope it wakes him up.

[JTech780]

4 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

is Pelletier a 3rd liner though? If he is, trade him. He's too small for that role and no bite. Lomberg is not blocking him.

I think he is a 3rd liner who can fill in on the top 6, basically a middle 6 winger. I think his size is fine and he does play with some bite. He will replace Mangiapane, similar players in a lot of ways.

[phoenix66]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

I could care less about Broburg.  He's a guy I think the scouts and team overrates.  The only reason to OS him it to PO EDM.  They will match.  The only player I would want and think they might let go is Holloway.  I'm not even sure that is worth the noise.  But it's a signal to the GM.  Especially after they scooped us on Arvidsson.  They say Brown too, but I'm not sure that's a loss.  I mix up old OTT players.

found it .. no matter , VEG already signed him on the 1st..PAVEL DOROFEYEV

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, robrob74 said:

The thing is, earned is too subjective. it's where I have a problem with how the Flames do things. We love the earned mantra. But a player can almost never earn it if they're played in the 4th line. Earning to me at least, is putting a guy in a position to succeed and they hold the spot. We have to start playing skill with skill or we Bennett more than we Tkachuk or Monahan. 
 

had we played Bennett with guys with skill more than a game or two, we see what he could do. 
 

I see your lines you posted, they look good. I'm just putting Pospisil at C. He played really well at C at the worlds. While it's not the NHL, it would be a slight indication that he can push play there as well. The radio guys said he didn't loose too much of his play on wing either... why not go for it and see what we got in that?

 

Earned meaning have a good camp and show that determination when you get a call up.  4th line or just getting a practice in.  I complained a lot about Hunt getting picked to play, but honestly what have the others shown?  Yes, the coach has to weigh more than just who looked best in practice.  But if you aren't even causing the coach to have to make a decision on other factors, you aren't doing enough.

 

We can't keep coming back to Monahan or Bennett.  That was 3 coaches ago.  Maybe more.  We had other players sniffing at spots.  We had vets that should have been sitting.  Different GM.  Too many things to use as a card against the team ideals.

 

I think you had Pospisil and Zary at C.  With Kadri and Backlund in the other C-spots, I struggled to see how that would work.  Zary at WJC was a defensive C.  I didn't watch Pops at the WC, but the NHL is players like Stamkos and Eichel etc.  At home you can shelter them to learn and get used to it.  On the road they are more likely to be exposed.  Maybe the best idea is to have them paired with Kadri and they alternate.  If they are winning most, then keep them there.  If not then put Kadri there.  Or Sharky or whatever.

 

I'm thinking we get a top 6 C before camp.  Either by trade or UFA.  That would push out Rooney.  Then we figure out what works at camp.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

I like Coronato he brings a lot to the table in regards to his willingness to compete, his shot and his hockey IQ, but if he can’t get to spots to use his shot and get in on the forecheck to create turnover and isn’t strong enough to fight through checks then it’s all for nothing.

 

I flip a coin with Pelletier and Coronato.  Both need a strong camp to win a spot.  as a distributor, Pelts takes it, but it depends what we need in the vacant spot.  'nato should be pushing for a top 6 RW spot, but compared to what's there, he's only above Duehr.  

[cross16]

I think Coronato played better than the sentiment here. I think if had some better puck luck around the net we’d be thinking of his season differently. 
 

but if he wants to maximize his potential he needs to improve skating. Needs some more acceleration to get this open areas. 

[phoenix66]

8 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I think Coronato played better than the sentiment here. I think if had some better puck luck around the net we’d be thinking of his season differently. 
 

but if he wants to maximize his potential he needs to improve skating. Needs some more acceleration to get this open areas. 

He also had to get used to the grind of an 80 game season.. that's way more than he had ever played. Also the reasons you mentioned ..he had to learn that extra step that was needed ..By end of season I think we were seeing a better image of what he can do .. I expect a big jump from him this season.. 

[MP5029]

28 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I think Coronato played better than the sentiment here. I think if had some better puck luck around the net we’d be thinking of his season differently. 
 

but if he wants to maximize his potential he needs to improve skating. Needs some more acceleration to get this open areas. 

Also he is only 21…flames feel he’s progressing, it may be slower than we like but he’s progressing…give him till 23/25 age at least before we start saying he’s trending bust (I know your not say it but other are) or if he stalls out or regresses then maybe we can be consider what to do with him.  Every player development is different some are fast some are slow…and TBH maybe slower is better so he develops with Honz and our recent steady class…there is something to be said for guys developing together in the AHL and graduating to the Big club at the same

time….

[cberg]

4 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

I don't really know how to best set up the 4th line.  Rooney is not the right choice if Lombo is there.  And Lombo with Backlund wastes a development spot that benefited guys like Tkachuk and Mangiapane.  Looking at your lines I have no idea how the minutes shake out.  Almost impossible to roll 4 evenly and reward with special teams.  

 

I like the idea of Mantha with Huberdeau; I think you need that big body allowing him some freedom.  Pelletier has earned nothing to get played with Kadri.  Lombo with Backlund seems odd.

 

I get you are coming up with ideas to try out.  If you want Pelletier or Coronato to develop his game, pair one of them with a responsible C.  I would have less issue with a 4th line of Lombo-C-Coronato as it would be a line able to get shots on net and would get less top lines playing against them.  

 

So, my suggestion doesn't have Pelletier in the top 12:

Zary-Kadri-Kuzmenko

Huberdeau-Sharky-Mantha

Pospisil-Backlund-Coleman

Lombo-C-Coronato

 

Considerng the excess LW's we have I would look to Montreal OR AN East team to trade Pelletier to.  Assuming we don't have the immediate need on the roster.  I can't see anyone in the list above that would be passed by Pelletier.  Injury replacement?  Sure.  Pelletier is more of the BT era and would be fine here if we didn't have excess LW.  We need a C to replace Rooney.  A high energy 4th line is great, but we need better than Rooney; more likely a younger player to build with.

Put Pelletier with Backlund, Pospisil 4C and add the big guy...

[conundrumed]

3 hours ago, tmac70 said:

This roster is a hot mess, especially on the D, we still need a gap fit for C. Bean swap for Kylington, I  am not sure about Oliver's thought process maybe it is just a total change that he may require for his health. Wish him well; for those who may think he owes the Flames, no, he doesn't. The organization did the right thing for the individual. 

 

Camp starts in 10 weeks. I have zero idea why we're forming lines and pairings in early July.

Throw all of your sticks in a pile, we'll toss them out into lines, go for it.

[Otown72]

22 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Camp starts in 10 weeks. I have zero idea why we're forming lines and pairings in early July.

Throw all of your sticks in a pile, we'll toss them out into lines, go for it.

Next week then?

[travel_dude]

The common belief is we lost three D this summer and as a result won't be able to compete.  The first part is 100% true, or at least 2 and 1 to likely follow.  As to the 2nd part, we have 3-4 other players that played NHL D last year. 

 

And it's not even the end of silly season.  Two of the guys were waiver pickups.  Teams are carrying guys they will want to sneak through waivers when the summer is over.  We never had roster space or cap to claim anyone.

 

Between trades, waivers, camp performance. we may see some new faces.  I think a coach like Huska will pass on needs to Connie, if he sees issues.  And Connie already knows we needed a mid level D to add to the team.  Analysts like to pronounce winners and losers on Day 1 of FA.  And they look at teams and announce that they are now cup faves.  Most of those predictions and so called winners turn out to have missed the mark.

[cross16]

1 hour ago, MP5029 said:

Also he is only 21…flames feel he’s progressing, it may be slower than we like but he’s progressing…give him till 23/25 age at least before we start saying he’s trending bust (I know your not say it but other are) or if he stalls out or regresses then maybe we can be consider what to do with him.  Every player development is different some are fast some are slow…and TBH maybe slower is better so he develops with Honz and our recent steady class…there is something to be said for guys developing together in the AHL and graduating to the Big club at the same

time….

 

Oh i don't think he's anywhere near bust.  My post was in defense of those suggesting he didn't look good last year, I would dispute that. I think his hockey IQ was visible an he fit in better than some think, the results just didn't follow. 

 

I'm also not as bullish on his upside so I would have given you a similar answer years ago. If he is to be a top end player he's always needed to work on his skating. Still think he'll be good but I don't see the ceiling as a top line player so I don't think he is off pace or trending poorly. 

[robrob74]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Earned meaning have a good camp and show that determination when you get a call up.  4th line or just getting a practice in.  I complained a lot about Hunt getting picked to play, but honestly what have the others shown?  Yes, the coach has to weigh more than just who looked best in practice.  But if you aren't even causing the coach to have to make a decision on other factors, you aren't doing enough.

 

We can't keep coming back to Monahan or Bennett.  That was 3 coaches ago.  Maybe more.  We had other players sniffing at spots.  We had vets that should have been sitting.  Different GM.  Too many things to use as a card against the team ideals.

 

I think you had Pospisil and Zary at C.  With Kadri and Backlund in the other C-spots, I struggled to see how that would work.  Zary at WJC was a defensive C.  I didn't watch Pops at the WC, but the NHL is players like Stamkos and Eichel etc.  At home you can shelter them to learn and get used to it.  On the road they are more likely to be exposed.  Maybe the best idea is to have them paired with Kadri and they alternate.  If they are winning most, then keep them there.  If not then put Kadri there.  Or Sharky or whatever.

 

I'm thinking we get a top 6 C before camp.  Either by trade or UFA.  That would push out Rooney.  Then we figure out what works at camp.

 

even though there are three different coaches, don't feel the philosophies have changed much. Huska is just a nicer version of the similar coach.

 

you also gotta start playing players in positions you want them to develop as. If they're not C's now, maybe they'll never be. If you ever want them to be a c in the nhl, play them as C's now or play C in the AHL 

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Camp starts in 10 weeks. I have zero idea why we're forming lines and pairings in early July.

Throw all of your sticks in a pile, we'll toss them out into lines, go for it.

 

because it's what we have right now... just wondering how it looks. 

[MP5029]

47 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Oh i don't think he's anywhere near bust.  My post was in defense of those suggesting he didn't look good last year, I would dispute that. I think his hockey IQ was visible an he fit in better than some think, the results just didn't follow. 

 

I'm also not as bullish on his upside so I would have given you a similar answer years ago. If he is to be a top end player he's always needed to work on his skating. Still think he'll be good but I don't see the ceiling as a top line player so I don't think he is off pace or trending poorly. 

Totally 👍 that’s why I said not you..😊 sorry if that wasn’t clear my bad dude! 

 

I’m totally with you on him, i think he caps out 2nd line scoring RW…kinda like Kuzy but more balance to his game than just scoring. 

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, Otown72 said:

Next week then?

I was actually thinking Saturday if everyone's available for a lineup draft.😃

[conundrumed]

Is it time to discuss the Johnny-Mony thing yet? He gets traded with a 1st, everyone leaves as soon as they can.

Full circle, reunited.

Do people still believe in coincidence?

An alternative take for discussion.

That Monahan trade/treatment soured Johnny. Everyone soured.

Him and Tkachuk leave, pretty much daring everyone else.

Nobody wants to re-sign, even Mangiapane unhappy and traded.

We gave up a 1st to get rid of Monahan.

Then the top half of our roster went, yeah, no we're out.

Was Monahan's treatment the linchpin that opened the floodgates?