2024 NHL draft - A New Hope

[phoenix66]

9 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Pronman did a full 7 round mock

 

Here's the haul the Flames netted

 

9th- Sam Dickinson LD

Great pick. The Flames passed on Iginla and Catton.

28th- Leo Sahlin Wallenius LD
I like this pick, I'm a fan of Wallenius. The Flames address their D prospect pool in a meaningful way with their first two picks.

41st- Jack Berglund C

I'm not all that familiar with Berglund. Pronman is higher on Berglund than almost any public scouting list though.

62nd- Spencer Gill RD

Big bodied, RHS. Some decent puck skills. Again, adding to the defensive depth, nice to add a RHS.

74th- Tanner Howe LW

This is my favorite pick of this mock. Howe is skilled and plays with grit. Great value here.

84th- Kamil Bednarik C

Three consecutive picks I like. Solid two game with Bednarik

107th- Alexis Bernier RHD

Going back to the Q and taking another RHD. Decent puck skills and plays with some edge.

108th- Kirill Zarubin G

The annual Russian goalie pick. 

170th- Darels Uljanskis D

Latvian D playing in Sweden. Pretty productive

 

Pretty good haul for Calgary. Of course, the biggest question would be, why not Tij? Other than not, this mock has the Flames bolstering their pipeline, in a meaningful way.

 

 

I would be extremely choked if we took Dickinson over those 2 .. to top it off he's a LD ..most mocks I've seen he doesnt crack top 10 ( but soon after )

 

Ironically this is what Pronman himself said about Dickinson fairly recently in May ..

 

"He has offense and can make some tough plays but I wouldn't call his vision what gets you excited about his game. Even with that in mind, in terms of what he could be in the league, I see PP2 potential who could have a major impact at even strength."

 

On Catton..

 

"His footspeed is strong, but not at the same level as his edges. He's a very skilled puckhandler and a great passer who can run a NHL power play. Catton makes a ton of difficult plays on the move and has a lot of pace in his game."

 

On Tij

 

He gets to the inside to score as well and displays a strong effort away from the puck. His pure sense and playmaking don't stand out like the rest of his game, though. He projects as a strong top-six wing who will score a lot of goals."

 

 

He must really think Calgary will prioritize D or something 

 

 

[Thebrewcrew]

1 minute ago, phoenix66 said:

I would be extremely choked if we took Dickinson over those 2 .. to top it off he's a LD ..most mocks I've seen he doesnt crack top 10 ( but soon after )

 

Ironically this is what Pronman himself said about Dickinson fairly recently in May ..

 

"He has offense and can make some tough plays but I wouldn't call his vision what gets you excited about his game. Even with that in mind, in terms of what he could be in the league, I see PP2 potential who could have a major impact at even strength."

I don't think it would happen, in reality.

 

If the Flames have Jarome's blessing, we're led to believe they do, I think Conroy would have a hard time justifying passing on Iginla to ownership.

 

If he's here, they're taking him. But I would rather have Catton lol.

[phoenix66]

1 minute ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I don't think it would happen, in reality.

 

If the Flames have Jarome's blessing, we're led to believe they do, I think Conroy would have a hard time justifying passing on Iginla to ownership.

 

If he's here, they're taking him. But I would rather have Catton lol.

I added more to my post .. he actually likes the other 2 players better as players ..weird ..he must think Calgary will focus on D 

 

Was reading where Iggy said he has purposely avoided scouting meetings etc where first round is being discussed .. he literally has no cluse where they have him ranked and doesn't want to know 

Even at the world Juniors he didn't sit with Conny and the rest during Canada games 

 

Will see how it plays out but taking him at 9 , nobody would consider that a nepo-reach .. personally I dont think he makes it to 9

[Thebrewcrew]

1 minute ago, phoenix66 said:

 

Will see how it plays out but taking him at 9 , nobody would consider that a nepo-reach .. personally I dont think he makes it to 9

Jarome told Eric Francis he has no problem with them taking Tij. If they believe he's the right pick, go ahead.

 

I think they would take him if he's available.

 

That said, I've said it a few times, I think the Iginla's and Flames hope he's gone before 9th. Makes Jarome's transition into management that much easier.

[Thebrewcrew]

Levshunov at 9th. Cole Beaudoin at 28th.

[conundrumed]

7 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

Ironically this is what Pronman himself said about Dickinson fairly recently in May ..

 

"He has offense and can make some tough plays but I wouldn't call his vision what gets you excited about his game. Even with that in mind, in terms of what he could be in the league, I see PP2 potential who could have a major impact at even strength."

Maybe not so ironically, he is parroting how Hunter used him, as a shutdown Dman. Next season, he'll be their top dman on the PP as a sr player. It's just how the Knights develop their players.

Then Pronman can write about that.

It's pretty well-known that the Knights develop. So if you're 16-17, you learn bottom 6 and shutdown hockey, PK etc.

At 18-19, you get coached in the prime roles.

See what they say about Bonk now. Typically, "knew he was solid defensively, didn't realize he had so much O-pop".

This is how it works. Is Dickinson better than Bonk? Certainly. Is he getting Bonk's minutes? Hell no, he can wait until next year.

This is why they are a pro hockey factory. Everybody is developed equally.

 

[phoenix66]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Maybe not so ironically, he is parroting how Hunter used him, as a shutdown Dman. Next season, he'll be their top dman on the PP as a sr player. It's just how the Knights develop their players.

Then Pronman can write about that.

It's pretty well-known that the Knights develop. So if you're 16-17, you learn bottom 6 and shutdown hockey, PK etc.

At 18-19, you get coached in the prime roles.

See what they say about Bonk now. Typically, "knew he was solid defensively, didn't realize he had so much O-pop".

This is how it works. Is Dickinson better than Bonk? Certainly. Is he getting Bonk's minutes? Hell no, he can wait until next year.

This is why they are a pro hockey factory. Everybody is developed equally.

 

Could just be my interpretation ,but I read that as a knock on his hockey IQ.. 

That being said if we were in the teens he looks like a steal , but at 9 we need a game breaker. Just surprised me he would describe the other 2 as being that , but figure we'd go for the dman 

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

Could just be my interpretation ,but I read that as a knock on his hockey IQ.. 

That being said if we were in the teens he looks like a steal , but at 9 we need a game breaker. Just surprised me he would describe the other 2 as being that , but figure we'd go for the dman 

 

Jarome didn't have high IQ either though.  He was just hard working, strong, willing to go to the tough places, and had a wicked shot.  A super grinder for his time. 

 

Tij is similar in that he is 110% effort and he's going to score goals with hard work.  He's going to take the puck and charge the front of the net.  Many of his highlight reels show this.  His highlight package actually looks a lot like Sam Bennett's did back in the day.  It's a lot of "give me the puck and i'll do it by myself".

[The_People1]

14 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

I added more to my post .. he actually likes the other 2 players better as players ..weird ..he must think Calgary will focus on D 

 

It's not weird at all for the Flames to focus on D.

 

We have seen Conroy target D in trades but they are all 3/4/5/6 types.  The high end D is still missing.  Dickinson is at least the next Hanifin.  And we need that.

 

I mean, let's not kid ourselves here.  The Flames need everything.  Dickinson is as needed as Catton.  Maybe the only thing the Flames don't need more of, ironically, is a LHS LW like Tij.  But you can argue the Flames also need a feel good story during their rebuild to keep fans interested.

[travel_dude]

30 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

It's not weird at all for the Flames to focus on D.

 

We have seen Conroy target D in trades but they are all 3/4/5/6 types.  The high end D is still missing.  Dickinson is at least the next Hanifin.  And we need that.

 

I mean, let's not kid ourselves here.  The Flames need everything.  Dickinson is as needed as Catton.  Maybe the only thing the Flames don't need more of, ironically, is a LHS LW like Tij.  But you can argue the Flames also need a feel good story during their rebuild to keep fans interested.

 

The only feel good story I care about is we get the absolute best player in the draft.  We are not getting Celebrini, so we need the 2nd best.  Be it at C or at D.  I suppose a LW is something too, but how many times have we had that stud LW and nothing to play them with.  Our last two top LW's ended up playing on the same line with a lesser C.  Neither Monahan nor Lindholm ever matched the level of the wings.  They were complementary.  We need that C who is top 3 capable in the NHL.  And who can score.

 

If Hanifin is your standard minimum, we likely already have some candidates; Bryz, Morin and Poirier.  That's without even talking about Miromanov, who, out of the gate put up 7 in 20.  I know he has a long way to go and is already a bit older.  Same with Kylington, who skates better than either of them.  

 

This year we may bottom out and end up in the bottom 10 again.  It's expected and it's not meant to have a feel good story because of a name.  Draft some players that turn heads for what they do in D+1.

[tmac70]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

It's not weird at all for the Flames to focus on D.

 

We have seen Conroy target D in trades but they are all 3/4/5/6 types.  The high end D is still missing.  Dickinson is at least the next Hanifin.  And we need that.

 

I mean, let's not kid ourselves here.  The Flames need everything.  Dickinson is as needed as Catton.  Maybe the only thing the Flames don't need more of, ironically, is a LHS LW like Tij.  But you can argue the Flames also need a feel good story during their rebuild to keep fans interested.

You are correct but if i comes to Dickinson vs Catton at 9th overall, you take Catton. Each should make the NHL Catton has a 2nd line C potential. Outside of Celebrini I don't think there are any projected top 3 Centers. Lindstrom, Catton, and  Helenius FWIH are both 2nd potential, each bringing a different element. I could see Lindstrom going high as he is a sought-after power forward, Helenius is a 200 ft ( lindholm type) and Catton playmaker and driver. If it comes to Catton, Dickenson or Ignila, IMHO they should take Catton based on on what we need. 

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, tmac70 said:

You are correct but if i comes to Dickinson vs Catton at 9th overall, you take Catton. Each should make the NHL Catton has a 2nd line C potential. Outside of Celebrini I don't think there are any projected top 3 Centers. Lindstrom, Catton, and  Helenius FWIH are both 2nd potential, each bringing a different element. I could see Lindstrom going high as he is a sought-after power forward, Helenius is a 200 ft ( lindholm type) and Catton playmaker and driver. If it comes to Catton, Dickenson or Ignila, IMHO they should take Catton based on on what we need. 

 

Based on team needs though... If Catton isn't a #1 Center, I mean, Zary and Pospisil are already 2/3 C on the depth chart.  We really just need that #1C.

[phoenix66]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Based on team needs though... If Catton isn't a #1 Center, I mean, Zary and Pospisil are already 2/3 C on the depth chart.  We really just need that #1C

Until Zary and Pospisil prove they can be better at center than they are at wing that should not be a consideration. If you can add a legit top 2 center you do it 

IMO unless it's a true stud D being added they shouldnt focus on D.. they have added good NHL ready D..likely to add more and they take 2-3 years to even be NHL ready in most cases 

[Thebrewcrew]

I don't usually like comps, but I'm gonna play the game anyway.

 

I've seen Dickinson compared to Hanifin  and Catton compared to Nick Suzuki.

 

Who would you rather have? 

[phoenix66]

4 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I don't usually like comps, but I'm gonna play the game anyway.

 

I've seen Dickinson compared to Hanifin  and Catton compared to Nick Suzuki.

 

Who would you rather have? 

A still trending up 30g/70pt center ?  I'll take the center 

[Thebrewcrew]

6 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

A still trending up 30g/70pt center ?  I'll take the center 

I think so too. The question will be how much more can Catton fill out? Height wise he's similar to Suzuki. 

 

It's a tough question to ask Flames fans because I think there's a bias when the name Hanifin is mentioned as a comp. Hanifin is a very good top 4 defender. The numbers are never going to point per game, but he can be used in all situations. There is value there. 

[JTech780]

28 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I don't usually like comps, but I'm gonna play the game anyway.

 

I've seen Dickinson compared to Hanifin  and Catton compared to Nick Suzuki.

 

Who would you rather have? 

I think Catton is a much better skater than Suzuki.

[phoenix66]

11 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I think so too. The question will be how much more can Catton fill out? Height wise he's similar to Suzuki. 

 

It's a tough question to ask Flames fans because I think there's a bias when the name Hanifin is mentioned as a comp. Hanifin is a very good top 4 defender. The numbers are never going to point per game, but he can be used in all situations. There is value there. 

Absolutely.. but you also have to look at development time.  Top 4 D can always be had ..trade / FA.. unless you're talking a real stud like a Fox/ Doughty/ Makar/mcavoy level .. we've seen how hard it is to add top centers .draft em when u can .. get too many you can always use one to get that D you want already developed 

[Thebrewcrew]

 

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

Until Zary and Pospisil prove they can be better at center than they are at wing that should not be a consideration. If you can add a legit top 2 center you do it 

IMO unless it's a true stud D being added they shouldnt focus on D.. they have added good NHL ready D..likely to add more and they take 2-3 years to even be NHL ready in most cases 

 

Ya I mean, we probably have 2 or 3 more chances over the next 2 to 4 years to pick top 10 again.  We need everything.  If we decide to take Catton this time around, then we should take a D next year.

[phoenix66]

24 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Ya I mean, we probably have 2 or 3 more chances over the next 2 to 4 years to pick top 10 again.  We need everything.  If we decide to take Catton this time around, then we should take a D next year.

Even then ..unless we're talking major stud.. I'd key more on the talent that's hard to acquire another ways...top 6 fwds especially centers .

Now if there's a major drop in talent between the dman and the forward then sure ..

 

We acquired Hamilton in trade.. Hanifin too.. Gio wasn't even drafted .... You can always get those.. 2 teams in the finals and only one drafted dman worthy of being called a stud..and he went first overall ..

I'd say it's easier and more likely to whiff on drafting a dman..real risky .. some of the best came from later in drafts..too much developing to be sure of what you are really getting

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, phoenix66 said:

Even then ..unless we're talking major stud.. I'd key more on the talent that's hard to acquire another ways...top 6 fwds especially centers .

Now if there's a major drop in talent between the dman and the forward then sure ..

 

We acquired Hamilton in trade.. Hanifin too.. Gio wasn't even drafted .... You can always get those.. 2 teams in the finals and only one drafted dman worthy of being called a stud..and he went first overall ..

I'd say it's easier and more likely to whiff on drafting a dman..real risky .. some of the best came from later in drafts..too much developing to be sure of what you are really getting

Ya, but if you can get them with one pick instead of a 1st and two 2nds, which would be better long term? I get it's never guaranteed but if you are drafting as a good team, you don't wanna trade picks because they're more than a decent chance of hitting again. Some have said the Flames have been drafting well/ 

 

we drafted Andersson and developed him, Kylington. Kulak might win a cup tomorrow, whom we also drafted. 
 

i kind of think we drafted poorly other than that though, but it might be due to reaching on guys like Whynot, or others. Sorry Whynot... but you're the one that came to mind, there are a few more...

[phoenix66]

4 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

Ya, but if you can get them with one pick instead of a 1st and two 2nds, which would be better long term? I get it's never guaranteed but if you are drafting as a good team, you don't wanna trade picks because they're more than a decent chance of hitting again. Some have said the Flames have been drafting well/ 

 

we drafted Andersson and developed him, Kylington. Kulak might win a cup tomorrow, whom we also drafted. 
 

i kind of think we drafted poorly other than that though, but it might be due to reaching on guys like Whynot, or others. Sorry Whynot... but you're the one that came to mind, there are a few more...

All later picks ..that's my point ..

In top 10, IMO unless you're nabbing a Cake Makar.. go with the best shots at game breakers / centers preferably 

[Thebrewcrew]

41 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

i kind of think we drafted poorly other than that though, but it might be due to reaching on guys like Whynot, or others. Sorry Whynot... but you're the one that came to mind, there are a few more...

The Flames had really good drafts in 20215 and 2016. It's been a mixed bag since then. They say two players in a draft is a success.

2017- Valimaki and Ruzicka made it. Not impactful for Calgary.

2018- They didn't pick until #105. They got Pospisil. 1 NHLer in this case is pretty good.

2019- Has a chance to be good. Pelletier and Wolf.

2020- Also a chance for a good draft. Zary is a regular. Poirier/Solovyov/Kerins/Kuznetsov have a chance. This was the first draft in a while the Flames had picks

2021- This draft comes down to Coronato, Stromgren and potentially Sergeev. Lots of misses, that didn't get contracts. Covid was a real factor here.

2022- They used one of their three picks on a criminal.

2023- too early to tell. Honzek and Morin were the top two picks, they didn't take as big as step as you'd hope. Still time with this class though.

 

I think Flames are probably a middle of the pack team, in terms of drafting. They've traded away a lot of picks in the past five years though.

 

I'll say this though, the 2024 draft is critical. With 8 selections in the top 110, the Flames have to find players. Most teams shoot for two in a draft. With eight picks in the first four rounds, I think the Flames need to find three players. If they want to shorten the rebuild.

[robrob74]

2 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

All later picks ..that's my point ..

In top 10, IMO unless you're nabbing a Cake Makar.. go with the best shots at game breakers / centers preferably 

I guess I worry about spending more than a first rounder for a D as it was the cost of Hamilton and Hamonic. Hamilton turned into Hanifin and Lindholm... but there was more to that deal, but still cost the Flames a lot in two first rounders and a bunch of second rounders.

 

so for me, we can get a very good D from one of the first rounders, it is more we need to. 
 

I don't want to spend a huge price to buy one. 
 

Hamonic was a bust, Hamilton was good. We got two Top4D in the second round in Andersson and Kylington. Kulak has been decent as depth. Did we draft any other D that is playing elsewhere? 
 

 I would rather UFA or draft one. If we can gain a D as a hockey trade, sometimes they pan out.