2023 Offseason

[cross16]

16 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

Except Weegar is a much better player than OEL is and was at the time of trade to the Canucks. 

 

I think Weegar is going to have a massive year next year under Huska.

he is a big name but I don’t think many realize that OEL really isn’t a very good dman. He was strong early in his career but he faded. The contract he got was awful and the trade even worse. 
 

doesn’t compare to Weegar at all imo. I think Weegar’s deal is going to be a bargain 

[sagacity7]

19 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Bruv come on.  You know how this works.

 

We going to trade Hanifin for a 30/31 year old with 4+ years left.  We want to win right away right?

Are you suggesting Taylor Hall is coming back as part of a deal?

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, sagacity7 said:

Are you suggesting Taylor Hall is coming back as part of a deal?

 

I'm saying Noah Hanifin is born and raised in Boston and Taylor Hall is from Calgary.  I'm just sayin

[travel_dude]

8 hours ago, cross16 said:

he is a big name but I don’t think many realize that OEL really isn’t a very good dman. He was strong early in his career but he faded. The contract he got was awful and the trade even worse. 
 

doesn’t compare to Weegar at all imo. I think Weegar’s deal is going to be a bargain 

 

I think Weegar hit his stride at the WC.  Showed what he is actually capable of.

I know, different competition, but he was so poorly coached here it wasn't funny.

My concern about Huska is that he leans back on Sutter type choices.

Seeing he was respnsible fo the D.

 

But anyway, I do think Weegar is likely to be our best D-man next season.

He's different than Ras and Hanifin.

 

Not that it makes us any better, but trading Hanifin probably means Weegar plays top minutes.

And that we use Hanifin to get a top 6 player (my hope).

It's a risk, relying on Kylington, but you manage the minutes and it shouldn't be a big issue.

Bring in a 3rd pair guy that could play 2nd pairing if needed.

[Thebrewcrew]

5 hours ago, The_People1 said:

Taylor Hall is from Calgary.  I'm just sayin

Considering Hall as a Calgarian is like viewing Dube as being from BC. It's true only on the birth certificate.

[The_People1]

13 hours ago, cross16 said:

he is a big name but I don’t think many realize that OEL really isn’t a very good dman. He was strong early in his career but he faded. The contract he got was awful and the trade even worse. 
 

doesn’t compare to Weegar at all imo. I think Weegar’s deal is going to be a bargain 

 

In 4 years (definitely by 6)... We are going to be buying out as many as 3 players.  Huberdeau, Kadri, and Weegar.  Not saying we are at that point right now.

[The_People1]

5 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Considering Hall as a Calgarian is like viewing Dube as being from BC. It's true only on the birth certificate.

 

I know.   Makes no sense but still.  Hanifin has been linked to BOS since Hanifin entered the NHL.

[sagacity7]

10 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

I'm saying Noah Hanifin is born and raised in Boston and Taylor Hall is from Calgary.  I'm just sayin

Technically yes. I believe there is a deal that could work here. Boston has been after Hanifin since he was drafted and may be willing to cough up assets to fit under the cap.

 

Boston may have trouble signing Trent Fredric so I could see a hockey deal here.
 

Hanifin for Fredric and Carlo?

 

Hanifin and Mangiapane for Hall, Fredric, and Carlo?

 

How about Debrusk for Hanifin?

[sagacity7]

What is the actual trade value of our pending UFA’s in a year from now?

 

Lindholm, Backlund, Toffoli, Tanev, Hanifin, Zadorov and Kylington.

[conundrumed]

4 hours ago, sagacity7 said:

What is the actual trade value of our pending UFA’s in a year from now?

 

Lindholm, Backlund, Toffoli, Tanev, Hanifin, Zadorov and Kylington.

Detroit sent a 3rd rder to St. Louis for negotiating rights for Husso last season as an example. Husso was excellent for the most part and kept the Wings relevant. By Coach Lalonde's own admission, he had to rely on Husso way too much and overplayed him. Nedeljkovic played poorly and wound up in the A. Detroit is in the market for a 1B.

But Husso proved he can take a substantial workload which was good to find out after being a backup in St Loo. They'll be looking at every possibility, including Vladar I would think.

Edvinsson underwent preventative shoulder surgery a month ago so perhaps they would consider renting Hanifin and move him at the tdl. But Albert Johansson is the more likely option while Wallinder seasons in the A. Wallinder was just named Euro Hockey's U22 MVP, following in the footsteps of Seider and Elmer Soderblom to make it 3 straight years for the Wings. All 3 won as 20yos.

So Hanifin isn't exactly a necessity.

Just for fun:

Detroit: Hanifin, Vladar

Calgary: Lesser of the 2 2024 1st rd picks(conditional), a 2023 2nd(they have 3) Veleno/Zadina, Sebrango.

Detroit could recoup at tdl if they chose to.

Before the harping about Zadina starts, he had virtually zero luck finishing to the point of completely bizarre for how often he creates chances.

 

[sagacity7]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Detroit sent a 3rd rder to St. Louis for negotiating rights for Husso last season as an example. Husso was excellent for the most part and kept the Wings relevant. By Coach Lalonde's own admission, he had to rely on Husso way too much and overplayed him. Nedeljkovic played poorly and wound up in the A. Detroit is in the market for a 1B.

But Husso proved he can take a substantial workload which was good to find out after being a backup in St Loo. They'll be looking at every possibility, including Vladar I would think.

Edvinsson underwent preventative shoulder surgery a month ago so perhaps they would consider renting Hanifin and move him at the tdl. But Albert Johansson is the more likely option while Wallinder seasons in the A. Wallinder was just named Euro Hockey's U22 MVP, following in the footsteps of Seider and Elmer Soderblom to make it 3 straight years for the Wings. All 3 won as 20yos.

So Hanifin isn't exactly a necessity.

Just for fun:

Detroit: Hanifin, Vladar

Calgary: Lesser of the 2 2024 1st rd picks(conditional), a 2023 2nd(they have 3) Veleno/Zadina, Sebrango.

Detroit could recoup at tdl if they chose to.

Before the harping about Zadina starts, he had virtually zero luck finishing to the point of completely bizarre for how often he creates chances.

 

Ok. So from what you’re saying Hanifin could fetch a first and 2 seconds with help from adding Vladar and also getting the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th round pick.

 

Lindholm would get more or less the same I suppose. Perhaps a bit better.

 

Backlund and Toffoli potentially could each get a first either now or at TDL if we aren’t competitive enough to make the playoffs. Could they get more for a whole season?

 

Tanev and Zadorov could fetch a 2nd or a late first at TDL.

 

Kylington is a wild card as he was out last year.

 

Due to age and potential value I believe you keep Lindholm, Zadorov.

 

Toffoli, Backlund and Hanifin are each going to fetch good returns and we have 2 older players who had pretty much career years and 1 who doesn’t want to play here.

 

Tanev will play most likely 60 games because he’s broken sometimes and Kylington you don’t know.

 

To me it seems you would maximize the return for Backlund, Toffoli, Hanifin and Tanev for 2 players who had career years, 1 who doesn’t want to be here and one who you will only get 3/4 of his value. This could potentially get 3 firsts, 3 seconds, and maybe 1 or 2 lesser roster players or prospects.

 

Why not move those players and try to package some of those picks to move up in the draft or get a top 6 forward and steady d man. It may be gutting part of the team but asset management is key here. You can sign some other UFA’s to replace as well and save lots of cap space. As good as these guys are they are replaceable and hanging on to them may not be the wisest thing long term. Just some random thoughts.

[travel_dude]

42 minutes ago, sagacity7 said:

Ok. So from what you’re saying Hanifin could fetch a first and 2 seconds with help from adding Vladar and also getting the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th round pick.

 

Lindholm would get more or less the same I suppose. Perhaps a bit better.

 

Backlund and Toffoli potentially could each get a first either now or at TDL if we aren’t competitive enough to make the playoffs. Could they get more for a whole season?

 

Tanev and Zadorov could fetch a 2nd or a late first at TDL.

 

Kylington is a wild card as he was out last year.

 

Due to age and potential value I believe you keep Lindholm, Zadorov.

 

Toffoli, Backlund and Hanifin are each going to fetch good returns and we have 2 older players who had pretty much career years and 1 who doesn’t want to play here.

 

Tanev will play most likely 60 games because he’s broken sometimes and Kylington you don’t know.

 

To me it seems you would maximize the return for Backlund, Toffoli, Hanifin and Tanev for 2 players who had career years, 1 who doesn’t want to be here and one who you will only get 3/4 of his value. This could potentially get 3 firsts, 3 seconds, and maybe 1 or 2 lesser roster players or prospects.

 

Why not move those players and try to package some of those picks to move up in the draft or get a top 6 forward and steady d man. It may be gutting part of the team but asset management is key here. You can sign some other UFA’s to replace as well and save lots of cap space. As good as these guys are they are replaceable and hanging on to them may not be the wisest thing long term. Just some random thoughts.

 

So you are saying rebuild.  That's fine, but never happening.

I would think we make some actual hockey trades, and the ones that return a pick so be it.

Toffoli - seems to age like a fine wine, so I would re-sign him

Tanev - warning signals, but we don't have a replacement; trade at TDL is we are a bubble team

Hanifin - well, this should be a hockey trade to get a winger or a top pick and prospect.  It's going to be 2024 draft pick, so keep that in mind.  Can't be lotto protected.  The bonus is really cap space.

Backlund - this has to be a trade unless we sign for 2 years.  We can't sign long term.  And he performs a function we need to be replacing.

Zadorov - pretty neutral on trading him.  He's not a great defender so it depends what the rest of the D looks like.

Vladar/Markstrom - pretty much have to make a choice and go all in.  As much as it makes sense to run 3 goalies by rotation to the AHL, this just delays the inevitable.  We would end up trading a guy with little value.  There are capable backups available every year, so if you can't run the remaining goalies for 82 games, then get a backup.

[sagacity7]

4 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

So you are saying rebuild.  That's fine, but never happening.

I would think we make some actual hockey trades, and the ones that return a pick so be it.

Toffoli - seems to age like a fine wine, so I would re-sign him

Tanev - warning signals, but we don't have a replacement; trade at TDL is we are a bubble team

Hanifin - well, this should be a hockey trade to get a winger or a top pick and prospect.  It's going to be 2024 draft pick, so keep that in mind.  Can't be lotto protected.  The bonus is really cap space.

Backlund - this has to be a trade unless we sign for 2 years.  We can't sign long term.  And he performs a function we need to be replacing.

Zadorov - pretty neutral on trading him.  He's not a great defender so it depends what the rest of the D looks like.

Vladar/Markstrom - pretty much have to make a choice and go all in.  As much as it makes sense to run 3 goalies by rotation to the AHL, this just delays the inevitable.  We would end up trading a guy with little value.  There are capable backups available every year, so if you can't run the remaining goalies for 82 games, then get a backup.

Doesn’t have to be a full rebuild. You can move some players for key draft picks in a deep draft and sign some UFA’s to replace them for 2 or 3 years until the draftees are ready. As an example, you said you can make a hockey trade for guys like Konecny or similar who’ve got 2 years left on their current deal or even get some players, like a C, who can’t move up the ladder because there is no room for them on their current rosters. Full rebuild isn’t going to happen with this ownership, but you could get some good prospects in a deep draft for good asset management. That’s all I’m saying. It’s actually upgrading your team long term and staying the same or better short term. I doubt Toffoli or Backlund improve over last year.

[cross16]

Not really a surprise. Tone since the end of the season was he wasn't likely coming back

 

 

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

Not really a surprise. Tone since the end of the season was he wasn't likely coming back

 

 

 

Lucic will find work somewhere.  At $1.5-mil, he would be a good add for several teams.  He's always wanted to play in Vancouver so maybe this is where he is headed.

[robrob74]

2 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Lucic will find work somewhere.  At $1.5-mil, he would be a good add for several teams.  He's always wanted to play in Vancouver so maybe this is where he is headed.

 

My bet is he wants to play for a cup. He'd probably get on as a deterrent in the ilk of a Reeves for a contender on a cheap deal. He might even get to 1.5m 

[travel_dude]

39 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Lucic will find work somewhere.  At $1.5-mil, he would be a good add for several teams.  He's always wanted to play in Vancouver so maybe this is where he is headed.

 

36 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

My bet is he wants to play for a cup. He'd probably get on as a deterrent in the ilk of a Reeves for a contender on a cheap deal. He might even get to 1.5m 

 

My bet is any team that is making a cup run sits his butt on the bench or eating popcorn for 99% of the games.  Most 4th lines make mincemeat out of his play.  SO, with that, VAN makes sense because they can use the (tanking) help.  I'm not being mean here, just saying that the Lucic from 2 years ago was a lot more than the Lucic from last season.  And that was with the cherleader coach playing him more last season.

[jjgallow]

5 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

My bet is any team that is making a cup run sits his butt on the bench or eating popcorn for 99% of the games.  Most 4th lines make mincemeat out of his play.  SO, with that, VAN makes sense because they can use the (tanking) help.  I'm not being mean here, just saying that the Lucic from 2 years ago was a lot more than the Lucic from last season.  And that was with the cherleader coach playing him more last season.

 

Yup he's off to Van, agree.

[sak22]

20 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

My bet is any team that is making a cup run sits his butt on the bench or eating popcorn for 99% of the games.  Most 4th lines make mincemeat out of his play.  SO, with that, VAN makes sense because they can use the (tanking) help.  I'm not being mean here, just saying that the Lucic from 2 years ago was a lot more than the Lucic from last season.  And that was with the cherleader coach playing him more last season.

I think there are plenty of 4th liners who were as good or worse than Lucic last year, some on good teams too.  Two things played into a little bias, we wanted younger players and his contract was terrible.  If he made Trevor Lewis money and the team had no prospects excelling on the farm I think the hate would've been much lesser.

[travel_dude]

1 minute ago, sak22 said:

I think there are plenty of 4th liners who were as good or worse than Lucic last year, some on good teams too.  Two things played into a little bias, we wanted younger players and his contract was terrible.  If he made Trevor Lewis money and the team had no prospects excelling on the farm I think the hate would've been much lesser.

 

I'm sorry, but I felt that Lucic was the worst player on the team almost every single game he played last year.  Did he make some good plays?  Sure.  At $1M I would have callled out his play.  His salary wasn't my issue other than forcing us to trade a 1st to get rid of Monahan.  The NMC caused more problems.  Again, this just comes down to gifting a player a spot for 82 games.  

[sak22]

32 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I'm sorry, but I felt that Lucic was the worst player on the team almost every single game he played last year.  Did he make some good plays?  Sure.  At $1M I would have callled out his play.  His salary wasn't my issue other than forcing us to trade a 1st to get rid of Monahan.  The NMC caused more problems.  Again, this just comes down to gifting a player a spot for 82 games.  

A) Not his fault, 

b) He didn't play 82 games.

 

I mean the GDT's for the past 4 years I'd think the only bad players we had on the team based on your posts are Lucic and Giordano.  I see plenty of players make mistakes, I don't see the same vitriol towards them as I did Lucic.  Lucic didn't play PP and that was a weakness on the team, he didn't play OT and that was a weakness on the team, he didn't play goal and that was a weakness on the team, but god almighty without him we probably win the cup.

[zima]

15 minutes ago, sak22 said:

A) Not his fault, 

b) He didn't play 82 games.

 

I mean the GDT's for the past 4 years I'd think the only bad players we had on the team based on your posts are Lucic and Giordano.  I see plenty of players make mistakes, I don't see the same vitriol towards them as I did Lucic.  Lucic didn't play PP and that was a weakness on the team, he didn't play OT and that was a weakness on the team, he didn't play goal and that was a weakness on the team, but god almighty without him we probably win the cup.

Man thats what I call sarcasim nice 

[conundrumed]

7 hours ago, sagacity7 said:

Ok. So from what you’re saying Hanifin could fetch a first and 2 seconds with help from adding Vladar and also getting the equivalent of a 3rd or 4th round pick.

 

Lindholm would get more or less the same I suppose. Perhaps a bit better.

 

Backlund and Toffoli potentially could each get a first either now or at TDL if we aren’t competitive enough to make the playoffs. Could they get more for a whole season?

 

Tanev and Zadorov could fetch a 2nd or a late first at TDL.

 

Kylington is a wild card as he was out last year.

 

Due to age and potential value I believe you keep Lindholm, Zadorov.

 

Toffoli, Backlund and Hanifin are each going to fetch good returns and we have 2 older players who had pretty much career years and 1 who doesn’t want to play here.

 

Tanev will play most likely 60 games because he’s broken sometimes and Kylington you don’t know.

 

To me it seems you would maximize the return for Backlund, Toffoli, Hanifin and Tanev for 2 players who had career years, 1 who doesn’t want to be here and one who you will only get 3/4 of his value. This could potentially get 3 firsts, 3 seconds, and maybe 1 or 2 lesser roster players or prospects.

 

Why not move those players and try to package some of those picks to move up in the draft or get a top 6 forward and steady d man. It may be gutting part of the team but asset management is key here. You can sign some other UFA’s to replace as well and save lots of cap space. As good as these guys are they are replaceable and hanging on to them may not be the wisest thing long term. Just some random thoughts.

Wow you quoted my post and went on a runaway.lol

[The_People1]

Interesting MTL and Monahan together for one more year.  $1.985-mil.  Would've thought he might go to CBJ to re-unite with Gaudreau.

 

 

[travel_dude]

13 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

Interesting MTL and Monahan together for one more year.  $1.985-mil.  Would've thought he might go to CBJ to re-unite with Gaudreau.

 

 

 

I think he was happier being close to his family and not having to play in the hole of Ohio.