2022 Offseason

[jjgallow]

So....the elusive Centers....

 

 

True story:    If you compare McDavid to Bedard (2023 draft)....Bedard is vastly better.

                               Now, Bedard lacks height, so that doesn't mean he'll be better in the NHL.

                               But what is clear, is that he's most likely generational.

 

I am excited because BT is going to screw this up and we could get a top 10 pick next year.

 

Even if we don't win Bedard by lotto, anything in the top 10 is a high end Center who could be ready somewhere between immediately and two years.   So all this talk of Centers....    the answer to that is the 2023 draft.
 

The only downside of that is we missed the best drafts for defensemen...which were the last two.

[JTech780]

Take this with a massive grain of salt, but…

[The_People1]

9 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

Take this with a massive grain of salt, but…

 

Probably fake.

 

But let's play along.  He has a 10 team trade list.  What is Backlund worth?  Probably nothing to a rebuilding team but a lot to a contending team looking for a 3rd line shutdown Center and PK specialist.

 

Not a lot of contenders have the cap space though...

[travel_dude]

11 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

Take this with a massive grain of salt, but…

 

Well, the guy isn't exactly tweeting stuff for the sake of spreading false rumors.  He tweets a lot of factual stuff by verified accounts.  He has 1000 fllowers, for what it's worth.

 

Anyway, sometimes Backlund gets no love in the fan world.  He might feel like all he does is get to defend.  Been there done that. 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, The_Snowbear said:

peeps Calgary has ton of cap space like 26m at the moment

 

Not really.  They have 18M with only 8 signed F.  And 8 signed D.  

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, The_Snowbear said:

peeps Calgary has ton of cap space like 26m at the moment

 

My point was, all of the space was unplanned for.  So that's why not many signings right now.

[LouCifer]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

So....the elusive Centers....

 

 

True story:    If you compare McDavid to Bedard (2023 draft)....Bedard is vastly better.

                               Now, Bedard lacks height, so that doesn't mean he'll be better in the NHL.

                               But what is clear, is that he's most likely generational.

 

I am excited because BT is going to screw this up and we could get a top 10 pick next year.

 

Even if we don't win Bedard by lotto, anything in the top 10 is a high end Center who could be ready somewhere between immediately and two years.   So all this talk of Centers....    the answer to that is the 2023 draft.
 

The only downside of that is we missed the best drafts for defensemen...which were the last two.

In addition to the above, here’s my hot take:
- Trade Chucky for picks/prospects/futures. Especially 2023 draft. 

- Keep broken Monahan for his final year, flip him at the TDL for something

- Keep Looch for his final year, flip him at the deadline to a team looking to beef up

- Keep Kylington: another year under Sutter will be good for him and prep him for the season after

- Sign Mange, play him on line 1 or 2 and let him grow 

- Bring up Ruzie and Pelletier. Let them use this season to get acclimated to the NHL. 
- Give Vladar more starts. Let’s see what we have in this guy. If he projects to be as good as Markstrom, keep him. If not, flip him at the TDL. 

 

[The_People1]

6 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Anyway, sometimes Backlund gets no love in the fan world.  He might feel like all he does is get to defend.  Been there done that. 

 

Sutter called him out publicly for getting lots of ice time and not putting up the numbers.  Maybe he doesn't want to play for Sutter?

[The_Tribal Chief]

i wont beileve he requested that untill someone i trust says he requested the trade

[travel_dude]

5 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Probably fake.

 

But let's play along.  He has a 10 team trade list.  What is Backlund worth?  Probably nothing to a rebuilding team but a lot to a contending team looking for a 3rd line shutdown Center and PK specialist.

 

Not a lot of contenders have the cap space though...

 

If he wanted out, he's not going to block many places.  If he wants out.

CBJ has a lot of nothing.

 

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Sutter called him out publicly for getting lots of ice time and not putting up the numbers.  Maybe he doesn't want to play for Sutter?

 

He called out every player at some point.  He also praised Backlund in the playoffs IIRC, saying the guy does the ehavy listing nobody else can do.  

[travel_dude]

4 minutes ago, The_Snowbear said:

i wont beileve he requested that untill someone i trust says he requested the trade

 

I would prefer that nobody trusted reports it.  If he wants out, keep it quiet and let BT find a deal.  Once teams know you want out, they offer a boat anchor and some pucks.

[The_Tribal Chief]

if Backs requested a trade it wouldnt be tweeted by a nobody like m eliotte freedmen or frank seravelli or pat steinberg or eric francis would be reporting this sorry to doubt that tweet but the above are alot better with knowledge of the flames

[The_People1]

28 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I would prefer that nobody trusted reports it.  If he wants out, keep it quiet and let BT find a deal.  Once teams know you want out, they offer a boat anchor and some pucks.

 

Ya Dubios to MTL for a 2nd round pick if the Jets are lucky.

[LouCifer]

I think we should Re-up stone on D sooner than later. The guy was the odd man out all last season, has always been a good soldier, and comes into the playoffs last year and plays above his pay grade. He also has a bomb from the point that’s so lacking on our PP. I’d throw him out there on PP2 so that if PP1 doesn’t get it done, he starts letting it fly. Bring back Stone. Now. 

[Thebrewcrew]

I seriously doubt Backlund has requested a trade.

 

I said it last year, when many wanted him traded, I think he's the next captain of the Flames.

 

Although again, I think the captaincy is a great carrot to dangle in a Tkachuk negotiation.

[Thebrewcrew]

If Tkachuk won't sign, In think ownership is smart enough to realize that a tear-down is the best way to go about things. If they're self-aware they'll realize that the fan base is in support of it. 

 

The Flames have a good roster with attractive trade pieces. They're not starting with nothing. Tkachuk/Kylington/Mangiapane this year. Tanev/Backlund/Toffoli/Hanifin next year. There are pieces here that can get you assets. Given the players the Flames currently have, I don't see this being an extended rebuild.

[robrob74]

I dunno if it’s due to being called out. He’s depended on a lot. But maybe concentrating on d all the time. Maybe there is a part of his game he misses that never gets to play? Sees Johnny get his money and then Tkachuk, and what if he got to concentrate more on offensive play than D?

[jjgallow]

2 hours ago, LouCifer said:

In addition to the above, here’s my hot take:
- Trade Chucky for picks/prospects/futures. Especially 2023 draft. 

- Keep broken Monahan for his final year, flip him at the TDL for something

- Keep Looch for his final year, flip him at the deadline to a team looking to beef up

- Keep Kylington: another year under Sutter will be good for him and prep him for the season after

- Sign Mange, play him on line 1 or 2 and let him grow 

- Bring up Ruzie and Pelletier. Let them use this season to get acclimated to the NHL. 
- Give Vladar more starts. Let’s see what we have in this guy. If he projects to be as good as Markstrom, keep him. If not, flip him at the TDL. 

 

 

I'm pretty much for this yes.    It's funny, we go to great lengths about hobbling through versus burning it down after Gaudreau.

 

From 1000 feet up the biggest difference is just what we do with Tkachuk.  IMHO, we should do what we should have done with Gaudreau, yes.

[conundrumed]

I know that I was confident JG would sign here and it didn't work out.

In the same measure, I think the same with Tkachuk, I want him to sign here. Again, as with JG, it makes the most sense to me. I can understand if he wants to wait and feel out the vibe of the team. The reason I see him staying is, as much as he got carried away with the whole, "it's a family business" thing, it has to be a point of pride.

His opportunity right now, imo, is to have his own team that will hang a C on him and pay him more than Brady. He is better than Brady.

Where else could he sign where he'd have the opportunity to say, "this is MY team"? Rather than be told to, "tone it down" as the rumours go after the Muzzin thing, he'll tell teammates the opposite. It's his now.

I "get" the Tkachuk family thing. Are they kind of arrogant and squeezing the dollars? Sure they are. You have to be that way if you're a leader. But those things contrast each other, in the sense that they WANT to be Captains and leaders.

It is literally served to him on a platter to stay here. They don't wanna be 2nd, 3rd fiddles.

Matt's easy to hate sometimes, but you can't deny that he's a fierce competitor and deserves a leader role.

In closing, lol, if you've ever talked with the old school guys, they feel like they got screwed by owners for so long that their advice now is zero remorse in promoting the players of today to squeeze every last penny out of owners.

Keith undoubtedly is of this mindset. They all are.

I'd lock him in at $9.5 x 8 personally. Give him the C. If we lose him too, attracting good NHLers to Calgary will take a massive hit.

Need to ensure JG was an anomaly. Once is a mistake, twice is a trend. No team needs that. It would be a horrible look.

 

[jjgallow]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I know that I was confident JG would sign here and it didn't work out.

In the same measure, I think the same with Tkachuk, I want him to sign here. Again, as with JG, it makes the most sense to me. I can understand if he wants to wait and feel out the vibe of the team. The reason I see him staying is, as much as he got carried away with the whole, "it's a family business" thing, it has to be a point of pride.

His opportunity right now, imo, is to have his own team that will hang a C on him and pay him more than Brady. He is better than Brady.

Where else could he sign where he'd have the opportunity to say, "this is MY team"? Rather than be told to, "tone it down" as the rumours go after the Muzzin thing, he'll tell teammates the opposite. It's his now.

I "get" the Tkachuk family thing. Are they kind of arrogant and squeezing the dollars? Sure they are. You have to be that way if you're a leader. But those things contrast each other, in the sense that they WANT to be Captains and leaders.

It is literally served to him on a platter to stay here. They don't wanna be 2nd, 3rd fiddles.

Matt's easy to hate sometimes, but you can't deny that he's a fierce competitor and deserves a leader role.

In closing, lol, if you've ever talked with the old school guys, they feel like they got screwed by owners for so long that their advice now is zero remorse in promoting the players of today to squeeze every last penny out of owners.

Keith undoubtedly is of this mindset. They all are.

I'd lock him in at $9.5 x 8 personally. Give him the C. If we lose him too, attracting good NHLers to Calgary will take a massive hit.

Need to ensure JG was an anomaly. Once is a mistake, twice is a trend. No team needs that. It would be a horrible look.

 

 

Well, Tkachuk pretty much stated how his contract negotiations were going to go.  Then he got heat for it, and he clarified saying he would "absolutely consider" an extension with Calgary.  lol.

 

IMHO the chances of losing him are in the 50% area.   But what could be even more devastating is keeping him and building your team around that.

 

Anyway I do get it, it's not easy at all to sell assets like this.   I get that and I never said BT had an easy job.    But, it really is his job to manage that risk.

[phoenix66]

2 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

Well, Tkachuk pretty much stated how his contract negotiations were going to go.  Then he got heat for it, and he clarified saying he would "absolutely consider" an extension with Calgary.  lol.

 

IMHO the chances of losing him are in the 50% area.   But what could be even more devastating is keeping him and building your team around that.

 

Anyway I do get it, it's not easy at all to sell assets like this.   I get that and I never said BT had an easy job.    But, it really is his job to manage that risk.

I remember that comment, but then Brady did a long-term.. I do believe he wants to re-up here but at the same time his last contract was set up purposely to give him leverage .. I have no doubt the flames will offer something fair.  Just like they did with Johnny...

 

BT has made mistakes .every GM has.. but one thing I've noticed from him is he doesn't get boxed into the same corner twice .. Bouma burned us in arbitration, no flame has ever made it to arbitration ever again..to the point where he just doesn't qualify them .. 

I do truly believe that johnny made his decision last minute .. I dont think we got played .. but that doesn't change the fact we lost him for nothing .. for that reason I don't see a scenario where Tkachuk is allowed to step back on the ice in a Flames jersey on a one year deal.  Even if he does sign the deal , his value is still high. He has no trade protection but I don't see BT making that mistake again regardless of how well intentioned either side is . Ironically if Johnny screwed anybody it was Chucky .

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

 

Well, Tkachuk pretty much stated how his contract negotiations were going to go.  Then he got heat for it, and he clarified saying he would "absolutely consider" an extension with Calgary.  lol.

 

IMHO the chances of losing him are in the 50% area.   But what could be even more devastating is keeping him and building your team around that.

 

Anyway I do get it, it's not easy at all to sell assets like this.   I get that and I never said BT had an easy job.    But, it really is his job to manage that risk.

 

The problem is you only see one thing now and that's a rebuild.  Whether you truly believe Tkachuk will walk or not, you are being consumed with the idea of tearing it down.  So, every thing is the same.  Fire the GM to rebuild.  Trade a player for a wealth of picks to rebuild.  Targeted tank to rebuild.

 

I get it.  It's an opinion.  You can only see one path.  Nothing else will bring the cup.  

[jjgallow]

18 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

The problem is you only see one thing now and that's a rebuild.  Whether you truly believe Tkachuk will walk or not, you are being consumed with the idea of tearing it down.  So, every thing is the same.  Fire the GM to rebuild.  Trade a player for a wealth of picks to rebuild.  Targeted tank to rebuild.

 

I get it.  It's an opinion.  You can only see one path.  Nothing else will bring the cup.  

 

I'm not the problem, I don't even work for the Flames.    This is just a chat forum.

 

But just so we're clear, it's you that can only view me one way, not me that can only see one path.   I go against your narrative so it's only natural to view me in the worst way possible.   

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-social-media-makes-us-more-polarized-and-how-to-fix-it/

 

It's well studied.  Just know that if you think you have me figured out, 

 

It's you  😅

 

 

For your notes:   I don't actually believe in rebuilds.  It's not my plan A and never was. 

 

I'd explain that, but I've already explained it in here for about 12+ years or whatever it's been.   Just know that.  You can't actually read what I'm writing if you're on the defensive before reading it.

[JTech780]

3pm is the deadline for players to elect arbitration. I would expect Kylington and Phillips and probably Mangiapane to elect arbitration. I think Tkachuk passes, I think he wants the ability to accept his QO and to accept offer sheets. There really isn’t a whole lot of benefit for him to go to arbitration.