Ryan Francis - 5th rounder 2020

[cross16]

This is why I'm thinking Francis is going to go back to junior at some point. In a season where they will be going to the Memorial Cup I don't think they would leave an over age spot open unless they have some level of assurance or belief Francis would come back. 

 

 

[travel_dude]

7 minutes ago, cross16 said:

This is why I'm thinking Francis is going to go back to junior at some point. In a season where they will be going to the Memorial Cup I don't think they would leave an over age spot open unless they have some level of assurance or belief Francis would come back. 

 

 

 

Although it's important for them to evaluate Francis, I would prefer he is playing a higher level role on a team, not a 3rd line or lower.

He's had 2 shots in 4 games, so it might be time to pull the ripcord soon.

[cross16]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

Although it's important for them to evaluate Francis, I would prefer he is playing a higher level role on a team, not a 3rd line or lower.

He's had 2 shots in 4 games, so it might be time to pull the ripcord soon.

 

I strongly suspect that this is tied to Zary's injury. 

[travel_dude]

21 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

I strongly suspect that this is tied to Zary's injury. 

 

He had a good start to camp, then kinda disappeared.

He's not even signed to a NHL contract yet as a Flames prospect.

Not that it's a big deal, just a bit odd.

Maybe it's a contract limit number game, but it seems like there is only 46/50 right now.

 

I heard the connection to Zary, but really the Heat have enough players available.

[jjgallow]

I find all of this frustrating, but at the same time not.

 

If Francis is given another year in junior he will be able to focus on key skills in a first line leadership role.

 

I'm...ok with that...I really am.

 

As long as he doesn't get lost on a third line.

[conundrumed]

16 hours ago, cross16 said:

This is why I'm thinking Francis is going to go back to junior at some point. In a season where they will be going to the Memorial Cup I don't think they would leave an over age spot open unless they have some level of assurance or belief Francis would come back. 

 

 

Does a time limit come into play? I'm guessing no...

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Does a time limit come into play? I'm guessing no...

 

I had heard there was a 25 game limit thingy, so I'm guess sometime no later than Christmas.

I really hope they do something with him in Stockton soon, so he can tale the learnings back to SJ and get them to the Memorial Cup finals.

 

[cross16]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Does a time limit come into play? I'm guessing no...

 

As TD mentioned the try out agreement is for up to 25 Games.  he would need to sign another to extend his stay or sign his ELC. 

 

I'm not positive on the CHL rules but I don't believe there would be any issues there as Francis is already property of Saint John. Pretty sure the CHL is the same rule as the NHL where in order to play on the playoffs you have to be on the roster by the trade deadline. 

 

So no there really isn't a time limit here outside of the 25 games. 

[cross16]

16 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

He had a good start to camp, then kinda disappeared.

He's not even signed to a NHL contract yet as a Flames prospect.

Not that it's a big deal, just a bit odd.

Maybe it's a contract limit number game, but it seems like there is only 46/50 right now.

 

I heard the connection to Zary, but really the Heat have enough players available.

 

They do but the way I see it is that they have a unique opportunity to get him some experience. As I mentioned I think it's a bit of a unique case where Francis is likely too good for Junior but stuck on a good depth chart in the AHL, with a really good opportunity waiting for him in Junior. The injury to Zary actually gives him an opportunity he would not have had before and the Flames are using it to give him some experience. 

 

I could be wrong, just the way I see it. 

[travel_dude]

55 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

They do but the way I see it is that they have a unique opportunity to get him some experience. As I mentioned I think it's a bit of a unique case where Francis is likely too good for Junior but stuck on a good depth chart in the AHL, with a really good opportunity waiting for him in Junior. The injury to Zary actually gives him an opportunity he would not have had before and the Flames are using it to give him some experience. 

 

I could be wrong, just the way I see it. 

 

I am hoping they actually use him up and down the lineup, to see what he can bring in all situations.

 

[cross16]

Ryan Francis heading back to junior

 

 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

Ryan Francis heading back to junior

 

 

 

That's a somewhat good sign.  Perhaps they can do the same with Kuz, who really isn;t getting the minutes.

Maybe this also means that Zary is getting close.

Hope so, there hasn't been any news about it.

[cross16]

28 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

That's a somewhat good sign.  Perhaps they can do the same with Kuz, who really isn;t getting the minutes.

Maybe this also means that Zary is getting close.

Hope so, there hasn't been any news about it.

last I heard Saint John, who has Kuneztsov’s rights, doesn’t have an open import spot. So to send him back to junior there would have to be a trade 

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, cross16 said:

last I heard Saint John, who has Kuneztsov’s rights, doesn’t have an open import spot. So to send him back to junior there would have to be a trade 

 

I didn't think thye had to use an import spot on a NA player.

[Thebrewcrew]

There's no shame in playing an overage season. Development isn't linear. He's heading to a team in Saint John where he's going to be playing meaningful games. That's very important for a young guy.

[cross16]

12 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

I didn't think thye had to use an import spot on a NA player.

Kuznetsov is considered an import by the CHL. CHL import rules are based on residency and residency of parents. 

[jjgallow]

On 10/29/2021 at 9:04 PM, Thebrewcrew said:

There's no shame in playing an overage season. Development isn't linear. He's heading to a team in Saint John where he's going to be playing meaningful games. That's very important for a young guy.

 

I'm not about to agree with how they handled it, stuffing the lineup with 23-24 year olds who will probably play out the remainder of their prime somewhere inbetween AHL and NHL.   I feel Francis could have been more than effective in the AHL if given more of a chance.

 

But, whining aside, I am actually quite excited to see him in a leadership role with first line minutes and responsibilities, likely key roles in playoffs as well.

 

Some of the best players in the NHL took this path.    Giving him third lines minutes...in...any league, would have hurt him.

I don't think this move will hurt him in the slightest.   It might even set him up to be the kind of RW we really, really need.   And if he takes advantage of it, when he comes back next year he'll get a minimum of first line minutes in the AHL no matter how many 23 year olds they bring in.

 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

 

I'm not about to agree with how they handled it, stuffing the lineup with 23-24 year olds who will probably play out the remainder of their prime somewhere inbetween AHL and NHL.   I feel Francis could have been more than effective in the AHL if given more of a chance.

 

But, whining aside, I am actually quite excited to see him in a leadership role with first line minutes and responsibilities, likely key roles in playoffs as well.

 

Some of the best players in the NHL took this path.    Giving him third lines minutes...in...any league, would have hurt him.

I don't think this move will hurt him in the slightest.   It might even set him up to be the kind of RW we really, really need.   And if he takes advantage of it, when he comes back next year he'll get a minimum of first line minutes in the AHL no matter how many 23 year olds they bring in.

 

 

First off, he hasn't yet been inked to a ELC.

Secondly, you can have a team of just prospects and expect them to progress.

Guys like Froese show them what it takes.

 

Francis and Poirier are together for the rest of the year.

Already, Francis had 1g 1a in a game and Poirier had 2 apples.

Let them learn winning attitudes, much like Pelletier did in the Q.

 

[jjgallow]

13 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

First off, he hasn't yet been inked to a ELC.

 

Irrelevant

 

13 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

Secondly, you can have a team of just prospects and expect them to progress.

 

I agree but I don't think it's what you meant to write.     

(well I don't actually agree, but you can have veterans in support roles.  You don't need them taking up all the development minutes on the first two lines)

 

13 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

Guys like Froese show them what it takes.

 

Yeah nobody goes back to junior for mentorship.    On the experience side it can be the right fit.

 

13 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

Francis and Poirier are together for the rest of the year.

Already, Francis had 1g 1a in a game and Poirier had 2 apples.

Let them learn winning attitudes, much like Pelletier did in the Q.

 

let's say continue to develop winning attitudes.  otherwise I agree.     

 

I think it's wrong to suggest that Francis lacked anything a 19 year old should have.  the Flames threw a bunch of vets in front of him 3 years old is all this is.

[conundrumed]

In his first 4 games, Francis is up to 2g and 3a.

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

In his first 4 games, Francis is up to 2g and 3a.

 

I look forward to him playing in the Memorial Cup.  Got to see the end of a Sea Dogs game on the weekend, and he was having a rough game.  Would have been nice for him to get a shot at the WJC.

[conundrumed]

On 11/10/2021 at 4:28 PM, travel_dude said:

 

I look forward to him playing in the Memorial Cup.  Got to see the end of a Sea Dogs game on the weekend, and he was having a rough game.  Would have been nice for him to get a shot at the WJC.

For his 5th yr in jr, I would have expected him to demolish the league. Not so much. Both him and Zary have that 1 year cheat due to the dumb Sept 15 draft rule. All 3 are the same age. Easy to see Pelletier is the dominant one of the 3.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

For his 5th yr in jr, I would have expected him to demolish the league. Not so much. Both him and Zary have that 1 year cheat due to the dumb Sept 15 draft rule. All 3 are the same age. Easy to see Pelletier is the dominant one of the 3.

 

I agree that both RF and Zary have kinda not been what I expected to see so far.  I can give Zary some reasons for the slow start; brutal injury for a guy that uses his edges.  He has to pick it up soon.

 

I'm surprised at the flack Pelletier has received from some of our fans.  The kid does nothing other than win and produce wherever he goes.  Leading the Heat (Ruzicka's call up not withstanding), game winning goals, game tying goals.  Plays in all game situations. 

 

Could have posted this in the Pelletier thread, but it seems to not get a lot of use.  Excited to see Pelts get NHL games at some point where we need a game changing LW to play in the middle 6.    

[jjgallow]

3 hours ago, conundrumed said:

For his 5th yr in jr, I would have expected him to demolish the league. Not so much. Both him and Zary have that 1 year cheat due to the dumb Sept 15 draft rule. All 3 are the same age. Easy to see Pelletier is the dominant one of the 3.

 

I noticed that they moved Francis to Center, so he is going through a bit of a transition.

 

I also would have expected him to tear the league up and I am dissapointed but feel it's still early.   It could be the adjustment, he could have a hidden injury, or ...yeah.   he may have plateaued sigh.

 

You know he was phenomenal in the first one or two Flames prospect games, looking like he might be going for making the NHL.  Then took a sharp dropoff and ended up not sticking in the AHL.   It's not unlikely that he suffered some kind of injury, whether it's unreported concussion or whatever, in those two games.

 

I am a little surprised to see him at center.    Seems an unusual fit.    But we'll see how things go.   Very early days.

 

 

[travel_dude]

The problem with early camp games is that they are against non-NHL talent for the most part.

But Francis played just a single game where he did little.

He may have shown in the intra-team scrimmages, but didn't look great beyond that.

 

Pospicil, Duehr and Gawdin were the only ones to show anything great.