phoenix66 Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Ortio absolutely goes right back in the next game. Definitely not his best outing, but not great support either. Part of the reason we tend to "ruin" goalies in this organization is confidence. I dont think its coincidence that all 3 were awful in the 3 system, or that Ramo got hot when he knew he could make a mistake and he was still playing. Ive seen enough of Ortio to say he should be resigned, so lets see what he does with a run of his own and how he rebounds from a bad game 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymo Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Agreed, Ortio should definitely start. Over to you Bob.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 This is a time where I think Treliving would need to provide direction to Hartley. It's Hartley's job to win games. But with where we are in the standings there are other needs that have to be addressed. If the Flames have any interest in Ortio then he needs to play 9 more games to maintain his RFA status. Plus we need to see what he does over a sustained period of time. The funny thing is I don't think playing the young guys conflicts with the idea of winning. We weren't winning with the vets in 60+ games and Ortio has looked at least as good as Hiller has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 This is a time where I think Treliving would need to provide direction to Hartley. It's Hartley's job to win games. But with where we are in the standings there are other needs that have to be addressed. If the Flames have any interest in Ortio then he needs to play 9 more games to maintain his RFA status. Plus we need to see what he does over a sustained period of time. The funny thing is I don't think playing the young guys conflicts with the idea of winning. We weren't winning with the vets in 60+ games and Ortio has looked at least as good as Hiller has. I have been saying this for some time. BT needs to give BH the players that need to be evaluated. Waive Hiller and pick up Stalock. Waive Bollig and bring in Hamilton. Call up Agostino and Poirier. Have Ortio and Stalock as the only options. The amount of waived players by teams that haven't made a trade is amazing. Lots of work possible to do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Pretty impressed with the responses on here.... I ran out of likes...I didn't know you could do that! Ortio stunk up the joint last night...no question. I was expecting a lynch mob this morning and got the exact opposite. I had you all wrong! lol. Last year, he had one stinker, and was banished. I never felt right about that. But maybe I just never had the same playoff fever last year (didn't think we had Stanley cup tools anyway yet). I have no doubt that he feels like one bad game will be the end of his career. You saw the desperation in him trying to get the one goal disallowed. And after the ruling....he may as well have been pylon. In his record in the minors/europe, with only a Very few recent exceptions, typically, he has Always been a Strong responder to a stinker. Giving him that opportunity could potentially restore a lot of his lost confidence from decisions made in the past. And then we can see what he's really made of. In Europe, and in previous AHL years, he has been a strong third period closer. In the NHL, and recently in the AHL, he's been the opposite. It's got nothing to do with skills or talent or technique....it's a painfully obvious confidence issue. Really happy to see all the support. And...I don't know if he's going to work out either. All I've ever wanted was a proper and fair evaluation opportunity. Here's hoping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 I have been saying this for some time. BT needs to give BH the players that need to be evaluated. Waive Hiller and pick up Stalock. Waive Bollig and bring in Hamilton. Call up Agostino and Poirier. Have Ortio and Stalock as the only options. The amount of waived players by teams that haven't made a trade is amazing. Lots of work possible to do. Is this how you would like to be treated if you were one of these players you want waived ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Is this how you would like to be treated if you were one of these players you want waived ? It's a business. How I would feel has nothing to do with it. Players have the responsibility to play their best and accept the results of that play. Big Ern was a player that had a lot of respect, but was waived anyway. Ramo was waived after being given the starter reins. Raymond had many chances. The country club is closed. It's tough, but the GM has to do the best he can to right the ship. Hiller isn't a starter on this team anymore, nor should he be. He lost the job this season. That's Hockey. Bollig has one dimension, so if that is needed, then keep him. If there is a need to move on, then why keep him around. Waiving him gives him a chance that a trade option doesn't. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 It's a business. How I would feel has nothing to do with it. Players have the responsibility to play their best and accept the results of that play. Big Ern was a player that had a lot of respect, but was waived anyway. Ramo was waived after being given the starter reins. Raymond had many chances. The country club is closed. It's tough, but the GM has to do the best he can to right the ship. Hiller isn't a starter on this team anymore, nor should he be. He lost the job this season. That's Hockey. Bollig has one dimension, so if that is needed, then keep him. If there is a need to move on, then why keep him around. Waiving him gives him a chance that a trade option doesn't. This a business that involves people and each situation has it's own set of circumstances. What does it matter if Hiller rides out the remainder of the season ? We always know when you take a dislike to players because you try and justify kicking them to the curb. Give Ortio all the starts for a true evaluation, Hiller will know what is going on. Why go get anyone else now ? What makes you think the ship is off course ? Other than not winning enough games and making the playoffs to keep fans happy, many answers have been gathered this season. These are answers that help make the next moves necessary. I'm sure BT will do all of what is required in a professional manner not as you suggest. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 This a business that involves people and each situation has it's own set of circumstances. What does it matter if Hiller rides out the remainder of the season ? We always know when you take a dislike to players because you try and justify kicking them to the curb. Give Ortio all the starts for a true evaluation, Hiller will know what is going on. Why go get anyone else now ? What makes you think the ship is off course ? Other than not winning enough games and making the playoffs to keep fans happy, many answers have been gathered this season. These are answers that help make the next moves necessary. I'm sure BT will do all of what is required in a professional manner not as you suggest. Hate is a strong word. I don't like players that subtract from our ability to win. Bollig and Hiller have shown that. Raymond has. How is it any worse to waive Bollig or Hiller than Raymond, Ramo and Ortio? You are naive if you think BT is doing anything different than I am suggesting. So why not try out another goalie right now. Split between Ortio and new goalie. Player evaluation. You want to keep Bollig because he drops the gloves or protects Johnny? Fine. Seems to me Johnny gets run or hacked without anyone doing anything. Bollig isn't doing that. Instead, he will step up when someone flattens Stajan. Whoops, that was Bouma that did that. Do we need two similar players as Booms; one that can play and one that can only hit or fight. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Hate is a strong word. I don't like players that subtract from our ability to win. Bollig and Hiller have shown that. Raymond has. How is it any worse to waive Bollig or Hiller than Raymond, Ramo and Ortio? You are naive if you think BT is doing anything different than I am suggesting. So why not try out another goalie right now. Split between Ortio and new goalie. Player evaluation. You want to keep Bollig because he drops the gloves or protects Johnny? Fine. Seems to me Johnny gets run or hacked without anyone doing anything. Bollig isn't doing that. Instead, he will step up when someone flattens Stajan. Whoops, that was Bouma that did that. Do we need two similar players as Booms; one that can play and one that can only hit or fight. Once again you show your true nature. As for me I have been in this world for a while now and hardly think I am naïve about much. Obviously I don't share your proposed treatment of people ( I hope you are not this way on the streets). BTW you used the word "hate" not me. Keeping players around like Bollig or Raymond are not causing this team to lose or win and there has to be a few spares around. I would rather it be them than another player who could be developing in AAA for us. Whether Hiller sees the ice again doesn't matter, let him finish out his contract and walk away. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Da4RealDeal Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 Once again you show your true nature. As for me I have been in this world for a while now and hardly think I am naïve about much. Obviously I don't share your proposed treatment of people ( I hope you are not this way on the streets). BTW you used the word "hate" not me. Keeping players around like Bollig or Raymond are not causing this team to lose or win and there has to be a few spares around. I would rather it be them than another player who could be developing in AAA for us. Whether Hiller sees the ice again doesn't matter, let him finish out his contract and walk away. I am sorry but I have to disagree. This is a sport that we all love, but it is also a business. Just because you have feelings does not mean we should allow a goalie to sit on the bench and collect a pay check all because waiving him is mean. This team is rebuilding and when you find yourself outside of the playoffs looking in evaluating players that are about to become FA must be done. I have to say I believe you to be wrong when it comes to Bollig and Raymond not costing us games. Bollig chooses the worst time to stick up for guys, he has taken bad penalties and if he was not a liability he would have played alot more games. Raymond turned over the puck alot, had very poor puck possesion and would not battle in the corner for a single puck. If they did not cost us games tell me how they helped us win one game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jjgallow Posted February 28, 2016 Report Share Posted February 28, 2016 this thread is intense. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
420since1974 Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 I say finish this season with Orito and Hiller. Hiller walks at season's end ($4.5M to help pay for Johnny & Sean). Orito gets a QO if he shows something consistently positive in the remaining 20 games. Summer is when I expect BT to sign or trade for one or more NHL goalies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Summer is when I expect BT to sign or trade for one or more NHL goalies. I hope the next goalie is not Swiss... After Hiller this season, I am a little bit leery of having another Swiss goaltender... 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rickross Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 I hope the next goalie is not Swiss... After Hiller this season, I am a little bit leery of having another Swiss goaltender... Yup, looks like Hiller alright! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 I am sorry but I have to disagree. This is a sport that we all love, but it is also a business. Just because you have feelings does not mean we should allow a goalie to sit on the bench and collect a pay check all because waiving him is mean. This team is rebuilding and when you find yourself outside of the playoffs looking in evaluating players that are about to become FA must be done. I have to say I believe you to be wrong when it comes to Bollig and Raymond not costing us games. Bollig chooses the worst time to stick up for guys, he has taken bad penalties and if he was not a liability he would have played alot more games. Raymond turned over the puck alot, had very poor puck possesion and would not battle in the corner for a single puck. If they did not cost us games tell me how they helped us win one game. It is OK to disagree. We are not in on the conversations between players and management so we have no idea what has been said or promised to these players. Why waive Hiller and bring in another back up goalie ? Does that really make sense to you ? Your comments on Bollig and Raymond are also very lame unless you can point to actual situations that cost us a game you have no idea if their replacements were or would have done any better. I suggest you take our feelings out of it. Were Bollig and Raymond mistakes on management's part, yes, are there times you live with your mistakes, yes. Raymond has been dealt with for now and I would expect BT to move Bollig in the offseason. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andymo Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Looks like Hiller starting... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Looks like Hiller starting... Before the pitchforks come out, its worth nothing that the Flames are playing back to back today and tomorrow so it wasn't very likely Ortio was going to start both anyway... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Before the pitchforks come out, its worth nothing that the Flames are playing back to back today and tomorrow so it wasn't very likely Ortio was going to start both anyway... The possibility that Ortio will be "paper transaction" assigned to the Heat is also there, but I doubt we are going to make the playoffs this season. I think it would be fair to say that a bad loss has Hartley questioning whether Ortio can handle Eastern conference teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 The possibility that Ortio will be "paper transaction" assigned to the Heat is also there, but I doubt we are going to make the playoffs this season. I think it would be fair to say that a bad loss has Hartley questioning whether Ortio can handle Eastern conference teams. If that's the case, Hartley should also question whether the defensive strategy itself is a good fit against a number of opponents, and he should also question the capabilities of a couple of D for taking care of business around the net... Not that goaltending was great last game, but I maintain the opinion that Ortio was still better than Hiller... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 If that's the case, Hartley should also question whether the defensive strategy itself is a good fit against a number of opponents, and he should also question the capabilities of a couple of D for taking care of business around the net... Not that goaltending was great last game, but I maintain the opinion that Ortio was still better than Hiller... I never said I agreed with Hartley. In fact I have said I felt Hiller was done. I even went so far as to suggest that BT should waive him to properly evaluate Ortio. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 I actually don't mind the idea of playing him in the 2nd half of a back to back. Extra's days rest and another test because you would suspect that it would not be as good a Flames team. If you want to be a backup at the NHL level you need to be able to play well in those scenarios. I'll start questioning Hartley if he goes to Hiller in back to back nets, or gives HIller another run. Until then I think he's playing his goalies well since Ramo went down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DirtyDeeds Posted February 29, 2016 Report Share Posted February 29, 2016 Oretio needs to reflect on his poor 3rd period last game. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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