GDT - Flames @ Blues - January 10 2023 - 6:00PM MT Start

[Thebrewcrew]

1 minute ago, Heartbreaker said:

 

Pfft! It's never on Sutter! It's on the young guys, and the goalies, and the AHL team.

 

Love.

Not one player stepped up in training camp!

[travel_dude]

1 minute ago, tmac70 said:

Not sure how this is a coaching issue, Markstrom can't stop a beach ball. and Hubudreau thinks that overtime is street hockey. These gusy find ever oppurtunity to lose its crazy.

 

This start for Marky was Sutter being smarter than everyone else.

We can score goals, but can't hold a lead.

Maybe we just continue to score goals?

Stop shutting down the offense after a 2 spot lead.

You ever notice that the play changes after they go up after a period?

Make the safe plays, dump and chase, nothing fancy.

 

Don't worry, Sutter will pick the goat.

He had no say in the loss, like every loss they have had.

 

[tmac70]

I thought Duehr looked fine Best game Rozie has had in awhile too. For me if your looking tot trade someone I am all for Markstrom getting shipped

[travel_dude]

3 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Not one player stepped up in training camp!

 

Zary was good, but Pelletier was not.

Phillips had a good exhibition game, but he was nowhere near Sutter or NHL players then.

Sutter even said that a couple guys looked better than NHL guys, but the waiver status ruled the choice.

Besides, the NHL guys don't have to win a spot.

[tmac70]

1 minute ago, travel_dude said:

 

This start for Marky was Sutter being smarter than everyone else.

We can score goals, but can't hold a lead.

Maybe we just continue to score goals?

Stop shutting down the offense after a 2 spot lead.

You ever notice that the play changes after they go up after a period?

Make the safe plays, dump and chase, nothing fancy.

 

Don't worry, Sutter will pick the goat.

He had no say in the loss, like every loss they have had.

 

Both those goals are on Markstrom. How many tomes has he been scored on from above the dot, too many. The 2nd rebound is just a poor rebound control and 3rd one is Markstrom on his kness praying the shot does get through. This club neve has had a killer instinct, never. Off topic, Huberdeau is really losing his luster very quick 

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

I thought Duehr looked fine Best game Rozie has had in awhile too. For me if your looking tot trade someone I am all for Markstrom getting shipped

 

If you are gonna play Lucic in the top 6, you might as well play Pelletie with Ruz and Duehr.

A line that doesn;t really do things wrong.

They might not get many minutes or HD chances, but they do no harm.

[travel_dude]

1 minute ago, tmac70 said:

Both those goals are on Markstrom. How many tomes has he been scored on from above the dot, too many. The 2nd rebound is just a poor rebound control and 3rd one is Markstrom on his kness praying the shot does get through. This club neve has had a killer instinct, never. Off topic, Huberdeau is really losing his luster very quick 

 

I watched the OT goal, Marky played it like he was going for the pad stack.

He was in position for the shooter, but layed sideays, opening up 2/3 of the net.

Not that it would have been an easy save, but he played it wrong.

[robrob74]

10 minutes ago, Heartbreaker said:

Flames Talk Post Game is going to be fired up tonight! Pat's in for a long one!

 

Love.

 

It sounded like he was in for a long one last game too. Call-in peeps were talking in theories and hunches and he was just not having any of it and only wanted proof last game. One caller he was like, "you're not in the locker-room, how do you know that's what is going on?" When Steinberg was asked about the leadership group and what's the point of all of these vets if they can't even get up for games... He was like, I can't say what the leadership is like because I am not in the room... 

[travel_dude]

5 minutes ago, tmac70 said:

Off topic, Huberdeau is really losing his luster very quick 

 

I think he should just rest during OT.  He looks gassed.

Maybe pick three other guys?

 

On a side note, Sutter mentioned that the 4th line was good excpet when Ruzicka went down before the 2nd goal.  Said he was late getting off.  That's a hoot, he was knocked down and was hurt.  Blame him for being slow getting off the ice.

[robrob74]

9 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Zary was good, but Pelletier was not.

Phillips had a good exhibition game, but he was nowhere near Sutter or NHL players then.

Sutter even said that a couple guys looked better than NHL guys, but the waiver status ruled the choice.

Besides, the NHL guys don't have to win a spot.

 

They don't have to win a spot in the regular season as well. Which many should be sat out. If a guy has two bad games in a row, sit him out?

[tmac70]

40 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I watched the OT goal, Marky played it like he was going for the pad stack.

He was in position for the shooter, but layed sideays, opening up 2/3 of the net.

Not that it would have been an easy save, but he played it wrong.

Overtime was absoulety not on Markstrom it was 100% on Hubie, but goals 2-3 are most definelty on Markstrom. How many long shot has he let in that should be routine saves this year, its brutal. The fact you can't close out teams constanlty it kills this team for years. If I hear from these fools that oh we have to learn from this, you have to question mental ability. One thing they do well is find ways to lose

[cross16]

Lots of things you can look at and discuss but at the end of the day you just are not going to find consistency as a team when your goaltending isn’t good. That isn’t to blame this all on Markstrom but it’s the reality of the league. To win consistently over the course of the regular season you need above avg goaltending. 
 

Flames are not getting that enough. Earlier in the year I was supportive of letting Markstrom try and play through it but that threshold has been crossed. You need to give Vladar a run at this and see if your team can build on the game they’ve been building the last month 

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, tmac70 said:

Off topic, Huberdeau is really losing his luster very quick 

 

But let's not trade him away or else no overpriced has been will ever sign with us again.

[sak22]

4 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

But let's not trade him away or else no overpriced has been will ever sign with us again.

What exactly do you think his value will be if he's a has been who hasn't even begun his overpriced contract?

[The_People1]

2 minutes ago, sak22 said:

What exactly do you think his value will be if he's a has been who hasn't even begun his overpriced contract?

 

Did we really need a $7/$10-mil veteran to lose tonight?  I haven't even gotten started on Weegar yet.  Geez.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, tmac70 said:

Overtime was absoulety not on Markstrom it was 100% on Hubie, but goals 2-3 are most definelty on Markstrom. How many long shot has he let in that should be routine saves this year, its brutal. The fact you can't close out teams constanlty it kills this team for years. If I hear from these fools that oh we have to learn from this, you have to question mental ability. One thing they do well is find ways to lose

Let me say it this way.

Every 2 on 1 we face with Marky in nets is in the net unless the player shoots wide.

On the other side of the coan, every 2 on 1 we gave is a miss if we pass it.

Okay, so the one to Lucic wasn't a traditional one.

 

[cross16]

2 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Not one player stepped up in training camp!

we are long past the point where this should matter 

[robrob74]

10 minutes ago, cross16 said:

we are long past the point where this should matter 

I think it's a point that players didn't show up in training camp, and, many aren't showing up now. It's been going on since before the season started. Sutter keeps rewarding vets who will probably play better next game but could end careers for young players who have a bad game and then never plays them again. Basically, I think this kind of coaching creates tension in the room. 

[sak22]

16 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Did we really need a $7/$10-mil veteran to lose tonight?  I haven't even gotten started on Weegar yet.  Geez.

What exactly do you mean?  Did they lose them the game tonight? or are there teams that don't lose with high priced players?  

[redfire11]

I feel that loss was on Sutter. 

1) Markstrom

2) He's plowing a field in a straight line and nothing will change his course.

3) I don't follow Sutter's thought pattern and it looks like neither does the team.

[rocketdoctor]

for the first 40 we were much the better team.

 

The last 20 was pretty poor.

 

 

[tmac70]

So here is the the thing. If this club just played the way that got them ahead all the time there wouldn't be an issue. RD is right and its been shown multiple times. We play well for 40 and crap for 20 minutes, either its at the beggining middle or end. The last two games are good examples, dominated paly for 2/3 of the game and than coast. This club especailly this year can not take its foot of the gas or they end up on the wrong side of it. Last year we out scored our mistakes thats not an option this year. With Hubie and Weegar and Mags to some extent, IMHO they are trying to make a differance and play to the contracts, instead of just playing to their abilities. You can just see it with Weegar and Hubie for sure. Hubie is not this bad of a player, its just way to much internal pressure. He can't seem to handle it unlike Kadri, for him his life has been pressure

[tmac70]

8 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Let me say it this way.

Every 2 on 1 we face with Marky in nets is in the net unless the player shoots wide.

On the other side of the coan, every 2 on 1 we gave is a miss if we pass it.

Okay, so the one to Lucic wasn't a traditional one.

 

As Sutter stated in his presser, If anderson stays in the Middle the only option is to shoot. Playing one side and than belly flopping your opening lanes for passes. Staying in the middle there is one option thats the player and the goalie now odds are better, but not sure it makes a differance with Markstrom. Marky is really off this year and I agree needs to sit for awhile. He does makes some good saves once and awhile but it needs to be more frequent like last year. Quite possible the departure of JG and Chucky has created a different element in that a lot of players may feel they have to do extra which is creating the poor performace results. Elite atheltes should never have to try they just do, trying just creates tension and uncertainty, thats what I see with Weegar, Hubie, Markstrom and Mags right now. 

[cross16]

This is not to lay everything on Markstrom as there are many things worth discussing around this club but at the same time it's the nature of the position. If you don't get good goaltending in the NHL, or really at any level of hockey, you are just not going to win consistently. 

 

At 5 on 5:

Goalie 1 - 900 Sv% and 0.796 HDSv %. On 25.39 Shots Against/60. 7.43 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.34

Goalie 2 - .920Sv% and 0.840 HDSV% on 28.85 Shots Against/60. 7.79 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.5

 

All situations:

Goalie 1 - .893 Sv% and 0.816 HDSv %. On 26.52 Shots Against/60. 7.51 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.68

Goalie 2 - .906Sv% and 0.847 HDSV% on 29.36 Shots Against/60. 8.27 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.78

 

Goalie 1 League Rankings: 39th in Save % 37th in GSAA/60 27th in HD SV%

Goalie 2 League Rankings: 24th in Save %. 25th in GSAA/60 15th in HD SV%

 

Both of those goalies play for the Flames. Don't think it would take many hints to figure out which is which. 

 

Flames as a team rank 7th worst in Save % 5 on 5 and High danger save % at 5 on 5. With how many 1 goal games they are in (which I absoltely agree is an issue in itself and is not the product of goaltending) I don't thin it's a stretch at all to say that if the Flames were just receiving league averaging goaltending they are likely right there with Seattle/LA. 

 

Interesting to point out that Markstrom is ranked 9th in Expected goals against/60 and Vladar 16th. Markstrom 7th in HD shots against and Vladar 17th. Flames team is far from perfect but it's really hard for me to suggest that the goaltending is a problem because of the team in front of them. That team isn't perfect and has issues but this is really a Markstrom issue right now and I think the numbers clearly show that. 

[robrob74]

19 minutes ago, cross16 said:

This is not to lay everything on Markstrom as there are many things worth discussing around this club but at the same time it's the nature of the position. If you don't get good goaltending in the NHL, or really at any level of hockey, you are just not going to win consistently. 

 

At 5 on 5:

Goalie 1 - 900 Sv% and 0.796 HDSv %. On 25.39 Shots Against/60. 7.43 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.34

Goalie 2 - .920Sv% and 0.840 HDSV% on 28.85 Shots Against/60. 7.79 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.5

 

All situations:

Goalie 1 - .893 Sv% and 0.816 HDSv %. On 26.52 Shots Against/60. 7.51 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.68

Goalie 2 - .906Sv% and 0.847 HDSV% on 29.36 Shots Against/60. 8.27 HD Shots against/60 and ExGAgainst of 2.78

 

Goalie 1 League Rankings: 39th in Save % 37th in GSAA/60 27th in HD SV%

Goalie 2 League Rankings: 24th in Save %. 25th in GSAA/60 15th in HD SV%

 

Both of those goalies play for the Flames. Don't think it would take many hints to figure out which is which. 

 

Flames as a team rank 7th worst in Save % 5 on 5 and High danger save % at 5 on 5. With how many 1 goal games they are in (which I absoltely agree is an issue in itself and is not the product of goaltending) I don't thin it's a stretch at all to say that if the Flames were just receiving league averaging goaltending they are likely right there with Seattle/LA. 

 

Interesting to point out that Markstrom is ranked 9th in Expected goals against/60 and Vladar 16th. Markstrom 7th in HD shots against and Vladar 17th. Flames team is far from perfect but it's really hard for me to suggest that the goaltending is a problem because of the team in front of them. That team isn't perfect and has issues but this is really a Markstrom issue right now and I think the numbers clearly show that. 

I think yes, but also think if the team can clean up its D it can change some of those numbers, like the OT goal last night. How many goals like that have been scored against? To further the need for better D and Goaltending, how many goals like that have the Flames scored on the chances they've had?

 

how many odd-man rushes have the Flames had where nothing happens? Not that that changes everything, but also, because scoring is down, how much of the mistakes are due to the need of scoring more and then gripping the stick too tight? Maybe the turnovers happen anyway? 
 

Marky is letting in too many softies and his mechanics are off. I'd say the same has been for most of the team?