Blockbuster: Hamilton Ferland Fox for Hanifin Lindholm

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Nope.

Maybe you should just be quiet.

 

Just finding a way to cut our losses short with Neal.  Nothing to see here.

[travel_dude]

10 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Ironically, it would be great to get Ferland back for the playoffs but the rumoured ask of a first round pick plus a prospect is too much.  Maybe they are willing to take Neal for Ferland straight up.  Maybe they want Ryan back?  Maybe a prospect like Mangiapane?

 

Does playing Ferland on the 3rd line make us a better team?  He was successful here because he played offense only on the top line.  In CAR, he plays with Aho.

Even if I was to entertain the idea of Neal for Ferland, I don't think he would be able to keep up the numbers he's putting up right now.  He's only ever seemed to develop chemistry with a few players, one being JH. 

 

Pass.

And no, I'm not giving up on a rookie NHL player plus a pick to get him as a rental we can't afford to sign to a new deal.  

[robrob74]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Does playing Ferland on the 3rd line make us a better team?  He was successful here because he played offense only on the top line.  In CAR, he plays with Aho.

Even if I was to entertain the idea of Neal for Ferland, I don't think he would be able to keep up the numbers he's putting up right now.  He's only ever seemed to develop chemistry with a few players, one being JH. 

 

Pass.

And no, I'm not giving up on a rookie NHL player plus a pick to get him as a rental we can't afford to sign to a new deal.  

 

Ferland scored a little bit on the 4th line. He showed his potential skill in that role, not just as a hitter. 

 

Its like saying, Monahan is a 2nd line C without Gaudreau but a 1st line C with him. He’ll score about 25 goals without Gaudreau but will score 35-40 with him. 

 

Ferland isnt going to make offence as a set up guy, but Monahan isn’t the driver either. 

 

Probably a bad example. But on a 3rd line I always saw Ferland as a 15 goal guy. He makes your team better as a depth scorer. Although he is showing he can score 20 on a first line. 

[cross16]

For me, Sam Bennett is turning into a more consistent version of what most wanted Ferland to be. 

 

So i don't see the fit personally. That role has been replaced with a more effective version. 

[The_People1]

10 hours ago, cross16 said:

For me, Sam Bennett is turning into a more consistent version of what most wanted Ferland to be. 

 

So i don't see the fit personally. That role has been replaced with a more effective version. 

 

So then why do fans love Ferland but hate Bennett?

[Khrox]

49 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

So then why do fans love Ferland but hate Bennett?

Because Ferland was a 5th round pick that was never expected to play heavy-top line minutes, but more of a bottom 6 physical player with some scoring potential (if he ever even made it to the NHL). Bennett was a first round pick (4th OA) who was expected to be a top line scorer in the NHL who could play a bit more physical.

 

Because of the expectations of them both (and their draft position) it makes it harder to swallow that they turned out to be very similar players (middle 6 players with scoring potential and physical play).

[MAC331]

10 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

So then why do fans love Ferland but hate Bennett?

Who hates Bennett ? Bennett is having an effective season however what I see is the constant mistake of playing him all over the place. It doesn't appear it will happen this season but I think if he were to move back to C between Tkachuk and Neal we would have another Monahan situation. Tkachuk is a great playmaker and he needs some speed, distractions and finishers with him. Maybe next year.

[cross16]

13 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

So then why do fans love Ferland but hate Bennett?

 

People like narratives. Ferland exceeded expectations, Bennett didn't live up to his. 

 

[cross16]

So according to Larry Brooks, who isn't always the most reliable, he thinks the Rangers have interest in Adam Fox's rights. This will certainly build the case for Fox wanting to be in New York.

 

What an absolutely incredible story this will be if the Canes trade Hamilton, Ferland and Fox all less than a year after the trade. Crazy. 

 

Quote

The Oilers are believed to be interested in Zuccarello. So, too, Carolina, which is both light on forwards and is seeking to move pending free-agent winger Micheal Ferland. The Rangers would not be interested in Ferland, but rather the rights to Harvard junior defenseman Adam Fox.

 

https://nypost.com/2019/01/16/rangers-will-play-it-cautiously-with-kevin-hayes-return/?utm_source=url_sitebuttons&utm_medium=site buttons&utm_campaign=site buttons

 

[travel_dude]

3 hours ago, cross16 said:

So according to Larry Brooks, who isn't always the most reliable, he thinks the Rangers have interest in Adam Fox's rights. This will certainly build the case for Fox wanting to be in New York.

 

What an absolutely incredible story this will be if the Canes trade Hamilton, Ferland and Fox all less than a year after the trade. Crazy. 

 

 

 

They seem to like D-men drafted by the Flames.

Another Erixon?

His rights are probably at their highest.

He's not going to forgo a contract at this point just to wait for FA.

[conundrumed]

7 hours ago, cross16 said:

So according to Larry Brooks, who isn't always the most reliable, he thinks the Rangers have interest in Adam Fox's rights. This will certainly build the case for Fox wanting to be in New York.

 

What an absolutely incredible story this will be if the Canes trade Hamilton, Ferland and Fox all less than a year after the trade. Crazy. 

 

 

That would be astounding.

Like we bundled up all of our problems if true.

 

[LouCifer]

On 1/14/2019 at 2:23 PM, cross16 said:

For me, Sam Bennett is turning into a more consistent version of what most wanted Ferland to be. 

 

So i don't see the fit personally. That role has been replaced with a more effective version. 

 

I’m a Bennett fan and supporter. Having said that, I do still see a fit for Ferly on this team. He’s not just a glorified knuckle chucker - he’s got a heck of a shot, can be incredible on the forecheck, and he leans on bodies and finishes checks. For me, he’s versatile that way and can be moved up and down the lineup. With the current lineup, if and when emotions run high during a playoff series, it’ll be Hamonic and Bennett doing the dirty work and sitting in the box for 5’s... Not sure we want to be down Hamomic on the backend very much.

 

I know Ferly showed us inconsistent glimpses of that edge we saw in the playoffs against Vancouver, but I think that has more to do with pacing himself over an 82 game season. IMHO, I think he goes beast mode for the playoffs. 

 

Edit: I’m not saying he should be target #1 for us, I’m just saying he should be considered and already has familiarity with our group. 

[MAC331]

10 hours ago, lou44291 said:

 

I’m a Bennett fan and supporter. Having said that, I do still see a fit for Ferly on this team. He’s not just a glorified knuckle chucker - he’s got a heck of a shot, can be incredible on the forecheck, and he leans on bodies and finishes checks. For me, he’s versatile that way and can be moved up and down the lineup. With the current lineup, if and when emotions run high during a playoff series, it’ll be Hamonic and Bennett doing the dirty work and sitting in the box for 5’s... Not sure we want to be down Hamomic on the backend very much.

 

I know Ferly showed us inconsistent glimpses of that edge we saw in the playoffs against Vancouver, but I think that has more to do with pacing himself over an 82 game season. IMHO, I think he goes beast mode for the playoffs. 

 

Edit: I’m not saying he should be target #1 for us, I’m just saying he should be considered and already has familiarity with our group. 

If CAR would take Ryan and Czarnick for Ferland I would do it in a heartbeat. Ferland for our 3rd line LW would be ideal IMO. Move Bennett over to C between Ferland and Neal.

[cross16]

11 hours ago, lou44291 said:

 

I’m a Bennett fan and supporter. Having said that, I do still see a fit for Ferly on this team. He’s not just a glorified knuckle chucker - he’s got a heck of a shot, can be incredible on the forecheck, and he leans on bodies and finishes checks. For me, he’s versatile that way and can be moved up and down the lineup. With the current lineup, if and when emotions run high during a playoff series, it’ll be Hamonic and Bennett doing the dirty work and sitting in the box for 5’s... Not sure we want to be down Hamomic on the backend very much.

 

I know Ferly showed us inconsistent glimpses of that edge we saw in the playoffs against Vancouver, but I think that has more to do with pacing himself over an 82 game season. IMHO, I think he goes beast mode for the playoffs. 

 

Edit: I’m not saying he should be target #1 for us, I’m just saying he should be considered and already has familiarity with our group. 

 

That may not be a selling feature... I'm not sure it's entirely coincidental that the chemistry and compete level is better this year and he's not here. 

 

Problem for me is more where do you play him. You aren't putting him back on the top line and that's the only line he really thrived on when he was here. I don't think he fits on the 3M line and while I guess you could play him on the 3rd line are we really going to give up a 1st round pick plus for a guy to play on the 3rd line and a guy who is a pure rental? I'm not. 

[LouCifer]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

That may not be a selling feature... I'm not sure it's entirely coincidental that the chemistry and compete level is better this year and he's not here. 

 

Problem for me is more where do you play him. You aren't putting him back on the top line and that's the only line he really thrived on when he was here. I don't think he fits on the 3M line and while I guess you could play him on the 3rd line are we really going to give up a 1st round pick plus for a guy to play on the 3rd line and a guy who is a pure rental? I'm not. 

 

Oh no no... Carolina can ask for a first for him all they want but I’m not giving them one for Ferly. I’m thinking more along the lines of what MAC suggested. Ryan (newsflash: I hate him) and Czarnik. 23 other teams wanted to sign Czarnik (aka Mangiapane 2.0) when we got him right? Playoffs are a comin’ so there must be some of those same teams interested! 

 

As as far as compete - I’ll hitch that wagon to Hamilton. Ferly plays a tougher game than most when he’s on. Ill wager his disappearing acts at times are related to bumps and bruises and taking measures to prolong his tough play. 

[cross16]

35 minutes ago, lou44291 said:

 

Oh no no... Carolina can ask for a first for him all they want but I’m not giving them one for Ferly. I’m thinking more along the lines of what MAC suggested. Ryan (newsflash: I hate him) and Czarnik. 23 other teams wanted to sign Czarnik (aka Mangiapane 2.0) when we got him right? Playoffs are a comin’ so there must be some of those same teams interested! 

 

As as far as compete - I’ll hitch that wagon to Hamilton. Ferly plays a tougher game than most when he’s on. Ill wager his disappearing acts at times are related to bumps and bruises and taking measures to prolong his tough play. 

 

I think there is no way you are getting Ferland for Ryan and Czarnik. Canes had every opporutnity to bring Ryan back and he left, why would they take him back?

 

I think the Canes are going to get a haul for Ferland. Thanks to Tom Wilson Ferland's value is as high as it's every been and someone's going to overpay. 

[LouCifer]

36 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

I think there is no way you are getting Ferland for Ryan and Czarnik. Canes had every opporutnity to bring Ryan back and he left, why would they take him back?

 

I think the Canes are going to get a haul for Ferland. Thanks to Tom Wilson Ferland's value is as high as it's every been and someone's going to overpay. 

 

I agree Cross. Perhaps it’s wishful thinking on my part. I guess I’m hoping that Carolina has noticed a void they’d like to fill since Ryan’s departure, and that they were also interested in Czarnik, and that other teams interested in Ferland recognize Carolina is dealing from a position of weakness and don’t offer anywhere close to asking. Ferland is a risk for sure - his concussion history and UFA status should give some teams pause for what they offer Carolina in trade. But you’re right, a lot has to go our way to get him for the 2 players mentioned. 

[Cowtownguy]

5 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

I think there is no way you are getting Ferland for Ryan and Czarnik. Canes had every opporutnity to bring Ryan back and he left, why would they take him back?

 

I think the Canes are going to get a haul for Ferland. Thanks to Tom Wilson Ferland's value is as high as it's every been and someone's going to overpay. 

I am still not clear why Ferland would go for so much. He has a history with concussions, so he cannot play as aggressively as he used to. Fighting is very dangerous for him. He has always been streaky. So, he is a third line player to me.

[conundrumed]

12 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said:

I am still not clear why Ferland would go for so much. He has a history with concussions, so he cannot play as aggressively as he used to. Fighting is very dangerous for him. He has always been streaky. So, he is a third line player to me.

But mainly, a pure rental.

Not interested. Someone'll give him $5+.

I'm pretty sure the Cane's were cool at 4+.

We lost Ferland before he became a headache imho.

He's been replaced. Him or Lindholm for that money and contract?

I'm over it.

[cross16]

5 hours ago, Cowtownguy said:

I am still not clear why Ferland would go for so much. He has a history with concussions, so he cannot play as aggressively as he used to. Fighting is very dangerous for him. He has always been streaky. So, he is a third line player to me.

 

Recency bias and suppply and demand. After last years Finals everyone now wants a Tom Wilson. Ferland is as close as you have available. 

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Recency bias and suppply and demand. After last years Finals everyone now wants a Tom Wilson. Ferland is as close as you have available. 

 

Kronwall is probably the other one who will be highly sought after.  He can change a game or a series with one big hit/KO.  I hope the Flames can land him as a rental but he's going to cost a 1st rounder for sure.  Probably the classic 1st + prospect + roster player.  So, might be some combination of Mangiapane, Czarnik, Gillies, Quine, ...maybe Kylington but hopefully not as expensive as Dube.

[Cowtownguy]

6 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Kronwall is probably the other one who will be highly sought after.  He can change a game or a series with one big hit/KO.  I hope the Flames can land him as a rental but he's going to cost a 1st rounder for sure.  Probably the classic 1st + prospect + roster player.  So, might be some combination of Mangiapane, Czarnik, Gillies, Quine, ...maybe Kylington but hopefully not as expensive as Dube.

I would rather keep Dube and our 1st pick myself. 

[Thebrewcrew]

I would like Kronwall as well, but to me it doesn’t make sense to give up a 1st for a 37 year old. I completely get why the Wings will want a haul for him as he is a franchise icon, but let Toronto give up a first for him.

 

 

Maybe a more realistic acquisition is Kiselevich from FLA, Yakolev from NJ or Davidson from CHI. Not a sexy pickup at all but some added depth for a playoff run without giving up much for a rental 

[The_People1]

38 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said:

I would rather keep Dube and our 1st pick myself. 

 

28 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I would like Kronwall as well, but to me it doesn’t make sense to give up a 1st for a 37 year old. I completely get why the Wings will want a haul for him as he is a franchise icon, but let Toronto give up a first for him.

 

 

Maybe a more realistic acquisition is Kiselevich from FLA, Yakolev from NJ or Davidson from CHI. Not a sexy pickup at all but some added depth for a playoff run without giving up much for a rental 

 

Agreed.  

 

There does seem to be more big named players available this trade deadline though so maybe the price drops around the league with less buyers.

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

A little tidbit on Hamiltons return to Calgary, post trade.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/dougie-hamilton-looking-forward-first-game-calgary-since-trade/