Goaltending

[redfire11]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

 

Darn Smith in tonight. 4 hours before the game and we are already down 1 or 2 goals.

[MAC331]

3 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I agree. It'll be quite a test tonight.

I've been wanting Smith to get back on form.

I'm starting to realize though, his form was always relying on athleticism vs mechanics.

For me, that's the scary part.

If we were to bring in Howard, I agree again. It would become relentlessly starting Howard, because he's a guy that isn't going to let go of the reigns.

That could be a nice lesson to Rittich too, though.

At the end of the day, Howard's better than Smith in near every category but size.

Like you say, this isn't an easy decision.

And like I said earlier, my biggest fear is Smith looking good until the deadline passes.

That would hurt a lot.

I'd imagine the NYIs are looking hard at Bobo and Howard also. If Howard gets moved, I just don't want it to be a playoff team in the west.

If I were the GM in SJ, I'd be all over it. They win in spite of Jones, not because of him.

St Loo?

No thanks. If he heads West, I would really prefer it to be to us.

Pretty sure that would put our conference on high alert that Howard is now Calgary's goalie.

As I said, it appears management is taking the necessary measures to make their decision. Either way they will have to live with it. I am saying I wouldn't make a change and would live with the experience this season. How far it takes us is anybody's guess.

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

2 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Flames had the 14, traded down with Buffalo to get a 2nd rd pick they wasted anyway.

With the 2 picks:

Jankowski

Patrick Sieloff

Ah. The move doesn't make much sense but hey theres a reason I'm not a GM.

[conundrumed]

3 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

Ah. The move doesn't make much sense but hey theres a reason I'm not a GM.

It was an incredibly goalie-rich draft.

Vasilevsky

Murray

Hellebuyk

Frederik Anderson

Korpisalo

Ullmark

Mazanec

 

We took Gillies in the 3rd rd.

[travel_dude]

18 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

Ah. The move doesn't make much sense but hey theres a reason I'm not a GM.

 

We opted to sign Gillies in the 3rd round.

At the time he was a good draft pick.

Some just never work out (for us).

Irving.  Ortio.  MacDonald.  Gillies.  Parsons.

Only two of those have a chance of becoming regular NHL goals, but both are still miles away.

[conundrumed]

16 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

Ah. The move doesn't make much sense but hey theres a reason I'm not a GM.

There prolly isn't actually. Just hire a good accountant and lawyer.

This is what we get for being Canadian. lol

[conundrumed]

1 minute ago, travel_dude said:

 

We opted to sign Gillies in the 3rd round.

At the time he was a good draft pick.

Some just never work out (for us).

Irving.  Ortio.  MacDonald.  Gillies.  Parsons.

Only two of those have a chance of becoming regular NHL goals, but both are still miles away.

Rittich was a good find. But it would appear that scouting goalies isn't our strong suit.

Further to this, there's no salary cap on the front end. just sayin'

 

[JTech780]

9 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Flames had the 14, traded down with Buffalo to get a 2nd rd pick they wasted anyway.

With the 2 picks:

Jankowski

Patrick Sieloff

 

To be fair at the time, I would have lost if they drafted a goalie in the 1st round and I still would. Sure Vasilevsky has turned out, but lots of goalies don't. I just don't think drafting goalies in the 1st round is a smart way to go.

[JTech780]

5 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Rittich was a good find. But it would appear that scouting goalies isn't our strong suit.

Further to this, there's no salary cap on the front end. just sayin'

 

 

But who is good at scouting goalies? Every team misses on goalies and when they hit it's more of a fluke.

[conundrumed]

1 minute ago, JTech780 said:

 

To be fair at the time, I would have lost if they drafted a goalie in the 1st round and I still would. Sure Vasilevsky has turned out, but lots of goalies don't. I just don't think drafting goalies in the 1st round is a smart way to go.

I disagree. I'm not with you at all.

I believe Vasilevsky was ranked 24th by a lot of the "systems".

At the time I was high on him and wouldn't have had a problem at all making that jump.

When we needed help, we took a 5 year science project and a dman I have no idea what our scouts saw.

Vasilevsky in his draft yr played out of his mind.

He was ranked 24th.

You'd have been pissed? Go back and look at that goalie list. He's still the #1 goalie from that draft that produced many good ones.

Everything in his draft year said this guy is some goalie. So what? But he's Russian?

BPA, unless he's Russian. lol

[JTech780]

3 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I disagree. I'm not with you at all.

I believe Vasilevsky was ranked 24th by a lot of the "systems".

At the time I was high on him and wouldn't have had a problem at all making that jump.

When we needed help, we took a 5 year science project and a dman I have no idea what our scouts saw.

Vasilevsky in his draft yr played out of his mind.

He was ranked 24th.

You'd have been pissed? Go back and look at that goalie list. He's still the #1 goalie from that draft that produced many good ones.

Everything in his draft year said this guy is some goalie. So what? But he's Russian?

BPA, unless he's Russian. lol

 

At the time I wouldn't have been happy because I think drafting goalies in the 1st round in general is a mistake. Would I have been happy to be wrong absolutely, but I still don't think it's a great idea. 

[cross16]

54 minutes ago, flames-fan-in-jets-land said:

BSDs numbers havent been much better lately. Are we writing him off also? I agree Rittich should be playing just to see if he gets his mojo back but as of late the on ice product has not been that different.

 

No. but the difference is we are seeing the top of Mike Smith's game so far this year and the bottom of Rittich's and yet their stats are very similar. Also for me and the eye test I don't see improvement in Smith's game. 

 

I have more faith in one of the 2 "bouncing back". Never mind the fact that I think the stats argument between the two is a little misguided. 

[conundrumed]

Just now, JTech780 said:

 

At the time I wouldn't have been happy because I think drafting goalies in the 1st round in general is a mistake. Would I have been happy to be wrong absolutely, but I still don't think it's a great idea. 

But the point is, we took a long term project and a dman I saw nothing in when he was with the Spits.

Taking a goalie in the 1st is not a bad thing if you consider just how good Vasilevsky was in his draft year. He was something special.

My own line of thinking is Vasilevsky was around a 24 ranking because:

a.) he's a goalie

b.) he's Russian

 

So he gets pushed down rankings.

They could only push him down to 24 oa. He should have been top 15 in reality.

Yzerman was scouting a lot differently imho. A lot more honestly.

With a clear plan for the scouts.

 

[conundrumed]

38 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

But who is good at scouting goalies? Every team misses on goalies and when they hit it's more of a fluke.

We got Rittich that way. Completely by accident while scouting a player.

So someone in the org knows the signs.

I hear all of the time, "goalie is voodoo".

Nope it's not. If it confuses, get more resources on it.

[JTech780]

7 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

We got Rittich that way. Completely by accident while scouting a player.

So someone in the org knows the signs.

I hear all of the time, "goalie is voodoo".

Nope it's not. If it confuses, get more resources on it.

 

I think goalies are tougher to scout because of how much of goaltending is mental. Right now for example Rittich has the technical side of goaltending down pretty well, but he struggles with focus from time to time. Gillies has all the size and athleticism you would want from a goalie, but mentally he can't stay sharp for a full 60 mins.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Rittich was a good find. But it would appear that scouting goalies isn't our strong suit.

Further to this, there's no salary cap on the front end. just sayin'

 

 

I agree.  Well scouted he was.

That is recently.

Before Parsons, not so much.

 

The other thing to remember is we still had Kipper as well as drafted Irving, Ortio and Brossoit.

And the Calgary Tower.

Drafting a first rounder wasn;t a priority.

 

 

[redfire11]

My bad Mr. Smith Good Game.

[MAC331]

11 hours ago, redfire11 said:

My bad Mr. Smith Good Game.

Smith has been answering the call as part of the Goalie answer for us. I don't see BT making a change. Now get BSD back I for a few games.

[rickross]

20 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Smith has been answering the call as part of the Goalie answer for us. I don't see BT making a change. Now get BSD back I for a few games.

I honestly think we are in a great win-win scenario with our goalies. Somehow, both of our goalies are effectively helping us win games but their both still quite rested and fresh. Last year we rode Smith until he was injured, partly out of necessity and lack of options at the time. We have 2 starting goalies! That’s a huge advantage, this development also allows more time for a guy like Gillies to properly develop. We are quite blessed in net as it stands

[travel_dude]

13 hours ago, redfire11 said:

My bad Mr. Smith Good Game.

 

1 hour ago, rickross said:

I honestly think we are in a great win-win scenario with our goalies. Somehow, both of our goalies are effectively helping us win games but their both still quite rested and fresh. Last year we rode Smith until he was injured, partly out of necessity and lack of options at the time. We have 2 starting goalies! That’s a huge advantage, this development also allows more time for a guy like Gillies to properly develop. We are quite blessed in net as it stands

 

He got the win.  That is all that matter when playing Smith.  He isn't any better than the other recent games he won.

First period 3 shots.  2nd, 4 shots one goal. 3rd 12 shots one goal.

Overall, he had a few good saves.

He was more risky with the puck than I would like.

None came back to haunt him.

 

Moving on.

No reason why we don't go to Rittich for the next 4 games.  Go to Smith (or TDL replacement) for Minny game.

Back to Rittich for TO and VGK.

Smith for ARI game.

No reason to believe that Smith is back to his early 2017/18 form.

He hasn't stolen a game in quite some time.

[rickross]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

He got the win.  That is all that matter when playing Smith.  He isn't any better than the other recent games he won.

First period 3 shots.  2nd, 4 shots one goal. 3rd 12 shots one goal.

Overall, he had a few good saves.

He was more risky with the puck than I would like.

None came back to haunt him.

 

Moving on.

No reason why we don't go to Rittich for the next 4 games.  Go to Smith (or TDL replacement) for Minny game.

Back to Rittich for TO and VGK.

Smith for ARI game.

No reason to believe that Smith is back to his early 2017/18 form.

He hasn't stolen a game in quite some time.

I think the real improvement comes in knowing our goalies aren’t getting peppered with 40+ shots every game. Luckily we haven’t had to overexpose Smith or Rittich so far this season. Smith for one hasn’t stolen a game because he hasn’t really had to,due to our ability to score this year. That’s key in keeping him healthy.  I agree we need to keep Rittich active and in rhythm but it’s huge to give him some rest at this key point in the season. Rittich has been the better goalie overall but it’s a great luxury to be able win with either goalie in net. 

[flames-fan-in-jets-land]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

He got the win.  That is all that matter when playing Smith.  He isn't any better than the other recent games he won.

First period 3 shots.  2nd, 4 shots one goal. 3rd 12 shots one goal.

Overall, he had a few good saves.

He was more risky with the puck than I would like.

None came back to haunt him.

 

Moving on.

No reason why we don't go to Rittich for the next 4 games.  Go to Smith (or TDL replacement) for Minny game.

Back to Rittich for TO and VGK.

Smith for ARI game.

No reason to believe that Smith is back to his early 2017/18 form.

He hasn't stolen a game in quite some time.

Thats the Smith were gonna need. Rittich did it on his hot streak, Smith was doing it early last year. Once the playoffs start having a goalie (either one) steal a game that you dont deserve to win can be the deciding factor in a series or even more.

[rickross]

He probably deserves more credit but Rittich played a solid road game against the Sens mind you. Still nice to get the win after sitting out awhile. I think we finally have a dependable 1a and 1b in net. 

[Thebrewcrew]

8 hours ago, rickross said:

He probably deserves more credit but Rittich played a solid road game against the Sens mind you. Still nice to get the win after sitting out awhile. I think we finally have a dependable 1a and 1b in net. 

It was by no means an easy game, yeah it was against the worst team in the league, but if rittich wasn’t sharp then the Flames don’t leave the nations capital with 2 points 

[travel_dude]

50 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

It was by no means an easy game, yeah it was against the worst team in the league, but if rittich wasn’t sharp then the Flames don’t leave the nations capital with 2 points 

 

Tkachuk's goal was the worst line change I have ever seen.  The Flames had been hemmed in and had the puck deep, but the D waited too long to change.  Turnover results in 2 on 0.  Neither Smith nor Rittich had much of a chance, but Rittich may have stopped it had he been fresh, not wasting away for 5 games.