Goaltending

[conundrumed]

14 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

I love the guy! I was like most and hated the signing, because I didn't see him play. But once we had those 3 goalies at once, I could see why they signed him. He has his structure down. I wanted our other prospects to shine as much as everyone else. Rittich is the clear choice and so far is showing it. We are lucky to have him. I hope he keeps it up. 

 

But I feel like Talbot has played well too. He hasn't had the run support, and now the only thing others will see in his play are the stats. Next year or the year after people will look at the stats and say the goaltending didn't cut it. 

Yup. Wish I could find the story about how we stumbled upon him. Whoever that scout was should stick to scouting goalies. lol

[cross16]

12 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Yup. Wish I could find the story about how we stumbled upon him. Whoever that scout was should stick to scouting goalies. lol

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/calgarysun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/calgary-flames/rittich-has-been-fantastic-find-for-flames/amp

[conundrumed]

9 hours ago, cross16 said:

https://www.google.ca/amp/s/calgarysun.com/sports/hockey/nhl/calgary-flames/rittich-has-been-fantastic-find-for-flames/amp

Pribyl was worth his weight in gold for getting us Rittich. lol

One chance encounter for Rittich or no one ever heard of him.

Very cool story

The kinda guy we like cheering for. Full on underdog. Talented and colourful.

He's been on the ride of his life, and he isn't out of place.

Not to mention our best effort award near every start.

Just get him into the playoffs healthy, scorers.

[jjgallow]

 

I don't want to kill the mood here guys, we do need some hope right now and if Riitich is providing that, good.

 

I don't personally get it, if we compare our current goaltending situation to 1989, we had Mike Vernon ranked 3rd overall and  (Rick Wamsley) ranked 20th.

 

In 2004 we had Kipper 2nd overall in the NHL, and Turek mid 20's rank.

 

 

So now we've acquired this over-aged goalie and we put all our development minutes into him instead of our younger top prospects, and he seems to have settled out around that 20th ranking.    We've  developed a backup goalie.   Our Wamsley, our Turek, at the expensive of having any chance of a first string goalie.   And Rittich is older than those backups were then.

 

Which I might add are freely available on the market each offseason.

 

I think Pribyl destroyed us.

 

I think the scout did a good job, it was management's fault for sending him to watch an over-age league in the first place.   What were we even doing there?

 

All they had to do was ask the scouts to do their job.  That was all.   Flames had a Very high draft selection.    Carter Hart was Right there.   Best goalie in the WHL by 10 miles.

 

Had they paid attention, we would have picked up Cater Hart with our 2nd pick (or Alex Debrincat), instead of wasting our picks on the Brian Elliot pickup.

 

And we would be set right now.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

So now we've acquired this over-aged goalie and we put all our development minutes into him instead of our younger top prospects, and he seems to have settled out around that 20th ranking.    We've  developed a backup goalie.   Our Wamsley, our Turek, at the expensive of having any chance of a first string goalie.   And Rittich is older than those backups were then.

 

Clearly you will never be happy.

A 2nd year NHL goalie is showing he is capable of being a (really good) starter and you complain that he's over the hill.

Or is it you complain about Zagidulin, who is older than a lot of goalies but has developed into a good goalie that needs to learn the NA game.

 

I am with you on development not being great here, but part of that is the quality of prospects isn't it.

MM over Demko.  Gillies over anyone else.

Not everything is a slam dunk.

 

I would prefer that they just dump Gillies and move on.

This is pretty much last chance territory, but they are at least giving him a shot.

Probably wasting a year, but whatever.

[jjgallow]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

Clearly you will never be happy.

A 2nd year NHL goalie is showing he is capable of being a (really good) starter and you complain that he's over the hill.

Or is it you complain about Zagidulin, who is older than a lot of goalies but has developed into a good goalie that needs to learn the NA game.

 

I am with you on development not being great here, but part of that is the quality of prospects isn't it.

MM over Demko.  Gillies over anyone else.

Not everything is a slam dunk.

 

I would prefer that they just dump Gillies and move on.

This is pretty much last chance territory, but they are at least giving him a shot.

Probably wasting a year, but whatever.

 

I'll try and shut up, I think it's good that there's support for our goalies.   And yes I am capable of it.   One of these days I'll show you I can be happy in here but I haven't been since about 2007.

 

We have done this many times before, bringing in 26 and 27 year old "rookies".     Players who were Just good enough to be NHL backups at the very peak of their career and every time we get foolled into thinking they have another 10 years of improvement because they're rookies.

 

Anyway I don't have anything against Riitich or his success story when looking at it in isolation.   It's the broader picture where I struggle.

[travel_dude]

4 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

I'll try and shut up, I think it's good that there's support for our goalies.   And yes I am capable of it.   One of these days I'll show you I can be happy in here but I haven't been since about 2007.

 

We have done this many times before, bringing in 26 and 27 year old "rookies".     Players who were Just good enough to be NHL backups at the very peak of their career and every time we get foolled into thinking they have another 10 years of improvement because they're rookies.

 

Anyway I don't have anything against Riitich or his success story when looking at it in isolation.   It's the broader picture where I struggle.

 

I would miss the interaction if you did.  😃

When we get back in the playoffs this year and we don;t have ancient Smith posing as a starter, maybe we can have someting positive to agree on.

[jjgallow]

4 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

I would miss the interaction if you did.  😃

When we get back in the playoffs this year and we don;t have ancient Smith posing as a starter, maybe we can have someting positive to agree on.

 

that would do it lol

[conundrumed]

On 11/29/2019 at 12:25 PM, jjgallow said:

 

I don't want to kill the mood here guys,

You can't really do that by being wrong. lol
Rittich was only 24 when they found him. Plus, he may be 20th ranked, but he's also on, can't argue, what has been a very bad team.

[robrob74]

On 11/29/2019 at 1:17 PM, jjgallow said:

 

I'll try and shut up, I think it's good that there's support for our goalies.   And yes I am capable of it.   One of these days I'll show you I can be happy in here but I haven't been since about 2007.

 

We have done this many times before, bringing in 26 and 27 year old "rookies".     Players who were Just good enough to be NHL backups at the very peak of their career and every time we get foolled into thinking they have another 10 years of improvement because they're rookies.

 

Anyway I don't have anything against Riitich or his success story when looking at it in isolation.   It's the broader picture where I struggle.

 

Rittich is only a year older than Binnington and my bet the only difference is that the Blues are a better all-round team than the Flames. They’re built a bit better throughout their lineup and were in the mix at the start of the season to be the 2nd tier of cup contenders. They weren’t supposed to be last in the league in January. They clearly showed why, and I don’t necessarily think it was just goaltending that brought them over the edge. 
 

I think Ritter should’ve been the clear starter last year. His age is roughly about where most starters start, no? 
anytime before then, they’d have been wasted years anyway. 
 

I say let’s keep Rittich as a starter for another 6 years and develop young again. He will be 33 and seems to have grasped the work it takes to train to be a starter in the NHL.

 

Who knows what will happen, maybe in the meantime we can draft and develop one of our own. 
 

thing about Rittich though, he’s Roughly the same as the core, so he can be the starter while the core is going. 
 

if we don’t win the cup, I have my doubts we can with this group, but it isn’t going to be because of Rittich. I want a clear 1st in the league goalie too, but so do 30-31 other teams. There are about3-5 of those in the league.
 

what I didn’t like was the Brian Elliott’s. 

[travel_dude]

I won't put words in JJ's mouth, but he's of the belief that you draft the winner and they start in the NHL by age 20.

There's so few examples of that.

That's his pie in the sky, pink unicorn.

 

The problem is that you rarely are able to draft that player and draft the rest of the core and keep the right pieces in place long enough to win the cup.

MAF was lucky to play on a team able to outscore teams 6-4 in the playoffs.

Bing was lucky to play on a team that used grit at the right time and depth scoring to finish off the playoffs.

Quick managed a cup because the slow, defensive structure was the right fit at the tight time.

Holtby managed to stop just enough to let a superior team show why they were superior.

 

No magic pill here.

Find the best goalie you can and surround them with the right team at the right time.

 

[jjgallow]

2 hours ago, travel_dude said:

I won't put words in JJ's mouth,

 

 

appreciated.  cause the rest of that was trash lol

[jjgallow]

3 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

Rittich is only a year older than Binnington and my bet the only difference is that

 

that....Binnington won a Stanley Cup two years younger than Rittich is now, and Binnington was an extreme "late bloomer".    That same year, been the 4th-ranked goalie in the NHL.

      And, the previous year, being ranked 5th in the AHL

      And, having previously won a championship in junior

 

Compared to Riitich, who:

 

Has never won a champtionship in any major league or performed particularly well in playoffs

Was 14th in the AHL while being older than Binnington while he was 5th in the AHL

Is currently 18th in the NHL  (which is what's spurring all this enthusiasm) while Binnington is 9th and younger.

 

It is great that Riitich is doing well but the above is the difference.

 

In a nutshell:   Binnington being younger and already significantly better.   I just think we've struggled for so long with our goalies we don't even remember what it's like to be great in net lol.   We're currently taking an extreme example of a late bloomer and hoping it maybe applies to a player who is even older and not nearly as good.

[conundrumed]

40 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

that....Binnington won a Stanley Cup two years younger than Rittich is now, and Binnington was an extreme "late bloomer".    That same year, been the 4th-ranked goalie in the NHL.

      And, the previous year, being ranked 5th in the AHL

      And, having previously won a championship in junior

 

Compared to Riitich, who:

 

Has never won a champtionship in any major league or performed particularly well in playoffs

Was 14th in the AHL while being older than Binnington while he was 5th in the AHL

Is currently 18th in the NHL  (which is what's spurring all this enthusiasm) while Binnington is 9th and younger.

 

It is great that Riitich is doing well but the above is the difference.

 

In a nutshell:   Binnington being younger and already significantly better.   I just think we've struggled for so long with our goalies we don't even remember what it's like to be great in net lol.   We're currently taking an extreme example of a late bloomer and hoping it maybe applies to a player who is even older and not nearly as good.

Why is this Rittich vs Binnington again?

[jjgallow]

13 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Why is this Rittich vs Binnington again?

 

I don't really know sorry I just saw a comparison and responded.   Anyway.   Would love to see Rittich jump up that next level as much as anyone

[robrob74]

22 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

that....Binnington won a Stanley Cup two years younger than Rittich is now, and he was an extreme "late bloomer".    That same year, been the 4th-ranked goalie in the NHL.

      And, the previous year, being ranked 5th in the AHL

      And, having previously won a championship in junior

 

Compared to Riitich, who:

 

Has never won a champtionship in any major league or performed particularly well in playoffs

Was 14th in the AHL while being older than Binnington while he was 5th in the AHL

Is currently 18th in the NHL  (which is what's spurring all this enthusiasm) while Binnington is 9th and younger.

 

It is great that Riitich is doing well but the above is the difference.

 

In a nutshell:   Binnington being younger and already significantly better.   I just think we've struggled for so long with our goalies we don't even remember what it's like to be great in net lol.

 

for me it is context. You can only win with what players you have in front of a goalie, regardless of how good the goalie is. If it were that way, how many cups should Price have by now? How many has he got?

 

some goalies are really good, but even that, how about Brobovsky, Lundqvuist? Luongo? 
 

what about Niemi and Crawford? So many here don’t think they’re bonafide #1’s. At least when Niemi wasn’t and Crawford some think wasn’t in his first cup, but was really good in his second. But the difference is the teams they have in front. 
 

yes you need a good goalie to win but you don’t need a great goalie. And you need a goalie to get hot. 
 

numbers look bad for Rittich right now, but the Flames numbers could be bottom feeding without Rittich. So I think it’s not really fair to judge the guy with what he has done. He had a different route to get here, but last year he should have been a starter, and this year he is showing why. He also worked harder to get his stamina up. 
 

I don’t want to be a Montreal for all of those years where goaltending was the only reason they got into the playoffs. 
 

we now have a goalie, it is painfully evident that the mix is wrong with our F & D. 

[robrob74]

5 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I don't really know sorry I just saw a comparison and responded.   Anyway.   Would love to see Rittich jump up that next level as much as anyone

 

I feel like he has.

 

but the team in front of him took a few huge strides backwards.

 

i was just saying, he’s only a few years older than Binnington. But I see the difference being their team is significantly better, and play a more significantly consistent game. 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

 

appreciated.  cause the rest of that was trash lol

 

I agree.

[conundrumed]

34 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

I don't really know sorry I just saw a comparison and responded.   Anyway.   Would love to see Rittich jump up that next level as much as anyone

Personally, off the record, lol.

I think Rittich's a workhorse.

That's a terrific find. Undoubtedly a top 31 goalie in the world, with more to prove.

So what are you babbling on about? He's been exceptional.

You're being silly.

 

[robrob74]

55 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Personally, off the record, lol.

I think Rittich's a workhorse.

That's a terrific find. Undoubtedly a top 31 goalie in the world, with more to prove.

So what are you babbling on about? He's been exceptional.

You're being silly.

 

 

now go sit in your room and think about what you’ve said.

[ABC923]

Kipper was 25 when he played his first nhl game, and 28 when he suited up for Calgary for the first time.  Was never a starter in the nhl until he came here.  Ritter is young by comparison.

[conundrumed]

Watching the highlights from Smith last night. He made some nice stops, but zero rebound control. Easily why he lost out to Rittich, the better man won.

[conundrumed]

29 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

now go sit in your room and think about what you’ve said.

And no dinner!

[The_People1]

Zagadulin is 9-1-1 in Stockton this season.  Does he deserve a call-up if Talbot can't win?  I haven't seen him play but maybe he's doing something right?

[robrob74]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

Zagadulin is 9-1-1 in Stockton this season.  Does he deserve a call-up if Talbot can't win?  I haven't seen him play but maybe he's doing something right?

 

I think our European goalie scouts sound like they’re starting to do really well.