Goaltending

[cross16]

I am a little frustrated by the fact that Smith was giving ALOT of latitude to find his game but Rittich has 1 bad period and they seem to have gone back to Smith as the starter. 

 

See how how it goes I guess but it's a little frustrating. I get the stats won't back me up but I honestly don't think Smith is even playing thst great. Teams been really good in front of him and he's gotten a little lucky, which happens and he was very unlucky to start the season. There are still a ton of holes in his game. 

[travel_dude]

48 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I am a little frustrated by the fact that Smith was giving ALOT of latitude to find his game but Rittich has 1 bad period and they seem to have gone back to Smith as the starter. 

 

See how how it goes I guess but it's a little frustrating. I get the stats won't back me up but I honestly don't think Smith is even playing thst great. Teams been really good in front of him and he's gotten a little lucky, which happens and he was very unlucky to start the season. There are still a ton of holes in his game. 

 

Well said.

Rittich's last two starts weren't goalie fails, they were more the team in front.

Smith drives you ro drink because of his puck handling.

Yes, there are a lot of them that set up the play.

There are a lot more that result in turnovers in the D-zone or neutral zone.

And his penchant for freezing the puck behind the net drives me crazy.

 

We need both goalies getting a feel for the game, not sitting while the "hot hand" gets the starts.

Rittich is the reason we are not in the basement.

Smith helped once he came back, and while he is making some great saves, he is also looking uncontrolled.

The Scorpion save was because he was swimming.

Last night he gave up a really bad goal that almost truned the tables.

His save right afterwards was a combo of position, luck, the D helping and a weak shot.

 

I think they need to get back to one or two each, not giving it to the "starter".

Determine each start by scouting and circumstance, not so and so played good or bad.

[CheersMan]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

I am a little frustrated by the fact that Smith was giving ALOT of latitude to find his game but Rittich has 1 bad period and they seem to have gone back to Smith as the starter. 

 

See how how it goes I guess but it's a little frustrating. I get the stats won't back me up but I honestly don't think Smith is even playing thst great. Teams been really good in front of him and he's gotten a little lucky, which happens and he was very unlucky to start the season. There are still a ton of holes in his game. 

In his last 5 games Smith is 5-0 with a 0.939 SA%, and your a little frustrated....interesting take. 

 

42 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Well said.

 

Seriously?

[travel_dude]

22 minutes ago, CheersMan said:

In his last 5 games Smith is 5-0 with a 0.939 SA%, and your a little frustrated....interesting take. 

 

Seriously?

 

What he said, and I agreed with is that you give the guy struggling a bunch of losses in a row and still go back to him thinking he can find his game.

If you looked at anything but the numbers, you might see some weakness still in Smith's game.  

Out of position and making the save looks amazing in the highlight reels, but the tendencies are still there.

He's battling through some of them and has looked good overall.

Nobody disputes that.

 

Rittich deserves a big credit to where the Flames are today.  Smith looked like an MVP last season, until he wasn;t.

In other words, don;t forsake the guy that held the fort.  

[robrob74]

8 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I think the G position is still a work in progress.

Smith playing better but still a few wrinkles. 

Rittich has been inconsistent in the past and hopefully that’s ironed out.

I’m very hopeful our goaltending solidifies between now and Christmas from hopeful to stalwart.

Ideally Rittich has given Smith the time he needed and Rittich keeps pressing to limit Smith’s starts.

Rittich’s up there for MVP rn for me. Holding the fort for a hugely struggling Smith is a very big deal imo.

Also consider we’ve had a couple of throwaway losses and we could be 1st in the NHL.

B2B walking into Edmonton, good time for Peters to tell the skaters why they’re first in the West.

C’mon Rittich, I’ve been your biggest fan for a while now, big night tonight will cost me a new jersey...!!

 

I am 427lbs, I might be his biggest fan. 

[conundrumed]

3 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

I am 427lbs, I might be his biggest fan. 

Not a snowballs chance in hell I'm buying that, or you're 8'2".

I get the, "biggest fan" part is unintentionally obnoxious. But it was me giving long-winded over-the-top posts re Rittich's play a long time ago.

Don't accuse me of, "I told you so" either, I despise that mentality.

Just observation by a very former Jr B goalie that Rittich is my kinda goalie and has been since taking over for Gillies in the A playoffs a few years back (when I actually got to watch him enough).

I love Quick as a goalie but I love Rittich as the polar opposite of a highlight reel goalie. He rarely puts himself in needing a highlight reel predicament (although the team puts him there on occasion).

I know this makes me a homer, but keep emotion away from Rittich and he might be the best "science of goaltending" in the league.

Also the polar opposite of Smith.

I honestly think that works in our favour, so long as Rittich simply stays with that and doesn't have to overthink or get caught up in emotion.

Now I'm rambling, but I'm so hopeful for him.

He plays the position the right way. No drama. I really hope this is his year. Just keep doing the same thing whether you give up 1 or 7. Don't get rattled.

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Not a snowballs chance in hell I'm buying that, or you're 8'2".

I get the, "biggest fan" part is unintentionally obnoxious. But it was me giving long-winded over-the-top posts re Rittich's play a long time ago.

Don't accuse me of, "I told you so" either, I despise that mentality.

Just observation by a very former Jr B goalie that Rittich is my kinda goalie and has been since taking over for Gillies in the A playoffs a few years back (when I actually got to watch him enough).

I love Quick as a goalie but I love Rittich as the polar opposite of a highlight reel goalie. He rarely puts himself in needing a highlight reel predicament (although the team puts him there on occasion).

I know this makes me a homer, but keep emotion away from Rittich and he might be the best "science of goaltending" in the league.

Also the polar opposite of Smith.

I honestly think that works in our favour, so long as Rittich simply stays with that and doesn't have to overthink or get caught up in emotion.

Now I'm rambling, but I'm so hopeful for him.

He plays the position the right way. No drama. I really hope this is his year. Just keep doing the same thing whether you give up 1 or 7. Don't get rattled.

 

Yup! 

 

I, never a goalie aside from lacing them up once against alternative high school students (a lot of youth at risk), feel the same. I didn’t like the idea of Rittich when they first signed him because he was taking these starts away from our goalie of the future, and doing very well. As a drafted goalie I wanted Gillies to develop into a great starter. actually seeing them play I changed my mind and was wowed by his positioning and calmness/patience in net. 

 

I almost never wanna see Gillies start a game for Calgary again because I just don’t trust him. But I am rooting for Rittich big time. Gillies reminds me of this year’s Smith. 

 

The bolded was my advice to a 10 ye old girl who was trying net for the first time. She, My coworker’s daughter, has played in net since. I said something like watch the play, stay a step ahead. Think about what it’s like when you play D or F. If you get scored on, don’t worry because goals happen. Keep making saves and Stop the next one.

its like 5+ years later and she is a goalie now.

[conundrumed]

20 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Yup! 

 

I, never a goalie aside from lacing them up once against alternative high school students (a lot of youth at risk), feel the same. I didn’t like the idea of Rittich when they first signed him because he was taking these starts away from our goalie of the future, and doing very well. As a drafted goalie I wanted Gillies to develop into a great starter. actually seeing them play I changed my mind and was wowed by his positioning and calmness/patience in net. 

 

I almost never wanna see Gillies start a game for Calgary again because I just don’t trust him. But I am rooting for Rittich big time. Gillies reminds me of this year’s Smith. 

 

The bolded was my advice to a 10 ye old girl who was trying net for the first time. She, My coworker’s daughter, has played in net since. I said something like watch the play, stay a step ahead. Think about what it’s like when you play D or F. If you get scored on, don’t worry because goals happen. Keep making saves and Stop the next one.

its like 5+ years later and she is a goalie now.

As far as kids go, every kid should play every position and then decide by 14.

And in all honesty.

Look at the Satoshi Nakamoto we waste money on. This is Canada.

Free hockey gear for everyone 0-15.

Every parent will vote that one in. How many kids can't play? Whytf is it a rich man's sport here?

It's sickening. Some National Sport we leverage all income ranges of parents to uphold.

The unfortunate....I guess that's unfortunate.

Does Canada actually have any culture? I thought hockey was a huge one.

But no. Government doesn't really embrace it, our fearless leaders.

Sorry for getting off topic. Just assumed "National Sport" has the connotations of heavy govt funding. Not municipalities struggling to keep rinks open and leagues afloat,

 

[robrob74]

36 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

As far as kids go, every kid should play every position and then decide by 14.

And in all honesty.

Look at the Satoshi Nakamoto we waste money on. This is Canada.

Free hockey gear for everyone 0-15.

Every parent will vote that one in. How many kids can't play? Whytf is it a rich man's sport here?

It's sickening. Some National Sport we leverage all income ranges of parents to uphold.

The unfortunate....I guess that's unfortunate.

Does Canada actually have any culture? I thought hockey was a huge one.

But no. Government doesn't really embrace it, our fearless leaders.

Sorry for getting off topic. Just assumed "National Sport" has the connotations of heavy govt funding. Not municipalities struggling to keep rinks open and leagues afloat,

 

 

I agree!

 

they kind of talked about accessibility to the game in the first intermission. I think every player should be able to play as well.

 

have team gear. For every league and ice time. Over $10,000 per year Is a lot. Is it more these days?

[Cowtownguy]

3 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Not a snowballs chance in hell I'm buying that, or you're 8'2".

I get the, "biggest fan" part is unintentionally obnoxious. But it was me giving long-winded over-the-top posts re Rittich's play a long time ago.

Don't accuse me of, "I told you so" either, I despise that mentality.

Just observation by a very former Jr B goalie that Rittich is my kinda goalie and has been since taking over for Gillies in the A playoffs a few years back (when I actually got to watch him enough).

I love Quick as a goalie but I love Rittich as the polar opposite of a highlight reel goalie. He rarely puts himself in needing a highlight reel predicament (although the team puts him there on occasion).

I know this makes me a homer, but keep emotion away from Rittich and he might be the best "science of goaltending" in the league.

Also the polar opposite of Smith.

I honestly think that works in our favour, so long as Rittich simply stays with that and doesn't have to overthink or get caught up in emotion.

Now I'm rambling, but I'm so hopeful for him.

He plays the position the right way. No drama. I really hope this is his year. Just keep doing the same thing whether you give up 1 or 7. Don't get rattled.

Maybe he is big boned.

[travel_dude]

BSD earned another start.

That was a clinic he put on.

Pefect positioning through the entire game.

One goal on a perfect pass to a wide open player.

 

BSD gets the toughest starts.

1a or 1b he is, not a backup as HNIC refers to him as.

[cross16]

Goalies have been playing well, but some goalie news today with a Flames twist...

 

 

[Fins&FIre15]

14 hours ago, travel_dude said:

BSD earned another start.

That was a clinic he put on.

Pefect positioning through the entire game.

One goal on a perfect pass to a wide open player.

 

BSD gets the toughest starts.

1a or 1b he is, not a backup as HNIC refers to him as.

 

He looked unbeatable most of the night, no panic at all. He has an odd off night like most goalies, but man when he is on, he looks vezina caliber.

[Thebrewcrew]

4 hours ago, cross16 said:

Goalies have been playing well, but some goalie news today with a Flames twist...

 

 

No fit here but I hope Chad gets claimed

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, Fins&FIre15 said:

 

He looked unbeatable most of the night, no panic at all. He has an odd off night like most goalies, but man when he is on, he looks vezina caliber.

 

Regardless of Smith's supposed "turnaround", I would still be feeding Rittich regular starts.  Give Philly to Rittich and Minny to Smith.  Then 2nd game of a B2B (STL) to Rittich.  The next set of games is more difficult.  I've put my preferred starts in ().

Dec. 18 - @DAL  (Smith)

Dec. 20 - vs TBL  (Rittich)

Dec. 22 - vs STL  (Smith)

Dec. 27 - @WPG (Rittich)

Dec. 29 - vs VAN  (Smith)

Dec. 31 - vs SJS  (Rittich)

 

Rittich played well against WPG, relief against STL 

Smith played well against Minny, VAN; 5 goals against playing STL.

The one sure thing for me is that Rittich plays well against the high event teams.

Maybe he is fixed.  If that's the case, run Rittich against TBL and STL, then Smith against WPG and VAN.

 

[cccsberg]

On 2018-12-09 at 9:23 AM, cross16 said:

I am a little frustrated by the fact that Smith was giving ALOT of latitude to find his game but Rittich has 1 bad period and they seem to have gone back to Smith as the starter. 

 

See how how it goes I guess but it's a little frustrating. I get the stats won't back me up but I honestly don't think Smith is even playing thst great. Teams been really good in front of him and he's gotten a little lucky, which happens and he was very unlucky to start the season. There are still a ton of holes in his game. 

Both are currently playing well.  Why not sit back and enjoy it?

[cccsberg]

On 2018-12-09 at 10:21 AM, travel_dude said:

 

Well said.

Rittich's last two starts weren't goalie fails, they were more the team in front.

Smith drives you ro drink because of his puck handling.

Yes, there are a lot of them that set up the play.

There are a lot more that result in turnovers in the D-zone or neutral zone.

And his penchant for freezing the puck behind the net drives me crazy.

 

We need both goalies getting a feel for the game, not sitting while the "hot hand" gets the starts.

Rittich is the reason we are not in the basement.

Smith helped once he came back, and while he is making some great saves, he is also looking uncontrolled.

The Scorpion save was because he was swimming.

Last night he gave up a really bad goal that almost truned the tables.

His save right afterwards was a combo of position, luck, the D helping and a weak shot.

 

I think they need to get back to one or two each, not giving it to the "starter".

Determine each start by scouting and circumstance, not so and so played good or bad.

Honestly, TD, you're seeming more and more like a negative Nancy that can find something to nitpick no matter the situation.  To say Smith has "a lot more that result in turnovers" versus setting up the D is so far from reality it's laughable.  Sure it happens a handful of times a game but far, far from most likely.  If you want to seek out "bad" goals, we can easily find them for both of the goalies.  We can also find many exceptional stops.  We now have both goalies playing well.  I'm not seeing a problem here.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, cccsberg said:

Honestly, TD, you're seeming more and more like a negative Nancy that can find something to nitpick no matter the situation.  To say Smith has "a lot more that result in turnovers" versus setting up the D is so far from reality it's laughable.  Sure it happens a handful of times a game but far, far from most likely.  If you want to seek out "bad" goals, we can easily find them for both of the goalies.  We can also find many exceptional stops.  We now have both goalies playing well.  I'm not seeing a problem here.

 

To ignore the obvious is worse than what I say.

 

[travel_dude]

Let me be a bit more specific, so as not to confuse criticism with being a Neg. Nancy.

Smith has a few different things that he does:

1) stop the puck behind the net on a dump in

2) play a soft shot with his stick to his D after he gloves it down

3) make short passes with no traffic to his D

4) make longer passes in traffic to his D or a forward back in the zone

5) fire the puck up the glass

6) hang onto the puck behind the net with forecheckers coming at him and the defense less than 3 feet away

7) freeze the puck behind the net against the boards

8) fire a long pass to a streaking forward

 

I have zero issues with 1, 2, 3, and 8 if they are safe.  Even 4 can be made safely sometimes.

5 can result in a turnover, and mostly does because you are clearing the puck not moving it from goalie to D to F.

6 and 7 can work, but is risky most of the time.

8 can be picked off if not perfectly executed, much like the stretch pass doesn't always work.

 

I may be a minority here, but I prefer to control the breakout starting with a short pass to the D.  Use the goalie to do it in an emergency only.

 

[cross16]

2 hours ago, cccsberg said:

Both are currently playing well.  Why not sit back and enjoy it?

 

I will. But doesn't mean I can't be frustrated that it sure seems pretty clear that the org is really committed to Smith being the starter. 

[CheersMan]

10 hours ago, travel_dude said:

Let me be a bit more specific, so as not to confuse criticism with being a Neg. Nancy.

Smith has a few different things that he does:

1) stop the puck behind the net on a dump in

2) play a soft shot with his stick to his D after he gloves it down

3) make short passes with no traffic to his D

4) make longer passes in traffic to his D or a forward back in the zone

5) fire the puck up the glass

6) hang onto the puck behind the net with forecheckers coming at him and the defense less than 3 feet away

7) freeze the puck behind the net against the boards

8) fire a long pass to a streaking forward

 

I have zero issues with 1, 2, 3, and 8 if they are safe.  Even 4 can be made safely sometimes.

5 can result in a turnover, and mostly does because you are clearing the puck not moving it from goalie to D to F.

6 and 7 can work, but is risky most of the time.

8 can be picked off if not perfectly executed, much like the stretch pass doesn't always work.

 

I may be a minority here, but I prefer to control the breakout starting with a short pass to the D.  Use the goalie to do it in an emergency only.

 

Your list is a little thin for a giving time of year. How about adding;

-Veteran leader who continues to mentor Rittich.

-Acts as a 3^rd dman with his ability to handle and play the puck.

-Alters the opposition game plan by forcing them to think twice before sending one or two men in on the fore check.

-Reduced opposition fore check results in reduced hits on our dmen, reduced dmen injury, reduced forced giveaways by our dmen, reduced energy expelled by our dmen from not having to necessarily race back to initially handle the puck, and allowing the dmen to save their energy for other areas of a 60-minute game.

-If the opposition commits to the fore check, Smith has the ability to dish off to a dman on either side or get the puck up the ice quickly to friendly sticks.

You make it sound like all Smith does is “off the glass and out”. Sure he is forced to do it on occasion, no more than some dmen are forced to do it on occasion, if that is the only play the opposition gives you then you do it, but there is much more to Smiths game than that.

Now if I had a complaint or two, I’d say he sometime hangs onto the puck too long creating that “Oh My God” play and on occasion gets caught out of his net in traffic. Nobody likes that.

I have no problem with how the goaltending starts have been handed out, with Smith getting the longer rope. What we should be happy about is Rittich closing the gap and possibly surpassing Smith by seasons end.  That was the game plan after all when Smith was brought in here on a 2 yr deal. Rittich will have his turn.

Having said that, I don’t care who they start tomorrow, which is a great situation for us to be in.

[travel_dude]

8 minutes ago, CheersMan said:

You make it sound like all Smith does is “off the glass and out”. Sure he is forced to do it on occasion, no more than some dmen are forced to do it on occasion, if that is the only play the opposition gives you then you do it, but there is much more to Smiths game than that.

Now if I had a complaint or two, I’d say he sometime hangs onto the puck too long creating that “Oh My God” play and on occasion gets caught out of his net in traffic. Nobody likes that.

 

I gave you a list of 8 things, not 1.  I clearly pointed out the ones that bother me or can come back to haunt you.  Off the glass and out....Why is the goalie doing that?  It's different if a D-man does it, because it has a better chance of actually making it past the winger.  And I don;t really like that as an option either, unless you are killing a penalty.  

 

The point is that possession is what this team thrives on.  Make the stop, make the short pass, allow the team to control the puck going up the ice.  Seems to make sense.  Or, you can fire the puck away, get a short breather, and face another wave.  That's my beef.    

[CheersMan]

2 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I gave you a list of 8 things, not 1.  I clearly pointed out the ones that bother me or can come back to haunt you.  Off the glass and out....Why is the goalie doing that?  It's different if a D-man does it, because it has a better chance of actually making it past the winger.  And I don;t really like that as an option either, unless you are killing a penalty.  

 

The point is that possession is what this team thrives on.  Make the stop, make the short pass, allow the team to control the puck going up the ice.  Seems to make sense.  Or, you can fire the puck away, get a short breather, and face another wave.  That's my beef.    

I think our possession game has improved immensely, it really has. Unfortunately we can not possess the puck the entire time, sometimes you have to send it.  

[robrob74]

11 hours ago, CheersMan said:

I think our possession game has improved immensely, it really has. Unfortunately we can not possess the puck the entire time, sometimes you have to send it.  

 

When you put it that way, it made me think of when Russians started to come over and their game seemed to be more possession centered. It has taken about 25 years to transform the game into that style of play. 

[travel_dude]

11 hours ago, CheersMan said:

I think our possession game has improved immensely, it really has. Unfortunately we can not possess the puck the entire time, sometimes you have to send it.  

 

And that's the point isn't it.  The D are usually better at judging that.  When they have the puck they have many options.  When Smith decides to fire the puck on glass, he is making the decision for the team and they have to regroup.  My beef is that most times that clearing attempt doesn't even clear the zone.  When Smith is playing well, the extra shot or two because of the zone not being cleared may not be an issue.  The extra zone time, however, can be taxing on the D.