conundrumed Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 I know the instant comparisons to Ramo are gonna start flowing when i say this, but The Finnish Goalie Koskinen would look great in the system. Does anybody know , do we have to trade for his rights from NYI , or can we just sign him ? I see the Wild already snapped up Vey He completed his ELC with the Isles, they hold no rights to him. The Finns were a trapping team this tourney and turned up some offence when they had to. So while his numbers were great, they were far from from stand alone numbers. Tough to sign a goalie you haven't previously been scouting in a small tourney behind one of the best teams. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 He completed his ELC with the Isles, they hold no rights to him. The Finns were a trapping team this tourney and turned up some offence when they had to. So while his numbers were great, they were far from from stand alone numbers. Tough to sign a goalie you haven't previously been scouting in a small tourney behind one of the best teams. Thats kind of like Ramo tho .. he completed his contract with Tampa and then went to Russia.. his rights got traded to MTL, then we got them from MTL and true , but even his team / league Numbers are pretty good. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=112570 and dont kid yourself.. this wont be the first time we've seen him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 Thats kind of like Ramo tho .. he completed his contract with Tampa and then went to Russia.. his rights got traded to MTL, then we got them from MTL and true , but even his team / league Numbers are pretty good. http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=112570 and dont kid yourself.. this wont be the first time we've seen him Well, let me be blunt then. We did nothing while Kipper was king but draft failures, acquire cheap crappy backups and never find a replacement. He retires, we keep boardinging around, trying to do it on the cheap, trying to buy time, etc. etc. MTL proved just how lousy the roster actually is when they lost Price. LA could lose Quick, they had Bernier, they had Jones as understudies. It's high time, Kipper's gone, he isn't coming back, we HAVE to get serious in net. Best goalie not in the NHL doesn't cut it anymore. It has gotten beyond serious. Now we'll bring in a Finn from the K.... No. Find money, get a goalie. I'm good with giving up a yr for that, next yr. That'll be a total of 3, I'll give you a pass, years. The first 2 he inflicted on himself. Treat the position seriously. Reimer wants to be a starter, here's $3, do it then. Nothing over 2 yr deals, preferably 1, for most, not digging the availables list atm. I've always been good with Vasilevsky, and after the "stick throwing incident", I like him even more. Too funny with the analysts "you can't disrespect your players like that. They'll talk to him I'm sure". Great emotion from Vasilevsky, I'm sure "the talk" went well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 Well, let me be blunt then. We did nothing while Kipper was king but draft failures, acquire cheap crappy backups and never find a replacement. He retires, we keep boardinging around, trying to do it on the cheap, trying to buy time, etc. etc. MTL proved just how lousy the roster actually is when they lost Price. LA could lose Quick, they had Bernier, they had Jones as understudies. It's high time, Kipper's gone, he isn't coming back, we HAVE to get serious in net. Best goalie not in the NHL doesn't cut it anymore. It has gotten beyond serious. Now we'll bring in a Finn from the K.... No. Find money, get a goalie. I'm good with giving up a yr for that, next yr. That'll be a total of 3, I'll give you a pass, years. The first 2 he inflicted on himself. Treat the position seriously. Reimer wants to be a starter, here's $3, do it then. Nothing over 2 yr deals, preferably 1, for most, not digging the availables list atm. I've always been good with Vasilevsky, and after the "stick throwing incident", I like him even more. Too funny with the analysts "you can't disrespect your players like that. They'll talk to him I'm sure". Great emotion from Vasilevsky, I'm sure "the talk" went well. see but again , Im not talking about bringing in goalies and saying " one of you will be our starter".. ala Ramo and Berra.part 2..no .. absolutely not We still need a starter next year who is not a gamble .. I get that But I'm also not a believer in having no competition throughout the organization either. Like having Gillies in Stockton and just some guy to play when he needs a break. nope, how about some guy that wants the job too? just suggesting a guy Like Koskinen (or another similar one)could be an upgrade to the backup position -- and if one does end up taking the job ? Great ! If we bring in a guy that takes Ortio's job ?.. oh well .. that just means we just got better at the position .. we have potentially 6 or more quality pro goalie positions open and right now im pretty sure we only have one filled (Gilies) Fill the pipeline.. but fill it with competition Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 I'd say more maybe 2-3 goalie seats. Just so happens 2 are potentially at the very top. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 I'd say more maybe 2-3 goalie seats. Just so happens 2 are potentially at the very top. I count at least 6 pro spots.. 2 each in Calgary, Stockton and Adirondack. Each of those spots should have a body you envision as having potential Calgary Starter upside. Stop signing the fillers. That doesn't include the ones you can leave in college, Junior and Europe. not sure what Macdonald's status is next year , but assuming we resign Ortio, and Mac plays as well and we get a #1-- that leaves about 3 spots in our organization that needs a serious prospect Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 Well, let me be blunt then. We did nothing while Kipper was king but draft failures, acquire cheap crappy backups and never find a replacement. He retires, we keep boardinging around, trying to do it on the cheap, trying to buy time, etc. etc. MTL proved just how lousy the roster actually is when they lost Price. LA could lose Quick, they had Bernier, they had Jones as understudies. It's high time, Kipper's gone, he isn't coming back, we HAVE to get serious in net. Best goalie not in the NHL doesn't cut it anymore. It has gotten beyond serious. Now we'll bring in a Finn from the K.... No. Find money, get a goalie. I'm good with giving up a yr for that, next yr. That'll be a total of 3, I'll give you a pass, years. The first 2 he inflicted on himself. Treat the position seriously. Reimer wants to be a starter, here's $3, do it then. Nothing over 2 yr deals, preferably 1, for most, not digging the availables list atm. I've always been good with Vasilevsky, and after the "stick throwing incident", I like him even more. Too funny with the analysts "you can't disrespect your players like that. They'll talk to him I'm sure". Great emotion from Vasilevsky, I'm sure "the talk" went well. We drafted goalies, but they never developed to plan. All were smaller guys until Gillies and MacDonald. Ok, so now we have two in the pipeline that can be developed right, since they have the things needed to be a NHL goalie these days. Fine, but that's years away. I am ok with finding a goalie in FA, assuming they have been scouted well enough to know what they really are. Reimer seems about the same as Bernier on a Leafs team. He may be the best option available this summer. My preference would be to get Andersen, assuming the cost is realistic. He has shown to be a starter and is still young enough to last many years. After that, I would look at Vasilevskiy. Tampa still has another guy waiting in the wings. They have cap issues and need to sign some players. Perhaps we can help them out there too. So we send em Ortio and some pieces for Vasilevskiy and Killorn. Yes, it needs to be a good offer, but it helps their cap. Ortio is insurance in case Gudlevskis isn't ready for the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 22, 2016 Report Share Posted May 22, 2016 We drafted goalies, but they never developed to plan. All were smaller guys until Gillies and MacDonald. Ok, so now we have two in the pipeline that can be developed right, since they have the things needed to be a NHL goalie these days. Fine, but that's years away. I am ok with finding a goalie in FA, assuming they have been scouted well enough to know what they really are. Reimer seems about the same as Bernier on a Leafs team. He may be the best option available this summer. My preference would be to get Andersen, assuming the cost is realistic. He has shown to be a starter and is still young enough to last many years. After that, I would look at Vasilevskiy. Tampa still has another guy waiting in the wings. They have cap issues and need to sign some players. Perhaps we can help them out there too. So we send em Ortio and some pieces for Vasilevskiy and Killorn. Yes, it needs to be a good offer, but it helps their cap. Ortio is insurance in case Gudlevskis isn't ready for the NHL. I'm still of the opinion we cant get Andersen.. so long as Anahaeim controls where he goes, he goes as far away from them as they can send him .. but that being said, Kudos if we pull it off I have a strong sense Reimer may be the perfect storm - he has enough knocks (not many games in a season .. never truly locking down a #1 spot..etc.. ) that he may need to sign a 1-2 yr deal and prove he can be a solid quality starter before cashing in . And if he does sign , it will be as a starter so he can do just that . i think you can get him on a 1-2 yr 3-4M.. which is ideal for us I like the fact he put up solid numbers on a bad team .. then only got better on a good team Im really curious what Pittsburgh does too.. Rutherford comes out and says MAF isnt going enywhere , but if expansion hits, its likely one has to go .. and i really dont see Murray going anywhere.. im actually hoping MAF goes lights out for the Pens now, might make Murray available I just feel , outside of signing Reimer, our #1 next year is gonna be one we didnt see coming ..much like we didnt see getting Hamilton coming either Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I'm still of the opinion we cant get Andersen.. so long as Anahaeim controls where he goes, he goes as far away from them as they can send him .. but that being said, Kudos if we pull it off I have a strong sense Reimer may be the perfect storm - he has enough knocks (not many games in a season .. never truly locking down a #1 spot..etc.. ) that he may need to sign a 1-2 yr deal and prove he can be a solid quality starter before cashing in . And if he does sign , it will be as a starter so he can do just that . i think you can get him on a 1-2 yr 3-4M.. which is ideal for us I like the fact he put up solid numbers on a bad team .. then only got better on a good team Im really curious what Pittsburgh does too.. Rutherford comes out and says MAF isnt going enywhere , but if expansion hits, its likely one has to go .. and i really dont see Murray going anywhere.. im actually hoping MAF goes lights out for the Pens now, might make Murray available I just feel , outside of signing Reimer, our #1 next year is gonna be one we didnt see coming ..much like we didnt see getting Hamilton coming either I think that it really depends on what we can offer to them. It's not like there will be many trading partners this summer. If (a big if) the expansion is set for 2017, there will be a few teams in peril of losing a goalie for nothing. Anaheim has cap issues to deal with as well. They have 4 RFAs that they really want to keep. plus Andersen. Sure, they can let a few pending UFA's walk, but they still need to ice a team. They would be better off taking Ortio as part of the payment (haha) as he would be a cheap re-sign. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Redslinger Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 Im really curious what Pittsburgh does too.. Rutherford comes out and says MAF isnt going enywhere , but if expansion hits, its likely one has to go .. and i really dont see Murray going anywhere.. im actually hoping MAF goes lights out for the Pens now, might make Murray available Does Murray even need to be protected? My understanding is 1st and 2nd year players are exempt. If so, the Pens can protect Fleury and keep both goalies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I think that it really depends on what we can offer to them. It's not like there will be many trading partners this summer. If (a big if) the expansion is set for 2017, there will be a few teams in peril of losing a goalie for nothing. Anaheim has cap issues to deal with as well. They have 4 RFAs that they really want to keep. plus Andersen. Sure, they can let a few pending UFA's walk, but they still need to ice a team. They would be better off taking Ortio as part of the payment (haha) as he would be a cheap re-sign. I think a few eastern teams will be looking. Toronto for sure, and if we are bidding against them no way we win. Carolina I can see looking, not sure how confident they are with lack, and to a much lesser degree Maybe Buffalo as well Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 Does Murray even need to be protected? My understanding is 1st and 2nd year players are exempt. If so, the Pens can protect Fleury and keep both goalies. Yep he just finished his 2nd complete pro season, so he'll be a 3rd year. I take whst Rutherford said with a grain of salt..I mean whats he supposed to say? MAF has a NMC and if speculation is true they will be forced to protect him. If it came down to it I cant believe they dont keep Murray so they will need to trade MAF. If they expose Murray hes as good as gone. I think Pittsburgh is top on the danger list to lose a goalie, so the best option to make a teade is with them Anaheim has enough other players a team may take instead of their goalies, Tampa could choose to not sign Bishop til after the expansion draft and protect Vasilevsky. Pittsburgh jumps out st me as the team that HAS to trade one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 Does Murray even need to be protected? My understanding is 1st and 2nd year players are exempt. If so, the Pens can protect Fleury and keep both goalies. It doesn't matter if it's AHL or NHL. Any players that started their pro career prior to the 2015/16 season have to be protected. Murray started his pro career in WB-Scranton in 2014/15. For clarity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I count at least 6 pro spots.. 2 each in Calgary, Stockton and Adirondack. Each of those spots should have a body you envision as having potential Calgary Starter upside. Stop signing the fillers. That doesn't include the ones you can leave in college, Junior and Europe. not sure what Macdonald's status is next year , but assuming we resign Ortio, and Mac plays as well and we get a #1-- that leaves about 3 spots in our organization that needs a serious prospect MacDonald is eligible for the A/E next year, we also have Nick Schneider on his ELC for 2 more years. Kevin Poulin is RFA. Add Gillies and Ortio, we're down to 2 if no moves are made and we let Poulin walk.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I would too, if he drops far enough. I'm not sure if I'd use #35, but at #53 or #55, I'd go for it. I found these draft rankings on Gustavsson: 28th - THN 29th - Sportsnet 29th - Draft Site 43rd - Bob McKenzie 46th - Craig Button 49th - LWS Just a question: if goalie is a priority why would you not draft a quality prospect goalie ? I suppose it depends on two things, who is BPA come the time of the pick and if BT could use that particular pick in a deal to get a NHL goalie with some experience. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 MacDonald is eligible for the A/E next year, we also have Nick Schneider on his ELC for 2 more years. Kevin Poulin is RFA. Add Gillies and Ortio, we're down to 2 if no moves are made and we let Poulin walk.. Ok cool I forgot about Schneider, youre right he will be on the farm next year. Poulin should be allowed to walk, he doesnt project. So that means we need our starter, and one other high end prospect on the farm. Perfect time to take a gamble on a European free agent Biggest thing is you need an nhl ready call up on the farm. Ideally I see McDonald and Schneider manning the E, mystery man and likely Ortio on the big club, and Gillies on the farm. We need to replace Poulin with that high end guy Just a question: if goalie is a priority why would you not draft a quality prospect goalie ? I suppose it depends on two things, who is BPA come the time of the pick and if BT could use that particular pick in a deal to get a NHL goalie with some experience. If we use our 3 2nd rounders I fully expect one to be. Barring a dropper from the 1st round would not surprise me if its at 35 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
conundrumed Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I can see Toronto taking Filip Gustavsson at 29 or 31. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
420since1974 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I agree that a NHL goalie is priority # 1 for this season. If one or more of the three 2nd round picks are necessary to obtain one, use them. If not, take the BPA. Personally, I'm nervous about drafting a goalie in the Top 60, as the Flames don't have a great track record drafting goalies in the first 2 rounds: Jason Muzzatti - 21st Trevor Kidd - 11th Evan Lindsay - 32nd Brent Krahn - 9th Andrei Medevev - 56th Leland Irving - 26th Mason McDonald - 34th (jury still out) Then again, I'm not a GM or scout. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I agree that a NHL goalie is priority # 1 for this season. If one or more of the three 2nd round picks are necessary to obtain one, use them. If not, take the BPA. Personally, I'm nervous about drafting a goalie in the Top 60, as the Flames don't have a great track record drafting goalies in the first 2 rounds: Jason Muzzatti - 21st Trevor Kidd - 11th Evan Lindsay - 32nd Brent Krahn - 9th Andrei Medevev - 56th Leland Irving - 26th Mason McDonald - 34th (jury still out) Then again, I'm not a GM or scout. I hear you, whatever happened with Kraun ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I hear you, whatever happened with Kraun ? Couldn't stay healthy. Most knee and groin injuries but I even think his back started to go towards the end. When're he could stay healthy he actually would look really good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I agree that a NHL goalie is priority # 1 for this season. If one or more of the three 2nd round picks are necessary to obtain one, use them. If not, take the BPA. Personally, I'm nervous about drafting a goalie in the Top 60, as the Flames don't have a great track record drafting goalies in the first 2 rounds: Jason Muzzatti - 21st Trevor Kidd - 11th Evan Lindsay - 32nd Brent Krahn - 9th Andrei Medevev - 56th Leland Irving - 26th Mason McDonald - 34th (jury still out) Then again, I'm not a GM or scout. I actually still support the Trevor Kidd pick. He came in as everything he was billed to be. Legitimately took the job from Vernon. I blame Pierre Page for ruining him after that. Plus I belueve there was a car accident in there somewhere. Yes, Medvedev had some serious weight issues, but the kid could stop a puck. He was a Craig Button pick and when Sutter came in we didnt even try to look at him again...he likely would have been a bust, but we'll never know. Brent Krahn I think as well had a car accident , sonehow blew his knees out..he did have some promise otherwise. But true, with an asterisk beside Kidd, our history has not been good Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I can see Toronto taking Filip Gustavsson at 29 or 31. That seems to be where some mock drafts put him. Toronto needs less draft picks and more NHL players unless they want to follow the Oilers or BJ's method of competing in the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 I agree that a NHL goalie is priority # 1 for this season. If one or more of the three 2nd round picks are necessary to obtain one, use them. If not, take the BPA. Personally, I'm nervous about drafting a goalie in the Top 60, as the Flames don't have a great track record drafting goalies in the first 2 rounds: Jason Muzzatti - 21st Trevor Kidd - 11th Evan Lindsay - 32nd Brent Krahn - 9th Andrei Medevev - 56th Leland Irving - 26th Mason McDonald - 34th (jury still out) Then again, I'm not a GM or scout. He reality is though is you could do this for just about every other team in the league. Top 60 goalies not panning out isn't only a flames issue its a league wide issue. They are just extremely tough to develop. Not saying the flames are fine at it because they arnt I just don't think the issue is that specific to the flames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 That seems to be where some mock drafts put him. Toronto needs less draft picks and more NHL players unless they want to follow the Oilers or BJ's method of competing in the NHL. I can totally see it ..TO already has the top prize and their goalie cupboard is more bare than ours.. but Im ok with that , I actually want the Finn Veini Vehvilainen.. call me bias , but the Finns are a Goalie factory . and the last few high end Swedes have not really impressed me . I think we may even be able to use one of our later 2nds to get him 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted May 23, 2016 Report Share Posted May 23, 2016 Fleury looked a little shaky last night with a .840 SV%... Still have to wonder about playoff jitters... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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