24-25 Training Camp

[conundrumed]

8 hours ago, tmac70 said:

He isn't worth a first. Kadri to MTL for our first back + would make sense. The fact that Pelts thinks he is dealing from a position of strength is funny. If I am Conroy, don't sign him and let him rot. 

I think we're getting a little ahead on blaming Pelletier, as we can only surmise what the hold up is. I know when I assume the word always falls apart to Hash Rate of u & me. lol

Both Solovyov and Schwindt have yet to sign, also. Could be a number of reasons. The QO has expired on all 3, so none of them loved the idea/offer/concept. I'm sure they'll all get done soon.

Everyone would love to squeeze another 10-20% out of their employer. For me, it's more like 50%, because if you're going to have goals, they may as well be unrealistic.

[travel_dude]

7 hours ago, robrob74 said:

I forget where I saw but some were saying he wants a deal that allows him to be easily claimed? Maybe my interpretation is wrong ? 
 

is he worth a 2nd? 
 

i dunno, this bothers me a bit. Like what has he done? Did ok so far, and hasn't really solidified a spot. 
 

I wish in some cases a team could get compensated for losing a waiver player, but every team goes through it... 

 

We had him for the latter part of one season.  It was under Sutter and he paid the proce for a few mistakes.  I felt when he was given ice he used it well.  Was a kid that meshed well with Huberdeau.  Unfortunately, he had a major injury at camp and never got much of a chance to ramp up.  We were trading mostly D at the TDL.  We had more than enough players to fill the team.  He is better off when he fights out of camp for a job. 

 

I would not consider trading him for a pick.  Maybe, just maybe you trade him for a similar prospect because he's not making the team out of camp.  That only makes sense if the prospect is waiver exempt.  But, I don't think trading him makes a lot of sense right now.  

 

BTW, it was me that started that discussion about him wanting to be claimed.  Like I said it was not really a confirmed rumour, just some report of his agent saying that.  This happens every year to every team.  A player may not exactly like the terms of a new deal, but he has little leverage.  Sitting out camp while waiting for a deal is pointless.  He may get signed and then what?  Players are solidifying their spots and the waiver guys are all fighting to stay with the club.  If they holds off signing until after day 1, then they need to deal with the waiver immediately.  Fine if they have a free roster spot.  The same is true of Schwindt.  Two players that are good enough to play in the NHL this season and have to show they displace somebody else.

[travel_dude]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I think we're getting a little ahead on blaming Pelletier, as we can only surmise what the hold up is. I know when I assume the word always falls apart to Hash Rate of u & me. lol

Both Solovyov and Schwindt have yet to sign, also. Could be a number of reasons. The QO has expired on all 3, so none of them loved the idea/offer/concept. I'm sure they'll all get done soon.

Everyone would love to squeeze another 10-20% out of their employer. For me, it's more like 50%, because if you're going to have goals, they may as well be unrealistic.

 

Other than the QO, we really don't know if another offer has been tabled.  It may be the Flames holding up things.  Of the player wants a better AHL portion of a two way deal.  Duehr and Hunt both signed so no good reason for Pelts not to sign.  Duehr has a minors salary the same as NHL, but Hunt is 350k in the AHL.  Solo has arbitration rights but never exercized them.  Weird.

[conundrumed]

I'm really interested to see Pospisil's development. He looked fantastic at the World Championship. 25 in November, his confidence seems to be growing by leaps and bounds. Really interested to see how far he can elevate.

I may have to get his jersey. You heard it here first. lol

I love players that put the effort in, gain traction, and exude confidence thereafter. My fave kind of player.

As @cross16 mentioned, the injury history is a concern. If I'm putting a positive spin on it, perhaps it only made his dev lag, but we'll be good from here on in...😬

[cberg]

46 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I'm really interested to see Pospisil's development. He looked fantastic at the World Championship. 25 in November, his confidence seems to be growing by leaps and bounds. Really interested to see how far he can elevate.

I may have to get his jersey. You heard it here first. lol

I love players that put the effort in, gain traction, and exude confidence thereafter. My fave kind of player.

As @cross16 mentioned, the injury history is a concern. If I'm putting a positive spin on it, perhaps it only made his dev lag, but we'll be good from here on in...😬

Agreed, with Zary, Pospisil, Morton and others the Flames may already have the makings of a solid C core, depending on development.  

[conundrumed]

12 minutes ago, cberg said:

Agreed, with Zary, Pospisil, Morton and others the Flames may already have the makings of a solid C core, depending on development.  

I think all 3 trend as wingers, though Pospisil's style leads me to believe he can be a C.

Lots of hope that Sharangovich can translate to C.

Will be interesting to see how FO% develops. Successful Cs grow the attitude that makes them formidable at the dot. Most start bad at the dot, then you see the confidence grow, and all of a sudden they're kind of a real pita in all the elements of play. lol

One thing for certain, it's hard to have an effective PP and PK without winning more than your fair share of face-offs.

I recall years ago at camp, someone yelled up to Conroy, "Is Mony ever going to win a draw"? Conny yelled back, "I've told him, Just Win One, it gets easier".

I hated losing Mony, because he became a PP-faceoff demon. The Flames PP history is head-shaking, but it wasn't for not getting possession. Imo, just too much standing still. Alternatively, Detroit and Van's thrive on chaos. Edmonton's, well...being down a man with McDavid on the ice generally won't end well.

I really like the chaos approach. It's really fun to watch the crazy puck touches everywhere.

If I'm a betting man, I'd say Sharangovich wants things to happen faster, so I'm hoping he eventually gets his way. I honestly think it took him a while last year due to getting used to the Flames' lethargic pace and how to fit in.

It's kind of fun the Flames have Pospisil and Sharangovich from the weak '18 draft, where we only had late round picks.

I was taken aback that NJ did that for Toffoli. I'd seen Sharky with them half a dozen times and was always impressed.

[travel_dude]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I'm really interested to see Pospisil's development. He looked fantastic at the World Championship. 25 in November, his confidence seems to be growing by leaps and bounds. Really interested to see how far he can elevate.

I may have to get his jersey. You heard it here first. lol

I love players that put the effort in, gain traction, and exude confidence thereafter. My fave kind of player.

As @cross16 mentioned, the injury history is a concern. If I'm putting a positive spin on it, perhaps it only made his dev lag, but we'll be good from here on in...😬

 

I will need to wait a bit before I jinx another player.  Gaudreau, Tkachuk, Monahan.....

Not serious there,  The GM set the conditions for those three to leave.

Two were decisions made by the player, but it was possible they would all three still be Flames.

 

Anyway, 24/25 TC....

I am interested to see the lines tried out in camp.

See if we can get away from the default ones and the prospect only lines.

We have two former prospects that cemented themselves as NHL players.

We have a former injured C that came back and had some success.

We have a tweener that didn't quite cement himslef.

We have a top prospects that lost his status due to a brutal injury.

We have young guys that might forge their way onto the opening night roster.

Then again, we have more than enough guys that require waivers.

 

I hate when roster decisions are guided by cap and waiver exemptness.

We don't need to worry about cap, but the other is a real.

[cberg]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I think all 3 trend as wingers, though Pospisil's style leads me to believe he can be a C.

Lots of hope that Sharangovich can translate to C.

Will be interesting to see how FO% develops. Successful Cs grow the attitude that makes them formidable at the dot. Most start bad at the dot, then you see the confidence grow, and all of a sudden they're kind of a real pita in all the elements of play. lol

One thing for certain, it's hard to have an effective PP and PK without winning more than your fair share of face-offs.

I recall years ago at camp, someone yelled up to Conroy, "Is Mony ever going to win a draw"? Conny yelled back, "I've told him, Just Win One, it gets easier".

I hated losing Mony, because he became a PP-faceoff demon. The Flames PP history is head-shaking, but it wasn't for not getting possession. Imo, just too much standing still. Alternatively, Detroit and Van's thrive on chaos. Edmonton's, well...being down a man with McDavid on the ice generally won't end well.

I really like the chaos approach. It's really fun to watch the crazy puck touches everywhere.

If I'm a betting man, I'd say Sharangovich wants things to happen faster, so I'm hoping he eventually gets his way. I honestly think it took him a while last year due to getting used to the Flames' lethargic pace and how to fit in.

It's kind of fun the Flames have Pospisil and Sharangovich from the weak '18 draft, where we only had late round picks.

I was taken aback that NJ did that for Toffoli. I'd seen Sharky with them half a dozen times and was always impressed.

Most players are kids when drafted, and take multiple years to develop their game, along with physically, mentally and socially maturing during those years.  I have little doubt that if they put in the hours, are receptive to learning and practice it is possible to transform massively into something special.  It depends on development and if given the chance, could happen with any of these guys, even if they currently are more suited as wingers…. I believe Conroy is a lot more receptive to such transformations, and we saw inklings of that last season.  This is season two, I’m betting it continues.

[conundrumed]

I'm kind of surprised that finding Flames info on the rookie camp/tourney roster is = to, > than pulling teeth.

The Wings have had it up for a week (50% are undrafted invitees, wow).

What's the big secret?

[travel_dude]

50 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I'm kind of surprised that finding Flames info on the rookie camp/tourney roster is = to, > than pulling teeth.

The Wings have had it up for a week (50% are undrafted invitees, wow).

What's the big secret?

 

Only thing I can find is a Captain Obvious piece about who isn't attending.  And one about who is showing up.  I think a lot of the press is/was about Gaudreau, so it may be taking time to get past it.

I couldn't watch today's thing, even if I had the time off.

 

It's really a matter of the stages of grief, and I think a lot of posts show the different stages.    

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

Only thing I can find is a Captain Obvious piece about who isn't attending.  And one about who is showing up.  I think a lot of the press is/was about Gaudreau, so it may be taking time to get past it.

I couldn't watch today's thing, even if I had the time off.

 

It's really a matter of the stages of grief, and I think a lot of posts show the different stages.    

Yeah for sure. Definitely not trying to be oblivious in that regard.

I haven't watched a sports channel since. It's hard enough on the home page.

I'm honestly just finding ways to get around it with something else to talk about. =(

[tmac70]

Johnny was beloved here and will be remembered as such. This incident could have been avoided but unfortunately, wrong choices were made, and here were are.  This hurt because it showed the organization and fans how much he was loved despite his leaving and what we meant to him. He may be gone but has left us all with fantastic memories that only Flames fans will truly enjoy and cherish. He brought us to the end of our seats and out of them many times. He was a special player and person and as much as it stings that one will never see him play again, I am grateful I as a Flames fan will have the memories we all cherished when he was here. Thanks Johnny for the great memories, Rest in peace

[travel_dude]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Yeah for sure. Definitely not trying to be oblivious in that regard.

I haven't watched a sports channel since. It's hard enough on the home page.

I'm honestly just finding ways to get around it with something else to talk about. =(

 

Season opener will be a tough watch.  I suspect there will be a few games that have huge tributes at the start.  The first game that CGY plays CBL in either city will be very sad.  

 

Unlike every other year, I have been mostly avoiding hockey coverage.  I come here because we are all in that same boat.  Have to start gearing up for pre-season and maybe the Young Stars if they have it available.

[jjgallow]

9 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I'm kind of surprised that finding Flames info on the rookie camp/tourney roster is = to, > than pulling teeth.

The Wings have had it up for a week (50% are undrafted invitees, wow).

What's the big secret?

 

Yeah Flames are gonna keep their marketing muffled for a while, they have to.

 

On the detroit front though, super jealous of the 50% undrafted invites.    I think it's a product of them having huge scouting strength but less strength at the draft now that they're moving up in the standings.   

 

I hope we continue to build up our scouting staff and end up with similar undrafted PTO rates in the near future, it's the way to go (if you have the right scouting)

[conundrumed]

6 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

Yeah Flames are gonna keep their marketing muffled for a while, they have to.

 

On the detroit front though, super jealous of the 50% undrafted invites.    I think it's a product of them having huge scouting strength but less strength at the draft now that they're moving up in the standings.   

 

I hope we continue to build up our scouting staff and end up with similar undrafted PTO rates in the near future, it's the way to go (if you have the right scouting)

I'm glad they aren't sending guys that are a few years in. Last year it was big Elm Soderstrom and a great big, "why are you here" to dominate 18-19yos?

They aren't a tourney format this year, which kinda sucks. Just them vs Dallas. Jim Nill just keeps coming back to Detroit. lol

[robrob74]

7 hours ago, conundrumed said:

I'm glad they aren't sending guys that are a few years in. Last year it was big Elm Soderstrom and a great big, "why are you here" to dominate 18-19yos?

They aren't a tourney format this year, which kinda sucks. Just them vs Dallas. Jim Nill just keeps coming back to Detroit. lol

 

Thinking as an educator, be cool to invite them until they're 3-5 years in, to mentor and work alongside coaching staff to foster leadership and their own professionalism... Maybe not everyone, but guys who exhibit leadership qualities... 

[conundrumed]

15 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

Thinking as an educator, be cool to invite them until they're 3-5 years in, to mentor and work alongside coaching staff to foster leadership and their own professionalism... Maybe not everyone, but guys who exhibit leadership qualities... 

If it were longer term, I'd understand. This mini-tourney is more just a primer for new to 2nd year ELC guys. It's not sensible to send guys that have already played for the Wranglers.

Those guys need to be ready for main camp, not this level. I'd use a guy like Stromgren as an example. He's played a year with the Wranglers. There is no reason for him to be at what is essentially a rookie/invite tourney.

They are basically jr all-star games.

[conundrumed]

Another fine job by Flo of listing all the rookie tourneys this wkend.

All games will be streamed (via Youtube) on each team's NHL website.

Of note...although it's directed through YT, the NHL sites may lag or drag, at which point, try streaming direct through YT.

edit

Pretty happy to see the Flames-Oilers game is a 10:30pm EST start Saturday. That takes it from not-a-chance to chance.

[robrob74]

4 hours ago, conundrumed said:

If it were longer term, I'd understand. This mini-tourney is more just a primer for new to 2nd year ELC guys. It's not sensible to send guys that have already played for the Wranglers.

Those guys need to be ready for main camp, not this level. I'd use a guy like Stromgren as an example. He's played a year with the Wranglers. There is no reason for him to be at what is essentially a rookie/invite tourney.

They are basically jr all-star games.

 

yup! Just meaning, a way for them to do beyond the camp and not have them there to participate as one who does the drills, maybe one who mentors and helps coach. 

[conundrumed]

9 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

yup! Just meaning, a way for them to do beyond the camp and not have them there to participate as one who does the drills, maybe one who mentors and helps coach. 

They'll do that next week when the kids arrive at main camp. That's where the real overwhelm starts.

[conundrumed]

Roster announced:

[conundrumed]

Pretty good rundown video of the tourneys by Peter Criss Chris Peters. He's a good guy.

Flo is a really solid hockey site for those interested in reading around other leagues.

https://www.flohockey.tv/collections/7958073-talking-hockey-sense-clips/videos?playing=12823646

[conundrumed]

Done deal!

 

[cross16]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Done deal!

 

 

Less than his Q/O. Flames played hardball here. 

[conundrumed]

10 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Less than his Q/O. Flames played hardball here. 

I prefer to think of it as, "drove home the reality of the situation". lol