Realistic (and unrealistic) Trades - 2024 Edition

[sak22]

6 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

 

The politics.  I get it.  But to a degree though.  No doubt Conroy will try to accommodate Hanifin because that's the right thing to do on a human level.  But Brisson and Hanifin have contractual obligations too.  It's fair game if Conroy doesn't like the returns from TB.  Brisson and Hanifin need to understand from a professional perspective or else the bad actor here is them, not Conroy.  The rest of the league will see it too.

Well Conroy represents one of the 5 least desired markets in the NHL, Pat Brisson represents Sidney Crosby, Nathan Mackinnon, John Tavares, Elias Pettersson and the Hughes brothers just to name a few, he isn't going to be hurt over this nor is this type of thing going to hurt his chances to land new clients, and Noah is still going to be paid, and Calgary will still be Calgary, it sucks but we've known our issues for a long time.

[The_People1]

2 minutes ago, cross16 said:

A lot of getting ahead of ourselves here. Math isn't that difficult. 

 

First of all, while technically yes Hanifin can be dealt to 23 teams let's be more realistic of actual possibilities because a non playoff team isn't going to rent Hanifin. If there are truly 4 teams (Boston, Vegas, TB and florida) who he will re sign with then your looking at 12 ish additional teams that might look at him for a rental. 

 

Now if your outside the top 10 are you really going to give up a rental price for a player you know isn't to re sign? No you'll drop your price and you'll give up less.  So that puts a team outside the top 10 as likely out. 

 

so let's look at the top 10 team in the NHL right now. Well 4 of them are Canadian teams so they are out (very likely that the CDN teams are on his NTC). 2 of which are the teams I just mentioned (basically 3 as Vegas is 11th) so your left with 4

Rangers ( Hanifin is not a big need here)

Stars

Avs (Can't swing a deal without get very fancy with the cap)

Canes

 

Even expand it a bit

Nashville (Renting him is not in their nature)

LA ( Maybe)

Detroit (thought they could be a player)

 

The rest your into fringe playoff teams. So again if you are told you have no shot to sign the player why as a fringe playoff team am I going to give up a 1st plus?

 

This isn't a robust market to begin with so it's not that difficult for Hanifin's camp to work this towards his preferred destinations. 

 

What is TB's offer though?

 

You're saying teams won't pay rental price for a rental when teams have paid rental prices for rentals going back decades.  If TB's offer to beat is 2nd + mid-prospect, then I'm sure someone will step up with better.  Because that's not a hard price to beat to land a top pair D.  It's potentially destiny altering talent.

 

Happy or not, you've got to assume you are acquiring a professional to do their job to the best of their abilities.  And then he can leave after.

[cross16]

10 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

What is TB's offer though?

 

You're saying teams won't pay rental price for a rental when teams have paid rental prices for rentals going back decades.  If TB's offer to beat is 2nd + mid-prospect, then I'm sure someone will step up with better.  Because that's not a hard price to beat to land a top pair D.  It's potentially destiny altering talent.

 

Happy or not, you've got to assume you are acquiring a professional to do their job to the best of their abilities.  And then he can leave after.

 

 

I think Tampa's offer is solid. I've heard something along the lines of 2026 1st, Isaac Howard and another pick. Maybe not super exciting but solid. I think you are jumping to a lot of conclusions here. No one is suggesting it's Tampa or bust, just that it may be his preferred destination with mutual interest. I think the Panthers are very much in there too so there is competition here. I don't think this is a a Tampa gets to set the price scenario. 

 

And no I did not say teams won't pay rental prices, I said fringe playoff teams won't pay top dollar rental prices. Funny how Hanifin has always just been good, and now that we want to trade him he's suddenly a destiny altering talent. He isn't that good... so no I don't think a team barely in the playoffs is going to cough up their first round pick for Hanifin. 

 

Basically what this boils down to for me, is you don't have a robust rental market to begin with so the agent exerting even minor influence on this process just shrinks the market further. So for me, Conroy dealing with the preferred destinations, and ideally letting an extension happen, is his best chance of getting the most value. 

[The_People1]

14 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

 

I think Tampa's offer is solid. I've heard something along the lines of 2026 1st, Isaac Howard and another pick. Maybe not super exciting but solid. I think you are jumping to a lot of conclusions here. No one is suggesting it's Tampa or bust, just that it may be his preferred destination with mutual interest. I think the Panthers are very much in there too so there is competition here. I don't think this is a a Tampa gets to set the price scenario. 

 

And no I did not say teams won't pay rental prices, I said fringe playoff teams won't pay top dollar rental prices. Funny how Hanifin has always just been good, and now that we want to trade him he's suddenly a destiny altering talent. He isn't that good... so no I don't think a team barely in the playoffs is going to cough up their first round pick for Hanifin. 

 

Basically what this boils down to for me, is you don't have a robust rental market to begin with so the agent exerting even minor influence on this process just shrinks the market further. So for me, Conroy dealing with the preferred destinations, and ideally letting an extension happen, is his best chance of getting the most value. 

 

Context matters though.  You talking like the Flames are going to have to settle.  Yet, 2026 1st + Howard + pick is a fair deal.  Nothing to see here.  Done deal.

[travel_dude]

I think we are jumpring the gun a bot on a few things.

32 teams out there and saying 4 CDN teams are on his 8 team list seems unlikely.

There are some teams I doubt any player would keep off the list; ARI, SJS, ANA, BUFF, WAS...

Secondly, if the FLA teams are both interested, then they will bid against each other.

FLA can offer a young C for Hanifin and probably win the trade.

Maybe they throw in Mikkola just to seal the deal and make the money work a bit next season.

Trading out Mikkola for Hanifin is a smart move, just gives you another top 4 D to work with.

 

No, Hanifin is not a game breaker, but some teams see his scoring at timely moments as a great thing.

Let's just get it done and move on.

Bad timing that we let it go to the point of fkying to two cities that may be trading partners.

Easy for him, but I don't want him to play another game.

[cross16]

12 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Context matters though.  You talking like the Flames are going to have to settle.  Yet, 2026 1st + Howard + pick is a fair deal.  Nothing to see here.  Done deal.

Where did I say that? I’ve simply said I don’t think there is a robust market out there. Think the rumored offer shows that. It isn’t a great return imo

[jefsmi]

Im not trading for Howard unless hes a guaranteed signing. Hes still unsigned with Tampa and could say no to flames and then were "Fox'ed" again.

[The_People1]

54 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Where did I say that? I’ve simply said I don’t think there is a robust market out there. Think the rumored offer shows that. It isn’t a great return imo

 

You literally said it's "solid" one post earlier?

[jjgallow]

4 hours ago, cross16 said:

Where did I say that? I’ve simply said I don’t think there is a robust market out there. Think the rumored offer shows that. It isn’t a great return imo

 

There is never a robust market for teams that hold onto their assets into their mid-30's and then want to cash out big.

 

Still, the rumored offers look decent.

[phoenix66]

6 hours ago, cross16 said:

Where did I say that? I’ve simply said I don’t think there is a robust market out there. Think the rumored offer shows that. It isn’t a great return imo

If that is Actually the offer then that would be solid for sure . 

[phoenix66]

5 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

You literally said it's "solid" one post earlier?

To me solid means .ok..fair ..    I suspect were looking at a return slightly above Tanev, but not as good as Lindholm..   he SHOULD be a better return than Lindholm 

[cross16]

7 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

You literally said it's "solid" one post earlier?

 

Yes solid, not great, solid. 

 

Not sure why but there is a lot of word twisting going on in this thread. 

[cross16]

3 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

There is never a robust market for teams that hold onto their assets into their mid-30's and then want to cash out big.

 

Still, the rumored offers look decent.

 

I'm referring to Hanifin. 

 

And the commentary was around people getting mad at the agents and the process, suggesting the Flames would take a lesser deal to send him to Tampa. I'm simply pointing out that doesn't feel like the case given it's not a robust market to deal with. 

 

You don't get peak value on an expiring deal and that's not what i'm expecting. if there is a deal and it's something along the lines of a 1st, Howard and a mid round pick it would only be slightly below what I expected for Hanifin. It would be below though but I just don't think there is much Conroy can do about that given the market. 

[phoenix66]

19 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Yes solid, not great, solid. 

 

Not sure why but there is a lot of word twisting going on in this thread. 

Too much social media .. people can't separate the hack rumors from logic ..

 

One that has some believability and would be funny is Canucks are already shopping Lindholm lol.. Connie for the win if that happens ..

 

Funniest part if they do?  They make the WCF they still lose the 3rd rounder 😂😂

 

 

[cross16]

35 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

Too much social media .. people can't separate the hack rumors from logic ..

 

One that has some believability and would be funny is Canucks are already shopping Lindholm lol.. Connie for the win if that happens ..

 

Funniest part if they do?  They make the WCF they still lose the 3rd rounder 😂😂

 

 

 

I have a bit of a different take on that. I think it's good when GMs admit there mistakes and are prepared to move on quickly. 

 

Lindholm is such a weird story for me me this year. Game just really fell off the map. 

[travel_dude]

2 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

I have a bit of a different take on that. I think it's good when GMs admit there mistakes and are prepared to move on quickly. 

 

Lindholm is such a weird story for me me this year. Game just really fell off the map. 

 

I know he wasn't driving the play, but he should have been excellent playing with really good players.  It's weird that he's been playing better with Sharky at C.  Line still a bit of a mish mash on RW.  Need a hard driving RW.  I would almost suggest Pospisil, if he wasn't suspended.  Kuzmenko is a good sniper, but that line already has issues away from the puck.

 

I think VAN made the mistake thinking he would be great at C.  I would have tried him with Pettersen at C.  Play him RW.  But it doesn't matter.  They likely won't want to re-sign him.  Too much for a guy not fitting in.

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

To me solid means .ok..fair ..    I suspect were looking at a return slightly above Tanev, but not as good as Lindholm..   he SHOULD be a better return than Lindholm 

 

Wow Hanifin should get better than Lindholm?  I was expecting a 1st + mid-prospect + fringe NHLer.  What were you expecting for Hanifin?

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

Yes solid, not great, solid. 

 

Not sure why but there is a lot of word twisting going on in this thread. 

 

Okay makes more sense.  I agree 2026 1st + Howard meets bare minimum, if not slightly below expectations.  Certainly not blown out of the waters or anything.  But it's close enough to fair that I would take it.

[phoenix66]

16 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Wow Hanifin should get better than Lindholm?  I was expecting a 1st + mid-prospect + fringe NHLer.  What were you expecting for Hanifin?

I know every fanbase over and undervalues their own players , but the unbias view of it is hes still a relatively young , in his prime Dman.. 1st/ 2nd pair at worst .. can play all situations ... Really his only knock for value is hes a LS..  if he were RS it would thru the roof 

 

compared to Lindy, Id expect a higher prospect .. a 1st and 2nd or 3rd ( no conditions) and a roster player with less question marks ( maybe younger , more known ) ..

[redfire11]

36 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

I was expecting a 1st + mid-prospect + fringe NHLer

The term "Fat kid on a smartie" comes to mind.

This would still be a great ROI

[cross16]

Be interesting to see the cost on this. Florida isn't ripe in assets so if they are pulling this off makes you wonder about what can they give up for Hanifin. 

 

I think the cap can work, wonder about assets

 

 

[sak22]

11 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Be interesting to see the cost on this. Florida isn't ripe in assets so if they are pulling this off makes you wonder about what can they give up for Hanifin. 

 

I think the cap can work, wonder about assets

 

 

 

 

[travel_dude]

15 minutes ago, phoenix66 said:

I know every fanbase over and undervalues their own players , but the unbias view of it is hes still a relatively young , in his prime Dman.. 1st/ 2nd pair at worst .. can play all situations ... Really his only knock for value is hes a LS..  if he were RS it would thru the roof 

 

compared to Lindy, Id expect a higher prospect .. a 1st and 2nd or 3rd ( no conditions) and a roster player with less question marks ( maybe younger , more known ) ..

 

I think the knock on his value is that he doesn't really do anything really well.  Not great on the PP.  Not a clutch scorer.  Not a PK stalwart.  Hronek got a 1st and 2nd last year.  Klingberg (at 50%) got a plug, a good young prospect and a 4th for retaining salary.  Greenway netted a 2nd and a 5th.  Chychrun was about the best return with a 1st a 2n and a 6th.  COnditions on those of course.  

[JTech780]

12 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Be interesting to see the cost on this. Florida isn't ripe in assets so if they are pulling this off makes you wonder about what can they give up for Hanifin. 

 

I think the cap can work, wonder about assets

 

 

Sounds like two mid round picks.

[cross16]

Interesting to see the retained salary but that definitely wouldn't take them out of the running for Hanifin. 

 

Just means that someone off the Florida roster would have to be coming back for cap purposes.