Calgary Flames draft 2023 (Look at Google sheet in link below)

[robrob74]

5 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

I don't understand why the draft is so late this year.  Game 7 should've ended already.  The draft should've been scheduled for this week Thurs/Fri.

Didn't they start just a bit later to get the season back to schedule but not too close to the previous Stanley cup year? Maybe they already made up

some time they lost due to Covid.

[conundrumed]

15 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Who are we kidding? We don't have anything of anything.  We need everything.

 

But if push comes to shove, we have LWs at the NHL level for are far as the eyes can see.  We can have LWs locked up for the next 8 years if we wanted to.  Can't say the same for C and RW... And even D starting to look thin.

 

We are in no luxury position to take a LW over other needs.

Again, you guys are fixated on right now rather than the future. Trade Mangiapane and Pelletier and where's all of your LWers?

Huberdeau is the only LW we have that I consider longterm.

We had Lucic playing 2nd LW. So tell me again about our fantastic LW depth, particularly about power forwards on either side.

Ruzicka is supposed to be a Center. Like a majority of centers in this draft, he's ending up a winger. So don't assume Danielson or Heidt guarantees you a center. Not even Smith is a lock to be a center.

If you focus on highest ceiling at 16, it may very well be Musty. Or do we need competition for Ronni, Zary and Kerins to develop into a 3C? Because it would appear that some people give our developing picks zero chance by hearsay.

Ronni, for one, looks like a natural Backlund replacement.

Led his team to the U20 championship. By led, I mean in points, icetime, faceoffs, playing every situation. He carried his team.

But he played 3rd line at the WJC so he's no good I guess.

It's the same as everyone under the sun changing their rankings based on the U18 tournament. Dvorsky, Wood and the USNTDP and Swede guys are now overrated due to a tournament below their typical weight class. Then they create the "fallers" to amount to guys that didn't play in that tourney or were playing through injuries and didn't dominate.

It's flavour-of-the-month stuff. It's really not much above a midget tourney. Yet hyped through the roof. Did any team actually play well defensively? Of course not, but why focus on that when you can focus on O stats?

Personally, I believe we're drafting Wood and I'm okay with that. Although I'd MUCH rather Musty or Simashev. I was championing Wood early on and he should be in our range.

Simashev I've loved all along. I was streaming his KHL games. He's scary and really good with the puck. Or should I say his puck. Challenge him at your risk because he loves to hit and hit hard. I can see him being the most dominant Dman in this class. I believe that once he gets here and gets some experience under his belt, fwds will be paying attention when he's on the ice. He reminds me of Seider against puck-carriers, never looks down at the puck, just stares at that giant target on your chest.

I can see him thriving on smaller ice. He'll make his own time and space. Dude's a beast.

[travel_dude]

45 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Again, you guys are fixated on right now rather than the future. Trade Mangiapane and Pelletier and where's all of your LWers?

Huberdeau is the only LW we have that I consider longterm.

We had Lucic playing 2nd LW. So tell me again about our fantastic LW depth, particularly about power forwards on either side.

Ruzicka is supposed to be a Center. Like a majority of centers in this draft, he's ending up a winger.

 

All of this is so true.  We turn F's playing with Backlund into checking players.  Mangiapane had one season that all his shots went in, but couldn't keep it up.  Some of our C/LW can play RW but a lot of them just move the play.  I would suggest that we get Nylander just to add some scoring so we can develop a 3rd line without Backlund going forward.  I tend to think we have some decent prospects that could develop into something, but we have to focus not just on maintaining but a little of playing guys where they can develop.  Ad scoring in the top 6 and we aren't so desperate to keep Backlund.  It's long term.  We may trade him this summer or TDL, which seems to be more difficult to accept.  Maybe a new GM and coach can give an honest assessment at TDL to say we need to win by losing a player.  Time is right.  The loss in FA is worth the possible loss in season.

 

Back to the draft, I would be happy with a number of players.  The need is not a player to come in right away.  

[The_People1]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Again, you guys are fixated on right now rather than the future. Trade Mangiapane and Pelletier and where's all of your LWers?

Huberdeau is the only LW we have that I consider longterm.

We had Lucic playing 2nd LW. So tell me again about our fantastic LW depth, particularly about power forwards on either side.

Ruzicka is supposed to be a Center. Like a majority of centers in this draft, he's ending up a winger. So don't assume Danielson or Heidt guarantees you a center. Not even Smith is a lock to be a center.

If you focus on highest ceiling at 16, it may very well be Musty. Or do we need competition for Ronni, Zary and Kerins to develop into a 3C? Because it would appear that some people give our developing picks zero chance by hearsay.

Ronni, for one, looks like a natural Backlund replacement.

Led his team to the U20 championship. By led, I mean in points, icetime, faceoffs, playing every situation. He carried his team.

But he played 3rd line at the WJC so he's no good I guess.

It's the same as everyone under the sun changing their rankings based on the U18 tournament. Dvorsky, Wood and the USNTDP and Swede guys are now overrated due to a tournament below their typical weight class. Then they create the "fallers" to amount to guys that didn't play in that tourney or were playing through injuries and didn't dominate.

It's flavour-of-the-month stuff. It's really not much above a midget tourney. Yet hyped through the roof. Did any team actually play well defensively? Of course not, but why focus on that when you can focus on O stats?

Personally, I believe we're drafting Wood and I'm okay with that. Although I'd MUCH rather Musty or Simashev. I was championing Wood early on and he should be in our range.

Simashev I've loved all along. I was streaming his KHL games. He's scary and really good with the puck. Or should I say his puck. Challenge him at your risk because he loves to hit and hit hard. I can see him being the most dominant Dman in this class. I believe that once he gets here and gets some experience under his belt, fwds will be paying attention when he's on the ice. He reminds me of Seider against puck-carriers, never looks down at the puck, just stares at that giant target on your chest.

I can see him thriving on smaller ice. He'll make his own time and space. Dude's a beast.

 

We have major needs everywhere though is my point.  In 4 years, this team might be all Coronato, Andersson, and Wolf.  In a worse case, all we have is Andersson.

 

LW no matter how high the ceiling is just not priority when the team needs everything.  D and C always more important.

[jjgallow]

On Left Wingers

 

My brain:  "Don't be sarcastic.  Don't be sarcastic.  Don't be sarcastic"

 

 

But the keyboard beckons me.

 

@conundrumed  why did it have to be you?  lol

[jjgallow]

2 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

We have major needs everywhere though is my point.  In 4 years, this team might be all Coronato, Andersson, and Wolf.  In a worse case, all we have is Andersson.

 

LW no matter how high the ceiling is just not priority when the team needs everything.  D and C always more important.

 

https://www.mdpi.com/2073-8994/15/4/940

 

It's a known fact that as soon as they allow bare-chested broken-stick-fighting, the team with the most LWers will have the better chance of survival.

 

[jjgallow]

8 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Again, you guys are fixated on right now rather than the future. Trade Mangiapane and Pelletier and where's all of your LWers?

Huberdeau is the only LW we have that I consider longterm.

We had Lucic playing 2nd LW. So tell me again about our fantastic LW depth, particularly about power forwards on either side.

Ruzicka is supposed to be a Center. Like a majority of centers in this draft, he's ending up a winger. So don't assume Danielson or Heidt guarantees you a center. Not even Smith is a lock to be a center.

If you focus on highest ceiling at 16, it may very well be Musty. Or do we need competition for Ronni, Zary and Kerins to develop into a 3C? Because it would appear that some people give our developing picks zero chance by hearsay.

Ronni, for one, looks like a natural Backlund replacement.

Led his team to the U20 championship. By led, I mean in points, icetime, faceoffs, playing every situation. He carried his team.

But he played 3rd line at the WJC so he's no good I guess.

It's the same as everyone under the sun changing their rankings based on the U18 tournament. Dvorsky, Wood and the USNTDP and Swede guys are now overrated due to a tournament below their typical weight class. Then they create the "fallers" to amount to guys that didn't play in that tourney or were playing through injuries and didn't dominate.

It's flavour-of-the-month stuff. It's really not much above a midget tourney. Yet hyped through the roof. Did any team actually play well defensively? Of course not, but why focus on that when you can focus on O stats?

Personally, I believe we're drafting Wood and I'm okay with that. Although I'd MUCH rather Musty or Simashev. I was championing Wood early on and he should be in our range.

Simashev I've loved all along. I was streaming his KHL games. He's scary and really good with the puck. Or should I say his puck. Challenge him at your risk because he loves to hit and hit hard. I can see him being the most dominant Dman in this class. I believe that once he gets here and gets some experience under his belt, fwds will be paying attention when he's on the ice. He reminds me of Seider against puck-carriers, never looks down at the puck, just stares at that giant target on your chest.

I can see him thriving on smaller ice. He'll make his own time and space. Dude's a beast.

 

I can't even.  I can't even start.

 

So I won't.  If I were to find common ground here, I would say that if a LW is truly BPA, I would have no problems taking them.

 

In our case though, if I felt that scenario likely I'd be highly motivated to upgrade into a spot where the bpa was not clearly LW.

       and I emphasize upgrade, not downgrade.

 

We have admittedly had some very good LW draft picks,  usually in the later rounds.   I would not go so far as to ignore them, it goes against my own theory on drafting.   That much I will say.

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, jjgallow said:

On Left Wingers

 

My brain:  "Don't be sarcastic.  Don't be sarcastic.  Don't be sarcastic"

 

 

But the keyboard beckons me.

 

@conundrumed  why did it have to be you?  lol

Best it's me because I think your anti-LW rants are laughable. Getting hung up on handedness isn't my thing. Look around the league at wingers. Nobody's hung up on it. Just a few fans.

[jjgallow]

7 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Best it's me because I think your anti-LW rants are laughable. Getting hung up on handedness isn't my thing. Look around the league at wingers. Nobody's hung up on it. Just a few fans.

 

oh an invite lol.

 

My dude.

 

Peeps was like "75% of all hockey players are lhs"

 

You be like "you guys are thinking short term"

 

okay.

 

It is of course possible that nature will stop selecting for handedness and in about 50,000 years it'll be a 50/50 split.  Technically you're right, but I'm going with Peeps on this one, sorry man.

 

 

Sorry you missed the cup this year btw. 

 

[The_People1]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Best it's me because I think your anti-LW rants are laughable. Getting hung up on handedness isn't my thing. Look around the league at wingers. Nobody's hung up on it. Just a few fans.

 

There's nothing anti-LW or whatever.  Building from the net out is foundational.  When a team's cupboards are so bare, rebuild it from the net out.  RHS RD is in critical need.  RHS C is also needed. Picking 16th, one pick to the next is too close to call.  When it's so close, pass on Barlow and Musty.  Of course take Reinbacher if he's there.  If not, then take Wallinder or Danielson.  Even Yager.

[conundrumed]

4 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

There's nothing anti-LW or whatever.  Building from the net out is foundational.  When a team's cupboards are so bare, rebuild it from the net out.  RHS RD is in critical need.  RHS C is also needed. Picking 16th, one pick to the next is too close to call.  When it's so close, pass on Barlow and Musty.  Of course take Reinbacher if he's there.  If not, then take Wallinder or Danielson.  Even Yager.

Wallinder is LHS but can play both sides. I've already made that trade proposal.

Detroit - Lindholm

Calgary - 17th, Veleno, Wallinder

Who doesn't love a smartass?lol

Detroit desperately needed a LHD to top pair with Seider. Chiarot was a disaster.

It's Jake Walman and he's stellar. Sundqvist, Walman, this year's 2nd for Leddy and Witkowski.

All were happy to get Sundqvist and a 2nd. Nobody but nobody saw Walman as a top 4.

So yet again we learn that we don't know much. The Maatta signing was met with, "What? Why? Whatever". He's been stalwart and a top 5 on any roster in the league.

2 lessons in mgmt being smarter than fandom's preconceived notions.

My loving Musty and Simashev's potential at 16 doesn't = me hating everyone else. It's not like I'll be angry.lol Simashev and Reinbacher were pretty much neck-in-neck earlier in the season.

I just refuse to believe handedness means anything.

And I still suffer ptsd from Sutter-draft parameters of 1. Size 2. WHL, actual skills being about #5 & 6. So...we never did get any skilled guys with size.

[conundrumed]

10 hours ago, jjgallow said:

 

oh an invite lol.

 

My dude.

 

Peeps was like "75% of all hockey players are lhs"

 

You be like "you guys are thinking short term"

 

okay.

 

It is of course possible that nature will stop selecting for handedness and in about 50,000 years it'll be a 50/50 split.  Technically you're right, but I'm going with Peeps on this one, sorry man.

 

 

Sorry you missed the cup this year btw. 

 

Well I hope making it a competition works out for you. I enjoy everyone's opinion. Whether it coalesces with mine or not is neither here nor there.

I split 2 offseasons ago due to bitterness. I grew up and decided it's fun to be a fan and not let the negative surround me. So now I'll be frustrated sometimes but quickly get over it.

So I don't take it out on BT, Sutter, Markstrom, Huberdeau, Weegar and Kadri. I can leave that to the many others that do.

I respect that they are some of the 1,000 few best in the world at what they do. I'm not, so I'm not going to pretend that I am, just add my 2 cents that doesn't matter and hope to be entertained. A Cup takes a lot of luck outside of skill.

I'm just happy to not be a TML fan. That has to be tortuous. The only thing that they're missing is luck.

If the Flames want to fully rebuild, I just hope they wait until the Wings are set for selfish reasons.lol

I didn't really care who won the cup this year. Only Adin Hill changed my mind because I've always thought that he's a solid goalie and couldn't really understand his career.

I really don't care who we take in the draft. I just know who my faves are. At 18yo, each and every one of them can fail or explode moving forward. So the hyperbole is really just that for the next few years and hope for the best. Tkachuk said it best, to paraphrase, he knew getting to the NHL would be hard, but it was waaay harder than he expected. It's going to be the same for every one of these kids. If Point didn't work hard on his skating, he'd have faded into obscurity. Same with Andersson and fitness. A lot can go wrong. Ask Jack Beck.

So I'm not really into the whole, I'm right and you're wrong game. Nobody knows.

[travel_dude]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Wallinder is LHS but can play both sides. I've already made that trade proposal.

Detroit - Lindholm

Calgary - 17th, Veleno, Wallinder

Who doesn't love a smartass?lol

Detroit desperately needed a LHD to top pair with Seider. Chiarot was a disaster.

It's Jake Walman and he's stellar. Sundqvist, Walman, this year's 2nd for Leddy and Witkowski.

All were happy to get Sundqvist and a 2nd. Nobody but nobody saw Walman as a top 4.

So yet again we learn that we don't know much. The Maatta signing was met with, "What? Why? Whatever". He's been stalwart and a top 5 on any roster in the league.

2 lessons in mgmt being smarter than fandom's preconceived notions.

My loving Musty and Simashev's potential at 16 doesn't = me hating everyone else. It's not like I'll be angry.lol Simashev and Reinbacher were pretty much neck-in-neck earlier in the season.

I just refuse to believe handedness means anything.

And I still suffer ptsd from Sutter-draft parameters of 1. Size 2. WHL, actual skills being about #5 & 6. So...we never did get any skilled guys with size.

 

As much as I hate to lose a good C, this one probably makes the most sense.  Not really one sided.

Not really a rebuild trade, but it makes the draft that much more important.

Can't have B2B picks and get it wrong by reaching unless that guy fell due to a limited tourney.

This would be the fist major test for Connie; what do you do with players like Lindholm.

His age would best be served by a 5 year deal here.

Ot trade him to a team that is close that a player like that becomes the leader.

 

My beef has always been who the heck are we signing and why?

Maybe it was all on BT or maybe we just didn't identify talent very well.

Iggy helps add some creds to the team, but it comes down to scouting.

The smartest guy in the room has to make the right choices considering the team play and the coaching style.

That's for trades and UFA's.

The scouting just has to be a good judge of talent that can be maximized.

3 years down the road (as you suggested) the best talents need to work out the kinks.

Even the top 10 have things they need to fix.

[jjgallow]

5 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Well I hope making it a competition works out for you. I enjoy everyone's opinion. Whether it coalesces with mine or not is neither here nor there.

I split 2 offseasons ago due to bitterness. I grew up and decided it's fun to be a fan and not let the negative surround me. So now I'll be frustrated sometimes but quickly get over it.

So I don't take it out on BT, Sutter, Markstrom, Huberdeau, Weegar and Kadri. I can leave that to the many others that do.

I respect that they are some of the 1,000 few best in the world at what they do. I'm not, so I'm not going to pretend that I am, just add my 2 cents that doesn't matter and hope to be entertained. A Cup takes a lot of luck outside of skill.

I'm just happy to not be a TML fan. That has to be tortuous. The only thing that they're missing is luck.

If the Flames want to fully rebuild, I just hope they wait until the Wings are set for selfish reasons.lol

I didn't really care who won the cup this year. Only Adin Hill changed my mind because I've always thought that he's a solid goalie and couldn't really understand his career.

I really don't care who we take in the draft. I just know who my faves are. At 18yo, each and every one of them can fail or explode moving forward. So the hyperbole is really just that for the next few years and hope for the best. Tkachuk said it best, to paraphrase, he knew getting to the NHL would be hard, but it was waaay harder than he expected. It's going to be the same for every one of these kids. If Point didn't work hard on his skating, he'd have faded into obscurity. Same with Andersson and fitness. A lot can go wrong. Ask Jack Beck.

So I'm not really into the whole, I'm right and you're wrong game. Nobody knows.

 

Good post.  Your 2am posts tend to be way better than your 5am posts for some reason.

 

It's a great perspective and a great explanation,  almost enough to overlook that you kond of instigated/escalated it in your 5am post, where you started making assumptions. 

 

I don't take it out on any of those players either, for similar reasons.   Not the coach either,  and not the scouts. My blame is mostly isolated to the GM who imho is not in that top 1000 but was rather born into opportunity and was well connected.   Further proof of this is that TML hired him lol.   I generally don't lay blame under him.

 

I enjoy and respect your player evaluations.   My interpretation of them just has it's own slant.   Right now, it's influenced me to think that we should actively pursue Reinbacher.  If it happens, gonna happen soon.

[The_People1]

7 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Wallinder is LHS but can play both sides. I've already made that trade proposal.

Detroit - Lindholm

Calgary - 17th, Veleno, Wallinder

Who doesn't love a smartass?lol

Detroit desperately needed a LHD to top pair with Seider. Chiarot was a disaster.

It's Jake Walman and he's stellar. Sundqvist, Walman, this year's 2nd for Leddy and Witkowski.

All were happy to get Sundqvist and a 2nd. Nobody but nobody saw Walman as a top 4.

So yet again we learn that we don't know much. The Maatta signing was met with, "What? Why? Whatever". He's been stalwart and a top 5 on any roster in the league.

2 lessons in mgmt being smarter than fandom's preconceived notions.

My loving Musty and Simashev's potential at 16 doesn't = me hating everyone else. It's not like I'll be angry.lol Simashev and Reinbacher were pretty much neck-in-neck earlier in the season.

I just refuse to believe handedness means anything.

And I still suffer ptsd from Sutter-draft parameters of 1. Size 2. WHL, actual skills being about #5 & 6. So...we never did get any skilled guys with size.

 

Detroit's William Wallinder is LHS.  Tom Wallinder is RHS.  Are they related by the way?

 

 

[conundrumed]

4 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

Detroit's William Wallinder is LHS.  Tom Wallinder is RHS.  Are they related by the way?

 

 

Maybe there was a spelling error in the population census way back when. Detroit should draft Willander and pair him with Wallinder just to hear Mickey Redmond tell us that he's had too many ginger ales.lol

Mickey's a card and I highly doubt that he knows what virgin ginger ale tastes like.

With Calgary's broadcasts, I always prefer the other team's broadcast outside of Boston and TBay. Different insights on how we're viewed.

With Detroit's, ALWAYS Ken Daniels/Mickey Redmond. Just.Stellar.

[The_People1]

1 minute ago, conundrumed said:

Maybe there was a spelling error in the population census way back when. Detroit should draft Willander and pair him with Wallinder just to hear Mickey Redmond tell us that he's had too many ginger ales.lol

Mickey's a card and I highly doubt that he knows what virgin ginger ale tastes like.

With Calgary's broadcasts, I always prefer the other team's broadcast outside of Boston and TBay. Different insights on how we're viewed.

With Detroit's, ALWAYS Ken Daniels/Mickey Redmond. Just.Stellar.

 

Oof Wallinder/Willander.  Lol I didn't realize. This should be fun.

[conundrumed]

16 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Oof Wallinder/Willander.  Lol I didn't realize. This should be fun.

Don't feel bad. I see it everywhere.

edit

Wallinder's leaving mighty footprints for Willander.lol

[The_People1]

10 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

Don't feel bad. I see it everywhere.

edit

Wallinder's leaving mighty footprints for Willander.lol

 

Mandella effect I think... Could've sworn it was spelled the same way.

[conundrumed]

Oh, and if you go waaaay back in the draft thread, you'll find me liking Willander more than Sandin-Pellikka before the hype machinery truly rolled in. Same with Reinbacher and Simashev. I like Dmen that are solid or close at playing D first. Let's face it, Makar is one-of-a-kind. I'd go so far as to say the best ever. Just give him the Norris every year. Nobody's touching him as a dman in our lifetime or previous ones. We're witnessing the greatest dman that ever laced 'em up. No use fighting it.

[Sarasti]

2 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

Mandella effect I think... Could've sworn it was spelled the same way.

 

Its the Berenstein/Berenstain fiasco all over again. 😰

[conundrumed]

2 minutes ago, Sarasti said:

 

Its the Berenstein/Berenstain fiasco all over again. 😰

[Sarasti]

3 hours ago, conundrumed said:

 

This is how I remember it as well but I have many a friend that say im misremembering.. 😆