GDT - Oilers @ Flames - December 27, 2022 - 7:00PM MDT Start - A Deeds/Saymzies Collaboration

[flames for life]

Just now, taz89 said:

It might be harsh but its the truth! Unless they get Patrick Kane to put some pucks in the net, if these teams meet again in the playoffs it will be the same result as last year.  That last shot by Backlund tonight that hit the post, if that was Kane it would be IN, not hitting the post.

But that’s my great fear!  Adding another overpriced, overages forward on the decline of a career, for the price of most of our future.

no matter how I slice it, it just doesn’t make sense.  It’s not a guarantee of a Stanley Cup, or even a round!  The cost is way too much!

[taz89]

2 minutes ago, flames for life said:

But that’s my great fear!  Adding another overpriced, overages forward on the decline of a career, for the price of most of our future.

no matter how I slice it, it just doesn’t make sense.  It’s not a guarantee of a Stanley Cup, or even a round!  The cost is way too much!

Yeah, you're right, it doesnt make sense but they already made that decision when they traded for Hubbey and Weegar and added Kadri...they want to win now, and be damn with the future...so might as well go for it

[flames for life]

8 minutes ago, taz89 said:

Yeah, you're right, it doesnt make sense but they already made that decision when they traded for Hubbey and Weegar and added Kadri...they want to win now, and be damn with the future...so might as well go for it

Hubby and Weegar was a trade making the best of a bad situation, and at the time, everyone was jumping for joy!  Kadri was a player the fans have wanted for years, which finally came to fruition!

Were these bad moves….no!  Will they work out?  They are all showing signs of continual improvement and connection as a group.

Fans need to keep in mind that JG and MK played together for a few years before producing like they did last year.  In fact, a lot of building around and through players had to happen to get last year’s team.  Are a couple of trades supposed to placate the skill level we lost and carry on as connected as they were?

I consider that to be a pipe dream.

what I do expect is that this team will continue to build the comfort ability with each other.  When that happens, less goalposts and more goals will happen.  Calgary will be in the playoffs.  How far they go will be another conversation.

[tmac70]

Well before the break was good and now tonight another self induced sucide by Mags. As I absoultey loathe the Oilers the reffing is god awful once again, hold on Tanev, interferance on Toffoli in the last minute are just a few. I thoought the Flames played well and lets face facts Coilers re only on the Power Play...Would pay good money to see Dry Saddle or Mc Baby laid out on the ice, but i digress. I thought the Flames fair well were the better team, still pass way to much for me. Tonights game almost feels like it could be the start of a break out for us, gut feeling, unless its gas pains but one can be optimistic

[tmac70]

5 minutes ago, flames for life said:

Hubby and Weegar was a trade making the best of a bad situation, and at the time, everyone was jumping for joy!  Kadri was a player the fans have wanted for years, which finally came to fruition!

Were these bad moves….no!  Will they work out?  They are all showing signs of continual improvement and connection as a group.

Fans need to keep in mind that JG and MK played together for a few years before producing like they did last year.  In fact, a lot of building around and through players had to happen to get last year’s team.  Are a couple of trades supposed to placate the skill level we lost and carry on as connected as they were?

I consider that to be a pipe dream.

what I do expect is that this team will continue to build the comfort ability with each other.  When that happens, less goalposts and more goals will happen.  Calgary will be in the playoffs.  How far they go will be another conversation.

I was surprised by the stats from last year at this time. We are only 3 points worse 1 goal For shy but like 28-32 goals worse defensivly. As we need to score more yes but you also have to stay out of the box and defend better. THis club is still 80% in tact from last year so the defensive struggles I don't get. 

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, tmac70 said:

I was surprised by the stats from last year at this time. We are only 3 points worse 1 goal For shy but like 28-32 goals worse defensivly. As we need to score more yes but you also have to stay out of the box and defend better. THis club is still 80% in tact from last year so the defensive struggles I don't get. 

 

Ok. so you need to dig into some tings that were hugely different.

We have Vezna goalies in the first half last year.

Marky was sporting shutouts, as was Vladar.

It's not that the goalies are bad, but they have let in alot of bad goals so far.

Cleaned up recently, but that doesn't change the results.

 

The other reason is Wideman level penalties.

3-1 tonight in calls and none of them were really obvious calls.

That's typical.

We maybe aren't converting on the PP, but some nights we give up 2 PP goals against.

 

[jjgallow]

9 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Ok. so you need to dig into some tings that were hugely different.

We have Vezna goalies in the first half last year.

Marky was sporting shutouts, as was Vladar.

It's not that the goalies are bad, but they have let in alot of bad goals so far.

Cleaned up recently, but that doesn't change the results.

 

The other reason is Wideman level penalties.

3-1 tonight in calls and none of them were really obvious calls.

That's typical.

We maybe aren't converting on the PP, but some nights we give up 2 PP goals against.

 

 

Cool, so we only have two problems from the above,

1.  we're not putting the puck in the net enough and

2.  we're not keeping it out of ours enough.   

 

Other than that, it's been a great year 😅

 

 

I'm going to whine and complain here because this thread will soon die and we won't have to look at it again.   I get rattled whenever we lose to the oils, especially this oils team.

 

Seriously who pins the dreams of their franchise on a 30-something goalie who hasn't been remarkable since junior?  Markstrom has had an entire career of just being passable, despite the Vancouver media claiming him to be the best goalie in the world lol, just like Weegar was hyped up before we gobbled that bait too.

 

I'll just add the one thing:  One of the biggest differences, if we're being honest, between this year and last is that we had a bunch of players on contract years last year who actually put the effort in because of it.

 

This year, players are not in contract years and we're getting a more accurate assessment of what we have under Sutter.  It is, not surprisingly, closer to previous years.

 

Truth is, last year was the outlier with players in contract years, and a hot goalie performing outside of his normal range.

 

 

This is going to be a rough few years.  I have dreaded the draft these last few years though, and this time I'm looking forward to it.  I don't think even BT is crazy enough to try and trade that pick now.

 

 

[travel_dude]

16 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

Cool, so we only have two problems from the above,

1.  we're not putting the puck in the net enough and

2.  we're not keeping it out of ours enough.   

 

Other than that, it's been a great year 😅

 

 

I'm going to whine and complain here because this thread will soon die and we won't have to look at it again.   I get rattled whenever we lose to the oils, especially this oils team.

 

Seriously who pins the dreams of their franchise on a 30-something goalie who hasn't been remarkable since junior?  Markstrom has had an entire career of just being passable, despite the Vancouver media claiming him to be the best goalie in the world lol, just like Weegar was hyped up before we gobbled that bait too.

 

I'll just add the one thing:  One of the biggest differences, if we're being honest, between this year and last is that we had a bunch of players on contract years last year who actually put the effort in because of it.

 

This year, players are not in contract years and we're getting a more accurate assessment of what we have under Sutter.  It is, not surprisingly, closer to previous years.

 

Truth is, last year was the outlier with players in contract years, and a hot goalie performing outside of his normal range.

 

 

This is going to be a rough few years.  I have dreaded the draft these last few years though, and this time I'm looking forward to it.  I don't think even BT is crazy enough to try and trade that pick now.

 

 

 

If that was the case, we wouldn't be the same numbet of goals for.

As far as goaltending, a Vezna season is not just passable.

But do go on about it.

[conundrumed]

2 wishes:

1. Put Dube on RW and Huberdeau on LW, don't care who centers.

2. Someone please return Mangiapane to his rightful owner.

[conundrumed]

Oh, and thanks schedulers. Oilers at home then off to Seattle to play the Kraken tonight. oof

[cross16]

40 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

2 wishes:

1. Put Dube on RW and Huberdeau on LW, don't care who centers.

2. Someone please return Mangiapane to his rightful owner.

 

Ya this doesn't' feel hard to me

Huberdeau - Lindholm - Dube

Mang - Kadri - Toffoli

Ruzicka - Backs - Coleman

Lucic - Lewis - Ritchie. 

 

Even if Sutter insisted on Lucic higher than swap him and Ruzicka. That's the most balanced/complimentary lineup IMO and I really don't understand the hesitation to try it. 

 

[conundrumed]

I could watch this allll day:

 

[travel_dude]

35 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

2 wishes:

1. Put Dube on RW and Huberdeau on LW, don't care who centers.

2. Someone please return Mangiapane to his rightful owner.

 

It would be so nice if we could have a top 9 that inclued players that fit together.

The Kadri line has been a failed experiment.

Looked good while playing basement teams, but that's about it.

Can't have the two top paid players being on for goals against and none for.

Can't have the top players together if you can't win faceoffs.

We have a C sputtering to get minutes on the 4th line and yet we feel that we are set at C.

Please get back to the 4th line that looked good in limited minutes.

 

If Kadri can't win faceoffs, put him on the wing.

 

I don't really have any lineup suggestions other than our top players look lost.

Too much dicking around with the lines to get player X going.

At best one or two lines have played well together for brief stretches.

Playing Lucic 15 minutes makes zero sense.

We haven't tried much different with everyone healthy.

Mangiapane is trying to find his game but keeps getting moved around.

Hiberdeau is playing about 50% of his game well.

The other part is trying to pass to players not knowing what he will do.

Kadri is used to playing with power forwards.

Lindholm and Backlund are the only top 6 C that play the same way every game.

It shouldn't be impossible to match them up with wingers.

[travel_dude]

48 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Ya this doesn't' feel hard to me

Huberdeau - Lindholm - Dube

Mang - Kadri - Toffoli

Ruzicka - Backs - Coleman

Lucic - Lewis - Ritchie. 

 

Even if Sutter insisted on Lucic higher than swap him and Ruzicka. That's the most balanced/complimentary lineup IMO and I really don't understand the hesitation to try it. 

 

 

Maybe I am mistaken, but I thought that Mange with Toffoli was too many guys trying to finish.

I would actually keep Mange with Backlund, since his defensive game is on track that way.

Let him build the offense from that.  Again.

I would offer up Ruzicka in place.

 

Huberdeau-Lindholm-Dube

Ruzicka-Kadri-Toffoli

Mange-Backs-Coleman

Lucic-Lewis-Ritchie

 

Sub in Zohorna if you feel Ritchie or Lucic isn't cutting it.

I actually thought the 4th line was one of the better lines.

Provided some spark.  Didn't get owned.

[jjgallow]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

If that was the case, we wouldn't be the same numbet of goals for.

As far as goaltending, a Vezna season is not just passable.

But do go on about it.

 

well, you were saying we need more goals.    And you were saying that last year too, and suggesting we get additions for it.

 

I don't know why it becomes ridiculous when i summarise it lol.

 

 

Basically last year most on here felt we needed more goals.  I felt we need more defense/goaltending.  Neither were wrong, it's just now the defense/goaltending is more blatant lol.

 

We made additions, so, really, we should have more goals.  Only thing is, we are older and we're not in contract years.  Is all I'm saying.   

[cross16]

15 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Maybe I am mistaken, but I thought that Mange with Toffoli was too many guys trying to finish.

I would actually keep Mange with Backlund, since his defensive game is on track that way.

Let him build the offense from that.  Again.

I would offer up Ruzicka in place.

 

Huberdeau-Lindholm-Dube

Ruzicka-Kadri-Toffoli

Mange-Backs-Coleman

Lucic-Lewis-Ritchie

 

Sub in Zohorna if you feel Ritchie or Lucic isn't cutting it.

I actually thought the 4th line was one of the better lines.

Provided some spark.  Didn't get owned.

 

I think this is a common misconception with Mang. he actually is equally as good as setting guys up as he is finishing. 

 

Not really gonna argue against swapping Ruzicka with Mang because at the end of the day I think the main thing here is how do the Flames get a great and consistent top line. I'm not really worried about their ability to build good secondary lines, it's the top line that is the issue for me. 

[travel_dude]

59 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

I think this is a common misconception with Mang. he actually is equally as good as setting guys up as he is finishing. 

 

Not really gonna argue against swapping Ruzicka with Mang because at the end of the day I think the main thing here is how do the Flames get a great and consistent top line. I'm not really worried about their ability to build good secondary lines, it's the top line that is the issue for me. 

 

Really, my thought process is having a line that played well last night except for the stupid penalties.

Mange fits well with Backlund and may get back to scoring goals.

Hubey and Lucic and Kadri was a turnover machine, or so it seemed.

Would like to see Kadri play with guys that don't just pass.

And Hubey with a winger that belongs in the top 6.

Dube seems like one of the few LHS that can play RW.

 

I like the idea of Ruzicka with Kadri and Toffoli simply because he drives play.

He may not get a ton of quality chances, but he hits the net.

Kadri or Dube going there to clan up seems to make sense.

 

 

[MP5029]

5 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

It would be so nice if we could have a top 9 that inclued players that fit together.

The Kadri line has been a failed experiment.

Looked good while playing basement teams, but that's about it.

Can't have the two top paid players being on for goals against and none for.

Can't have the top players together if you can't win faceoffs.

We have a C sputtering to get minutes on the 4th line and yet we feel that we are set at C.

Please get back to the 4th line that looked good in limited minutes.

 

If Kadri can't win faceoffs, put him on the wing.

 

I don't really have any lineup suggestions other than our top players look lost.

Too much dicking around with the lines to get player X going.

At best one or two lines have played well together for brief stretches.

Playing Lucic 15 minutes makes zero sense.

We haven't tried much different with everyone healthy.

Mangiapane is trying to find his game but keeps getting moved around.

Hiberdeau is playing about 50% of his game well.

The other part is trying to pass to players not knowing what he will do.

Kadri is used to playing with power forwards.

Lindholm and Backlund are the only top 6 C that play the same way every game.

It shouldn't be impossible to match them up with wingers.

A lot of this is exactly what I have been saying…it’s as obvious as the nose on your face…and to be honest Sutter has a good size honker so what can’t he see it?

 

anyway, as I’m down east I can’t see the games often, I’m wondering if all these penalties are legit or are we back to being the ref whipping boys every time we touch the puck? We had that issue a few years back and I’m kinda heading a bit of that frustration in Sutters pressers from

time to time so thought I’d ask? 

[flames for life]

4 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

Really, my thought process is having a line that played well last night except for the stupid penalties.

Mange fits well with Backlund and may get back to scoring goals.

Hubey and Lucic and Kadri was a turnover machine, or so it seemed.

Would like to see Kadri play with guys that don't just pass.

And Hubey with a winger that belongs in the top 6.

Dube seems like one of the few LHS that can play RW.

 

I like the idea of Ruzicka with Kadri and Toffoli simply because he drives play.

He may not get a ton of quality chances, but he hits the net.

Kadri or Dube going there to clan up seems to make sense.

 

 

The Ruzie with Kadri and Toffoli is not a bad idea.  All three can shoot, and two can set up plays.  Mangie will get back to scoring, he’s too good not to. As I recall, I think he leads the team in goalposts and “so close” shots.  Once that leans in his favour, he’ll be back.  I like him with Backlund.  They gel well together, along with Coleman.

I think they are closer than we think.