Geoff Ward, Flames 18 th coach

[cross16]

2 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

Great article. 

 

This team is frustrating because I am not sure I have seen them play the same way two games in a row. I don't know if it's the players that change the way they play or if it is coaching that is changing systems to try and match up against other teams. 

 

 

ive been struggling on just one too which is also why I have not been as critical on Ward as I want to be. It’s possible there are other factors at play. 
 

but they keep coming back to this way and this is the way they played against Dallas, a series Ward was quoted as saying was the blueprint for how they wanted to play. 
 

So unfortunately for me most signs point to this being the way the coaching staff wants them to play but I’m really hoping it turns around. I mean all you have to do is turn on some game tape and see the huge difference in quality of play 

[rickross]

On 2/14/2021 at 3:14 PM, cross16 said:

ive been struggling on just one too which is also why I have not been as critical on Ward as I want to be. It’s possible there are other factors at play. 
 

but they keep coming back to this way and this is the way they played against Dallas, a series Ward was quoted as saying was the blueprint for how they wanted to play. 
 

So unfortunately for me most signs point to this being the way the coaching staff wants them to play but I’m really hoping it turns around. I mean all you have to do is turn on some game tape and see the huge difference in quality of play 

It’s a head scratcher as we lost that series under Wards watch. It was embarrassing as a matter of fact , not sure how that performance locked Ward in as the best coach available. Him pulling Cam Talbot was such an act of desperation not of good coaching, I just have no reason to trust Ward as a our best coaching option. Not putting this all on Ward, our players are an inconsistent mess but at some point the coach needs to right the ship and I’ve yet to see Ward do that. 

[robrob74]

It sounds like Wills or Loubo is extremely pissed that us fans are blaming coaching for the outcomes. Maybe we should just call them Loubills or Willoubo. 
 

I get that the players gotta play. I feel like coaching trying to coach (too much at times and not enough at others).

 

I think there’s a lot wrong with this team. It’s hard to get a read on it. I think it’s a lot of everything right now. 

[Thebrewcrew]

24 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

It sounds like Wills or Loubo is extremely pissed that us fans are blaming coaching for the outcomes. Maybe we should just call them Loubills or Willoubo. 
 

I get that the players gotta play. I feel like coaching trying to coach (too much at times and not enough at others).

 

I think there’s a lot wrong with this team. It’s hard to get a read on it. I think it’s a lot of everything right now. 

I think a big part of it would be Wills and Ward were AHL roommates. Sticking up for a friend.

 

Both parties are at fault here. This team has issues and the coaching staff has issues

[cross16]

Well it depends on what the criticism is. Slow starts, inconsistent efforts, not being mental strong, all of those predate this coach so yes if you are just going to pile on and blame everything on Ward and the staff that isn’t fair. 

but some of the inconsistency, the lapse in execution, the struggle to create offense, breakouts can be tied back to the coach. He’s trying to fit a square peg in a round hole here with both systems and deployment. Both are at fault just depends what your more upset about. 
 

but if it was Derek wills then no surprise there. Not exactly an impartial observer when it comes to the flames. 

 

[cross16]

Blaming Ward for everything is easier but players need to be accountable too. 
 

This is Vancouvers 4th goal. watch the effort level on this play by everyone not wearing 88. 

 

 

[travel_dude]

I fond it hard to take the continued overthinking lineup choices.  I don't get what he's trying to build. 

• Use every player at some point from the taxi aquad? 
• Experiment with guys on 2nd line 2-3 times per game? 
• Find chemistry and fotget about it. 
• Trying to fit a nice to have RHS C onto a lone that excelled as a 2 way line? 
• Play Backlund with a guy like Lucic, who he's had limited success with?
• Have 2 pairs that were looking okay mostly, just needed some work on communication.  Perhaps reduce some minutes for the oldest player.
• Move Bennett to 3 or 4 different spots, regardless of how he looks in any spot.
• Overplay Marksytom and fail to use Rittich early enough to keep him in the game

That's a lot of pre-game mistakes by Ward.  In game has been much worse.  Has no concept of what it takes.  No idea how to adjust.  Time to move on.  It's hasn't worked for months now.  

[travel_dude]

5 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Blaming Ward for everything is easier but players need to be accountable too. 
 

This is Vancouvers 4th goal. watch the effort level on this play by everyone not wearing 88. 

 

 

Oh, I thought the effort was pretty bad after we got a goal.  Looked like we thought ther was 10 seconds left and we could coast.  Late goals you score should not result in two coming back.  The again, we have no real shutdown line now.  And we are using our best RW at C.  

[rocketdoctor]

More than Ward at play in the current situation.

 

Thought last nights coach's post gammer presser was very telling that all is not right but he is also correct that the players do not appear to give a shut.

 

 

 

 

[JTech780]

I agree there are issues with this core and the leadership, and I have said as much going back to the offseason.

 

That being said, this core isn't getting changed anytime soon. Those type of moves will have to wait till the offseason.

 

So we are left with the team as constructed. My biggest issue with the team right now is the coach. It really feels like he is trying to coach the 2011 Boston Bruins, he wants his team to grind it out an wear out the opposition with battles on the boards. The problem lies in that he is actually coaching the 2020 Calgary Flames, this team is built to be a skilled puck possession team that is going to beat teams with speed and skill.

 

Now Ward won a Cup with the 2011 Bruins so it isn't surprising that he would go with what gave him success in the past. He just doesn't have the right team to play that way.

 

So if this team wants to be a playoff team this year, something needs to change with the way it's coached, because the team on the ice isn't changing.

[cross16]

53 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

Oh, I thought the effort was pretty bad after we got a goal.  Looked like we thought ther was 10 seconds left and we could coast.  Late goals you score should not result in two coming back.  The again, we have no real shutdown line now.  And we are using our best RW at C.  

 

We easily could, but for some reason Ward sees Lindholm as the next Patrice Bergeron when Backlund is actually his better option. 

[cross16]

43 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

I agree there are issues with this core and the leadership, and I have said as much going back to the offseason.

 

That being said, this core isn't getting changed anytime soon. Those type of moves will have to wait till the offseason.

 

So we are left with the team as constructed. My biggest issue with the team right now is the coach. It really feels like he is trying to coach the 2011 Boston Bruins, he wants his team to grind it out an wear out the opposition with battles on the boards. The problem lies in that he is actually coaching the 2020 Calgary Flames, this team is built to be a skilled puck possession team that is going to beat teams with speed and skill.

 

Now Ward won a Cup with the 2011 Bruins so it isn't surprising that he would go with what gave him success in the past. He just doesn't have the right team to play that way.

 

So if this team wants to be a playoff team this year, something needs to change with the way it's coached, because the team on the ice isn't changing.

 

Agreed. I put this in another thread but this is an interesting problem for the Flames and their ownership. Their mandate is to be good every year and win now but now you are facing a scenario with a coach clearly in over his head and veteran options sitting out there. Now again i could be wrong but I very strongly believe Ward was hired not because he was the best option but we was the best option at the price they wanted to pay. 

 

Is the Flames organization prepared to punt a season to keep saving costs? Does the fact that you are not looking at the playoff revenue bump influence their decision?

[JTech780]

11 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Agreed. I put this in another thread but this is an interesting problem for the Flames and their ownership. Their mandate is to be good every year and win now but now you are facing a scenario with a coach clearly in over his head and veteran options sitting out there. Now again i could be wrong but I very strongly believe Ward was hired not because he was the best option but we was the best option at the price they wanted to pay. 

 

Is the Flames organization prepared to punt a season to keep saving costs? Does the fact that you are not looking at the playoff revenue bump influence their decision?

Oh for sure and it's hard to argue that a cap team should spend more in a time with no arena revenues.

 

I guess my only argument would be that they should look towards a time when fans get back, and trying to generate excitement for this team. Like we said in the GDT even when this team is winning the games aren't enjoyable to watch.

 

But there is very little reason for ownership to do anything different.

[travel_dude]

3 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

We easily could, but for some reason Ward sees Lindholm as the next Patrice Bergeron when Backlund is actually his better option. 

 

Yeah, and I'm starting to question the logic of the present top 9 construction.

We lost in the playoffs because we didn't manage the game (coach) to the team's strengths.

You have 3 home games and you aren't taking advantage where the weaknesses were.

 

All we have now is a former shutdown line that isn't producing enough 5v5 and looks lost at times.

Dube is fine, but a little much to expect him to face top defenders every night.

They are being played against like a top line.

The 2nd line is missing a good RW.

The 3rd line is Backlund and whatever is left besides Lucic.

The 4th line is never consistent lines.

 

We picked up role players but assigned them minutes according to rolling 4 lines, not specific assignments.

Nordstrom is a PK person and that's about it.

Leivo is being inserted/removed on a whim.

Simon should be a depth guy not defacto top 6.

What is Bennett?  Use him whenever there is a vacancy?

 

My advice?

Go back to what worked last year in January/Feb.

Gator Aid line - give them a lot of O-zone starts.

3M line - it worked.

3rd line from playoffs - this worked the one time we tried it, why change from this?

4th line - whatever.  Use it to integrate a new C into the lineup or convert Leivo to C.  Only give them minutes as they earn it.  Make sure they are not facing L1 from other teams.

 

Nothing magical here.  We are not a 4 line team right now.

I don't care what BT says about Lindholm, he's a shooter first.  Any wonder why Monahan went dry? 

[89Again]

Fully agree

 

Ward needs to go now.

[The_People1]

Is Gallant still available?

[cross16]

I don't normally like stocking the fires of the whole "blame the coach" movement but I found this comment by Tkachuk really interesting. It's up on the Fan 960s main page but he basically says he's tired of hearing about their bubble identity because that wasn't good enough and they need to strive to be better than that. 

 

I find it interesting because 1- I 100% agree with him and 2 - Ward has talked a lot about how how they played in the bubble is how he wanted them to play moving forward. 

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/

[The_People1]

16 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I don't normally like stocking the fires of the whole "blame the coach" movement but I found this comment by Tkachuk really interesting. It's up on the Fan 960s main page but he basically says he's tired of hearing about their bubble identity because that wasn't good enough and they need to strive to be better than that. 

 

I find it interesting because 1- I 100% agree with him and 2 - Ward has talked a lot about how how they played in the bubble is how he wanted them to play moving forward. 

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/

 

What exactly is the bubble?

[cross16]

5 minutes ago, The_People1 said:

 

What exactly is the bubble?

 

Summer time. Play-in/playoffs. 

[robrob74]

8 hours ago, cross16 said:

I don't normally like stocking the fires of the whole "blame the coach" movement but I found this comment by Tkachuk really interesting. It's up on the Fan 960s main page but he basically says he's tired of hearing about their bubble identity because that wasn't good enough and they need to strive to be better than that. 

 

I find it interesting because 1- I 100% agree with him and 2 - Ward has talked a lot about how how they played in the bubble is how he wanted them to play moving forward. 

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/

 

yup! I get you gotta kick them when they are down and they did that with the Jets. So you gotta give them credit for taking that initiative. But in no way was that a full Jets team and a Flames team / measuring stick to put this team up to. I will give them the positives that they did take advantage of a good situation there. 
 

I assume that is the bubble being referred to.
 

the play against the stars was horrible! Like now, they’ve had glimpses of good, but never sustained.

 

Tkachuk is right, it’s not good to compare to the bubble team, it’s giving them a pass on what was a bad end... 

 

I think it’s just time to play. Stop comparisons, stop talking, go out and play to win, play to enjoy playing again. 

[MP5029]

Ok it’s time for Ward to go, it’s pretty clear from how the team plays he’s lost the players....forget what they all

say about it being a tight room, it’s clearly not the case based on their play.

 

Thanks for the effort Ward but your clearly in over your head.  Best of luck in your future endeavours!

 

 

[LouCifer]

Can’t wait to start the Flames 19th coach thread... 😓

 

And I’m not giving a pass to the players here. That next coach has to run the show, because right now it’s being run by the inmates...

[dieselmarble]

First move, Coach has to go. BT should get off his azz and do something.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, lou44291 said:

Can’t wait to start the Flames 19th coach thread... 😓

 

And I’m not giving a pass to the players here. That next coach has to run the show, because right now it’s being run by the inmates...

 

I see it a bit different.

The players look lost.

Like the systems they are being drilled with have no success in the division.

Or the coach can't figure out what things are working and what aren't.

Has using Lindholm as the top C been a success?

Is Dube ready for top line duty?

Backlund with Lucic is a thing?

 

Ward has lost the team at this point.  His decisions are usually wrong.

He's sending messages instead of adapting.

The win streak seems so long ago, and the first thing done after 3 wins is change the lineup.

 

I'm all for holding the players accountable, but for what?  Not being able to play dump and chase when that's not our strength?

Play a passive defense when the PK is known for being in your face?

Exit the zone like you only have one choice?

[LouCifer]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

I see it a bit different.

The players look lost.

Like the systems they are being drilled with have no success in the division.

Or the coach can't figure out what things are working and what aren't.

Has using Lindholm as the top C been a success?

Is Dube ready for top line duty?

Backlund with Lucic is a thing?

 

Ward has lost the team at this point.  His decisions are usually wrong.

He's sending messages instead of adapting.

The win streak seems so long ago, and the first thing done after 3 wins is change the lineup.

 

I'm all for holding the players accountable, but for what?  Not being able to play dump and chase when that's not our strength?

Play a passive defense when the PK is known for being in your face?

Exit the zone like you only have one choice?

Well, the coach goes first. To me, some of our players appear to be going through the motions - perhaps they disagree with the coach, but there’s a lack of emotion and drive. Whatever is making them “give up” or “give in” or say “whoa is me” needs to change. Start with the coach, bring in a bonafide one (I say Gallant), and if the players are still underperforming address that thereafter. Ward IMO has made many questionable decisions, in fact, that’s probably been the most consistent thing for the flames this season.