travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 3 minutes ago, phoenix66 said: There are so many parts to a deal.. bonuses, cap , No trade clauses ... when you hear about the "trade call" thats when the league advises of all contract clauses ,makes sure its compliant to both sides .. sometimes bonus structure creates cap issues etc.. that one almost sounded like it fell apart in the trade call they way both sides (minnesota and calgary beat writers) were so sure it was done I heard Tre bring something up in the interview, not specifically to that deal but in general , that bonuses becomes payable in full or apply to the cap in full .. something like that ..made me wonder if there was some compliance issue in this one They never got to that stage that I know of. Details of the Zucker trade might surface, but I don't think the trade was NHL rejected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 Okay, done with the thread myself. We got a depth D-man and that is it. Focusd on finishing the season and winning the cup. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 3 minutes ago, travel_dude said: They never got to that stage that I know of. Details of the Zucker trade might surface, but I don't think the trade was NHL rejected. there's always the old Late fax reason too.. we may never know Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 2 hours ago, travel_dude said: Just quoting the parts I want to comment on. PK - don;t look at the rankings as proof. It's been up and down all year. We've gone on streaks where we have zero scored on in many games. The we get creamed in a couple with 2/4 1/2 etc. It kills the averages. They know how to PK. They are pressuring the forwards, and stopping them at the line. And then there are games that seem like they forget. We are also one of the worst offfenders in the league and take a lot of penalties. We have also been victimized by having putrid goaltending during the PK. Check out Smith's stats for 4v5 play. .798 Rittich for 4v5 play .839 Rinne .844 MAF .870 PP - same look every time. Easy to adjust to. JH to Gio to Lindy. 2nd unit was good for awhile, but stagnant with Brodie and Backlund there. Backlund has exactly one point on the PP, yet he's a fixture again it seems. Lazy plays and G - mostly G it seems. The laz plays are less, but they always seem to end up in the net. You can;t fault Rittich for that breakaway goal by Tkachuk, but most times a mistake ends up in the net. See, this isn’t necessarily what I was talking about, but the inconsistency in those ups and downs can winnyoi one-two series, dependin on being on the good or bad role on special teams and play. And that’s what I mean about the lazy plays. We don’t seem to give up as many but enough to pay for them. Ok, Time to get positive. How deep is this draft? What is the fall off point? We need to keep first rounders so I am happy we kept it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 hour ago, Thebrewcrew said: I'm a little mad Stone went to Vegas. I appreciate BT tried, maybe it was the Stone camp not wanting to sign here. We'll never know. Knowing BT he will be back at the table with MIN at the draft and we will have Zucker They say there are no taxes in Vegas so making the 9.5 is like making whatever you’d lose on a contract higher than that if it was taxed. Compared to Canada that’s gotta be a few million. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 4 minutes ago, robrob74 said: See, this isn’t necessarily what I was talking about, but the inconsistency in those ups and downs can winnyoi one-two series, dependin on being on the good or bad role on special teams and play. And that’s what I mean about the lazy plays. We don’t seem to give up as many but enough to pay for them. Ok, Time to get positive. How deep is this draft? What is the fall off point? We need to keep first rounders so I am happy we kept it. Not so much after 20. Back to what you were saying. It all comes back to goaltending and PP. The only real areas we have to improve upon. 1st PP unit isn;t getting it done now. Coincides with Tkachuk's fall from grace (lack of production). PK points to goalies almost entirely, IMHO. Smith bad for most of the year. Rittich just recently bad. Smith's 4 game streak was littered with PP goals against. TBL - Rittich 1 PP GA Smith 1 PP GA FLA - Rittich no PP GA PITTS - Smith 3 PP GA ARI - Smith 1 PP GA NYI - Smith no PP GA ANA - Smith no PP GA OTT - Rittich no PP GA Maybe he's improving. Can;t say at this point. We'll see tomorrow at NY. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 13 minutes ago, robrob74 said: They say there are no taxes in Vegas so making the 9.5 is like making whatever you’d lose on a contract higher than that if it was taxed. Compared to Canada that’s gotta be a few million. So, BT knew what the price was to extend and was in it till the end. I don;t think the re-sign was a show stopper for BT. He would have been completely out, not back in it. Maybe we offered Lazar as part of the deal. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 5 minutes ago, travel_dude said: Not so much after 20. Back to what you were saying. It all comes back to goaltending and PP. The only real areas we have to improve upon. 1st PP unit isn;t getting it done now. Coincides with Tkachuk's fall from grace (lack of production). PK points to goalies almost entirely, IMHO. Smith bad for most of the year. Rittich just recently bad. Smith's 4 game streak was littered with PP goals against. TBL - Rittich 1 PP GA Smith 1 PP GA FLA - Rittich no PP GA PITTS - Smith 3 PP GA ARI - Smith 1 PP GA NYI - Smith no PP GA ANA - Smith no PP GA OTT - Rittich no PP GA Maybe he's improving. Can;t say at this point. We'll see tomorrow at NY. Thinking about the back to Backs, it makes sense to start Rittich in the 2nd one as the team might not be as sharp as the 1st game. Get the win on the first and then hope Rittich stays fresh in the 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 2 minutes ago, travel_dude said: So, BT knew what the price was to extend and was in it till the end. I don;t think the re-sign was a show stopper for BT. He would have been completely out, not back in it. Maybe we offered Lazar as part of the deal. I could see Valamaki being the stopper. Maybe they needed Dube as well. I think BT could’ve worked around the cap, but maybe he wasn’t willing to go 10.5 that Stone was asking to play in Canada. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Thebrewcrew Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 11 minutes ago, robrob74 said: I could see Valamaki being the stopper. Maybe they needed Dube as well. I think BT could’ve worked around the cap, but maybe he wasn’t willing to go 10.5 that Stone was asking to play in Canada. Who knows, after all Stone has been through in Ottawa, maybe he was sick of playing in a Canadian market. He has 9 years of anonymity in Vegas now Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 24 minutes ago, robrob74 said: I could see Valamaki being the stopper. Maybe they needed Dube as well. I think BT could’ve worked around the cap, but maybe he wasn’t willing to go 10.5 that Stone was asking to play in Canada. I'm not going to go on about this because it's done. Stone said he was fed up with the way the team was being set up. The "offer" leaked to be 10.5 x 5 was to stick around during a rebuild without Karlsson, Duchene, and Dzingle. If that was even a real offer. Souns like the "offer" they gave to Karlsson. Dorion said this was by far the best offer they were given. Didn;t even get a conditional for signing. What a joke of a GM. Brannstrom will be a great player some day. Maybe even as good as Dahlen. That's a long way off. Sucks to be a Sens fan. Any time a player makes too much or is looking for money, they ship him out. Turris - makes too much and wants more money - trade him + 1st (2017)+ 1st (2019) + rd (2019) for Duche Hoffman - lockerroom cancer because his fiance is being sued by Karlsson's wife. Duchene - makes too much and wants more money - trade him for 1st in 2019 and a conditional on 2020 and two prospects Dzingel - pending UFA who will make too much - traded with a 7th for Duclair and 2020 2nd and 2021 2nd Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 1 minute ago, travel_dude said: I'm not going to go on about this because it's done. Stone said he was fed up with the way the team was being set up. The "offer" leaked to be 10.5 x 5 was to stick around during a rebuild without Karlsson, Duchene, and Dzingle. If that was even a real offer. Souns like the "offer" they gave to Karlsson. Dorion said this was by far the best offer they were given. Didn;t even get a conditional for signing. What a joke of a GM. Brannstrom will be a great player some day. Maybe even as good as Dahlen. That's a long way off. Sucks to be a Sens fan. Any time a player makes too much or is looking for money, they ship him out. Turris - makes too much and wants more money - trade him + 1st (2017)+ 1st (2019) + rd (2019) for Duche Hoffman - lockerroom cancer because his fiance is being sued by Karlsson's wife. Duchene - makes too much and wants more money - trade him for 1st in 2019 and a conditional on 2020 and two prospects Dzingel - pending UFA who will make too much - traded with a 7th for Duclair and 2020 2nd and 2021 2nd Ya, I was a bit miffed on not picking something up. But in the end we have players who now know how to play together and have grown chemistry. The fan960 talking heads were giving that as the consolation prize of the day. Czarnik and Ryan playing better. But I have loved the way the 4th line has played. They’ve been good for getting momentum back at key times. Hockey is like that, whoever scores when they have momentum tends to win. This year the team has been scoring with momentum. Even if the 4th isn’t going to score as much, they’re breathing life into the lineup and helping the rest of the team get up. The 4th has given decent offence lately. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 42 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said: Who knows, after all Stone has been through in Ottawa, maybe he was sick of playing in a Canadian market. He has 9 years of anonymity in Vegas now Yup! True story. vegas also seems like it is well run so far. The way ottawa has has been the last 2-3 years who’d want to be associated with that team? they probably need new blood to rinse the recent past & start over. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 12 minutes ago, robrob74 said: Ya, I was a bit miffed on not picking something up. But in the end we have players who now know how to play together and have grown chemistry. The fan960 talking heads were giving that as the consolation prize of the day. Czarnik and Ryan playing better. But I have loved the way the 4th line has played. They’ve been good for getting momentum back at key times. Hockey is like that, whoever scores when they have momentum tends to win. This year the team has been scoring with momentum. Even if the 4th isn’t going to score as much, they’re breathing life into the lineup and helping the rest of the team get up. The 4th has given decent offence lately. I credit BP for the secondary scoring kicking in. Giving them a chance by rolling 4 lines. Mangapane, Czarnik, Ryan and Backlund scoring now 5v5. We were missing that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob74 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 7 minutes ago, travel_dude said: I credit BP for the secondary scoring kicking in. Giving them a chance by rolling 4 lines. Mangapane, Czarnik, Ryan and Backlund scoring now 5v5. We were missing that. Very true. I am wondering how banged up Monahan & Tkachuk might be. They’re both as quiet as the other, so I think it could be something more than we are aware of. It could just be that teams are zeroing in on them more. I am surprised their isnt more chatter for coach of the year for him or even GM of the year for BT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted February 26, 2019 Author Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 29 minutes ago, robrob74 said: Very true. I am wondering how banged up Monahan & Tkachuk might be. They’re both as quiet as the other, so I think it could be something more than we are aware of. It could just be that teams are zeroing in on them more. I am surprised their isnt more chatter for coach of the year for him or even GM of the year for BT. Coach of the year has many possibles. Trotz is the likely candidate, even though our turnaround has been nothing short of amazing. Name recognition. BT Hasn't done anything to help the team since the summer. When the Flames win the cup, he may get a lot of votes. The GM's that fleeced Dorion also will get votes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 McKenzie saying the Flames may be a little "miffed" about the Zucker deal falling through Quote Wild basically had a deal done for Jason Zucker to go to Calgary, and something went wrong at the last minute and the deal got kiboshed. I think Calgary was a little miffed at how all of that rolled out. So they thought they had a pretty significant add at the deadline, and for whatever reason - and I don’t know what it was - it didn’t materialize. Also confirms that Ottawa insisted on Valimaki in the Stone deal and that was a no go. Quote “They were in on Stone, but the guy that Ottawa was insisting on as a comparable for Brannstrom was Juuso Valimaki, and Calgary was determined not to give him up. So I think that’s why they basically backed out of that one. https://www.nicholsonhockey.com/archives/2019/2/26/mckenzie-on-flames-deadline-disappointment-level Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheersMan Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 11 minutes ago, cross16 said: McKenzie saying the Flames may be a little "miffed" about the Zucker deal falling through Also confirms that Ottawa insisted on Valimaki in the Stone deal and that was a no go. https://www.nicholsonhockey.com/archives/2019/2/26/mckenzie-on-flames-deadline-disappointment-level And that still may not have been enough. Dorion was playing BT and McPhee like a banjo. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 12 minutes ago, cross16 said: McKenzie saying the Flames may be a little "miffed" about the Zucker deal falling through Makes me feel uneasy. I hope we don't revisit Zucker this summer. We don't have cap space (unless it's Zucker for Neal straight up). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 14 minutes ago, CheersMan said: And that still may not have been enough. Dorion was playing BT and McPhee like a banjo. How so? Looks like Dorion only played McPhee. Unless of course, BT DID offer Valimaki but Dorion chose Brannstrom instead. And now all this "news" from Bob McKenzie is BT using the media after the fact to save face. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 I have to agree that I don't think there is a GM who looks worse today than Pierre Doiron and he got played. He had the best asset available and managed to get it to a point where he drove away all other buyers than 1. Not exactly how you extract max value. Don't get me wrong Branstrom is a fantastic add but they should have got more for Stone, just like they should have got more for Karlsson etc etc. Ottawa seems to do a great job at the draft table so maybe they can put themselves out of this but boy oh boy is their management team a wreck. The logic they seem to have behind their approach to team building is incredibly bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfire11 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 I would have loved to have Mark Stone on our team but not at 10+ mil a year and not for 8 years. Now we can trade Michael Stone and use our 1st round pick to select another Valmaki, Stone, Point, or Gaudreau. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CheersMan Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 28 minutes ago, The_People1 said: How so? Looks like Dorion only played McPhee. Unless of course, BT DID offer Valimaki but Dorion chose Brannstrom instead. And now all this "news" from Bob McKenzie is BT using the media after the fact to save face. With an expiring asset (Stone), Dorion ended up with Brannstrom and BT helped him get it, that's how. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 Lebrun explains how the Sens were about 30 mins away from the deal faling apart. Not to mention what a horrible look it is that the Sens had how much time to for them to NOT get a deal with Stone and yet the Knights get it done in 30 mins. I'm honesty not sure the Sens can repair their image with Melnyk around. https://www.nicholsonhockey.com/archives/2019/2/26/lebrun-explains-last-minute-stone-trade-details Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted February 26, 2019 Report Share Posted February 26, 2019 9 minutes ago, cross16 said: Lebrun explains how the Sens were about 30 mins away from the deal faling apart. Not to mention what a horrible look it is that the Sens had how much time to make a deal and yet the Knights get it done in 30 mins. I'm honesty not sure the Sens can repair their image with Melnyk around. https://www.nicholsonhockey.com/archives/2019/2/26/lebrun-explains-last-minute-stone-trade-details Well, when fans crowd fund to post billboards about how much Melnyk sucks, I would say that he has an optic challenge as they say. With that owner, the Senators do not have a chance of ever getting anywhere. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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