Flyerfan52 Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 1 hour ago, MAC331 said: Still a lot of good talent on that team. Definitely they will need some change there, just a matter of who a new GM sees staying and going. Lombardi handed out some stupid contracts, could be some opportunities coming out of there. I wonder if we can add Quick to the long list of available goalies. 31 with 6 years @ 5.8 left (true $s remaining = 31 million). Doughty will be in demand as a dang good #1 RD. Bad for budget teams is his contract is rear loaded. Carter is 32 with 5 years remaining @ 5.27 (true $s over those 5 years 19.5) since it was front loaded. None of the 3 complicate matters with a NMC . The glut of good goalies available via UFA or trade limits the return for Quick so they might as well keep him unless they intend to go full turtle (in which case they might as well expose him in the LV draft). Doughty is still a top 10 D so the return there would be great from rich teams that care less about true $s. Carter with a built in discount in true $s would be a target for teams like the Jets (cap hit matters less than true money) but he sure would look good with Gaudreau & Monahan for a few years. Again the cost to acquire will be high which gives the Jets the edge with a glut of kids that project as high end forwards. ***************************************************************************** I'd forgotten about this thread when I started the 1 about Sutter & Lombardi being fired so if Kulstad or 1 of the mods would consolidate them I wouldn't mind. Cowtownguy foresaw big changes for the Kings so this is the thread to post in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 8 minutes ago, Flyerfan52 said: I wonder if we can add Quick to the long list of available goalies. 31 with 6 years @ 5.8 left (true $s remaining = 31 million). Doughty will be in demand as a dang good #1 RD. Bad for budget teams is his contract is rear loaded. Carter is 32 with 5 years remaining @ 5.27 (true $s over those 5 years 19.5) since it was front loaded. None of the 3 complicate matters with a NMC . The glut of good goalies available via UFA or trade limits the return for Quick so they might as well keep him unless they intend to go full turtle (in which case they might as well expose him in the LV draft). Doughty is still a top 10 D so the return there would be great from rich teams that care less about true $s. Carter with a built in discount in true $s would be a target for teams like the Jets (cap hit matters less than true money) but he sure would look good with Gaudreau & Monahan for a few years. Again the cost to acquire will be high which gives the Jets the edge with a glut of kids that project as high end forwards. ***************************************************************************** I'd forgotten about this thread when I started the 1 about Sutter & Lombardi being fired so if Kulstad or 1 of the mods would consolidate them I wouldn't mind. Cowtownguy foresaw big changes for the Kings so this is the thread to post in. I think you hit the nail on the head for the Flames not having the parts or will to part with the players necessary to obtain Carter. Blake will have an interesting clean up job there this offseason for sure. I'm afraid to guess, from a Flames perspective I would like Toffoli but he is likely a young player they want to keep. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulstad Posted April 11, 2017 Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 2 hours ago, Flyerfan52 said: I'd forgotten about this thread when I started the 1 about Sutter & Lombardi being fired so if Kulstad or 1 of the mods would consolidate them I wouldn't mind. Cowtownguy foresaw big changes for the Kings so this is the thread to post in. That other thread has lost it's collective mind, so "normal" conversation can be had here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted April 11, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 11, 2017 Getting rid of Sutter and Lombardi suggests a desire to change management style. To me, that means developing young talent, trying to avoid trading for veterans, and possibly rebuilding. If so, how many of their good players will want to stay with them? Doughty and Quick don't strike me as the type to patiently work through a rebuild of sorts. They may also be the chips to turn around the ship. It might yet get interesting come off-season. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockeypriest2 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 I see this slightly different than most...From the things I have heard and read my inference (tinfoil hat stuff) is that the Kings really just wanted to fire Sutter and thought that the players underperformed on the ice...I think that Lombo wouldn't do it so he fell on the sword as well... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hockeypriest2 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 2 hours ago, Kulstad said: That other thread has lost it's collective mind, so "normal" conversation can be had here. Sorry!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Heartbreaker Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 3 hours ago, Kulstad said: That other thread has lost it's collective mind, so "normal" conversation can be had here. 1 hour ago, hockeypriest2 said: Sorry!!! It was bound to happen Sutter or later... Love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carty Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 4 hours ago, Kulstad said: That other thread has lost it's collective mind, so "normal" conversation can be had here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 12 hours ago, Carty said: I wonder if you work at the same place I do!? 13 hours ago, hockeypriest2 said: I see this slightly different than most...From the things I have heard and read my inference (tinfoil hat stuff) is that the Kings really just wanted to fire Sutter and thought that the players underperformed on the ice...I think that Lombo wouldn't do it so he fell on the sword as well... Lombardi made some unusual moves. He really tapped out his picks, brought in Bishop when the problem was a lack of scoring, and the Gaborik signing seemed like a poor decision to me. I think that you are correct that the two seem to be a solid due. I just think that the organization really needed to replace them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 16 hours ago, Cowtownguy said: Getting rid of Sutter and Lombardi suggests a desire to change management style. To me, that means developing young talent, trying to avoid trading for veterans, and possibly rebuilding. If so, how many of their good players will want to stay with them? Doughty and Quick don't strike me as the type to patiently work through a rebuild of sorts. They may also be the chips to turn around the ship. It might yet get interesting come off-season. I see an attempt to retool rather than a youth movement. They IMO went to far on size and forgot that the game has become about speed. Honestly I don't know how this will all shake out because Lombardi handed out the money like candy. I would take an approach that built from the net out having Quick G, Doughty D and Kopitar F as my starting point with everyone else available within trades. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 I think this came down to a philosophy of management combined with the fact the Kings do have some talented young execs in their front office that may have been poached. Blake comes highly regarded and while most scoff at the "former player" idea, I think its important to know that Blake has spent the last 7 years working in the game. Cut his teeth in the NHL front office and then in the Kings front office working under Lombardi, and also worked for Team Canada. He is qualified. They also have Mike Futa who is a very highly respected talented evaluator league wide. From a combination of Lombardi trading away too many picks/young players trying to patch holes in a sinking ship, acquiring older/slower players, tied up cap room in aging slower players, and Darryl Sutter not being very open to playing younger players, especially form certain development leagues it sure sounds like it was just a philosophy change the Kings were after. Going to be tough, but I agree the Kings are likely to re tool, not rebuild. I don't see the need to "rebuild" they've got some talent they can use to get back into the playoff picture and you have to think that Sutter just wore on these guys. Guys like Kopitar and Toffoli are just too good to have that bad of seasons. They need to get some excitement back in the way the play. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 1 hour ago, MAC331 said: I see an attempt to retool rather than a youth movement. They IMO went to far on size and forgot that the game has become about speed. Honestly I don't know how this will all shake out because Lombardi handed out the money like candy. I would take an approach that built from the net out having Quick G, Doughty D and Kopitar F as my starting point with everyone else available within trades. I wonder how they can proceed and keep their best players. They have a difficult task ahead of them. They need to get younger players with speed and eliminate some brutal contracts. Sutter helped get them two cups, but he is the ice hockey equivalent to a dystopian zombie movie. The main difference is that the zombies in The Walking Dead can skate faster. Unless I am missing an angle here, it seems to me that management will either go the Vancouver route which means a slower death, or trade off the best players and snag several solid rookies. Toronto has tried the retooling route for decades and it has not worked. Only San Jose has been exceptional in managing assets IMO. I give credit to Wilson. He has a talented young line and a solid veteran line that may raise their game in the playoffs. Edmonton is in for a series because they cannot quadruple shift McJeebus. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 23 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said: I wonder how they can proceed and keep their best players. They have a difficult task ahead of them. They need to get younger players with speed and eliminate some brutal contracts. Sutter helped get them two cups, but he is the ice hockey equivalent to a dystopian zombie movie. The main difference is that the zombies in The Walking Dead can skate faster. Unless I am missing an angle here, it seems to me that management will either go the Vancouver route which means a slower death, or trade off the best players and snag several solid rookies. Toronto has tried the retooling route for decades and it has not worked. Only San Jose has been exceptional in managing assets IMO. I give credit to Wilson. He has a talented young line and a solid veteran line that may raise their game in the playoffs. Edmonton is in for a series because they cannot quadruple shift McJeebus. Trading for prospects youth is the direction I see Blake/Robitaille taking. I'd call Chicago's asset management 2nd to none. They've traded away enough dang good players to form a contender but every year bring in parts to complement Toews, Kane, Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson & Crawford (say what you will but 2 SC rings tell me he's pretty dang good). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cowtownguy Posted April 12, 2017 Author Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 1 minute ago, Flyerfan52 said: Trading for prospects youth is the direction I see Blake/Robitaille taking. I'd call Chicago's asset management 2nd to none. They've traded away enough dang good players to form a contender but every year bring in parts to complement Toews, Kane, Hossa, Keith, Seabrook, Hjalmarsson & Crawford (say what you will but 2 SC rings tell me he's pretty dang good). You may be correct. Perhaps Chicago is managed even better than San Jose. I often wonder, however, if the team is going to seriously plummet once Kane and Toews lose just a bit of their excitement for the game. How long can these guys keep going at this pace? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 25 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said: I wonder how they can proceed and keep their best players. They have a difficult task ahead of them. They need to get younger players with speed and eliminate some brutal contracts. Sutter helped get them two cups, but he is the ice hockey equivalent to a dystopian zombie movie. The main difference is that the zombies in The Walking Dead can skate faster. Unless I am missing an angle here, it seems to me that management will either go the Vancouver route which means a slower death, or trade off the best players and snag several solid rookies. Toronto has tried the retooling route for decades and it has not worked. Only San Jose has been exceptional in managing assets IMO. I give credit to Wilson. He has a talented young line and a solid veteran line that may raise their game in the playoffs. Edmonton is in for a series because they cannot quadruple shift McJeebus. There is a task ahead undoubtedly but to keep hockey prevalent in LA which the owners will want to do they won't do a full rebuild. Try and trade size for some speed and skill should be part of the process. The players they need to move are Carter, Brown, Gaborik and maybe one of Clifford or Lewis. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted April 12, 2017 Report Share Posted April 12, 2017 15 minutes ago, MAC331 said: There is a task ahead undoubtedly but to keep hockey prevalent in LA which the owners will want to do they won't do a full rebuild. Try and trade size for some speed and skill should be part of the process. The players they need to move are Carter, Brown, Gaborik and maybe one of Clifford or Lewis. Brown with his play the last 2 years will be tough to move with almost $6 million x 5 left on his contract. Ditto for 35 year old Gaborik with $5 x 4. Clifford & Lewis are on the bargain contracts LA needs so should be retained. Carter is the only 1 that would be in demand & bring a good return. Unless the Kings are open to moving Doughty, Mantinez, Muzzin they stay with little cap space & holes to fill. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
redfire11 Posted April 13, 2017 Report Share Posted April 13, 2017 I predict Sutter to Las Vegas Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kulstad Posted April 13, 2017 Report Share Posted April 13, 2017 22 hours ago, Heartbreaker said: It was bound to happen Sutter or later... Love. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Flyerfan52 Posted April 13, 2017 Report Share Posted April 13, 2017 1 hour ago, redfire11 said: I predict Sutter to Las Vegas LV hired Gerard Gallant as their 1st head coach. Foley will make the announcement tomorrow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MAC331 Posted April 13, 2017 Report Share Posted April 13, 2017 16 hours ago, Flyerfan52 said: Brown with his play the last 2 years will be tough to move with almost $6 million x 5 left on his contract. Ditto for 35 year old Gaborik with $5 x 4. Clifford & Lewis are on the bargain contracts LA needs so should be retained. Carter is the only 1 that would be in demand & bring a good return. Unless the Kings are open to moving Doughty, Mantinez, Muzzin they stay with little cap space & holes to fill. I agree about Gaborik and Brown with those contracts being hard to move. Clifford and/or Lewis wold be a fundamental change away from some size possibly toward some speed and skill. I couldn't believe it when Lombardi did that extension with Gaborik, stupid move. One move that may become available would be with WAS if Oshie moves on as a UFA. Keeping Brown wouldn't be the worst thing for them. Carter I agree could be the piece that nets them some useful pieces from somebody. The only piece as a Flames fan I would like to see come our way would be Toffoli however unlikely. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Fowl Posted April 15, 2017 Report Share Posted April 15, 2017 Sutter did the best he could with what he had. Lombardi mortgaged the future trying to grab one more cup, and he ended up losing too many future assets in the short term. There were too many bad contracts, and high paid poor performers. IMO, Kings will be struggling to see the post season for 3-4 years. Talk was that Sutter considering retirement anyway. If true, the Kings did him a favor since he still has term on his contract. In the LA market, we get all of the Kings and Ducks games televised. Always enjoyed watching Mumbles and his post game comments. Best thing for Kings to do would be to make a couple of trades, and start the rebuild sooner versus later. [Admin edit: moved your post from its original spot cuz that was the "weird place".] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.