What Is Best For Matthew Tkachuk

[Thebrewcrew]

So Tkachuk's actions Wednesday result in a 5,10 and a game suspension. You gotta be kidding me NHL.

[The_People1]

JUST IN: @NHLFlames F Matthew Tkachuk has been suspended one game for his actions on Wednesday against the @DetroitRedWings. Tkachuk was given a five-minute major and a game misconduct on the play for spearing. #NHL https://t.co/6EG8ej5hzZ pic.twitter.com/u4w8lIixKc

— SportsCentre (@SportsCentre) November 18, 2017

[MAC331]

17 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

So Tkachuk's actions Wednesday result in a 5,10 and a game suspension. You gotta be kidding me NHL.

They gave the other guy 10 games so you knew Tkachuk as the instigator of that whole melee was going to get something. I have to be honest, Tkachuk has to learn how and when to poke the bear and that isn't at every opportunity. He'll learn or he better because these situations can start going against you real fast and he is to good of a player to be in the box.

[travel_dude]

2 hours ago, MAC331 said:

They gave the other guy 10 games so you knew Tkachuk as the instigator of that whole melee was going to get something. I have to be honest, Tkachuk has to learn how and when to poke the bear and that isn't at every opportunity. He'll learn or he better because these situations can start going against you real fast and he is to good of a player to be in the box.

 

The other guy gets 10 games for walking back on the ice, whether Tkachuk riled him up or not.  Let's see, Witkwoski fights a guy unprovoked.  Slams him on the ice twice after he is down.  Tries to escape the linesman and fight Hamonic.  Chirps every Flame on the way out.  Leaves the ice and comes back.  Goes after anyone on the ice.

Yeah, that's all on Tkachuk.  Can;t say I've ever heard of Unsportsmanlike suspension. 

 

Tkachuk knows that he was wrong in touching a guy off the ice, but there are others that did more to incite this.  NHL PS can;t even get it right for a guy pounding a guy off the ice.  Nothing wrong there.    

[MAC331]

1 minute ago, travel_dude said:

 

The other guy gets 10 games for walking back on the ice, whether Tkachuk riled him up or not.  Let's see, Witkwoski fights a guy unprovoked.  Slams him on the ice twice after he is down.  Tries to escape the linesman and fight Hamonic.  Chirps every Flame on the way out.  Leaves the ice and comes back.  Goes after anyone on the ice.

Yeah, that's all on Tkachuk.  Can;t say I've ever heard of Unsportsmanlike suspension. 

 

Tkachuk knows that he was wrong in touching a guy off the ice, but there are others that did more to incite this.  NHL PS can;t even get it right for a guy pounding a guy off the ice.  Nothing wrong there.    

Feel better now

[Heartbreaker]

A serious question - does anyone know who I would contact about advertising with the Flames? 

I'd like to buy advertising space on Matthew's mouthguard. 

Love. 

[jjgallow]

37 minutes ago, Heartbreaker said:

A serious question - does anyone know who I would contact about advertising with the Flames? 

I'd like to buy advertising space on Matthew's mouthguard. 

Love. 

 

I love this forum

[travel_dude]

On 11/18/2017 at 2:03 PM, MAC331 said:

Feel better now

Maybe you need a break.  Why did you even bother responding?  

[Carty]

Comment for the Flames on SN's power rankings this week...  http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/nhl-power-rankings-standings-apology-edition-maple-leafs-babcock/

 

          

[Thebrewcrew]

Tkachuk's has a hearing today. Got a bad feeling about this one. Of course TO media has blown it way out of proportion as per usual

[JTech780]

1 hour ago, Thebrewcrew said:

Tkachuk's has a hearing today. Got a bad feeling about this one. Of course TO media has blown it way out of proportion as per usual

He'll probably get 2-4 games and he probably deserves it. You can't spear a guy and absolutely can't spear a guy from the bench, especially after you just got suspended.

 

With that being said I am fine with it and I am fine with Tkachuk getting this label of a dirty player, I think it's a good thing. If you go into the corner or battle in front of the net with Tkachuk, you'll have in the back of your head "this guy might spear, slew foot, butt end or elbow me" and if you are thinking about that then you aren't thinking about playing hockey and that will give Tkachuk the extra time and space he needs.

[MAC331]

44 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

He'll probably get 2-4 games and he probably deserves it. You can't spear a guy and absolutely can't spear a guy from the bench, especially after you just got suspended.

 

With that being said I am fine with it and I am fine with Tkachuk getting this label of a dirty player, I think it's a good thing. If you go into the corner or battle in front of the net with Tkachuk, you'll have in the back of your head "this guy might spear, slew foot, butt end or elbow me" and if you are thinking about that then you aren't thinking about playing hockey and that will give Tkachuk the extra time and space he needs.

I disagree in that Tkachuk has to be smarter with his antics than what he has displayed so far. You become ineffective if the refs turn the other way as infractions happen to you but keenly watch to you for every little thing. Sorry to say this but he has become a bit of a punk and I don't see the effect you want but the opposite. He has almost everyone on the ice looking to get a rise out of him so he does something to get a penalty. He'll learn.

[JTech780]

4 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

I disagree in that Tkachuk has to be smarter with his antics than what he has displayed so far. You become ineffective if the refs turn the other way as infractions happen to you but keenly watch to you for every little thing. Sorry to say this but he has become a bit of a punk and I don't see the effect you want but the opposite. He has almost everyone on the ice looking to get a rise out of him so he does something to get a penalty. He'll learn.

 

Tkachuk is still one of the top players at drawing penalties in the league so I think he doing an effective job at getting in the head of the opposition. I don't think he reacting to players targeting him, I think he is provoking players already on the edge and trying to get them to go over the edge.

[MAC331]

22 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

Tkachuk is still one of the top players at drawing penalties in the league so I think he doing an effective job at getting in the head of the opposition. I don't think he reacting to players targeting him, I think he is provoking players already on the edge and trying to get them to go over the edge.

The word for Tkachuk right now is "borderline" everything IMO

Just a comment on a positive note going into next season, it would be good to see him put 15 lbs of muscle and let his hockey do the talking for him.

[Cowtownguy]

Despite having been suspended before, I think that the league should be easy on him. Martin was not even aware that Chucky had "speared" him in the first place. Martin admitted that it was only upon video review that he found out about it. If a spear happens on video review, but the victimized player is not even aware of it, did it really happen?

[DirtyDeeds]

19 minutes ago, Cowtownguy said:

Despite having been suspended before, I think that the league should be easy on him. Martin was not even aware that Chucky had "speared" him in the first place. Martin admitted that it was only upon video review that he found out about it. If a spear happens on video review, but the victimized player is not even aware of it, did it really happen?

If a tree falls in the forest but no one sees or hears it.. did it really fall?

 

Of course it did. The cameras saw Chucky "laying the lumber" so it matters not. He has to stop the idiot stuff from the bench.

Big fine and 2 games.

[cross16]

2-3 game is my guess and he deserves it. I'm fine with the edge he plays on and I can tolerate suspensions that come out of borderline plays but spearing a guy from the bench is bush league and unacceptable. Doesn't matter if it was hard, soft, Martin didn't feel it whatever. The action is bush league and the fact he literally just got suspended for something similar makes it an incredibly stupid decision by Tkachuk.

 

You can live with the on ice stuff, but the other stuff has to stop. 

[Cowtownguy]

5 minutes ago, cross16 said:

2-3 game is my guess and he deserves it. I'm fine with the edge he plays on and I can tolerate suspensions that come out of borderline plays but spearing a guy from the bench is bush league and unacceptable. Doesn't matter if it was hard, soft, Martin didn't feel it whatever. The action is bush league and the fact he literally just got suspended for something similar makes it an incredibly stupid decision by Tkachuk.

 

You can live with the on ice stuff, but the other stuff has to stop. 

I suspect that a 2 game suspension will happen because Chucky just finished a prior suspension and, as you say, he was on the bench. I think anything more than that is too much. 

 

I disagree with you about the significance of whether the spear was hard or soft. Surely a guy who spears a person to the extent, say, that they require surgery for a ruptured spleen should get a longer suspension than someone who feathers his stick at another. After all, a significant part of the rationale for rules is to reduce injuries. If you agree that the spleen rupture guy should get a more severe punishment, then surely you agree that a spear that is not even felt deserves a less severe punishment.

 

I am not defending Chucky. This has happened before and he was on the bench. He violated the rules and will receive punishment. Having said that, perhaps if the league would officiate evenly and redefine "instigation", there would be less of this bush league crap. By redefine instigation, I mean that a guy who starts a fight is not necessarily the instigator. The crap before he began a fight should also be interpreted as instigation.

 

I may be wrong, and I do not have a review of the play, but if memory serves, Martin had just hit Brouwer from behind. It was a potentially dangerous hit. It could be, and was, subjectively interpreted as inconsequential, but it looked bad to me. It was ignored by the refs, and Martin was more than happy to instigate this sort of thing. That was also bush league. He was just smarter about it and got away with it. 

[The_People1]

I think spearing alone should be 2-games.  Then there's the whole "from the bench" angle which should be a 10-game suspension itself. 

 

Stupid play.  

[JustAFlamer]

The previous 1-game suspension was ridiculous : the 5-10 that resulted in multiple goals should have been enough (notice how players safety did not even bother calling it a spear).  That one should have been nothing.

 

This one, from the bench.  You can see he Jabs/Spears.  If he was on ice in scrum that probably would go free.  BUT from Bench, i would say 3 games just since he does not seem to be learning where the line cannot cross is.

Personally i like him, antagonize = ok, but stop crossing the line (a couple of the crashes to Anderson were a little iffy as well)

 

Unfortunately with the history (doughty/detroit) i can see him getting 5-10 (if the detroit one wasnt there which i dont believe should be would be less.  But he already got the hand slap this year and they will push more)

 

Really really hard to "guess" what the penalization will be when you see "other" infractions reviewed by player safety (intentional 2 handed chop/slash = 1 game) : tap to skate = 1 game ???? this one could be anywhere from Fine to (since is tkachuk) 10 games

[Carty]

28 minutes ago, JustAFlamer said:

The previous 1-game suspension was ridiculous : the 5-10 that resulted in multiple goals should have been enough (notice how players safety did not even bother calling it a spear).  That one should have been nothing.

 

This one, from the bench.  You can see he Jabs/Spears.  If he was on ice in scrum that probably would go free.  BUT from Bench, i would say 3 games

 

The problem I would have with a suspension is during the same game against the Wings you mentioned there were punches thrown from both benches that never even got mentioned by the league...   So for them to hand out a suspension for that little love tap would be a hypocritical reaction from player safety, but at the same time also typical...

[cross16]

1 hour ago, Cowtownguy said:

I disagree with you about the significance of whether the spear was hard or soft. Surely a guy who spears a person to the extent, say, that they require surgery for a ruptured spleen should get a longer suspension than someone who feathers his stick at another. After all, a significant part of the rationale for rules is to reduce injuries. If you agree that the spleen rupture guy should get a more severe punishment, then surely you agree that a spear that is not even felt deserves a less severe punishment.

 

The context of what I was saying relates more to the defense of "well it wasn't that hard so we shouldn't treat it as a big deal". The action and intent of trying to spear someone is bush league on the ice and is even more so from the bench, irregardless of the result.

 

Absolutely I would agree that the severity would impact the suspension i wasn't trying to say otherwise. I'm just saying you are already hearing some people defend Tkachuk by saying "well it wasn't that had a spear" and I don't agree with that logic. Severity for sure determines suspension lengths no question there. 

[Heartbreaker]

12 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

The context of what I was saying relates more to the defense of "well it wasn't that hard so we shouldn't treat it as a big deal". The action and intent of trying to spear someone is bush league on the ice and is even more so from the bench, irregardless of the result.

 

Absolutely I would agree that the severity would impact the suspension i wasn't trying to say otherwise. I'm just saying you are already hearing some people defend Tkachuk by saying "well it wasn't that had a spear" and I don't agree with that logic. Severity for sure determines suspension lengths no question there. 

I pretty much agree with this sentiment. A spear is a spear - but this wasn't violent by any stretch. I think this was more Matthew saying, "Get the hell out of here!" and pushing him away. It's bush, and it'll have to be dealt with. 

I definitely agree with what you're saying, though. If players were disciplined based on the severity of the injury caused, then there would be no consistency at all. Take Steckel on Crosby, for example. I don't think that there was intent to injure on the play, but Crosby was out for a long time because of that hit. Per: http://nationalpost.com/sports/hockey/nhl/haunted-by-sidney-crosby-injury-david-steckel-maintains-he-is-not-a-violent-player

 

Quote

“Every day, it becomes a bit less intense, but the feeling always returns when I see the video of the Crosby incident,” Steckel said. “Obviously, there was no intent whatsoever on my part; I never want to see any player injured, regardless of stature, and I’ve felt badly for [Crosby] since the day it happened.”

Although he returned to play in the next game, and was hit by Victor Hedman, I believe that it was the Steckel hit that really did the more significant damage. Crosby went on to miss 66 games - the rest of the season, and part of the next season: http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/look-sidney-crosbys-nhl-concussion-history/

 

How do you punish that - I mean, if you base the punishment on the severity of the injury? At the time, the league didn't punish David Steckel at all, much to the chagrin of the Penguins: http://nhl.nbcsports.com/2011/01/04/nhl-will-not-discipline-david-steckel-for-his-winter-classic-hit-on-sidney-crosby-crosby-not-amused/

 

If they were to do that, though, they'd never know how long he was out until he was back in. In this case, he was back in the next game. So the only way to handle this is to call a spade a spade, regardless of the outcome. 

 

Love. 

[Flyerfan52]

4 hours ago, JTech780 said:

He'll probably get 2-4 games and he probably deserves it. You can't spear a guy and absolutely can't spear a guy from the bench, especially after you just got suspended.

 

With that being said I am fine with it and I am fine with Tkachuk getting this label of a dirty player, I think it's a good thing. If you go into the corner or battle in front of the net with Tkachuk, you'll have in the back of your head "this guy might spear, slew foot, butt end or elbow me" and if you are thinking about that then you aren't thinking about playing hockey and that will give Tkachuk the extra time and space he needs.

The zebras didn't see it & Martin says he never felt it. It must have been a very light touch if the 1 getting speared didn't know until showed it on tape.

That said it was a stupid thing for Matt to do.

[Flyerfan52]

1 hour ago, Carty said:

 

The problem I would have with a suspension is during the same game against the Wings you mentioned there were punches thrown from both benches that never even got mentioned by the league...   So for them to hand out a suspension for that little love tap would be a hypocritical reaction from player safety, but at the same time also typical...

I saw Freedman (1 of the very few talking heads who's opinion I actually respect to a degree) saying he figures a fine would be more that enough. He also opined that that little tap was no more harmful that squirting water from the bench. Both childish moves but certainly not suspension worthy.