Glen Gulutzan-16th Flames Coach

[conundrumed]

Our offense is almost non-existent, we don't know how to score.

Now I know stat magic can show me how we're so much better, but at the end of the day, we aren't scoring.

Same as usual.

Not enough forward power.

[robrob74]

2 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Our offense is almost non-existent, we don't know how to score.

Now I know stat magic can show me how we're so much better, but at the end of the day, we aren't scoring.

Same as usual.

Not enough forward power.

 

Yup! Bennett at wing definitely opened things up the last year. But they also took more chances that created opportunities both ways. 

 

I was hoping for more wt the game tonight. The Canucks kept them from the outside and even though the Flames had control, I felt Miller saw most of the shots. That's where I have a problem with stats and possession, because it's great to have the possession. But if you're not in position to score, it is meaningless. For the first few periods, Miller saw everything, and then in the third he was already dialled in and feeling good about his game. There were a few good scoring chances but I never really felt that the Flames might score, aside from those few. What I mean is, there weren't that many dynamic scoring chances. 

[cross16]

8 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Our offense is almost non-existent, we don't know how to score.

Now I know stat magic can show me how we're so much better, but at the end of the day, we aren't scoring.

Same as usual.

Not enough forward power.

 

I would tweak this. They CAN score, when they are confident. This team on more than one occasion has gotten on rolls where their offence looks great but can't do it consistently enough. When you're offecne is built predominantly around players 23 and younger you need to expect some inconsistencies. 

 

I dont knoe how they can do it, but getting a veteran top line forward to take some pressure off the kids would do wonders for this team. That's was never going to be Brouwer so that is not an answer. 

 

[MAC331]

5 hours ago, robrob74 said:

 

Yup! Bennett at wing definitely opened things up the last year. But they also took more chances that created opportunities both ways. 

 

I was hoping for more wt the game tonight. The Canucks kept them from the outside and even though the Flames had control, I felt Miller saw most of the shots. That's where I have a problem with stats and possession, because it's great to have the possession. But if you're not in position to score, it is meaningless. For the first few periods, Miller saw everything, and then in the third he was already dialled in and feeling good about his game. There were a few good scoring chances but I never really felt that the Flames might score, aside from those few. What I mean is, there weren't that many dynamic scoring chances. 

I agree, they made the game easy for Miller for the very first shot. On our side, you know it isn't going to be a good night when a 60' knucklepuck goes in first shot.

[AlbertaBoy12]

1 minute ago, MAC331 said:

I agree, they made the game easy for Miller for the very first shot. On our side, you know it isn't going to be a good night when a 60' knucklepuck goes in first shot.

That crushed my soul watching the game, and seeing that happen..

[MAC331]

Just now, cross16 said:

 

I would tweak this. They CAN score, when they are confident. This team on more than one occasion has gotten on rolls where their offence looks great but can't do it consistently enough. When you're offecne is built predominantly around players 23 and younger you need to expect some inconsistencies. 

 

I dont knoe how they can do it, but getting a veteran top line forward to take some pressure off the kids would do wonders for this team. 

 

PP has dried up lately as well.

[MAC331]

Just now, AlbertaBoy12 said:

That crushed my soul watching the game, and seeing that happen..

Certainly deflating but Elliott bounced back from it.

[AlbertaBoy12]

2 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Certainly deflating but Elliott bounced back from it.

I agree. But if we hadnt scored in the last 5 seconds the canucks would have won on a goal from center ice, how ridiculous. 

 

Anyways thouhg, I was happy to see the team stick with the system for a full 60, I wanna see that more.

[cross16]

6 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

PP has dried up lately as well.

 

Shouldn't matter, PPs dry up that is the nature of the beast. It's their 5 on 5 scoring that has been inconsistent. That's where they need to improve the most. 

[MAC331]

18 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Shouldn't matter, PPs dry up that is the nature of the beast. It's their 5 on 5 scoring that has been inconsistent. That's where they need to improve the most. 

Well it does matter when you have been getting a lot of your offense from it. We all know the 5 on 5 has to get way better and we can all see the reasons why it isn't getting any better.

[DirtyDeeds]

2 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Shouldn't matter, PPs dry up that is the nature of the beast. It's their 5 on 5 scoring that has been inconsistent. That's where they need to improve the most. 

It should and does matter. Special teams accounts for 1/3rd of a game(rough avg).  It is so much more important now than just a few years ago.

[travel_dude]

3 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

I would tweak this. They CAN score, when they are confident. This team on more than one occasion has gotten on rolls where their offence looks great but can't do it consistently enough. When you're offecne is built predominantly around players 23 and younger you need to expect some inconsistencies. 

 

I dont knoe how they can do it, but getting a veteran top line forward to take some pressure off the kids would do wonders for this team. That's was never going to be Brouwer so that is not an answer. 

 

 

There are some things that I notice in games where we have the puck on a string (like last night).

• The Brodie PP unit is all passing around the horn; nothing in close, no blasts from the point
• In general, shots from the defense are too finessed, the D hold onto the puck looking for the perfect shot
• No attempts to deflect the puck; the shots are easily stopped by a competent goalie

 

That top line RW is showing in its absence.  If it was possible to make a deal for one today, I would gladly expose Brouwer.    Versteeg is okay n that role right now, and I would keep him there for a few games to see if the RHS helps the line.  But he isn't a true top 3 player.

[cross16]

1 hour ago, DirtyDeeds said:

It should and does matter. Special teams accounts for 1/3rd of a game(rough avg).  It is so much more important now than just a few years ago.

 

You shouldn't need your PP to drive your offence that is the point. Of course PP matters but your PP is gojng to dry up from time to time and that shouldn't explain your team offence disappearing. Flames rely on their PP too much. 

[DirtyDeeds]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

You shouldn't need your PP to drive your offence that is the point. Of course PP matters but your PP is gojng to dry up from time to time and that shouldn't explain your team offence disappearing. Flames rely on their PP too much. 

You are living in the dark ages Cross.  Special teams is probably the single most important area for teams to work at for playoff contention. Just look at the simple data of how many teams fail make the playoffs with poor special teams and you can see this. The inverse is true as well. Good special teams makes it easier for playoffs more often than it doesn't.

You don't need more advanced stats to show you the importance of special teams and how they affect playoff contention.

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

There are some things that I notice in games where we have the puck on a string (like last night).

• The Brodie PP unit is all passing around the horn; nothing in close, no blasts from the point
• In general, shots from the defense are too finessed, the D hold onto the puck looking for the perfect shot
• No attempts to deflect the puck; the shots are easily stopped by a competent goalie

 

That top line RW is showing in its absence.  If it was possible to make a deal for one today, I would gladly expose Brouwer.    Versteeg is okay n that role right now, and I would keep him there for a few games to see if the RHS helps the line.  But he isn't a true top 3 player.

Brodie needs a huge kick in the pants and start shooting the puck, he is really starting to bother me. I'm sure GG gave him the same message. I look at SJS and their approach is funnel the puck to the net and have the forwards channeling down with it to the net. We should be doing the same especially from of point men or the ones that can put it on the net.

[MAC331]

7 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

You are living in the dark ages Cross.  Special teams is probably the single most important area for teams to work at for playoff contention. Just look at the simple data of how many teams fail make the playoffs with poor special teams and you can see this. The inverse is true as well. Good special teams makes it easier for playoffs more often than it doesn't.

You don't need more advanced stats to show you the importance of special teams and how they affect playoff contention.

We need both

[cross16]

49 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

You are living in the dark ages Cross.  Special teams is probably the single most important area for teams to work at for playoff contention. Just look at the simple data of how many teams fail make the playoffs with poor special teams and you can see this. The inverse is true as well. Good special teams makes it easier for playoffs more often than it doesn't.

You don't need more advanced stats to show you the importance of special teams and how they affect playoff contention.

 

Ad again, no one said special teams are not important. Flames derive 26% of their goals off their PP. league avg I see about 21 and a good team would be under 20%. 

No one is saying that special teams arnt important but you need to expect your pp will run hot and cold from time to time. A cold pp shouldn't be an excuse for a team not being able to score. Flames need to get more production 5 on 5 to go along with their pp so they don't live and die by their PP. that isn't healthy in the long term. 

Just because I'm a loser like this, I did the math on special teams league wide. 31.8% of the Flames goals come via special teams (PP and PK). League avg is 24.5 and most of the upper end teams are 20-22%. Catch 22 story is the flames have good special teams but they need more 5 on 5 production that is the point I am making. 

[MAC331]

38 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Ad again, no one said special teams are not important. Flames derive 26% of their goals off their PP. league avg I see about 21 and a good team would be under 20%. 

No one is saying that special teams arnt important but you need to expect your pp will run hot and cold from time to time. A cold pp shouldn't be an excuse for a team not being able to score. Flames need to get more production 5 on 5 to go along with their pp so they don't live and die by their PP. that isn't healthy in the long term. 

Just because I'm a loser like this, I did the math on special teams league wide. 31.8% of the Flames goals come via special teams (PP and PK). League avg is 24.5 and most of the upper end teams are 20-22%. Catch 22 story is the flames have good special teams but they need more 5 on 5 production that is the point I am making. 

You are absolutely correct they need way better 5 on 5 play, we have no consistency and its killing us.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, MAC331 said:

Brodie needs a huge kick in the pants and start shooting the puck, he is really starting to bother me. I'm sure GG gave him the same message. I look at SJS and their approach is funnel the puck to the net and have the forwards channeling down with it to the net. We should be doing the same especially from of point men or the ones that can put it on the net.

 

For the most part, I have no problem with Brodie's defensive game.  He isn't hard enough on the puck on the boards or the player with the puck, but that is more to do with the type of player he is.  Have to live with that.  Where I have the problem s his usage on the PP.  You see it in the 1st unit's struggles.  If you are going to give Brodie PP minutes, pair him with Gio on the 2nd unit and put Hamilton on the 1st unit.  

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

For the most part, I have no problem with Brodie's defensive game.  He isn't hard enough on the puck on the boards or the player with the puck, but that is more to do with the type of player he is.  Have to live with that.  Where I have the problem s his usage on the PP.  You see it in the 1st unit's struggles.  If you are going to give Brodie PP minutes, pair him with Gio on the 2nd unit and put Hamilton on the 1st unit.  

I would be satisfied if he would just shoot the darn puck when he has the opportunity and quit looking to pass off all the time. he will never be the strongest defender but he does well with the stickwork to keep the opposition at bay.

[conundrumed]

9 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

I would tweak this. They CAN score, when they are confident. This team on more than one occasion has gotten on rolls where their offence looks great but can't do it consistently enough. When you're offecne is built predominantly around players 23 and younger you need to expect some inconsistencies. 

 

I dont knoe how they can do it, but getting a veteran top line forward to take some pressure off the kids would do wonders for this team. That's was never going to be Brouwer so that is not an answer. 

 

I know he'll be $6mil per, but I think Oshie fits the bill. I know his background story about hating hockey etc due to just being pressured too much as a kid and I'm pretty sure he's come to terms with it.

He's never really been in a position to put a team on his back, but he almost did with Wash in last yrs playoffs.

He went to Washington for Brouwer, lol.

Right-shooting C bulky enough to match his attitude, he checks a lot of boxes for me.

Can we afford him is where the problem lies...

Who are the alternatives for a vet top 6 guy?

I agree and think it might be our biggest need after G.

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

I know he'll be $6mil per, but I think Oshie fits the bill. I know his background story about hating hockey etc due to just being pressured too much as a kid and I'm pretty sure he's come to terms with it.

He's never really been in a position to put a team on his back, but he almost did with Wash in last yrs playoffs.

He went to Washington for Brouwer, lol.

Right-shooting C bulky enough to match his attitude, he checks a lot of boxes for me.

Can we afford him is where the problem lies...

Who are the alternatives for a vet top 6 guy?

I agree and think it might be our biggest need after G.

Does Oshie not play RW ? I don't see him getting 6M and if we could snag him at 5.5M and lose Brouwer's 4.5M we would be better for it.

[DirtyDeeds]

8 minutes ago, MAC331 said:

Does Oshie not play RW ? I don't see him getting 6M and if we could snag him at 5.5M and lose Brouwer's 4.5M we would be better for it.

He is having a career year in Washington. Not sure we can afford what he would be asking(buying high). He is listed at RW but my memory says he was LW when he visted our barn while with the Blues.

[cross16]

Oshie was drafted as a center but blues moved him to wing a few years into his career and his game elevated. Plays mostly RW. 

I like oshie i just can't see the fit. Between both $ and term he'll likely get a contract that the flame would have trouble with. Term being the bigger concern. 

[AlbertaBoy12]

9 hours ago, cross16 said:

Oshie was drafted as a center but blues moved him to wing a few years into his career and his game elevated. Plays mostly RW. 

I like oshie i just can't see the fit. Between both $ and term he'll likely get a contract that the flame would have trouble with. Term being the bigger concern. 

I really dont see a fit long term for oshie here, id rather see us get a d man then sign oshie long term. Our pairings at forward need to be solidified with tkachuk moving alongside bennett then finding the right complimentary players to play alongside our top 9 players. Parenteau is a guy id target for next year on a short term deal to ride shotgun with JH and mony.