Brad Treliving - GM Tracking & Evaluation

[travel_dude]

14 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

I wonder if it's just a lack of talent around him.  Never had a true #1 Center to play with.  

 

Another thing is, he was able to push guys around in Juniors.  At the NHL level, guys are too big for him to push around consistently.  I also wonder how many times he's been challenged to fight just becauseof his dad.  Must be annoying.

 

The difference between Domi and Bennett is that Bennett is great without the puck.  Domi floats around.

 

There's the crux of the problem with Bennett.  He came in as another Doug Gilmour.  That kind of player takes years to develop.  Unless you are huge or can push around guys over 200 pounds, you better be able to adjust your game.  Sure Bennett is good without the puck, but he also needs to focus on doing things with the puck.  Not just trying to walk through the defense by yourself.

[DirtyDeeds]

7 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

There's the crux of the problem with Bennett.  He came in as another Doug Gilmour.  That kind of player takes years to develop.  Unless you are huge or can push around guys over 200 pounds, you better be able to adjust your game.  Sure Bennett is good without the puck, but he also needs to focus on doing things with the puck.  Not just trying to walk through the defense by yourself.

I wonder if this is just because he feels he has no support and wants to do things on his own because of that. I know there have been times I have been saddled with inept help or trainees and felt the need to just do it myself...

[travel_dude]

15 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

I wonder if this is just because he feels he has no support and wants to do things on his own because of that. I know there have been times I have been saddled with inept help or trainees and felt the need to just do it myself...

 

For about half a season I would have agreed, but he's been playing with at least one skilled passer since then.

Backlund, Frolik, JH, Janko....

I just get left with the sense, after watching games, that he doesn't want to pass or his passing is not great.

I just seems to me that he believes he can gain the zone by going through players.

Not to say he won;t become the next Backlund, but Backlund spent time in the AHL and 4th line.

[ABC923]

Bennett is actually a decent playmaker when he wants to be.  I think the problem is (especially lately) he just wants to score so badly that he tries too hard.  He’s too focused on ending his scoring drought and lets other aspects slide by the wayside.

[conundrumed]

On 4/7/2018 at 1:06 AM, The_People1 said:

 

I wonder if it's just a lack of talent around him.  Never had a true #1 Center to play with.  

 

Another thing is, he was able to push guys around in Juniors.  At the NHL level, guys are too big for him to push around consistently.  I also wonder how many times he's been challenged to fight just becauseof his dad.  Must be annoying.

 

The difference between Domi and Bennett is that Bennett is great without the puck.  Domi floats around.

That's a part of scouting I'll never understand is over-estimating wingers with good centers on great teams. Domi's C was Bo Horvat in London and the ice was always tilted.

Good numbers are easy when you don't have to play much D. This is why I have a slanted view of Raddysh. He went from Dylan Strome to Boris Katchouk. The points come easy with players like that.

Bennett is being Bennett. He put up solid numbers in his draft year, not incredible numbers, but didn't have much around him.

I think his biggest issue is the fans. Let him develop without the hairy eyeball of expectation. His body language, imo, is defeat too often.

Mony's a 6 pick, Bennett a 4, to expect that means he's better than Mony isn't the case. I'm sure at least half the fans thought, "great, Bennett at 1C, Mony at 2".

That was never going to be the case. If drafted in the same year, you don't take Bennett before Mony.

In shot release alone, Monahan is a world apart from Bennett, always has been, and scoring goals is the name of the game. It's how you shoot, not how hard. Bennett always pulls it back and zips it. World class goalies get most of those.

We gifted Bennett the 3C and have done nothing but complain since. His confidence is eroded, the team needs to take a step back and work with what he can become, not what they expect him to be.

Just my 2 cents. At $2mil for another year, it would be silly to cut bait.

 

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

That's a part of scouting I'll never understand is over-estimating wingers with good centers on great teams. Domi's C was Bo Horvat in London and the ice was always tilted.

Good numbers are easy when you don't have to play much D. This is why I have a slanted view of Raddysh. He went from Dylan Strome to Boris Katchouk. The points come easy with players like that.

Bennett is being Bennett. He put up solid numbers in his draft year, not incredible numbers, but didn't have much around him.

I think his biggest issue is the fans. Let him develop without the hairy eyeball of expectation. His body language, imo, is defeat too often.

Mony's a 6 pick, Bennett a 4, to expect that means he's better than Mony isn't the case. I'm sure at least half the fans thought, "great, Bennett at 1C, Mony at 2".

That was never going to be the case. If drafted in the same year, you don't take Bennett before Mony.

In shot release alone, Monahan is a world apart from Bennett, always has been, and scoring goals is the name of the game. It's how you shoot, not how hard. Bennett always pulls it back and zips it. World class goalies get most of those.

We gifted Bennett the 3C and have done nothing but complain since. His confidence is eroded, the team needs to take a step back and work with what he can become, not what they expect him to be.

Just my 2 cents. At $2mil for another year, it would be silly to cut bait.

 

You are right they did gift Bennett 3rd line C but never supported the move. In the meantime I think the move to LW is the right move and I say this only because I don't think Bennett has the smarts for C at this level. We need him to regain a scoring touch and its there so the players I think would compliment him the most are Backlund and Frolik. Bennett has become good defensively and with these two were could have one of the best checking lines in hockey. Should they gell and the offense evolves this team take a big leap forward.

[redfire11]

AHHH Brad Don't you have an announcement about firing Gulutzan? !!!!!!!

[DirtyDeeds]

22 minutes ago, redfire11 said:

AHHH Brad Don't you have an announcement about firing Gulutzan? !!!!!!!

This wont happen until he has done all the seasons reviews.. including his own. Doesn't that sound like government? I review myself and all the coaches, players, and give you the decision in May..

 

News on BH came out about May 3rd so don't expect BT's choice to go any sooner..

Personally I don't think GG is gone. He was BT's choice so will be given another year. Just My Opinion

We are already hearing rumblings about some players not showing heart or something.. The Brass of the Flames can sell it as a player problem not so much a coaching problem.

[JTech780]

27 minutes ago, redfire11 said:

AHHH Brad Don't you have an announcement about firing Gulutzan? !!!!!!!

 

 

Today isn't the right time to make such an announcement.

[cross16]

44 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

 

Today isn't the right time to make such an announcement.

 

Pretty special stuff. Both finished up late last night and already out there. Hat tip to both. 

 

 

[redfire11]

43 minutes ago, cross16 said:

 

Pretty special stuff. Both finished up late last night and already out there. Hat tip to both. 

 

 

YUP totally agree. Encouraging to see the hockey community pull together in support of one another.

[Cowtownguy]

1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

 

 

Today isn't the right time to make such an announcement.

While I agree with you and appreciate the sentiment, I will point out, however, that the Rangers didn't seem too worried about that when they canned Vigneault. They must have some folks from Western Canada on that team.

[JTech780]

The other thing is that there really is no rush to fire Gulutzan as most of the top candidates are still coaching, so you most likely aren't hiring anyone before the playoffs are over anyways.

[travel_dude]

5 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

The other thing is that there really is no rush to fire Gulutzan as most of the top candidates are still coaching, so you most likely aren't hiring anyone before the playoffs are over anyways.

 

True, but the sooner you pull the trigger the better.

You let it fester and the fan polls start showing up in the news.  

In EDM, the media made the decision to get rid of Eberle.

Get ahead of it, one way or the other.

 

[JTech780]

4 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

True, but the sooner you pull the trigger the better.

You let it fester and the fan polls start showing up in the news.  

In EDM, the media made the decision to get rid of Eberle.

Get ahead of it, one way or the other.

 

 

If management let's the fans sway their decisions on players and coaches then we don't have the right people in place at the management level.

[The_People1]

2 hours ago, Cowtownguy said:

While I agree with you and appreciate the sentiment, I will point out, however, that the Rangers didn't seem too worried about that when they canned Vigneault. They must have some folks from Western Canada on that team.

 

I would consider AV to coach the Flames. I think he simply had no talent in New York and had an aging goalie that was past his prime this year.  Considering Babcock coached a talentless team to dead last in the NHL, you cannot blame AV for his teams results with a roster he had.  He had so little to work with.

 

That plus you look at the talent the Flames have, there's no excuse to under perform.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, JTech780 said:

 

If management let's the fans sway their decisions on players and coaches then we don't have the right people in place at the management level.

 

If season ticket sales drive revenue, there will always be impact from the fans.

What I am simply saying is make the decision early enough.

You wait till the summer to start looking or announce he's your guy, there is less time to sell it to the fans.

 

[The_People1]

On 4/8/2018 at 1:46 PM, JTech780 said:

 

If management let's the fans sway their decisions on players and coaches then we don't have the right people in place at the management level.

 

Agreed.

 

The thing that concerns me the most though is BT confessing he's as perplexed by the team's results as us.  He gives off the shoulder shrug expression almost to say he thought he had a great team.  Man, he shouldn't be "confused" with where our team is.  He sounds like a walking wounded with no confidence in himself right now, all while trying his best to direct most of the blame on himself to shield his coaching staff and players.

[travel_dude]

1 hour ago, The_People1 said:

 

Agreed.

 

The thing that concerns me the most though is BT confessing he's as perplexed by the team's results as us.  He gives off the shoulder shrug expression almost to say he thought he had a great team.  Man, he shouldn't be "confused" with where our team is.  He sounds like a walking wounded with no confidence in himself right now, all while trying his best to direct most of the blame on himself to shield his coaching staff and players.

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/the-big-show/brad-treliving-things-didnt-go-way-cant-blame-injuries/

 

The Fan960 interview really has me concerned.

The questions were easy to avoid direct answers to.  Nothing hard hitting at all.  

I get he won't tip his hat but honestly, if you don;t have a clue to the problems, waiting till after garbage day, and after the emotion is gone is not going to reveal the answers in a bowl of alphabet soup.  You have to ask the coach what he thinks in a few days?  The Stajan's and Brouwer's are going to provide you with that great insight?  

 

Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors, but if nothing changes between now and next season, we are in for more of the same.  We aren;t just a good team that hasn;t quote reached our potential.  Corsi number are nice if they aren;t achieved by not getting quality shots and just passing around the puck.        

[The_People1]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/the-big-show/brad-treliving-things-didnt-go-way-cant-blame-injuries/

 

The Fan960 interview really has me concerned.

The questions were easy to avoid direct answers to.  Nothing hard hitting at all.  

I get he won't tip his hat but honestly, if you don;t have a clue to the problems, waiting till after garbage day, and after the emotion is gone is not going to reveal the answers in a bowl of alphabet soup.  You have to ask the coach what he thinks in a few days?  The Stajan's and Brouwer's are going to provide you with that great insight?  

 

I know man.  The right answer would have been, "we've evaluated for some time now and as soon as the season is over, we will go into motion and fix this thing".  But no.  Instead it's a lot of vocabulary gymnastics to dance around questions and stay uncommitted to any sort of clear direction.  

[cross16]

I get everyone is hungry for blood after a season like this, but expecting it to come yesterday wasn't going to happen. Treliving is always cryptic in his press conferences and yesterday was no different, it's how he and most execs operate. 

 

Worth pointing out that he praised Hartley in 16 during his year end press conference and then ended up letting him go. He isn't going to give straight direction and he really shouldn't. 

[Cowtownguy]

1 minute ago, cross16 said:

I get everyone is hungry for blood after a season like this, but expecting it to come yesterday wasn't going to happen. Treliving is always cryptic in his press conferences and yesterday was no different, it's how he and most execs operate. 

 

Worth pointing out that he praised Hartley in 16 during his year end press conference and then ended up letting him go. He isn't going to give straight direction and he really shouldn't. 

You are bang on with that post. I remember him offering praise for Hartley around this time. In fact, I believe he was quite gracious in praising him as he fired him. Yesterday was too early for several reasons (including the Humboldt tragedy), but there is nothing preventing him from moving before long. 

[MAC331]

10 minutes ago, cross16 said:

I get everyone is hungry for blood after a season like this, but expecting it to come yesterday wasn't going to happen. Treliving is always cryptic in his press conferences and yesterday was no different, it's how he and most execs operate. 

 

Worth pointing out that he praised Hartley in 16 during his year end press conference and then ended up letting him go. He isn't going to give straight direction and he really shouldn't. 

No coach does everything right and even GG would have done some good this season. BT needs to identify the real issues with this team and I am not so sure GG is the main one. Having said this if there is an opportunity to upgrade a segment of your team BT has to strongly consider all areas. Personally I think BT needs to correct some of his own wrong doings such as moving out Brouwer, Versteeg and Stone. I think we need a proven winner like Neal on this team so we don't end up depending on a 3rd year player like Tkachuk to provide all the leadership with the forward group.

[cccsberg]

11 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

https://www.sportsnet.ca/960/the-big-show/brad-treliving-things-didnt-go-way-cant-blame-injuries/

 

The Fan960 interview really has me concerned.

The questions were easy to avoid direct answers to.  Nothing hard hitting at all.  

I get he won't tip his hat but honestly, if you don;t have a clue to the problems, waiting till after garbage day, and after the emotion is gone is not going to reveal the answers in a bowl of alphabet soup.  You have to ask the coach what he thinks in a few days?  The Stajan's and Brouwer's are going to provide you with that great insight?  

 

Maybe it's all smoke and mirrors, but if nothing changes between now and next season, we are in for more of the same.  We aren;t just a good team that hasn;t quote reached our potential.  Corsi number are nice if they aren;t achieved by not getting quality shots and just passing around the puck.        

Yup, unfortunately it is becoming clearer by the day that BT is also in shock and believes we had a great team and somehow just missed.  He’s still hung up on the Corsi lie and so unless he has a revelation soon, he’ll end up the biggest problem.  That’s bad because it’ll be more of the same plus big deals for all the wrong reasons...

[MAC331]

17 minutes ago, cccsberg said:

Yup, unfortunately it is becoming clearer by the day that BT is also in shock and believes we had a great team and somehow just missed.  He’s still hung up on the Corsi lie and so unless he has a revelation soon, he’ll end up the biggest problem.  That’s bad because it’ll be more of the same plus big deals for all the wrong reasons...

I think you have to give BT more credit than you have here. Even he had to have learned somethings from this season. If he truly believed he had a team that would challenge for a SC then yes change him because he is delusional. Now if he steps back and takes a rational approach to analyzing all the why, what, where and how the season went the way it did he will come out a better GM. I believe it starts with him being real about his own decisions and thinking.