The Official Calgary Flames "New Arena" thread

[conundrumed]

15 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

I started this thread in 2014 with the above comment that is even more relevant today.

 

So much for, "build it and they will come".

ARI and Ottawa will end up with arenas before Calgary, who should have been between Detroit and NYI.

Amazing that they can't make it work.

The 'ol dome isn't exactly a nice experience.

[Thebrewcrew]

13 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

So much for, "build it and they will come".

ARI and Ottawa will end up with arenas before Calgary, who should have been between Detroit and NYI.

Amazing that they can't make it work.

The 'ol dome isn't exactly a nice experience.

It's amazing that a fantastic city like Calgary has two of the worst venues in North America. 

[conundrumed]

40 minutes ago, Thebrewcrew said:

It's amazing that a fantastic city like Calgary has two of the worst venues in North America. 

It really is. I was '94-2012 in Calgary, then a frequent visitor. It's a bummer that so little is invested towards any kind of top-shelf entertainment experiences.

[The_People1]

54 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

It really is. I was '94-2012 in Calgary, then a frequent visitor. It's a bummer that so little is invested towards any kind of top-shelf entertainment experiences.

 

But why don't billionaires build them if they need them?

[sak22]

5 hours ago, The_People1 said:

 

But why don't billionaires build them if they need them?

Because one gets help from the government so others try to do the same.  Crazy how cities have built football stadiums, baseball stadiums and hockey/basketball arenas for billionaires.  

[cross16]

12 hours ago, sak22 said:

Because one gets help from the government so others try to do the same.  Crazy how cities have built football stadiums, baseball stadiums and hockey/basketball arenas for billionaires.  

 

Just because it's the way it's traditionally been done, doesn't make it the right way to do it. I think this philosophy is, and should be changing, because public money can only go so far. You are seeing more and more teams fund projects, to various degrees, with mostly private money as opposed to public. I still believe cities have a role to play but it should be a smaller role that has been tradition to this point. I applaud the Cities approach to reach out to other investors and try to find new or other partners. 

 

I do think City of Calgary needs to investment more in sport but it should be at the grassroots level. Free up public money for that and let the private sector take care of these stadiums. 

[The_Tribal Chief]

Then if you want it that way cross then the city shouldnt expect to reap so much of a reward with the flames here they expect to take as much money from the team as they can then they expect them to also build a arena privatley no offence cross somethings gotta give

[cross16]

25 minutes ago, The_Snowbear said:

Then if you want it that way cross then the city shouldnt expect to reap so much of a reward with the flames here they expect to take as much money from the team as they can then they expect them to also build a arena privatley no offence cross somethings gotta give

 

Not sure I understand the angle here. 

 

The City doesn't make a lot of money off the Flames and they were not the ones who were going to profit more in the previous arena deals. Plus no one is suggesting that the City play no part it's just they shouldn't be relied upon for he majority of funding. 

[The_People1]

The city should pay for,

- road expansion (if necessary)

- train station expansion/new (if necessary)

- pedestrian bridges (if necessary)

- crosswalk designs to handle massive crowds

- plan for traffic lane reversals or whatever to handle sudden loads of traffic

- create parking lots nearby

- all utility infrastructure to the new arena

- lastly, offer land tax free because the revenue generated from the building should more than make up for it.

 

And that's it.  The owners need to pay for the actual arena building, engineering costs, construction costs, material costs, etc.

[The_Tribal Chief]

The city makes alot more from the flames stampeders aswell for that matter cause off the taxes they implement cause of them being a event based company so they make alot of cash it is like if they both left the cirty is gonna lose alot of Cash that is the angle im talking about right there if they dont want to help with the arena fine i understand thewy treat them like any other business and dont expect money from them cause there making alot more then most of the businesses in the city were right now they get alot of money yet also expect flames to cover it them self that is why im saying Treat them like a regular business if you want the arena's to be private purchase

[phoenix66]

8 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Not sure I understand the angle here. 

 

The City doesn't make a lot of money off the Flames and they were not the ones who were going to profit more in the previous arena deals. Plus no one is suggesting that the City play no part it's just they shouldn't be relied upon for he majority of funding. 

I will say this for perspective.. 

Don't ask how I know this, I can't tell you.. but the cost of NEXT to clean up the area was far less than what was reported .. let's just say in the big picture it was negligible ..contractors were already on standby..

But the fact of the matter is if it were built , it screwed the stampede board..the downtown revitalization  project.. u of c because they would become Soley responsible for the running and upkeep of McMahon etc. 

iF it were to become Murray Edwards footing the entire bill that is the kind of project that will happen..

They will own the land ..they will hold the rights to what else gets built in that zone ..likely become the landlords to the businesses that move in..

 

Agreeing to the last deal is what got the city to the table .. shovels wouid be in the ground now if the new mayor had not changed the  rules last minute .. whatever the next deal is will be far less beneficial to the city 

[cross16]

12 hours ago, phoenix66 said:

I will say this for perspective.. 

Don't ask how I know this, I can't tell you.. but the cost of NEXT to clean up the area was far less than what was reported .. let's just say in the big picture it was negligible ..contractors were already on standby..

But the fact of the matter is if it were built , it screwed the stampede board..the downtown revitalization  project.. u of c because they would become Soley responsible for the running and upkeep of McMahon etc. 

iF it were to become Murray Edwards footing the entire bill that is the kind of project that will happen..

They will own the land ..they will hold the rights to what else gets built in that zone ..likely become the landlords to the businesses that move in..

 

Agreeing to the last deal is what got the city to the table .. shovels wouid be in the ground now if the new mayor had not changed the  rules last minute .. whatever the next deal is will be far less beneficial to the city 

 

 

Then go nuts. I wasn't a fan of Calgary Next but if Edwards wants to do it, pay for it, and build another business then I don't have a problem with him doing it. 

 

I don't believe for a second he will though. 

[conundrumed]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

 

Then go nuts. I wasn't a fan of Calgary Next but if Edwards wants to do it, pay for it, and build another business then I don't have a problem with him doing it. 

 

I don't believe for a second he will though. 

I'm a big fan of that location myself. I find the Stampede area really dumpy and half sketchy. Along the river along Bow Trail west of downtown would be a prime area to turn into something. Has anything happened with that Greyhound Stn? I haven't been in, like, 6 years. Calgary needs a bunch of infrastructure upgrades. They pushed a lot of it outwards as the city expanded, but the downtown core has disintegrated into not nice, at all, regarding public transportation imo.

[sak22]

 

Some things are better not to post to social media.

[The_People1]

3 hours ago, sak22 said:

 

Some things are better not to post to social media.

 

I've been in the locker room during media scrum.  The room is smaller than it looks in the video.

[phoenix66]

10 hours ago, sak22 said:

 

Some things are better not to post to social media.

Been tagging Jyoti Gondek in every negative tweet I see about this. Hahaa

[cross16]

I've been in that room too and honestly I thought that video made it look way worse than it is. Of course you would prefer a new one but I don't think the locker room is a big issue to be honest, it is fairly nice. The rest of the rooms on the other hand.....

 

Different angle on it too

 

 

[conundrumed]

I've been to games in Calgary, Edmonton (Rexall & the new monstrosity), Detroit (the Joe & LCA), Toronto (MLG & Scotiabank) Montreal (The Forum & Molson Centre), the United Center in Chicago, MSG in NY and Xcel Energy Center in Minny.
I have to be honest. The Joe & the Saddledome are Satoshi Nakamotoholes. The Joe at least had Cobo Hall next to it, Greektown and casinos right close, a maybe 4-6 block walk to anything you might want for entertainment. Calgary has 17th Ave, big deal. The Stampede grounds location is a dump. Not even great hotel locations. I'm calling it as I see it. That whole Stampede area is a dump.

I was shocked when I first saw it, having moved to Calgary in '94. It's deflating. I've been away since 2015ish. Is it still a race between Forest Lawn, Marlborough and the Stampede area for crime?

Detroit was bankrupt....not sure what to say.

Bring on the hate, but I'm really just trying to be honest. Everything surrounding the Stampede grounds looks like 1976.

Take some Blockchaining pride. JFC. Taking public transport from S.of MacLeod or downtown is not a good experience.

Detroit's downtown core feels way safer. That is saying something.

[sak22]

20 minutes ago, conundrumed said:

I've been to games in Calgary, Edmonton (Rexall & the new monstrosity), Detroit (the Joe & LCA), Toronto (MLG & Scotiabank) Montreal (The Forum & Molson Centre), the United Center in Chicago, MSG in NY and Xcel Energy Center in Minny.
I have to be honest. The Joe & the Saddledome are Satoshi Nakamotoholes. The Joe at least had Cobo Hall next to it, Greektown and casinos right close, a maybe 4-6 block walk to anything you might want for entertainment. Calgary has 17th Ave, big deal. The Stampede grounds location is a dump. Not even great hotel locations. I'm calling it as I see it. That whole Stampede area is a dump.

I was shocked when I first saw it, having moved to Calgary in '94. It's deflating. I've been away since 2015ish. Is it still a race between Forest Lawn, Marlborough and the Stampede area for crime?

Detroit was bankrupt....not sure what to say.

Bring on the hate, but I'm really just trying to be honest. Everything surrounding the Stampede grounds looks like 1976.

Take some Blockchaining pride. JFC. Taking public transport from S.of MacLeod or downtown is not a good experience.

Detroit's downtown core feels way safer. That is saying something.

I think that's the purpose of the BMO expansion, event center and entertainment district.  The hotels will come once the others are built.  Once you cross the train tracks between 9th and 10th and the East Village has been improved visually with the music center and central library and river walk.  Still a little sketchy, but I don't find it too dangerous.

[cross16]

City and Flames have agreed to restart formal talks on the Event Center. 

 

City has engaged with an agency to represent them in the talks. And so it begins... again.......

 

 

[travel_dude]

I'm not holding my breath on this one.

Mayor and council may understand the value of an event centre, but other things are going on.

Neither side is going to budge a lot from the original deal.

In fact, I would think that the city may even want to get a better deal.

Just a feeling, since it was a pretty minor event that nixed the last deal.

[sak22]

Interesting CAA Icon was hired by the Oilers to help create their plan and negotiated with the city of Edmonton, now they are working for the city of Calgary in their negotiations.  They have a strong portfolio and have helped get a lot of projects going lately, I'm pretty optimistic this will get going in the right direction.  

[cross16]

Obviously would never question any hesitation or pessimism around this project but there is some hope here. While it feels like the City and CESC went dark after the last deal fell apart that wasn't the case. The line of communication was open, albeit through hired representatives, so the fact they are willing to start formal talks again would suggest that the conversations they've been having have been positive. 

 

I also agree that the City engaging in an experience negotiating partner is a good sign too. 

[The_Tribal Chief]

I heard this aswell but honestly i will beileve it when something is Done the new city council really scares me cause they dont seem interested what so ever in a new arena

[sak22]

6 hours ago, The_Snowbear said:

I heard this aswell but honestly i will beileve it when something is Done the new city council really scares me cause they dont seem interested what so ever in a new arena

If they weren't interested they wouldn't have been working on getting back to negotiations immediately after the Flames backed out, it took the Flames 10 months to get back to the table.  City council has a duty to get the best possible deal for the citizens of the city, because public support for this project is a lot lower than it would appear on here.