AlexDreki Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Just quietly, I don't think we should chuck him in the line up just for the sake of chucking him in the line up, when it's right it's right, say we lose to LA, the coaches may feel he's what we need to push us over the line against the Jets, or they may decide he won't. Personally I'd love to see him play but I think the timing has just been awful for him especially in a race this tight, you really don't want to be putting a new part into the engine unless you absolutely have to. Part of it also could be to test in Mental Fortitude, he's up with the big club in such a critical time of the season, he's done great in the Juniors, but this is the NHL, and it maybe learning experience enough being up at the next level, where you have to be able to jump in the deep end at a moments notice to help the team... the call may not come this year, but I think it's fair to say theirs got to be a Ton of nerves if your name gets put in the line up this late and with things so close. I'm not going to be terribly upset if he doesn't get the nod, either now or the playoffs, but I think being in such an environment, if he is the player we believe him to be, will only make him that much more determined. Anyway that's my two cents Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JTech780 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I agree. Some people around here have to quit mothering our prospects. Leave the coaches to make the decision on how much sheltering this little pitbull needs and let him run. Give him a chance to contribute to the teams success and become one with the pack in a meaningful environment.. And what if the coaches decide that the sheltering he needs is to sit in the press box? As far as I know a prospect hasn't been hurt by the team taking their time with them, but lots have been hurt by being rushed. Shore gives a better chance to win versus LA. Bennett hasn't played a single game in the NHL and has only 15 games this season. Calagry can't afford rookie mistakes in a game this important, Shore will play a solid, safe game. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Where did II'm sorry, but how is this comparable to Sven's development? Oh, you mean bringing him up, not playing him, telling him he needed to play big minutes not on the Flames. I am sure Sven would have delighted in playing 10-12 minutes per game. Anyway, the point of my post was that absolutes are pretty narrow minded thinking. Kehatch gave you some examples of how Bennett could draw in. I look at these three games as important to the Flames as any game all season. If Bennett gave us the best chance to win, do you think Hartley would pass that up? If a 3rd or 2nd line LW spot was available due to injuries, would it make sense to put a RHS like Shore in? Maybe Hartley does that maybe not. There is nothing absolute. Paint it 50 shades of Red it is still part of development. I am with everyone that wants to see Bennett. How is a 18 year old that has never played going to give us the best chance? Hey if we are in and Winn are in maybe just maybe he slots in, but I still don't do it. Other than fan selfishness there is not good coming from putting him in. As JT stated he has 18 junior games this year, NONE against big boys. To large of a gamble for ZERO benefit to either side. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Paint it 50 shades of Red it is still part of development. I am with everyone that wants to see Bennett. How is a 18 year old that has never played going to give us the best chance? Hey if we are in and Winn are in maybe just maybe he slots in, but I still don't do it. Other than fan selfishness there is not good coming from putting him in. As JT stated he has 18 junior games this year, NONE against big boys. To large of a gamble for ZERO benefit to either side. Do you recall Iggy, when we got him in trade from Dallas? Played in the playoff after avery short end of season. ZERO benefit is another absolute which doesn't make any sense. If he scored the GWG, then we would be in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 Raymond = current whipping boy For me, I've just never liked him as a player and always thought we didn't need his type of game. Not sure why, but I just never have. Maybe his time in Vancouver? I think he's too soft and is very one dimensional. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I don't agree that Shore necessarily gives us a better chance to win. He very well might, but not for us to decide. Maybe Bennett isn't ready, maybe he would light the world on fire. I think we have to be careful here, not to rush him and put unreal expectations on him. It could be he is fully capable of playing a few games and that excited energy gets him through them. What if he doesn't stick in the fall? Like Baertschi... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I don't agree that Shore necessarily gives us a better chance to win. He very well might, but not for us to decide. Maybe Bennett isn't ready, maybe he would light the world on fire. I think we have to be careful here, not to rush him and put unreal expectations on him. It could be he is fully capable of playing a few games and that excited energy gets him through them. What if he doesn't stick in the fall? Like Baertschi... Puting him in the game, in case (say it isn't so) Bouma is a game-time decision, isn't putting unreal expectations on him. The team is banged up and has Black Aces waiting in the wings. Playing his intead of Backlund or Stajan and expecting a solid 2-way performance is unreasonable. Playing him as a top 9 winger and managing his ice-time according to his results is reasonable. At best, he scores a goal helping the Flames win the game. Bennett has practiced and been around the Flames organization as much (or more) than Shore. If he has shown more than Shore, then he will get in due to an injury. Bumping up Ferland and playing Bollig does more harm than good. Playing Shore on LW is not a great idea. Switching Colborne to LW to play on the 2nd line and Shore on RW on the 3rd line is an option, but you are creating more disruption that way; affect 2 lines and players on those lines instead of swapping in a single player. In the fall, Bennett has two options; he makes the team or goes back to junior. Considering he had one of the better training camps last year, I would suspect he continues that this summer. His biggest problem is that he will crawl through mud to reach the NHL. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pucksage Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 In case the Flames win in regulation over LA tomorrow then the last game with Winnipeg might be the best time to put Sam in as it would be a no bearing game as far as the playoffs are concerned, but not against LA as it's a must win. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The_People1 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 If Bouma is injured then i think Ferland moves up. We also need size against LA so, maybe Raymond and Byron comes out. We insert the entire practice line of Bollig - Bennett - Shore. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 If Bouma is injured then i think Ferland moves up. We also need size against LA so, maybe Raymond and Byron comes out. We insert the entire practice line of Bollig - Bennett - Shore. There was some hint that Bollig may be back in. With that the tendencey would be to keep the "kid" line together, and would likely have Bollig play with Stajan and Jones. That puts the Stajan line as the defacto 4th line. Johnny/Mony/Hudler Raymond/Backlund/Colborne Ferland/Granlund/Jooris Bollig/Stajan/Jones Although a "truculent" 4th line makes some sense against the Kings, they have four lines that can score. Our 4th line has to play less than 10 minutes to limit Bollig's negative effect. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I don't like Bollig. He is a liability on the ice and completely unnecessary to have out there. If they don't want to baptize Bennett in the biggest game in years (understandably) then Shore is a better option IMO. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cross16 Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 If Bouma can't go, and early indications are he won't, then I would put Bolig in. Against LA I take the size and intimidation factor because that's how the play. Shore brings you size but no intimidation. I don't think Bennett plays unless they win tomorrow night. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 8, 2015 Report Share Posted April 8, 2015 I don't like Bollig. He is a liability on the ice and completely unnecessary to have out there. If they don't want to baptize Bennett in the biggest game in years (understandably) then Shore is a better option IMO.Bollig and Sam shoot left. Shore is a righty. The least disruptive thing to do is replace a LW with a LHS. Hartley would probably lean towards Bollig, but he also knows that Bollig offers no real offense, and limited functional effectiveness. In the last two weeks, he was in against the Stars (shootout loss) and the Blues (his penalty turned a close game to a loss). The other games were MIN (4-2 loss), Nashville (5-2 win), Dallas (5-3 win), EDM (4-0 win) and ARI (3-2 win). That is 4-1-0 without him and 0-1-1 with him. Cross, Johnny has been killing it against the Kings. Their intimidation did not limit Johnny one bit. Bollig served no useful purpose. In the 2-1 OT win against the Kings, he played all of 6 minutes, had a penalty for roughing, and was a -1. He was on the ice for the only goal against. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
xstrike Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I would tend to agree that Bollig hasn't been the most effective player on the ice. Who else do we have though? Really, I think the best option would be Hudreahan Ferland - Stajan - Jones (Shut down/tough minutes) Colborne - Backlund - Jooris Bollig - Granlund - Mayray This way, all but the 4th (and 1st) have the RWRS/LWLS and our two least effective players (Mayray and Bollig) are playing limited minutes. Feel bad for Granlund with them. Ferland showed he could potentially take Bouma's spot and has the edge to him that could help against the Kings. I know the criticism will be messing up the lines, but Hartley does that in game anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TrippinVdUb Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I think there is far too much over thinking going on here, like the fate of the game would be decided by putting Sam in the line up, Drew Shore or Brandon Bolig have had little to no impact on the result of games outside of BBs stupid penalties and were thinking of replacing them with a kid who has unreal natural ability. I dont believe tomorrow's game is the right stage to bring him out on but I will be extremely dissapointed if he doesn't make it in Saturday, for his sake and my own! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I think there is far too much over thinking going on here, like the fate of the game would be decided by putting Sam in the line up, Drew Shore or Brandon Bolig have had little to no impact on the result of games outside of BBs stupid penalties and were thinking of replacing them with a kid who has unreal natural ability. I dont believe tomorrow's game is the right stage to bring him out on but I will be extremely dissapointed if he doesn't make it in Saturday, for his sake and my own! I was wrong earlier when I said Iggy played in a few games before the playoffs, after being traded for Newy. Iggy played zero games before playing 2 games in the playoffs. one goal and one assist in his first two games as a Flame. No previous NHL experience. I may not be an NHL coach, but my first choice is always playing the best player in a position to succeed. Whether Sam can be a difference maker, he is by far a better player than Bollig. Risk to play him in the NHL? Of course. Better chance to help us win? What did Johnny do in his first game as a Flame - score a goal. If Bollig plays and costs us a goal or is ineffective on the line, we may lose the game. I prefer to put our fate in the hands of a capable rookie, surrounded by better vets and worthy rookies. If he was to get one shot on nets it could be a game changer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I may not be an NHL coach, but my first choice is always playing the best player in a position to succeed. Whether Sam can be a difference maker, he is by far a better player than Bollig. Risk to play him in the NHL? Of course. Better chance to help us win? What did Johnny do in his first game as a Flame - score a goal. If Bollig plays and costs us a goal or is ineffective on the line, we may lose the game. I prefer to put our fate in the hands of a capable rookie, surrounded by better vets and worthy rookies. If he was to get one shot on nets it could be a game changer. 2 different players with 2 different roles..makes no sense to put Sam in for Bollig. As a scorer on a scoring line, sure. Im sure hes showing Hartley in practice where he fits and building chemistry , when the time is right we'll see him I'm sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
flamesfan85 Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 I was wrong earlier when I said Iggy played in a few games before the playoffs, after being traded for Newy. Iggy played zero games before playing 2 games in the playoffs. one goal and one assist in his first two games as a Flame. No previous NHL experience. ... If Bollig plays and costs us a goal or is ineffective on the line, we may lose the game. I prefer to put our fate in the hands of a capable rookie, surrounded by better vets and worthy rookies. If he was to get one shot on nets it could be a game changer. A few days ago I was absolutely on the "don't rush him if we don't have to" wagon. But with the injury to Bouma we need to replace some potential scoring and grit. Sam is both of those, even if he is 18 and has never played in an NHL game. All of your points about Bollig are spot on. At this point in the season is it more than reasonable to say he is a liability at best. Sam was voted the most intelligent player in his league. Spent the majority of the season training with and being around our team, our system, our building. He was sent back to the OHL and had no problem vocalizing his surprise and the fact that he was upset he did not get a chance to play. He dominated in the OHL, took his team to the playoffs and unfortunately did not get a chance to progress in them. Now he is back. He has done what we have asked, he has proven he still has more to give. Even if he isn't going to score 2 goals and get an assist tonight, I have to think that his speed, tenacity and "hockey intelligence" would make him more useful on the fourth line than Bollig ever could be. And of course there is the everywhere-but-NHL-proven massive scoring upside he brings over Bollig. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
travel_dude Posted April 9, 2015 Report Share Posted April 9, 2015 2 different players with 2 different roles..makes no sense to put Sam in for Bollig. As a scorer on a scoring line, sure. Im sure hes showing Hartley in practice where he fits and building chemistry , when the time is right we'll see him I'm sure Sam is not intended to replace Bollig. He is an option for the 2nd or 3rd line (whichever Bouma played on). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
phoenix66 Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 NOW I say he should absolutely play against Winnipeg. Yes I know we are still playing for home ice, but Vancouver plays edmonton, and we have some bruises that need to heal, and you need depth in the playoffs. Lets see what hes got in a real game with essentially nothing to lose. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 Cloutier basically said that they were going to rest some guys next game so we're healthy for the Playoffs. He probably gets in. Wotherspoon probably does too. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tmac70 Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 I was wrong earlier when I said Iggy played in a few games before the playoffs, after being traded for Newy. Iggy played zero games before playing 2 games in the playoffs. one goal and one assist in his first two games as a Flame. No previous NHL experience. I may not be an NHL coach, but my first choice is always playing the best player in a position to succeed. Whether Sam can be a difference maker, he is by far a better player than Bollig. Risk to play him in the NHL? Of course. Better chance to help us win? What did Johnny do in his first game as a Flame - score a goal. If Bollig plays and costs us a goal or is ineffective on the line, we may lose the game. I prefer to put our fate in the hands of a capable rookie, surrounded by better vets and worthy rookies. If he was to get one shot on nets it could be a game changer. Bollig was good tonight, he will be an assest in the Playoffs to as it gets close checking and the game slows down. Back to Bennett, now that the last game is meaningless for both teams, I would venture to let the kid play now. I would have at no time allowed him to play without us being in the playoffs at risk. He may not even play as home ice advantage is at stake. That said I have now lessened my stance with him possibly playing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AlbertaHockey Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 Overall I am very happy the Flames Management did not throw Bennett into the wolves pit too early and ruin his career like the Oilers have done with so many of their top drafts. Development is key to these young players, I cant wait to introduce him into the lineup of the start of a new season after of course we win this damn Stanley Cup this year. Go Flames Go,, well deserved hard working players with an exceptional coach has this team an underestimated contender. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robrob1974 Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 Not only that, Bennett gets to workout in a healthy summer and beef up just a bit. It will be even better for his development because he probably lost most of last summer with his injury. AND, he still looked good in camp. Let's go Bennett! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kehatch Posted April 10, 2015 Report Share Posted April 10, 2015 I would play Bennett, Wotherspoon, and Ortio (if healthy). Home ice is important. But letting some of our guys rest up is more important. Plus, we need to see what we have in these players before the playoffs. For the first two they might be upgrades on what we have. For Ortio he needs a warm up in case we need him. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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