travel_dude

Good deal for the Flames.

I know about that one as well. Just a couple though, right? Girard. Hronek? Kyrou took 6 years before he stuck, so that make the rebuild with players like him extremely long.

Okay, so as a fan that watches games regularly (every one most likely), I am not about to watch us lose for 5 years to possibly one day have a team that is watchable. Not a contender, but watchable. We went through at least one and I won't even go to the Young Gun days, since that was old world bad. The reasons for blowing the rebuild, assuming that we did, isn't really important. You are as liable to make some of those same types of decisions again. No team avoids them. So, we can go through that all over again and have 10 more years of getting to the point we were in 2018 or last season. Or end up a lot worse and have to go through it again. So we finished the rebuild and ended up with some bad signings that turned into bad trades that limited our ability to sign better talent or make great trades. $11M on two players that contributed little this past playoffs where $11M could have put us over the top. We are closer to contender than closer to a successful rebuild that might be better. There are about 150 players drafted every year that go on to being just okay. Some years more, some less. Looking back to the 2016 draft, your would be hard pressed to find more than about 30 that have yet to do much with their careers. Draft plus 6. First round about 10 players that have played a reasonable amount of games at a high level. Top end mostly in the top 20. Few exceptions like Debrincat in the 2nd. All I am getting at is that if you get 2 players per year in the top 20 of players available full draft, you might be lucky to have drafted a full team in 10 years. By then the oldest taps out or moves on. Your window is what, 3 years if you are lucky?

Had Q for some time, so it's different. Even if the styles are exactly the same, they would still be coach and player figuring each other out. I don't doubt he will fit in, just has to get used to the style or personality.

Yes, the original rule was up to the award, but the amendment made it up to the start of hearings.

I am a realist. As mentioned, I was reacting to what seemed to be overly negative stuff about the two new guys not wanting to sign. If that was not you intent, then my bad. The realist part of me suggests that a new player on your team wants to be paid and wants to play where he is liked. So, I would book Hubie at about 75% and Weegar at about 90%. I can understand that Hubie may have some reservations playing for Sutter, since Johnny described him as not easily pleased. Get an OT series winning goal, get a pat on the back is all. Ranting at players about perfection. Which I find odd, since if you need it to win, why are you whining about having to do it. You want to win, then put up. But, not all players are annoyed by a coach like that. They are inside their own heads and can't see the little things. So, I can see your argument about them not wanting to sign. Every draft is huge it seems. Every draft is deeper than (insert draft year here). But rebuilding through the draft is perhaps best for "Blow it up?". Trading for two pending UFA's doesn't put us in that territory unless they get traded for picks or walk.

I was referring to the parts about the new two not wanting to sign here. Maybe I read it wrong but it looked that way. I agree about going for the cup. I don't agree that it leads to blowing it up. If neither signs, then we are essentially forced to a re-tool of some degree. But I don't think that is due to them walking. Last year of his contract or not, he doesn't set us up like Chia. He can go out with a bang by trading the new two for a big haul. Leave it to the successors to plan the rebuild part.

It's smart business. Talk to the guy, see what he thinks about things. See what's important to him. Hubie does some work for his hometown, giving back, so we need to respect that.

Just thought I would put this out there. Lucic in Italy for Rask's wedding with his buds from Beantown. Heard that he sold or was selling his place in CGY (not sure on that one) Wonder if there is a possibility that he goes back to BOS to play out his last season where it all began. It would sting, but would also help two teams. Story from Boston... https://www.boston.com/sports/boston-bruins/2022/08/01/former-bruins-milan-lucic-torey-krug-reunite-at-tuukka-rasks-wedding/

Wow guys. Debbie Downer much? Perhaps focus on the positives that we will re-sign both these guys AND add to the team. It only makes sense that trading away Tkachuk is a view towards domination sooner. Love the guy, hate the guy, we had him and Gaudreau and neither was moving the needle enough in the playoffs. He may have taken a step sometime. Learned how to skate. Matured. Stopped noticing squirrels in games. A three year window is all you can really hope for without rebuilding from the ground up. Nobody stays. Firesale. When the 2-5 years of drafting perfectly starts to hit the ice at the same time, you add the completer pieces. You build up into a contender and get to the finals or re-tool. We can look at TBL as a contender right now, since they have looked good and were able to win 2 cups in weird years where they might not have won. They have the goalie and some studs, but are they able to maintain next year? Probably, but that doesn't mean they should have been B2B winners. But anyway, I am looking forward to the signing day. Figuring out what the team needs. We had enough to be individual scoring stars, but not enough of a team to do anything else much.

Ahh, makes a little more sense then.

As long as Brad picks up the tab. Strange how he is pictured in Yellowhead County here then is in MTL for dinner. Oh the marvels of jet travel. Hope he didn't get hung up in PET Airport.

Used the wrong tense. Would have loved those guys is what I was saying. If they still had Trotz, he would have loved those guys. I wasn't asleep this season. just seems like I was in round 2 and it was a nightmare.

I don't think we have the horses to trade. I don't know that Toffoli is the right player for them, but if they got Kadri, Barzal doesn't fit their top 3. Toffoli would look better with Kadri IMHO. But then we paid a big price already to get him. The only way we end up with Baezal is that we have the guys that NY really wants. I don't think Dube moves the needle. Maybe it's Ras or Hanifin or Kylington, but I doubt it. Trotz would love those guys though.

I am a firm believer in bringing n at least a 2/3C. There are guys that could help right now. We may not be able to do it all by trade, but UFA signings now are below market. At the very least we should be able to get a 3C for Kylington or a 2C for Hanifin. It just stands to reason that D are worth a lot to teams. Two guys that played top 4 on a team that finished 2nd to FLA in GF/GA differential and 3rd only to CAR for lowest goals against. It's a bit of a drag to have to trade one of them, but I think we have enough guys that could play 3rd pair with Zaddy. At the very least we have to explore the value of Valimaki and even Mackey. Just too many D. The prospects can win jobs by beating out 4th liners and even 3rd liners. If they can, then Sutter has a choice. If they can't they aren't ready.

This guy is a wannabe with no insight. He may be repeating something he read elsewhere, but I doubt it. Last week it was Kadri close to signing. Then Sam Steele.

I think it's similar to what Chucky brought back, but maybe closer to what CAR was offering. FLA overpaid in any stretch of the imagination. Sure, a top 3 player under 25, but FLA paid for the long term deal and the idea of what Tkachuk could do to their team. He doesn't turn Bennett into a 40 goal guy. Barkov is good enough to make him look good, though. Any Barzal trade is to get rid of the player. Signing Kadri doesn't get them to be a contender, it's a guy that also is a playmaker. I would think that if you substitute Kylington, you help them manage the cap better in future years. Monahan is not enough though, even at 50%. Has to include Dube as a young F.

Earned, yes. But there's a huge size difference between Phillips and Pelts. 40 pounds and close to 3 inches. Not saying he can't or shouldn't make the team, but that's a lot to overcome. He's a 4 year pro and just broke out last year, playing with Pelts. Pelletier has risen to every league he's played in very quickly. The question becomes who between the two can play in a spot in the top 9. Camp should sort that out. If Pelts was able to play RW as well, I don't even think it would be a question. Then again, don't know what camp will look like for invites, PTO's and signed or traded for players.

Having 2 scoring lines and a top defensive line is as essential as an additional (or default) #1D. We were a top 2 D away from being a really deep defense last year. We had puck movers and Satoshi Nakamotodown D. We had one scoring line and Mangiapane. We had a gritty 4th line. We had a 3rd line that accomplished little.

Not sure who Russ is. I know we signed Rooney as a potential 4C. Projecting monahan to a 2C role after his lacklustre performance with Dube and Mange at points in the season is pretty extreme. He was healthy then and didn't really do much. I was a big Monahan fan, but his game took a steep dive away from Gaudreau and has fellen off the cliff without an elite playmaker or anywhere else. Mangoapane is a threat to score anywhere on the ice. If it's a rush with Hubie and Lindy, he will be driving the net. If it's a pass from the LW, he's one timing it in the slot. Lindy is smart enough to never leave any holes. Also, Mangiapane shooting from the off wing is as deadly as Tkachuk. Remeber that goal against Otter? Was the right circle shot. Having a top 6 C means we have two scoring lines. A playmaking C helps drive offense. I don't care if it's Toffoli on the top line or Mange, we have a top 6 winger to fill. RW are harder to pick up. LW can be a middle 6 guy that stretches with a good playmaker C.

It's pretty obvious that we need more than one player, but it's not multiple players like Tkachuk. We have 9F that are NHL players that played full seasons. 10 once Mangiapane signs. Monahan at anything less than a 2C is not improving us. For sake of argument, let's look at the roster with Kadri or Barzal but no Monahan: Hubie-Lindholm-Mange ?-Barzal-Toffoli Coleman-Backlund-Dube Lucic-Rooney-Lewis or Hubie-Lindholm-Mange ?-Kadri-Toffoli Coleman-Backlund-Dube Lucic-Rooney-Lewis Is that really more than one player off? A Rodriguez or Milano set on 2LW fills a hole. Having two possible scoring lines makes us deeper than just the scoring of Mange on the 2nd line and all the top line scoring. None of those lines are a black hole for scoring and being scored on. Are we really any less of a contender than we were this past year? Last year we had a 3rd line that didn't really score a ton or keep the puck out. Monahan was a bit of a hindrance for the 4th line with his lack of speed and not really being a great defensive C.

I think you have to be carefull when isolating points. Have to look at the big picture. He has 311 points in 362 games. Kyle Connor has 344 in 384 games. In Barzal's best year he had Tavares and Anders Lee scoring 37 and 40 goals. In other words, sometimes who you play with makes a big difference. Connors has had the likes of Laine, Sheifele and Ehlers, but scores more than he passes. Barzal is more dependent on being the playmaker.

I thought he had a similar start that Maniapane did in his "2nd" stint of 44 games. The only reason Rozie was limited to 28 was the arrival of Carpenter. Not Jarnkrok. Rozie was sent down prior to TDL to allow some moves. Jarnkrok took the 3C spot, but it only made us more defensively sound, but in the process killed the offense from the bottom 6. Carpenter floated in and out, but we were locked in until the playoffs. Unless we do something splashy at the 2C or 3C spot, Rozie is in the top 12. So, in effect I thought he graduated last season. Or at least he finished all his credits required. Regardless, we don't have close to a full roster yet. It's kinda why I have been pushing Pelts. He fits the need we have in the roster. Playmaker. Possible PP2 B. Okay, that's a bit too much.

For no apparent reason, Dube was top line before Sutter got there. I don't know if it really made sense. Sutter really only had one look at Pelletier. He wasn't interested at the time. Guy was just coming out of junior. Was not going to get much of a look. Was in the "everyone else" crew. I think Duehr and Pospisal got a longer looker because of age and physical play. I look at the AHL players right now. Phillips, Pettersen, Pelletier all are smaller skilled players. Should graduate one at least, but we can't have all small players. Phillips is probably similar in player size and attitude to be a Yamamoto player. He's successful there due to his linemates. But really too small for a top 6 player.

But is it value for NY? They would have trouble with him next summer, but he would be worth quite a bit. Not Tkachyuk level value per se. But as a playmaker and a RHS C?RW, he's worth a lot. What I look at is even now it shows we are serious about winning. We can parlay that belief into signing Hubie and Weeger. The 2025 pick is the lower value of the two. If FLA has a top 3 pick (called a lotto pick), we don't get this year's anyway. If we are a serious contender, we should be able to re-sign Barzal anyway. Anyway, just throwing it out there. Everything in the deal is either replaced by Barzal or extras. I haven't bothered to project it out over the course of 23/24, but it seems doable. Maybe a little tight, but Kylington and Hanifin are the eildcard. We may choose to only keep one.