cross16

I have a bit of a different take on that. I think it's good when GMs admit there mistakes and are prepared to move on quickly. Lindholm is such a weird story for me me this year. Game just really fell off the map.

I'm referring to Hanifin. And the commentary was around people getting mad at the agents and the process, suggesting the Flames would take a lesser deal to send him to Tampa. I'm simply pointing out that doesn't feel like the case given it's not a robust market to deal with. You don't get peak value on an expiring deal and that's not what i'm expecting. if there is a deal and it's something along the lines of a 1st, Howard and a mid round pick it would only be slightly below what I expected for Hanifin. It would be below though but I just don't think there is much Conroy can do about that given the market.

Yes solid, not great, solid. Not sure why but there is a lot of word twisting going on in this thread.

Where did I say that? I’ve simply said I don’t think there is a robust market out there. Think the rumored offer shows that. It isn’t a great return imo

I think Tampa's offer is solid. I've heard something along the lines of 2026 1st, Isaac Howard and another pick. Maybe not super exciting but solid. I think you are jumping to a lot of conclusions here. No one is suggesting it's Tampa or bust, just that it may be his preferred destination with mutual interest. I think the Panthers are very much in there too so there is competition here. I don't think this is a a Tampa gets to set the price scenario. And no I did not say teams won't pay rental prices, I said fringe playoff teams won't pay top dollar rental prices. Funny how Hanifin has always just been good, and now that we want to trade him he's suddenly a destiny altering talent. He isn't that good... so no I don't think a team barely in the playoffs is going to cough up their first round pick for Hanifin. Basically what this boils down to for me, is you don't have a robust rental market to begin with so the agent exerting even minor influence on this process just shrinks the market further. So for me, Conroy dealing with the preferred destinations, and ideally letting an extension happen, is his best chance of getting the most value.

A lot of getting ahead of ourselves here. Math isn't that difficult. First of all, while technically yes Hanifin can be dealt to 23 teams let's be more realistic of actual possibilities because a non playoff team isn't going to rent Hanifin. If there are truly 4 teams (Boston, Vegas, TB and florida) who he will re sign with then your looking at 12 ish additional teams that might look at him for a rental. Now if your outside the top 10 are you really going to give up a rental price for a player you know isn't going to re sign? No, you'll drop your price and you'll give up less. So that puts a team outside the top 10 as likely out. so let's look at the top 10 team in the NHL right now. Well 4 of them are Canadian teams so they are out (very likely that the CDN teams are on his NTC). 2 of which are the teams I just mentioned (basically 3 as Vegas is 11th) so your left with 4 Rangers ( Hanifin is not a big need here) Stars Avs (Can't swing a deal without get very fancy with the cap) Canes Even expand it a bit Nashville (Renting him is not in their nature) LA ( Maybe) Detroit (thought they could be a player) The rest your into fringe playoff teams. So again if you are told you have no shot to sign the player why, as a fringe playoff team, am I going to give up a 1st plus? Heck why am I giving up a first period? This isn't a robust market to begin with so it's not that difficult for Hanifin's camp to work this towards his preferred destinations.

True in theory but just not the direction the game is going. Players and agents are doing this across all sports now. I don't think for a second Conroy is going to accept a lesser deal just to move Hanifin where he wants to go. He'll do it because it's the best deal. I think the Hanifin camp are just working to try and make sure that the best offer is also in a place where he wants to go. I think the idea in Florida if Hanifin would be there guy and then they would not be retaining both of Forsling or Montour. So Florida can make this work. End of the day though it's up to Hanifin where he wants to play. If that's all they can pay him and he still wants to be there, cest la vie.

I think that return goes down quite a bit if your agent is telling that team the player doesn't want to be there. I'm not giving up a 1, 2, 3 for a player to come and be unhappy. Rental or no rental.

Tampa might the the clubhouse leader

I think you are going to see that with Kylington. He'll be a staple in the top 4 once Hanifin is gone Kylington - Andersson ????? - Weegar ???? - Pachal So you've got 2 open spots and Oesterle, Hanley and Gilbert plus guys on the AHL. But also keep in mind Solovyov is hurt, they just acquired Grushnikov and Kuznetsov needs to play. There is still a spot for them when ready but I think the depth was really needed. Also as Jtech pointed out he is under contract next year where Gilbert and Oesterle are not. This gives them flexibility without having to rush young dmen.

I don't think they need to pick up the phone. I'm not sure this rant comes as a surprise to them. I think Holtz's name has been out there for a while. Why i'm pretty confident in thinking he was the offer for Markstrom.

Start of the season yes. but GM contracts tend to be longer and pricier so firing a coach less than a year is much less expensive then a GM 2 months after being re upped. Also far less detrimental to fire a coach then a GM

Signed an extension 2 months ago and got a promotion. He isn't going anywhere.

He just signed his extension so I can't imagine he's on the hot seat but boy is Fitz looking bad in this. - Ruff was always a pretty questionable hire - The Meier trade/signing is looking rough - Toffoli/Sharky trade isn't looking good - Failing to address a major need and then publicly call out players and point to holes in their game. Holes that goaltending would really, really help with - Fire said coach in large part due to weak goaltending He just sounds all over the place these days. Kind of like he can't believe he's here and is reaching at straws trying to get out. Sounds like a guy under a lot of pressure. Just give the Flames Mercer for Markstrom and you'll feel better.

I think it's fair to say he isn't a "start the car" type return. That be Mercer but for the same reasons NJ is resisting given him up. He's got his warts and I for sure see why people are wary of him. I think my take is less about him and more about the value. Do we really think Markstrom is going to return a piece that is better than Holtz, a former top 10 pick? I don't think he does so i'd bank on the upside personally.

No surprise. I think he is going to get a couple games. not based on this hit but based on his overall approach. He's gotten too reckless out there

That's not how you do it if that's your intent. You don't single out a player like that if you are trying to build his value.

Going to add fuel to the fire that it's the Florida teams after him

Huge opportunity for Kylington. Are you a top 4 dman or did you look that way with Tanev? I'm excited for him.

Strickland is pretty credible. I think he's going to go to a Florida team and which one is still uncertain

Brutal hit. He'll get a call from the DOPS on that one.

Not a good look for the org. I didn’t like the hire but this is a pretty clear scapegoat move IMO and it looks bad coming off rumors you want pay the asking price for your top target at a major position if need. I wouldn’t give up Mercer for Markstrom either but it does look bad all around for Devils.

Devils with even league average goaltending right now are likely comfortably in the playoffs. Vezina calibre?? who knows. Wonder how much pressure is on Fitz right now. That ownership group can't be happy hearing the rumors of being that close to acquiring a goalie like Markstrom as their season craters. Will he feel it enough to pull the trigger is now the question

I agree, but i'll just add or get compensated for it. Retention or taking on a cap dump comes with a price and if you are not going to build that benefit into the offer than I woudln't be interested in it. A 1st and Ceci, there is no benefit to me there. That's Edmonton saying ya Ill give you a first but I need you to take Ceci in order to do it so where it he upside? I think that ultimately agreeing to that cost is what prevents a lot of these trades

So if you want to believe the Edm rumors then I think this would have been your choice. Oilers 1st round and Cody Ceci Vs Stars 2nd and Grushnikov. I don't think is debatable as to what package is better there, IMO the Stars is clearly better. I would have taken that 10/10. I think it's less about not wanting to take on the salary dump and more you had a better offer on the table. I'm not a big fan of ownership here mostly because of their expectations and I think some arrogance that prevents them from making moves that I think are necessary to win a cup. However, even if I acknowledge my dislike I have to admit than they have been good about providing the financial resources when asked or required to in order to improve the club. Don't think the narrative is totally fair that they hold this club back, the situation could be far worse.