Calgary Flames Offense

[CheersMan]

1 hour ago, conundrumed said:

Gallant has been the difference imho.

He was a lethal player, now he's a lethal coach.

The biggest losers will always be Florida.

Gallant the 30 goal guy liked fighting too much, where Jacques Demers once said, " he'd score 50 if he'd stop fighting everybody".

He's a red knuckles guy, the Vegas players have had one yr of that, why stop now?

When I read many telling me how they can't repeat that, I think of their coach and think people are convincing themselves without thinking about their coach.

The guy just knows when to let the dogs run.

Contrast that with GG, who seemed to never let his dogs run...

Thinking Vegas is going to, "take a step back", seems like wishful thinking imho.

The additions and subtractions are on target imho.

No one expected a cup-contending team out of the gate. Well, they are one.

Time to stop pretending that it's an illusion.

 

I agree.  Game after game last season they continued to impress, everyone waited for the bubble to burst and it didn't.  SC finals was a huge success for that team and there was no luck involved, just hard work.  You have to consider them a shoe in for a playoff spot this season.  

[cross16]

23 hours ago, conundrumed said:

Gallant has been the difference imho.

He was a lethal player, now he's a lethal coach.

The biggest losers will always be Florida.

Gallant the 30 goal guy liked fighting too much, where Jacques Demers once said, " he'd score 50 if he'd stop fighting everybody".

He's a red knuckles guy, the Vegas players have had one yr of that, why stop now?

When I read many telling me how they can't repeat that, I think of their coach and think people are convincing themselves without thinking about their coach.

The guy just knows when to let the dogs run.

Contrast that with GG, who seemed to never let his dogs run...

Thinking Vegas is going to, "take a step back", seems like wishful thinking imho.

The additions and subtractions are on target imho.

No one expected a cup-contending team out of the gate. Well, they are one.

Time to stop pretending that it's an illusion.

 

 

Guess we'll find out but i'm not buying it personally.  We've seen this before in many different sports but I don't think a year like they had last year is sustainable. Nothing against any of their coaches, staff, players etc, I just think they had something special last year. 

[7wit]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

Guess we'll find out but i'm not buying it personally.  We've seen this before in many different sports but I don't think a year like they had last year is sustainable. Nothing against any of their coaches, staff, players etc, I just think they had something special last year. 

 

Whether you buy it or not, they believe in themselves and they’re going for it. A large part of winning is confidence and the unwavering belief you are going to win. Wouldn’t surprise me to see Yzerman land there as a hockey operations president or some other made up title if they sign Karlsson. Vegas is serious and has a good team. Our offense needs to continue to get better, and we are close. Just need a couple of more pieces.

[kehatch]

4 hours ago, cross16 said:

 

Guess we'll find out but i'm not buying it personally.  We've seen this before in many different sports but I don't think a year like they had last year is sustainable. Nothing against any of their coaches, staff, players etc, I just think they had something special last year. 

 

I am scared to say it because we were all wrong last season, but I agree. Too many of their players had career seasons. Take Karlsson for example. Is he really a point per game player? Can he do it again? What about Marchessault? 

 

At forward they have a lot of guys who played so much beyond what they did in the past. They did upgrade there by turning Perron and Neal into Stastny and Paccoriety, but I have trouble seeing a bunch of their forward roster repeat. 

 

Then you have D. In some cases it's the same story (see Engelland and Miller). But overall their D is terrible on paper. Plus they are losing Schmidt for a quarter of the season. 

 

That leaves goal. And Fleury is good. But not that good. He never out up those types of numbers in Pittsburg. 

 

Most of us were wrong last season. Some of us might be this season. But I think Vegas really struggles this season. 

[Going4TheCup]

I'm just wondering but which line should James Neal be on to use his goal scoring skills?

[DirtyDeeds]

21 minutes ago, Going4TheCup said:

I'm just wondering but which line should James Neal be on to use his goal scoring skills?

He was bought in to be a scorer. He should be playing on top line however...

 

Backs line is doing a good job at what they do and they are not going to be broken up very much.

Lindholm is doing quite well on top line. I think he will be given more opportunity there.

 

James Neil is/should be playing with Bennett until he(Neil) is needed on top line. That combo could become 2nd line and bump Backs down if played right.

[travel_dude]

31 minutes ago, DirtyDeeds said:

He was bought in to be a scorer. He should be playing on top line however...

 

Backs line is doing a good job at what they do and they are not going to be broken up very much.

Lindholm is doing quite well on top line. I think he will be given more opportunity there.

 

James Neil is/should be playing with Bennett until he(Neil) is needed on top line. That combo could become 2nd line and bump Backs down if played right.

 

The other option is to play Neal with Backlund and Tkachuk.  Stop burying them in the D-zone and spread it out.  Lindholm has help the top line win more than 50% of the draws, so they don;t always have to start in the O-zone.  Just food for thought.  

 

I would prefer to get Neal away from Ryan to see what he can do.  If that means Janko and Bennett, then they need to play 13+ minutes.  Otherwise, it would have to be Backlund.

[kehatch]

19 hours ago, DirtyDeeds said:

He was bought in to be a scorer. He should be playing on top line however...

 

Backs line is doing a good job at what they do and they are not going to be broken up very much.

Lindholm is doing quite well on top line. I think he will be given more opportunity there.

 

James Neil is/should be playing with Bennett until he(Neil) is needed on top line. That combo could become 2nd line and bump Backs down if played right.

 

I completely agree. 

 

The Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm line has connected for 5 goals (10 points) in 2 games. When it cools off they might consider Neal on the line, but not right now. 

 

The Backlund line is a shut down line for a reason. That is what it is good at. Plus, the team doesn't have a lot of other options. Putting Neal on a shut down line makes zero sense. 

 

But the third line isn't clicking. They have yet to score a goal and they haven't been consistently dangerous. Bennett has been buzzing and looked good in his limited play time. Plus Bennett/Neal compliment each other on paper. I think putting them together makes sense. 

[cross16]

For me, Neal was never brought in to play the top line. from time to time for sure, but I don't think they envisioned him being up there full time. He was brought in to give consistent scoring outside the top line because that was arguably their biggest hole. They had talent but they lacked that consistent scorer you could count on outside the top line, that and a trigger man to help the pp. this is the role I think he will play. 

 

i don't get the uproar over his utilization. I get the angst with the lines as I'm not a fan myself but I also think Peters is still experimenting and has shown a willingness to experiment so I'm not that worried. 

[MAC331]

35 minutes ago, cross16 said:

For me, Neal was never brought in to play the top line. from time to time for sure, but I don't think they envisioned him being up there full time. He was brought in to give consistent scoring outside the top line because that was arguably their biggest hole. They had talent but they lacked that consistent scorer you could count on outside the top line, that and a trigger man to help the pp. this is the role I think he will play. 

 

i don't get the uproar over his utilization. I get the angst with the lines as I'm not a fan myself but I also think Peters is still experimenting and has shown a willingness to experiment so I'm not that worried. 

The part you have right is that BP is still experimenting to find what works best with this group.

[travel_dude]

#Flames lines and pairings at practice:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm

Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik

Bennett-Dube-Neal

Frolik-Ryan-Hathaway

Peluso-Jankowski

 

Giordano-Brodie

Hanifin-Stone

Valimaki-Andersson

Prout

 

Smith

Rittich

 

One possible solution to two problems; what to do with Bennett and who to play Neal with.  Not sure it's a great idea, so maybe they slot Bennett in at center and shift Dube to wing.  At this point, I would say Bennett is better at taking draws.  

[robrob74]

21 hours ago, travel_dude said:

#Flames lines and pairings at practice:

Gaudreau-Monahan-Lindholm

Tkachuk-Backlund-Czarnik

Bennett-Dube-Neal

Frolik-Ryan-Hathaway

Peluso-Jankowski

 

Giordano-Brodie

Hanifin-Stone

Valimaki-Andersson

Prout

 

Smith

Rittich

 

One possible solution to two problems; what to do with Bennett and who to play Neal with.  Not sure it's a great idea, so maybe they slot Bennett in at center and shift Dube to wing.  At this point, I would say Bennett is better at taking draws.  

 

Ya, if they want Bennett st wing, he could take draws and then shift over to the wing in the other situations on the ice. 

[travel_dude]

17 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

Ya, if they want Bennett st wing, he could take draws and then shift over to the wing in the other situations on the ice. 

 

I not really convinced that we are using Neal in the proper sense.  

3rd line with Bennett and Dube?

That's a tough assignment.

Play with a rookie and a guy who is/was struggling to find the net.

 

As an experiment, I am fine with it.  I want to see Bennett passing a whole lot more.  Dube is a speedster who is having some trouble scoring on NHL goalies.  Expected.  Neal is a finisher.  Give him the pass when he's on the rush and he will get the puck on net.  Bennett should be going directly to the net for any rebounds.

[Going4TheCup]

The coach said that Neal is going to provide the Flames with scoring depth and that he likes how he talks to the young guys, I hope his line has a good game and scores. I'm not sure what the Flames should do with Neal because Lindholm is doing good on the first line and Tkachuk and Backlund are solidified on the second line with good chemistry with Czarnik.

[travel_dude]

21 minutes ago, Going4TheCup said:

The coach said that Neal is going to provide the Flames with scoring depth and that he likes how he talks to the young guys, I hope his line has a good game and scores. I'm not sure what the Flames should do with Neal because Lindholm is doing good on the first line and Tkachuk and Backlund are solidified on the second line with good chemistry with Czarnik.

 

I wouldn't be too concerned as of yet.

2 games is all we are talking about.

Top line is playing well as a group.  They've had more time to develop together than Neal had with them.

As well, the ability to use Linholm on faceoffs is helping that line.  At some point, Monahan may not need help there and you could have Lindholm be the center for a 3rd line of Neal and whoever.  That's just an option.

 

Neal could easily be moved up to play with Backlund and Tkachuk.  Backlund isn't much of a finisher, and Czarnik hasn't lit it up yet.  Having two players that can finish in close and Tkachuk there to mop up the Neal shots is intriguing.  The added benefit is you have Backlund and Tkachuk there to help with possession and driving the play in the right direction.

 

We'll see.  As of yet, we haven't had 4 lines playing well on the same night.  An adjustment was made to the 3rd line because they were struggling with possession.  Being able to have different looks keeps teams guessing.

[cccsberg]

On 2018-10-07 at 1:54 PM, DirtyDeeds said:

He was bought in to be a scorer. He should be playing on top line however...

 

Backs line is doing a good job at what they do and they are not going to be broken up very much.

Lindholm is doing quite well on top line. I think he will be given more opportunity there.

 

James Neil is/should be playing with Bennett until he(Neil) is needed on top line. That combo could become 2nd line and bump Backs down if played right.

Neil will likely work his way up the line-up as he gets back into game shape.  Right now Lindholm seems to be working very well.

[MAC331]

1 hour ago, cccsberg said:

Neil will likely work his way up the line-up as he gets back into game shape.  Right now Lindholm seems to be working very well.

I'm not sure where Neal is playing has anything todo with whether he is in game shape or not. They want a RHS RW with Gaudreau and Monahan to assist Monahan with draws. Lindholm is a good complimentary player there. The other obstacle is the reluctance to break up the 3M line or Tkachuk and Backlund while they see what Czarnik is all about. I give it this month and situations will sort themselves out.

[cross16]

With how much the Flames have struggled with secondary scoring for what feels like a decade, I find it very interesting why Neal playing without Gaudreau/Monahan seems like such a big deal to people. 

 

Focus should be on getting 3 lines going, not just 1. Why is it such a bad thing if Neal stays on the 3rd line the whole season?

[MAC331]

32 minutes ago, cross16 said:

With how much the Flames have struggled with secondary scoring for what feels like a decade, I find it very interesting why Neal playing without Gaudreau/Monahan seems like such a big deal to people. 

 

Focus should be on getting 3 lines going, not just 1. Why is it such a bad thing if Neal stays on the 3rd line the whole season?

2nd line, 3rd line 4th line isn't the point, get a line together that will max out each others talents.

[kehatch]

4 hours ago, cross16 said:

With how much the Flames have struggled with secondary scoring for what feels like a decade, I find it very interesting why Neal playing without Gaudreau/Monahan seems like such a big deal to people. 

 

Focus should be on getting 3 lines going, not just 1. Why is it such a bad thing if Neal stays on the 3rd line the whole season?

 

I agree. Except that (so far) Neal hasn't had a goal and we haven't had any goals from the bottom 6. He also isn't exactly a defensive specialist.

 

Lindholm's game might fit better on the third line while Neal's might fit better on the top. But it's moot right now. With the way the top line is producing Lindholm isn't going anywhere. 

[travel_dude]

4 hours ago, cross16 said:

With how much the Flames have struggled with secondary scoring for what feels like a decade, I find it very interesting why Neal playing without Gaudreau/Monahan seems like such a big deal to people. 

 

Focus should be on getting 3 lines going, not just 1. Why is it such a bad thing if Neal stays on the 3rd line the whole season?

 

I think we are seeing a 3rd line (Neal's) that really isn't scoring.

So we really have 1.5 lines and the D scoring.

Top line, no issue.

2nd line, Tkachuk mostly and Czarnik a bit.

Rest of forwards, two points.

 

 

[robrob74]

42 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

I think we are seeing a 3rd line (Neal's) that really isn't scoring.

So we really have 1.5 lines and the D scoring.

Top line, no issue.

2nd line, Tkachuk mostly and Czarnik a bit.

Rest of forwards, two points.

 

 

 

I know it can be scary that that's the case 3 games in, but it's only 3 games in. Hopefully the other lines get going too. 

[travel_dude]

20 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

I know it can be scary that that's the case 3 games in, but it's only 3 games in. Hopefully the other lines get going too. 

 

It's something that really only shows up early in the season.

You notice the zeros and the guys who get points.

Czarnika nd Frolik both had EN goals.

Doesn't mean too much.

Monahan + JH + RW = money; no surprise there.  They rarely go more than a game without a point.

 

With all the chances Dube, Czarnik, Valimaki, Ryan, Bennett, and Backlund get, it's shocking none of them have scored on a goalie.

That will come.  Just not yet, and perhaps not on their current lines.

[LouCifer]

Maybe audition Neal with Backlund and Tkachuk. We talk a lot about Backlund being snake bitten around the net, and we know his line drives possession with the most difficult starts - so why not add a legitimate sniper to the line?

 

Otherwise (I know this will be unpopular given what we’ve seen thus far) try pairing up Neal with Lindholm at C. We may have a 1B line in the making with those two together. Give’er a whirl BP!

 

 

[kehatch]

1 hour ago, lou44291 said:

Maybe audition Neal with Backlund and Tkachuk. We talk a lot about Backlund being snake bitten around the net, and we know his line drives possession with the most difficult starts - so why not add a legitimate sniper to the line?

 

Otherwise (I know this will be unpopular given what we’ve seen thus far) try pairing up Neal with Lindholm at C. We may have a 1B line in the making with those two together. Give’er a whirl BP!

 

 

 

Neal doesn't drive a line. He compliments the right line very well. If the third line doesn't get going they need to try something. Putting him on the top line is the most obvious option if Lindholm cools off.

 

I have liked the idea of Tkachuk-Bennett-Neal as a second line since the summer. I also don't mind Lindholm in place of Bennett. But so far the coach has been reluctant to put either of those guys at C, and I expect Bennett would need to take a step forward before the coach would even consider him on a line like that. But if you can turn one of those into a second line then you have Backlund for the third and that makes you very deep.