conundrumed
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Posts posted by conundrumed
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I don't think Howard has any value and that's why I think you can get him cheap. He hasn't been a decent started for two seasons and other than calgary and Buffalo who is looking for a 5 mill goalie? Detroits going to find a pretty bare market for Howard which is why I think you can probable get Howard with salary retained and not have to give up much.
Again around here, it's treated like free candy for Raymond.
Detroit is not likely looking for a big contract coming back, but they will get value for him, especially if they are eating salary. I'd guess taking on salary would be a year of Smid for them, not retaining Howard salary.
No point in giving him away, Dats is retiring pdq, their cap is fine.
It'll take Hudler and Smid in the give and take, maybe a middling pick our way.
We are awesome at under-valuing anyone not on the Flames.
It sure wouldn't hurt our team to have an 8 yr Detroit vet back there. He hates the same teams we hate. Detroit moved to the East. Howard's a Western Conference goalie used to going toe-to-toe with his western counterparts.
I guarantee Anaheim and Chicago would hate us.
It's not a panic move for them.
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A goalie option i've beomcing more intrigued about is JImmy Howard in Detroit. His contract sucks, (3 more years at 5.25/season) but I think you oculd get Detroit to eat part of that. He isn't getting dealt somewhere for full value, and if they ate 1.6 you could have him for 3.6 for 3 years. Thats decent value and you roll the dice that he gets back to the above avg starter level he was just a season or two ago. Worst, case you've got reasonably priced stability in net while you try and develop Gilles so you can bring in a decent backup at sat 2 mill or less and run with 2 goalies.
Detroit being my "other" team, I would be perfectly fine trying to get Howard. I've never had a problem with him at all. I've seen him full on win games almost single-handedly many times. Chicago's 2013 cup went through Detroit and Howard almost took them out, losing in OT in game 7. I saw 2 games live and Howard was spectacular. The whole arena chanted his name repeatedly.
If Howard is on the block, it's not because he's not a really good NHL goalie, but because Petr Mrazek (2010 5th rd) is looking Top 3 elite at 23. Howard lost his seat to a goalie that would take the seat from 75-85% of all teams.
Mrazek's RFA, they'll be needing Howard's cash, without a doubt.
If you haven't seen much Mrazek, you might want to. Put Howard in, he could easily be Rinne, Bishop, Crawford etc. This kid is taking your job.
Good point to get them to retain salary, but we'll have to give up more than our crap.
I'd think maybe a Hudler rental and upper D prospect.
Retaining salary comes at a cost. Howard's value can't be underrated.
Calgary's goalie transitioning out of Kiprusoff is pretty much a failure.
For Detroit, if you're playing pairs,
Datsyuk
Larkin
Zetterberg
no 4th (Abdelkader?).
Hudler is a perfect fit.
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Thought it was 4 years, actually 5 years. Only thing wrong was not getting 8 years. Term is fine and $$ are a steal, just wish we could have gone longer.
It's 5 yrs after this one. Hard to knock it for a 6 yr, 8 yr $ amount goes up.
I don't know how you argue it wasn't a great deal for us.
Sometimes you just have to admit you made a mistake...
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Doing so requires that you show confidence in both, not just the guy winning or playing well. Hiller got his chance after Ramo was brutalized by bad bounces. You want Ramo to get cold? Sit him out until he is needed.
That's how they tandemed last year though, how cold do you think Hiller was? We need both of them playing well, Hiller needed some games. I'm just really happy he didn't lose us games. The team in front of him has responded well, also.
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He is getting the next start (deservedly so) based on a SOL. He let in a softie, but overall was good against a team struggling to score. I'm not sure I agree with the strategy of going with the hot hand over who established himself as the #1. Yes, you give the guy who gets a shutout (in a lopsided game) the next start, and 1GA is a good reason to get him a 3rd in a row, but Ramo is the guy that got you to this point. You have to go back to Ramo after the NJD game.
I think the point is that we need both guys going.
Shouldn't be a "favourite" in our tandem, just establish confidence and reliability in both.
That was a lot of why we surprised so many last year imho.
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Ramo was 12 minutes shy of setting a franchise shut out record. He let in one goal and got the win. Seems incredibly knit picky to over analyze a goal against from a wide open Stamkos off if a wide open shot.
Depends on point of view I guess. If we were all Michelangelos, the world would be a boring place...
If you want to focus on negatives when you read, I can't do much about that.
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How about the players who should actually be covering Stamkos ? Stamkos should never be left alone in our zone.
But I was talking about how the goalie played a shoot in, I know full well 6 other things could have happened.
I'm not ROASTING Ramo as CheersMan alludes to.
I'm talking about 1 split second play, and I've given Ramo full props.
Can be a touchy bunch around here.
There is a saying, "midseason form" for a reason. We're hitting it. Hopefully it's yet another message to fans to wait 6-8 weeks into the season before being dismissive and down on everyone...
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Are you really trying that hard to find fault in his game? Dont like him that much?
As kehatch said and I said earlier, its not exactly an easy play no matter which way you slice it. Ramo had a stellar game.
No, I'm commenting on the goal, not attacking Ramo. I'd have said the same of any goalie; it's still Stamkos, I never said easy save, just that he got out of position too early and couldn't recover.
Since Nov 13: 12-6-1; 2.07; .926.
Not complaining, it was one play, I'm not slamming him
All I can say about Ramo is that he's ripped that starter roll and we're getting consistency, all due to him.
He's pushing 2 months of being a bonafide NHL starter while playing every single game.
It is firmly him that's really helped turn it around.
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Ramo had no chance in the stamkos goal. That took a wicked bounce off the board right to a wide open stamkos. Would have taken an unbelievable save to stop that. I was as there and the puck shot off the boards right to Stamkos.
Before the wicked bounce, he exited net left on a wide of the net shoot in.
If he stays on the post and watches the puck, he gets across for the shot.
I thought the goal was his own fault. Misplayed the sequence on the shoot in.
He should have 2 shutouts in a row, don't get me wrong, not complaining.
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I have been hard on Ramo in the past, but he has absolutely turned his game around the last month. He seems much more calm in the net, he isn't overplaying the puck and is staying deeper in the net, his rebound control is much better, and he isn't cheating as much. He seems much better positionally and technically and relying on his athleticism when has to. Hopefully he can keep this level of play up for the rest of the year.
He over-dramatized the shoot in on the Stamkos goal. He instantly put himself out of position and couldn't recover on a shoot in.
Not being overly-critical, I'm sure he replayed that one in his head!
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If we have the cap space and need better goaltending (assuming that it is not a defence issue), why might Treliving not make the deal for Khudobin?
It's the chemistry set imho.
The team struggled as a group to get better and they've been winning.
Not nice to send constant notices to the goalies.
I would surmise it effects the group. Hiller flubs, maybe it was a "we've got your back" win...
who's to say.....we're gaining momentum, can we turn off the sky is falling network yet?
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It can be argued that goalies have a frail psyche and if you hit it enough times it dissolves. Then you work triple time to find it again.
It can also be argued starting Ramo off the hop hit Hiller's psyche.
I could be altogether in the wrong, but every stone must be turned!
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We demote Granlund when we find out if we won the claim or not. We would have to wait till tomorrow to waive Hiller and then wait another day after that to send him down. Granlund would miss tomorrow's game.
We'd really be swinging from a rope if Khudobin doesn't look any better than Ortio.
I realize I'm giving Hiller a lot of rope, but I believe his errors are mental/influenza and can be overcome.
All I'm saying is I want the move to be the right one, not the right now one. I know you guys are just spitballing, but you also have to look at the flip side that maybe he sucks and you just put the boots to Hiller in the altogether.
I had a lot of faith in our roster to start the season and many had hiccups, but for my money, none go under the bus, you pick up the one's that are flailing, it'll only serve you better.
Call it blind faith, but it's faith no less.
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I've been trying to stay confident with Hiller, but last night was like a dagger. After he flubbed the puckhandling for the 2nd goal, my confidence shrivelled to "you're going to blow this aren't you"...yes he did.
I realize he's battling the flu so I'm going to try to remain loyal.
But for the love of gawd, he has to lose the body language EVERY TIME HE GIVES UP A GOAL. That language is total DEFEAT.
If I'm the opposing coach, I'm saying, "shoot from everywhere, he's rattled".
He has to snap out of it and keep confident, because I'm sure I'm not the only one seeing that miserable body language.
We need attitude back there. I rarely remember Kipper's expression changing at all whether it was a goal against or spectacular save.
With Hiller, you can almost see the balloon deflate, every flipping goal.
He has to cut that out! Coaches, drill it into him!!
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I thought Smid played quite well actually. He brought a good physical element but he also pinched really effective and a few times did a nice job holding the puck in the zone. I was very happy with Smid's game last night.
Good timing cross, I agree that Smid is playing a real sound D game for us. It's only 10-12/night, but he doesn't make me nervous at all.
Tough injury to overcome, but it's obvious he worked his tail off and thought about the game a lot. He's comfortable handling the puck, good decision-making, safe pinches, he's gained confidence with the coaching staff, he's a team first guy.
Contract aside, I've been real happy with his play and my expectations started off in the lav!
Third pairing stability imho.
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And any dealer
Any motivational coach will tell you it is mostly finding the right button to press to coach the intensity.
As for a goalie with a chip on his shoulder??? why is this a big concern. Kipper was awesome yet had no chip on his shoulder....
Sure find a good character goalie that hates to lose.....
Chip on shoulder.. no so important...
If that were true DD, it would be easier to get a read, just take the guy with the most sound mechanics.
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There were times last night where you could tell Hiller wasn't feel well, caught him may times hunched over almost grasping for air. I get Kehatchs point but I do think he deserves a pass. guy played well enough to win despite feeling like crap.
We shall see. I prefered Demko but i think its early.
WJC should tell a lot with Demko slated to start for US and McDonald for team Canada. Long time to go before we can say the Flames made a mistake here.
The point it, even the best laid goalie plan is sketchy becuase goalies are "sketchy" by nature. hardest position to plan for because so much can change so quickly. The flames went out and got themsevles a variety of options and so far it hasn't worked to the level you want but thats the challenge of devleopoing goalies and not a knock on the Flames IMO.
I do agree and admit I was working in hindsight, looking back on "what if"? I freely admit, but I still do not see a firm plan back then, regardless, just a bunch of, pick 1: desparation; low on the list in importance.
But again, it's purely in hindsight and being suggestive where I'm purely speculating. So I apologize for that and for inferring a weak strategy by the org.
So outside of all that, let's talk about the top 5 in the league(subjective):
Price
Lundqvist
Quick
Rinne
Holtby
Just my thoughts, but all of these guys are Grade A attitude-riddled posteriors on the ice.
They won't break their sticks if you score on them, but they'll break their sticks on you if you annoy them.
I get thinking that should be your focus in draft interviews, is he passive, no thanks. Does he have an edge? Let's push his edge.
Maybe I'm beating the wrong drum here, but can you coach intensity?
If it's true you build a team from the net out, my first wish would be intensity. A goalie with a chip on his shoulder daring everyone to knock it off.
That isn't Ramo or Hiller, you have to admit. Should we adjust to picking up goalies, more to the kind of anti-mindset than we seem to be running with?
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Ristolainen should have been laid out when he tried to take off Gaudreau's head and maybe he would not have been so effective.
Our team needs more aggressiveness and more standing up for each other when the situation call for it. You can notice our opposition thinking they can push us around.
The play wasn't nearly so bad if Jones weren't falling towards Johnny from the backside. Ristolainen isn't dirty, but he's 6'4 and talented, he's going to let you know he's out there if you're a huge threat like Johnny.
Thankfully it was no worse, but I doubt Ristolainen meant to push him down into an oncoming falling player, just to get him out of the play.
I'm not out to defend the guy, but the Sabres have quite the 21yo Dman there. He had his game, we won, Johnny's okay, it's all good!
SV% .862, GAA 3.75, W 3. Worst in SV% and GAA among NHL goalies that have played at least 9-games. Third worst in wins. Tough to be cheery about Hiller's performance this season.
Understandable, but being a vet, I have to believe he'll be better like the team as a whole had to be better.
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If Gaudreau has a mediocre game because of illness he gets a pass. He has earned that with his play. I really didn't like the second goal last night and the third was pretty weak as well. Tough to give Hiller a pass since he hasn't played well sick or healthy.
Man your harsh. Gaudreau plays every game.
Hiller hasn't played more than 1 game in how long?
Nice comparison, god you're miserable about most things.
I particularly liked Ristolainen's 2nd goal, he shot to the opposite side. Who does that?
Wish he was on my team.
Hiller's been an NHL goalie for years, why not say, "wow is that Ristolainen a sharp player".
They have Evander Kane, Sam Reinhart, Ryan O'Reilly, Eichel, etc I don't recall them beating Hiller...
Take your positives.
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We had a choice to draft either top ranked Thatcher Demko or second ranked Mason McDonald in the 2014 entry draft and we went with McDonald. The Canucks took Demko two picks later. Did the Flames make a mistake here? McDonald is having a fairly average season in the Q whereas Demko is dominating College...
I don't think that at all, After seeing M&Ms interviews, I think we took who was best through the process. My only knock might be lack of cockiness, but it's what you do with the goalie once you have him with you. It's too early to tell. Neither goalie is around his pro team, it's players/prospects or coaches.
I'm happy with the pick, he's a pretty astute kid with the right attitude.
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Flames drafted Irving in the frist round, Ortio in the 5th and then traded for Ramo. Doesn't exactly scream "we have no plan". It didn't work out but remember the vast majority of goalies don't work out, but its not likey they weren't prepared.
And I would go nuts over Vasilevsky just yet, the guy has yet to prove he can be a legit NHL goalie and the amount of 1st round prospects that look good early as goalie and then bust is pretty high. Personallyi would prefer Jankowski.
I don't mean it as a knock on Jankowski, just that I don't think we had a plan, just prayers.
Irving had established he isn't an NHL goalie, Ramo was unknown, Ortio in the 5th hardly seems like a great part of a master plan, and then we sign a goalie from the Swiss league.
I can correct myself if you like, we had a plan, but a really sketchy one.
I'm not overboard with Vasilevsky, but he was definitely a formidable goalie coming into the draft, but a Russian one.
Our plan really was trial by fire, not development. Our goaltending now looks exactly like that.
All of this is easy in hindsight, but the reality is we had a ton of holes in the roster, at center for a start. I know I'm being simplistic in "maybe we should have", but it's cause and effect nonetheless.
We have a good chunk of change tied up in our goaltending for what it is, even a Greiss looks fine tandeming at 1/3 of the cost as I mentioned pages ago.
Perhaps we're over-thinking it?
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I think it boils down to having zero plan to replace Kipper. Vasilevsky was on the board when we took Jankowski but we didn't seem to have any interest in our goaltending atm. So we grabbed "the best goalie not in the NHL", twice. I guess that was the plan.
But for now I think of Holtby, Bishop, and to a lesser extent Eliot. They were goalies needing a place to play, we didn't seem to get in on any of that either.
So with that, I think we have to be patient for the right move, not the right now move.
Then of course there is "what are you willing to pay"? I'd rather roster players/prospects myself, not picks.
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Thought I would throw this out there - it seems to me that Ramo cheats to the short side on the rush. When the opposing team is bringing the puck in on the wing he stands too close to the icing line of the short side, leaving too much room on the far side. Thoughts?
The short side was a point he was breaking from too early and imho teams were targeting the short side on him. I think your seeing the correction they're applying. I think it's probably over-committing for the time being and just one of those things where the adjustment looks dangerous but I'm sure with coaching their aware of addressing it. Ortio has the short-side issue also imo.
As for the anti-Hiller sentiments elsewhere, he's had 1 game back from injury, I think he could have used a conditioning stint. I'm not ready to throw him to the dogs personally, although I admit he hasn't been solid. With a veteran goalie, I'm alright with giving him some redemption time.
I believe Vasilevsky will be the next goalie wanting starter minutes and would be nice to target, but he won't come cheap. He'll be in an LA-style predicament where he won't get a chance to overcome Bishop.
See what their playoff needs are at TDL perhaps.
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We've given up more goals than every other team. Blame everyone, but the goalies take a fair share of that blame or it's just excuses.
One thing I've noticed with Ramo, I know he's scrambly, but he seems to give up on pucks too quickly when he's out of position and he loses sight of the puck. Almost like there is a bit of a delay from him because he thinks it's already in the net.
It's up to the goalie coach to keep him focused and tuned in for 60 minutes, which might be the case with all of our goalies so far.
Calgary Flames Drafting and Development: Your Analysis
in Flames Talk
Posted
If we could pull down 2 picks in the top 25, I'd be all about skilled wingers with size, don't care what hand.
Hope they're only max 2 yrs out.
Goaltending will follow suit, I'm not worried about that as much as too little offensive talent in the roster in general, let alone size.