Calgary Flames Expectations

[cross16]

3 hours ago, Thebrewcrew said:

I think the Ward “bump” after he took over was a mirage. Yes they won some games, but even the last few games Peters coached the Flames played better. This is still the same team we’ve seen all year. Play great for a while, then fall off the map for a stretch and in the process cost yourself the game 

 

I think yes and no to a certain extent. yes the puck did start to go in and they got some bounces they weren't getting before but at the same time they did drastically change their chances. Under Peters it was low event hockey and they struggled to generate quality chances. Under Ward they now generate chances at a high level while still not really giving up any more. So while in some ways they got some puck luck they also created a lot more chances in order to earn that. I don't think "mirage" is fair because they earned many of those victories and even in the losses to Carolina/Pittsburgh they were right there. Those games were running away from them under Peters because they were just not capable of generating quality. 

 

Doesn't mean issues aren't there they for sure are, and by no means am I saying that Peters was the problem. I didn't think coaching was the problem and it still isn't under Ward. 60 mins and top players not consistently being top players are the theme of the season and I don't think that falls under coaching. 

 

 

[jjgallow]

3 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

The team is there, hiding behind poor defensive play.

 

Defense isn't something your team hides behind.

 

Defense is your team.

 

If you don't have defense, you don't really have a team.

[travel_dude]

29 minutes ago, jjgallow said:

 

Defense isn't something your team hides behind.

 

Defense is your team.

 

If you don't have defense, you don't really have a team.

 

 

It's not systemic, it's event driven.

Mostly a case of guys failing to recognize what is going on.

Tunnel vision.

 

[jjgallow]

36 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

It's not systemic, it's event driven.

Mostly a case of guys failing to recognize what is going on.

Tunnel vision.

 

I will hope that you are right until we get a little closer to the trade deadline. 

 

Not much point until thinking otherwise until then

[robrob74]

7 hours ago, travel_dude said:

 

For the money Bennett does not do enough.

When was his last multi point game, let alone goal.

Cut bait or scratch him until you get him to fit.

 

yup, and that is pretty much what I am saying there. I’ve slowly come to it, but it’s why I ask, is it worth it to hold on or worth it to let him try somewhere else. Realistically Rinaldo kind of does the same thing and has scored. I don’t think Rinaldo’s overall game is better, but they’re basically doing the same things.

 

 

[robrob74]

48 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

 

 

It's not systemic, it's event driven.

Mostly a case of guys failing to recognize what is going on.

Tunnel vision.

 

 

I actually don’t think it is events driven as much as it is defensive IQ driven. The events happen more frequently than it to be strictly just events. I feel like it has plagued the team too often over the past 3-5 years or more. Maybe that is tunnel vision, but then that means that it is habitual as it happens enough.

 

I hope Valamaki can be the full meal deal as we need studs to come along. Andersson is trending well. I feel like Hanifin thinks the game too much. 

[robrob74]

I have to say, the time to get it all together is fast approaching. Does the team have what it takes as the games start to get harder to play?

we have now until our mandated break or the ASB to prove what we can do. 
 

can they play when it gets hard? I feel like other teams have played the Flames harder this year than last and it’s why it has been a tougher season. How much harder are teams going to be to play? Do the Flames have what it takes?
 

I think they can make the playoffs. But the holes are even more evident this year.

[cross16]

Why are the Flames 9 pts behind last year's pace? the answer in 1 tweet. 

 

I don't care what type of depth you have or do not have, if this happens to you it will reflect in the standings. No question

 

 

[robrob74]

15 minutes ago, cross16 said:

Why are the Flames 9 pts behind last year's pace? the answer in 1 tweet. 

 

I don't care what type of depth you have or do not have, if this happens to you it will reflect in the standings. No question

 

 

 

that’s the thing, he has only had glimpses of good play over a full season-ish if you count from this time last year to now as equivalent to “a season.” Which is what I mean. What are his totals over the past 82 regular season games including this year and last year?

can he get back to business. 

[cross16]

7 minutes ago, robrob74 said:

 

that’s the thing, he has only had glimpses of good play over a full season-ish if you count from this time last year to now. 

can he get back to business. 

 

It's gone to another level though. for context:

First 41 games last year : 22-37-59

Next 41 games: 14-26-40

First 41 this year: 10-20-30

 

The Flames had a lot go right for them in the first half of last year, especially offensively so no question his first half was inflated as was the team's I've always believed that. But this hasn't been gradual, it's been a fall of the cliff type performance. At this rate he won't even match his rookie season. 

 

[JTech780]

1 hour ago, cross16 said:

 

It's gone to another level though. for context:

First 41 games last year : 22-37-59

Next 41 games: 14-26-40

First 41 this year: 10-20-30

 

The Flames had a lot go right for them in the first half of last year, especially offensively so no question his first half was inflated as was the team's I've always believed that. But this hasn't been gradual, it's been a fall of the cliff type performance. At this rate he won't even match his rookie season. 

 

 

It looks to me like he doesn't want to be here. His game came back for a couple of games after Ward took over, but he has since gone back to just coasting around. He is putting up some points but it's all based off his immense skill level, but he is missing that drive and desire to be a difference maker on the ice. 

 

It's really disappointing. I was one of the people defending the idea of trading him in the off season, but I have been proven wrong on that point. 

 

If he does in fact not want to be here, it would explain a lot with this team and the disfunction so far this season. 

[stubblejumper1]

6 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

It looks to me like he doesn't want to be here. His game came back for a couple of games after Ward took over, but he has since gone back to just coasting around. He is putting up some points but it's all based off his immense skill level, but he is missing that drive and desire to be a difference maker on the ice. 

 

It's really disappointing. I was one of the people defending the idea of trading him in the off season, but I have been proven wrong on that point. 

 

If he does in fact not want to be here, it would explain a lot with this team and the disfunction so far this season. 

 

Why does there always have to be disfunction with this team?  

[travel_dude]

8 hours ago, JTech780 said:

 

It looks to me like he doesn't want to be here. His game came back for a couple of games after Ward took over, but he has since gone back to just coasting around. He is putting up some points but it's all based off his immense skill level, but he is missing that drive and desire to be a difference maker on the ice. 

 

It's really disappointing. I was one of the people defending the idea of trading him in the off season, but I have been proven wrong on that point. 

 

If he does in fact not want to be here, it would explain a lot with this team and the disfunction so far this season. 

 

There's 4 other guys on the ice at the same time.

Have you noticed a lot of blown plays when he out there?

A lot of chip and chase that comes out in about 2 seconds?

His game used to be a lot of speed and passing, but nobody is executing.

Passes from the D are mostly on the boards unlss a forward carries the puck out.

A couple of the D do carry the puck, but they usually enter the zone with it.

It seems like the D has gotten aay from oving up the ice as a unit.

 

I am by no means defending the player.

He has to get over the missed opportunities.

Get over the frustration from a bad shift.

Talk amongst yourselves and fix the problems.

If the D is not working right, then talk to Gio or the coach.

Tell Backlund you need him to delay by half a second.

Or stop at the side of the net.

 

[robrob74]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

There's 4 other guys on the ice at the same time.

Have you noticed a lot of blown plays when he out there?

A lot of chip and chase that comes out in about 2 seconds?

His game used to be a lot of speed and passing, but nobody is executing.

Passes from the D are mostly on the boards unlss a forward carries the puck out.

A couple of the D do carry the puck, but they usually enter the zone with it.

It seems like the D has gotten aay from oving up the ice as a unit.

 

I am by no means defending the player.

He has to get over the missed opportunities.

Get over the frustration from a bad shift.

Talk amongst yourselves and fix the problems.

If the D is not working right, then talk to Gio or the coach.

Tell Backlund you need him to delay by half a second.

Or stop at the side of the net.

 

This definitely has been something not just this season. It has been going on since the AllStar break last year or even sooner. 
 

anyone that says Lindholm was great with them is right, but it was only in the first half. It seems like they all forgot how to play with each other in the 2nd half last year.
 

I don’t know what the fix is. Gaudreau doesn’t look happy and it was beyond this year. I dunno. 
 

the thing is, I see a lot of other teams cutting the Flames off from playing their way, and the Flames adjustments haven’t been successful. 
 

plus, most of the year there just hasn’t been a lot of puck support like in the past. To me it looks like a lot of guys are cheating the game which you just can’t do. 
 

when we do get possession, like the Canucks game, the passing seems off and we pass it into the opponents’ feet or sticks, trying to be fancy and they just clog up where we try to get it to. 
 

 

[travel_dude]

If all the D do is stand motionless at the goal line and look for passing options, there will be none.

The F are moving to be ready to get a pass, but there is little movement back there.

Call that cheating if you like, but it's a lack of skating from the D a lot of times.

We have guys that could skate it in from behind our own net.

But just doing that is only a bt better than dump and chase.

 

I don't use the Nucks game as anything typical.

Bad games show up now and again.

More typical is late starts or 2nd period let downs.

We seem to be getting better in those regards, but attention to detail hurts us.

 

Gaudreau doesn;t look happy.

He wants to win every game.

He wants to win every shift.

Frustrated, for sure.

He's getting hacked, held, hooked, and obstructed with no calls.

If it was just him, I would say he was whining.  It's the entire team.

 

Coaching is still an issue.

Some good changes have been made.

Some things have not changed that need it.

In-game adjustments, EN usage, line matching.

PP setup.

I haven;t seen much in the way of change to the PP, even when the drought continues.

 

[JTech780]

42 minutes ago, travel_dude said:

If all the D do is stand motionless at the goal line and look for passing options, there will be none.

The F are moving to be ready to get a pass, but there is little movement back there.

Call that cheating if you like, but it's a lack of skating from the D a lot of times.

We have guys that could skate it in from behind our own net.

But just doing that is only a bt better than dump and chase.

 

I don't use the Nucks game as anything typical.

Bad games show up now and again.

More typical is late starts or 2nd period let downs.

We seem to be getting better in those regards, but attention to detail hurts us.

 

Gaudreau doesn;t look happy.

He wants to win every game.

He wants to win every shift.

Frustrated, for sure.

He's getting hacked, held, hooked, and obstructed with no calls.

If it was just him, I would say he was whining.  It's the entire team.

 

Coaching is still an issue.

Some good changes have been made.

Some things have not changed that need it.

In-game adjustments, EN usage, line matching.

PP setup.

I haven;t seen much in the way of change to the PP, even when the drought continues.

 

 

If the other forwards were struggling to get High Danger Scoring Chances, I could get behind this, but that's not the case. The 6 forwards ahead of Gaudreau are all on pace to reach their career norms or beat it for iHDCF, Gaudreau is nowhere near his pace from last year. He has 18 iHDCF, last year he lead the team with 79.

 

We all want Gaudreau to go back to being the player he was, but he hasn't been that player in a long time now, and it has very little to do with anyone else on the ice, this is an issue with Gaudreau. Not sure what the problem is exactly, but there is something wrong.

[travel_dude]

32 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

If the other forwards were struggling to get High Danger Scoring Chances, I could get behind this, but that's not the case. The 6 forwards ahead of Gaudreau are all on pace to reach their career norms or beat it for iHDCF, Gaudreau is nowhere near his pace from last year. He has 18 iHDCF, last year he lead the team with 79.

 

We all want Gaudreau to go back to being the player he was, but he hasn't been that player in a long time now, and it has very little to do with anyone else on the ice, this is an issue with Gaudreau. Not sure what the problem is exactly, but there is something wrong.

 

We have at least two other line that can puck retrieve and forecheck the bejezzub out of other teams, so dump and chase works for them more often.

What I see with JH's line is one and done.

They don't cycle well.

They don;t regain possession once they lose it.

 

Yes, I think there is a problem with Gaudreau.

Teams are targetng him more and more and he's not playing through it.

Lindholm didn;t make the line much better earlier, and Tkachuk has breathed a new life into him.

Maybe with a player like Tkachuk or Mangiapane on JH's line might infuse them.

If Backlund isn;t doing it, then maybe they need to find the right player.

Give up on the player or fix the issues impacting him.

 

 

[JTech780]

1 hour ago, travel_dude said:

 

We have at least two other line that can puck retrieve and forecheck the bejezzub out of other teams, so dump and chase works for them more often.

What I see with JH's line is one and done.

They don't cycle well.

They don;t regain possession once they lose it.

 

Yes, I think there is a problem with Gaudreau.

Teams are targetng him more and more and he's not playing through it.

Lindholm didn;t make the line much better earlier, and Tkachuk has breathed a new life into him.

Maybe with a player like Tkachuk or Mangiapane on JH's line might infuse them.

If Backlund isn;t doing it, then maybe they need to find the right player.

Give up on the player or fix the issues impacting him.

 

 

 

Where I am coming from is that I don't think the players around Gaudreau are the issue. I think the issue is with Gaudreau, I am not sure what the issue is or how you fix it. He has been tried on different lines with different players and it hasn't changed much for him.

 

Maybe putting him with Tkachuk and Lindholm would be the answer, but that line gets tough zone starts and defensive assignments, Gaudreau might have trouble with that.

[travel_dude]

55 minutes ago, JTech780 said:

 

Where I am coming from is that I don't think the players around Gaudreau are the issue. I think the issue is with Gaudreau, I am not sure what the issue is or how you fix it. He has been tried on different lines with different players and it hasn't changed much for him.

 

Maybe putting him with Tkachuk and Lindholm would be the answer, but that line gets tough zone starts and defensive assignments, Gaudreau might have trouble with that.

 

There's only a few possible ways to fix it.

Trade him for something that may help down the road.

Trade for a player for the top line that can finish or help drive the play.

Do nothing and hope he works it out.

Play him with superior players like Tkachuk.

 

I think we can both agree that the current line isn;t working.

I haven't seen anything really positive since Backlund joined the line.

Nothing against Backlund, but he's already been bumped to 3C or wing.

We have Ryan, Janko, Bennett and Dube that can be bottom 6 C's.

Unless we want to spend 5m on a 3C or wing.